Snowden's Secret
Banned
I've been burglarized three times in the last seven months to have $10,000 worth of stuff taken. I'm about as non-violent as they come but I'm pretty sure I would have finished them off in my rage as well.
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Minnesota man who killed teens in break-in charged with murder
- Thread starter The Culture Vulture
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You have a weird definition of non-violent.
wsoxfan1214
Banned
If this isn't a troll, fuck off.
Snowden's Secret
Banned
I mean, I don't think he should have killed them and wouldn't have done so myself in a clear mind, but I know first hand that the sense of violation in this situation is a strong and uncontrollable force.
Devolution
Member
It's great when someone has a stash of weapons that others can easily steal, thus putting more guns into the hands of criminals. And then people say we need them because criminals have them. Huh.
I am not defending the guy, but at the same time I have no fucks to give about the pillheads.
Darkmakaimura
Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
If they would have died after he had shot them, most people would have no problem with this. He would have been defending himself and his home. However, he went out of his way to kill them. At that point, he was not defending himself. He acted as an executioner. He waited before calling the authorities as well.
These kids were down for the count. He should have immediately called the police once that happened.
There's no 'right' in this matter, only 'wrong'. Kids were dumb and died as a result, nobody will argue. Expect lethal retaliation if you're going to break into someone's property. But shooting people in the head after they're down and injured, knowing full well they are incapacitated and then proceeding to fire shots in their heads.... on a teenage girl of all things.... you are certainly not in your right mind.
God...frey Jones
Banned
Wait, at what point did he laugh when he killed them? I thought the news piece said the girl laughed after she was shot once...
Sad story in every facet.
Sad story in every facet.
God...frey Jones
Banned
But there's more to self-defence than guns...
Did you read this?
biggersmaller
Banned
I don't think he should be charged. I don't think what he did was moral, either.
Necromanti
Member
I dunno, I still think it's tragic that life was lost, whether or not they were the best of people. Not everyone is raised in an environment that is conducive to well-adjusted behaviors. Many are driven to crime for valid reasons. Whatever the case may be, I would rather have the law exercise judgment for their crimes than condone vigilante executions, even if I were to do so implicitly.
Dreams-Visions
Member
Cases like this remind me of why we need an Express Justice lane.
Under the jail, plz.
Private citizens don't have the right to execute unarmed intruders after successfully disabling/incapacitating them. His safety was secured when he shot them both as they came down the stairs. He became a murdered when he walked up to them and shot them both in the head, as though he were on a battlefield fighting soldiers. That you would believe otherwise speaks to problems with your own morals that you ought to think about.
Under the jail, plz.
Private citizens don't have the right to execute unarmed intruders after successfully disabling/incapacitating them. His safety was secured when he shot them both as they came down the stairs. He became a murdered when he walked up to them and shot them both in the head, as though he were on a battlefield fighting soldiers. That you would believe otherwise speaks to problems with your own morals that you ought to think about.
IHaveCandy
Banned
This should be pretty cut and dry. Somebody breaks into your home, you shouldn't fear about the consequences of taking a kill-shot. You don't know what the intruder will do after being warned or injured. There are actually cases where intruders sued the home owner for injuring them. With that said, the home owner should not be able to treat it like an execution. If by some way, the intruders gave themselves up and were detained by him, he shouldn't be able to execute them like he's making a snuff film.
Every day is a choice.
What the fuck? Those teenagers were stealing stuff. Not killing his dog, torturing his children or raping his wife, they were stealing stuff. This is not something that excuses his actions in the slightest way
You've never had an intruder break into your property so you really have zero basis on which to judge this situation.
The guy was obviously off the rails, but the teenagers were doing a lot more than just "stealing stuff"
It has a serious psychological effect that when combined with someone who is already mentally insane, leads to this
/Hindsight post
He snapped, yes. He rationalized it after the fact, yes. But why the fuck did he not call the police after the matter? He waited twenty-four hours to call the police. That's murder, right there.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
This is absolutely the case which is what makes this such an odd fucked up case. If he had shot them each once and they died, we would have never heard a thing about this. But, he went full on fucking crazy. How you punish that I don't know. He certainly shouldn't be put out into the world again, that's for damn sure. I guess he needs a legit psych evaluation, and I'd hand out punishment from there. Which I imagine is what will happen.
Yeah. It's the walking over, seeing they are no longer a threat, and unloading on them like they were rabid dogs that's going to, deservedly, fuck him.
Hell, if he would have shot them both a couple of times in rapid succession he probably would have been fine.....
So I shouldn't judge a guy who kills his wife and kids after a divorce either because I never got divorced? There are also plenty of other self defense cases with people who didn't put some extra rounds into the burglars head
What hindsight?
The guy wanted them dead because he wanted them dead. He didn't do it because he was scared for his life or was fearing for anyone's safety.
It's what happens when you try to be That Guy.
harriet the spy
Member
I am assuming Manos is banned?
He wouldn't defend this....
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
Yes, perma, I believe.
Which guy, the guy who is ok with executing people?
The guy is not a psychopath, but he did commit homicide. He'll probably plead temporary insanity considering the fact that he had been burglarized before recently. It's really hard to know how anyone is going to react in these types of situations, and he obviously went overboard, and was probably in shock afterwards. But, is he a threat to society? Probably not; only if you break into his home.
I think the time it took to report is the most irrelevant part of this situation. He clearly murdered them but after that there's really no reason for him to be in a rush to call the police. Mid 60s and just executed two (scumbag) teenagers... pretty much fucked no matter what he did next short of lying.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
One where people think that, if you don't have health care and you need a surgery or get hurt, you should just die.
That kind of society.
Can you quote the people that are saying they are ok with cold blooded murder?
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
From the story in the OP, that's what happened with the first burglar. No defense for going to get another gun and finish off the second who he could clearly see was not a threat by then.
Craig Majaski
Member
This happened 10 miles away from me - kind of freaky to see it here on GAF.
Yeah...though I read it as he had another gun in his pocket that he pulled out. Not that he went and got one. Maybe I need to reread though...
Now, before I say this, I want it to be perfectly clear. I am in no way defending this guy or his actions.
However, the dude didn't know why they were there. He didn't know they were there to steal stuff. He didn't know why they were there until after the fact. They could have been in there simply to kill someone. It's happened before, and unfortunately it'll happen again. So yeah, you're saying that with a bit of hindsight.
Again, this dude is a monster. Defending your person? I'm totally ok with that. This went too far.
Agent Unknown
Member
Not too far away from where this happened, this has been all over our local news, so messed up. The kids were idiots for breaking and entering but this guy is a nutjob and a murderer pure and simple. Everybody has the right to self defense but it doesn't give one the right to methodically kill people execution style.
100% agreed. People in this gun crazed nation need to start learnIng that your property isn't some magical, self contained country where you can do whatever you want to whoever without impunity.
100% agreed. People in this gun crazed nation need to start learnIng that your property isn't some magical, self contained country where you can do whatever you want to whoever without impunity.
I never robbed people as a kid because I knew people out there like this dude exist. Plus I wasn't a piece of shit. These kids were shit heads, but they didn't deserve this. I am not surprised at all though this is what I expect to face when breaking into peoples homes even if it is not the reality most of the time.
GrandHarrier
Member
You are right that you can't do ANYTHING but you certainly should and in many cases do have the right to defend yourself. I personally have ZERO sympathy for thieves. If you choose to knowingly break into and try to rob someone, if you get shot by the homeowner, you deserve it. All they should be obligated to do is call 911 after the confrontation.
SMT
this show is not Breaking Bad why is it not Breaking Bad? it should be Breaking Bad dammit Breaking Bad
Old man with guns, 'workshop', previously paranoid from multiple robberies over the last 10 months, two thieving teens with drug addictions, hmmm, HMMMM.
derp.
derp.
No, it will not end in some weird gun fetish porn threesome!
Napoleonthechimp
Member
Because when you intentionally execute people you don't really mean to kill them. It was an accident. Honest.
I don't think you understand what manslaughter really means.
SMT
this show is not Breaking Bad why is it not Breaking Bad? it should be Breaking Bad dammit Breaking Bad
I think the dichotomy lies in the fact that if he had a shotgun, and shot them, each with a 'clean hit', they would have both been dead no question, and we wouldn't be having this conversation right now.
But because he had to install 4 discs to finish the job, people are up in arms, some of you are sympathizing with the girl by stating ''she's only a girl'' not realizing how demeaning this could be to other members on the forum. Think with your minds, not your dicks. Roses have thorns too, don't judge a book by its cover, looks can be deceiving, but I'm sure you all will get married one day, after you stopped wailing over a dead thief you never knew.
You'll never know what the intentions of the deceased were, but if they were experienced robbers, they knew one day they would have to face this type of situation, in the US of A no less.
I'm not saying grandpa executioner was right, but he probably acted in the heat of the moment, some people are perfectionists, and listen, he wanted to 'end her suffering', if you believe that.
Maybe he was being humane, maybe he was being insane!
But because he had to install 4 discs to finish the job, people are up in arms, some of you are sympathizing with the girl by stating ''she's only a girl'' not realizing how demeaning this could be to other members on the forum. Think with your minds, not your dicks. Roses have thorns too, don't judge a book by its cover, looks can be deceiving, but I'm sure you all will get married one day, after you stopped wailing over a dead thief you never knew.
You'll never know what the intentions of the deceased were, but if they were experienced robbers, they knew one day they would have to face this type of situation, in the US of A no less.
I'm not saying grandpa executioner was right, but he probably acted in the heat of the moment, some people are perfectionists, and listen, he wanted to 'end her suffering', if you believe that.
Maybe he was being humane, maybe he was being insane!
Zeus Molecules
illegal immigrants are stealing our air
man .... I mean the finishing shot needs to get him murder.... thats .... thats just disturbing thievery is wrong but in the end it is just stuff. He has a right to protect his stuff and himself of course but after shooting them initially he was in no danger and choice of his actions became sadistic.
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