TheKaeptain
Banned
This is why Iruka is the father figure and Kakshi is the cool uncle.
Last panel needs to be older Naruto eating Ramen with Iruka.
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Naruto Manga Thread (OT) - The End is here
- Thread starter SolVanderlyn
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This is why Iruka is the father figure and Kakshi is the cool uncle.
Last panel needs to be older Naruto eating Ramen with Iruka.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
ill cry evrytme
Because Kishi hadn't thought up Jiraiya yet.
I am rereading the entire series, for the first time since 2008, ahead of the final chapters, and I am currently on volume 22. What kinda shocked me is that Naruto being shunned is not as prominent as I remember. Sure, there is a couple of pages so far where random villagers kinda throws him ugly looks, but there is not much else beyond that. I guess the anime, with its frequent use of flashbacks, left a lasting impression me when I watched it back in 2005.
Also, another thing that kinda suprised me is that Itachi seems kinda troubled in the flashbacks so far and not like an obvious bad guy. I always felt like the reveal about Itachi in part 2 made little sense, but I never went back to part 1 to actually check it.
Edit: Another thing I forgot to mention is that Sasuke is acutally likeable so far. He has been an unlikable douchebag since 2008, so I actually forgot that he was a decent person for much of part 1. Still, even on volume 22 it is obvious that several of the rookie 9, especially Chouji and Shikamaru, have been a better friend to Naruto than Sasuke ever was.
TheKaeptain
Banned
If it happens legit tears.
Well Jiraiya was gone most of his life.
I don't think so. The 4th seemed to have been a real private person. No one even knew she was giving birth.
The Silver
Member
The Rain village was so cool. I wish Naruto had focused more an adventure so we could see and spend more time in places like that.
Winterfang
Banned
Kishimoto is a fantastic world builder. The world of Naruto is pretty full of places and lore.
TacticalFox88
Banned
I wanted more Cloud village business.
Darui is my dude!
As well as Omoi.
Darui is my dude!
As well as Omoi.
Amaretti had some of the best colorings ever, her Itachi vs deidara is legend.
Sucks that I can't find all of her work anymore, shit like this makes me realize how long I've been in this fandom.
NHarmonic.
Member
Well it's a pretty interesting world, but i still feel like Kishi could've taken some notes from Oda, tbh.
TacticalFox88
Banned
IDK.
Problem with Oda is that his world is far FAR more interesting than the story he's trying to tell.
truly.
The Silver
Member
Kishi created an interesting world but he never really uses it to its full advantage, he just creates some new place in service to the plot and then forgets about it. That a big issue I have with part 2, it's far far too plot driven.
TheKaeptain
Banned
Weird. I guessed early on there was going to be another war.
zedreamcast
Member
again the level of tech in Naruto is so confusing. I mean they have TVs, and microphones and halogen lights but still use wagons and shit.
gigantor21
Member
I love One Piece, but I fully agree with this. Particularly post time-skip.
zedreamcast
Member
It seems like time skips always mess things up.
Omnistalgic
Member
I agree, but isn't that a better problem to have? Oda can put Luffy and crew in so many interesting dynamics it's not even funny. Who says there won't be another time skip so the crew can go through even more characterization?
With Naruto how many characters who were once the pinnacle of the story are now irrelevant. Kishi has traded character importance like baseball cards, and then the plot-points and obscure twist and turns. This whole time travel, reincarnation stuff is bollocks. I mean, wtf is Ninjutsu? Is the old Sage's mother a friggin demon, an Angel? Who's there father?
The fook is the nonsense? And all the mind-games of who was really in control. Oro is the strongest, no Itachi is, Itachi is secretly good, but Pain is the mastermind. Pain is just a puppet Tobi is the master, tobi is madara, no tobi is Obito, Madara is madara, but wait, he's really kagara and a shadow baby?! The fook?!?
Orichimaru--naturally talented, extremely bright, lost his parents and became obsessed with living forever and power and discovering the truth of the world. Good villain.
Pain--naturally talented, lost his family/village and decided to change the endless cycle of hatred that caused him so much pain by giving everyone tools of destruction. Good villain.
That's enough evil for the show right there. What kishi has done since those two villains has been almost atrocious. I honestly feel like he's been done with Naruto and this ending is over-due. You can feel the quality drop and pick back up with almost complete randomness. I'm just so attached to the characters I can't NOT watch it, but man, some things could have been done so much better.
Still, Kishi is amazing. I can only pray to write something as captivating as him. Just think he should've ended it a long time ago.
zedreamcast
Member
Remember when Lee was his character and not just literally mini gai?
remember when Chouji had his badass moment during the SR arc, and not just shikamarus best friend?
rember when ten ten....ok ten ten was never interesting but thats besides the point!
Winterfang
Banned
I think people give Kishi too much snit, for not having part one characters be relevant right now. Specially when
1-Think about any climax, finally battle arc of a long running anime and how important are the secondary characters in it, compared to Naruto. Every single character played their part in the war.
2- The characters that already got their arc/problem fixed/goal accomplished. They don't need to be shoehorned. Who cares about Choji is thinking right now, Naruto and Sasuke are fighting.
Also read more of the Rock Lee's magna. Is fun.
1-Think about any climax, finally battle arc of a long running anime and how important are the secondary characters in it, compared to Naruto. Every single character played their part in the war.
2- The characters that already got their arc/problem fixed/goal accomplished. They don't need to be shoehorned. Who cares about Choji is thinking right now, Naruto and Sasuke are fighting.
Also read more of the Rock Lee's magna. Is fun.
PeakPointMatrix
Member
Don't usually do fan art butI had to keep myself busy through this agonizing wait.
Be Thursday already!!
Be Thursday already!!
TheKaeptain
Banned
Yep. Every secondary young character has had an ending to their arcs. Shit, even Kakashi finally got his closure with Obito.
The Silver
Member
It's not that no one is relevant now, it's that they've never been relevant outside of the first few arcs after their introduction. Again I put this down to part 2 being largely plot driven compared to part 1 which focused more on the characters.
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
I guess the problem is that most of those conclusions were pre-timeskip. A number of the characters, awesome characters during the chunnin exams basically had their arcs started and completed during the exam or during the Rescue Sasuke arc and have just been...there since. Only a few, like Shikamaru when Asuma died and Kakashi with Obito really got any extra development since
Nice!
Some assorted fanart
Its a shame the kage assistants were underdeveloped, they were all awesome.
Winterfang
Banned
I think they problem is that people want secondary characters that got their conclusions 8 years ago, still be relevant right now. Specially with so many new characters introduced since. The biggest surprise is how useful they still are, like how Choji help in the war, and Ino. That's like expecting the other Bronze Saints, still be relevant in the Hades Arc.
Some old characters got major changes in part 2. Like Gaara becoming the Kazekage, losing his bijou, learning about his parents, getting in touch with his bijou again. Kabuto coping with the lost of Orochimaru, falling into Black Zetsu's trap by trying to decipher the Uchiha tablet, starting a war, then getting mind raped by itachi.
I think is that people liked the characters too much and just want to see more of them. Which can only be a plus.
Omnistalgic
Member
b/s
How the heck is Rock's Lee development finished? He was pegged as Naruto's rival at one point.
And Neji was a major obstacle for Naruto, had a break-through moment, and only got a moment to die in front of his friend.
No, these characters arc weren't over, Kishi simply stopped developing them along with Naruto and Sasuke, when, by all intents, half of them should be very strong by now. Neji is a genius, a year ahead of Naruto/Sasuke and on's Sasuke level pre-time skip. What level is he at now? equal to Hinata?
part 1 was a balance of characters and abilities simply stated, and a lot more fighting based on wits/smarts/clever thinking, and not this dbz stuff which at times seems out of place with the original show.
part 2 all plot plot plot with hardly any time to care about anyone else but Naruto/Sasuke. The Shikimaru arcs and Sakura fight with rescue Garra arc are the bright spots of part 2, because they had characters we were already invested in.
You can say it's us holding on to characters we liked, I think it's just unfocused writing.
And part 2 has it's nice parts as well...Flashbacks with Naruto's parents are always beautiful, the Sasuke vs. Deidara fight was awesome, almost everything with Bee is fantastic, Guy fight with the Itachi's partner (swordsmen) etc...
But it has some truly awful anime segments, and at times the manga just fell very flat for me, most of the time having to do with Sasuke's parts and Naruto/Sakura talking about the same crap over and over.
The Silver
Member
I don't know what you guys are talking about with them having "conclusions" they barely had a character arc to even give conclusions to.
The ones that did have a defineable goal like Rock Lee and........Neji? Clearly did not get any sort of conclusion. None of the characters had conclusions, just potential that was never acted upon, Neji being one of the worst cases(seriously who cares that he's dead?) and Shikamaru being the closest to having his potential realized.
The ones that did have a defineable goal like Rock Lee and........Neji? Clearly did not get any sort of conclusion. None of the characters had conclusions, just potential that was never acted upon, Neji being one of the worst cases(seriously who cares that he's dead?) and Shikamaru being the closest to having his potential realized.
Omnistalgic
Member
This guys..this guy gets it.
TheKaeptain
Banned
People die in war. Neji's death was needed show the younger ones that it wasn't a game.
Omnistalgic
Member
Chouji got skinny and said "this fists is heavier than life itself!"
I almost cried...
It would have been better if Chouji died right there than what has happened to the rest of the cast after time skip. Should have just used the loss to make Shikimaru strong, and development resentment towards Sasuke.
Omnistalgic
Member
that's all fine and dandy...Death is a part of the show.
Just arguing how most of the cast didn't have conclusions to their character arcs. They are all IMO underdeveloped.
No one cares that Neji died, since he was so irrelevant to the whole part 2. It loses impact and is just a nice way for Naruto to get a power boosts mid-battle. It could have been much more impactful.
Winterfang
Banned
Neji's development end up with Naruto fight. He fought Naruto, told his story, he had his flashback, then he got the Talk No Jutsu. Neji got the full treatment, and changed his personality after the event. Why would Neji be as strong as Naruto, he is a secondary character, his point in the story is showing how Naruto is getting respect and acknowledgment as a member of the village. He served his purposed, he even got a couple of fights after that and die in front of Naruto.
Lee is Naruto's rival, like Guy is Kakashi's rival. Is a humorous rivalry, his goal is to prove that he can become a ninja even if he doesn't know Ninjutsu. He became a Ninja, that's pretty much his story. What is left inconclusive?
Omnistalgic
Member
Naruto and Sasuke are going to be the strongest, no question. What I'm saying is part 2 leaves behind most of the supporting casts in a rather abrupt way. IMO it's also not realistic for Neji to be basically a genius, and them for him to not be a big part of protecting Konoha. Same for Lee. But they do not get any real development per time skip, in fact it's mostly Guy who has all the interesting fights, not Lee.
And I know I enjoy the fights immensely. Guy's hand-to-hands fights I'm sure are among the more popular.
I mean, we may not even be arguing over the same thing here. I simply think the supporting cast could have been used more and better, and it overall would have impacted the story in a beneficial way.
Neji's death for example, would hold more weight if he actually kept pace with Naruto and was in the picture more.
TheRealTalker
Banned
So the word going around is that we are going to get a trailer for the LAST this coming Thursday
-Pyromaniac-
Member
Dawww the picture with Hinata on Naruto's shoulders is MAD ADORBS.
bless.
omg a chapter and a new trailer.
bless.
Laughing Banana
Weeping Pickle
Oda's world-building is ruined by his boring cliche-filled stories and his tendencies to drag along stuff. It's too bad, since the world of One Piece is actually interesting, if only it is allowed to shine more instead of arcs with repeating themes, storylines, etc etc.
Well, not that it's a problem unique to him though. Naruto suffers from it as well.
The uncontested *best* world right now in manga in my opinion is Toriko. Fantastic, fantastic stuff, and in it the world is allowed to shine, to be shown, and explored, instead of filling 100 pages with sob stories or flashbacks or what-have-you.
Well, not that it's a problem unique to him though. Naruto suffers from it as well.
The uncontested *best* world right now in manga in my opinion is Toriko. Fantastic, fantastic stuff, and in it the world is allowed to shine, to be shown, and explored, instead of filling 100 pages with sob stories or flashbacks or what-have-you.
TheRealTalker
Banned
Toriko, Berserk, Kingdom, HXH, and more do great world building
I love One Piece's world but ODA tends to focus on his character's pasts more so then the former... Usually his Front page chapter stories expands upon world events
Still, to me he gives us more depth to his world then Kishi does.... Although the Narutoverse has wonderful areas... sadly we don't explore them as much as we did in Part 1
Oh and Kubo..... :/
I love One Piece's world but ODA tends to focus on his character's pasts more so then the former... Usually his Front page chapter stories expands upon world events
Still, to me he gives us more depth to his world then Kishi does.... Although the Narutoverse has wonderful areas... sadly we don't explore them as much as we did in Part 1
Oh and Kubo..... :/
The Silver
Member
Definitely agreed that Toriko is the best at world buidling right now
Icyflamez96
Member
THIS WORLD SHALL KNOW TRUE USELESSNESS
Welfare
Member
Could be a Jojo characterTHIS WORLD SHALL KNOW TRUE USELESSNESS
I call bullshit on this, especially in regards of the timeskip in One Piece making things worse considering I could make a pretty damn good argument why Dressrosa thus-far has been the best arc in the entire series.
The problem with One Piece isn't necessarily the storytelling, but rather the lack of continuity when it comes to the core characters. By this I mean you have a group of Strawhats who get TONS of development, but it only exists in the arcs that focus on them. Sometimes you'll get rare breaks from this formula like Usopp in CP9 arc for example, but that's outside the norm.
Oda makes these fantastic, heart-felt stories but it's all self-contained in a single arc. Some are better than others, but all are linked together in one big setting. One could argue Oda is making some type of mega-manga kind of like Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, cause obviously the arcs in One Piece are long enough to be the content of an entire manga series at times.
In Naruto, everything follows in a linear path. Character development is carried over from each arc and is actively touched upon on the core characters (well, when they aren't forgotten about at least...). The only real break here that was plainly obvious was the transition between Part 1 and Part 2. One Piece has many of these transitions on an arc-by-arc basis which makes it clear what story it's telling for the most part.
However this storytelling was also a part of Naruto's downfall. Because of it's structure, people EXPECTED to see characters like Rock Lee to remain relevant. When they didn't, people backlash. Not only that, because Naruto likes to spend time on intricate details about chakra, I think sometimes Kishimoto forgets some things which leads to little retcons and alterations to the storytelling which again pisses fans off.
This is also the weakness Kishimoto has: Consistency in his world building. One second Madara is the mastermind, and another second it's Kaguya. Kishimoto puts stacks upon stacks of information that really in the end was never all that significant to anything even though it was an attempt to make Sasuke and Naruto more important with the reincarnation plotline. Cause you know, them clashing with each other wouldn't have made sense otherwise...even though Sasuke betrayed Naruto and they should still be pissed off at each other without that plotline.
He also left a lot of unanswered questions up in the air in the midst of all this, which again it's stuff that Kishimoto should've never put in the first place. Naruto is just going to end up like Dragonball where people talk about it years afterwards pointing out all the plotholes and flaws with it, but maybe Kishimoto designed it that way to keep the series relevant in the future. Regardless, flaws are in no way a good thing and this is still an issue. Even in other mediums plotholes are an issue, though they don't necessarily bring the entire product down.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
I dunno, Dressrosa is bringing some amazing storytelling - easily my favorite arc since Water 7. I agree for the most part, but there are some arcs in OP that stand on their own from a storytelling perspective - Arabasta, Water 7, and Dressrosa being the top 3, IMO.
Kishimoto is a good world builder, too, and the lack of focus on other villages/areas isn't entirely his fault - his world was bigger than the story he was trying to tell. You can see him try to incorporate areas he's mentioned all the time - Rock village was at the center of this conflict, Mist had some major stuff going down at this particular time, Lightning did this or that. He can only focus on one area at a time, and so far, aside from the Invasion of Pain arc, every arc has been in a different area (although several of them were inside the Land of Fire). The Shinobi World War taking place in the Land of Lightning is one of the better decisions he's made as a world builder - the rocky, mountainous landscape is really unique when compared to the other places we've seen.
Winterfang
Banned
The problem with One Piece is that it can get mind numbling boring. Sometimes you get pages and pages of multiple characters and text and text and text.
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