ratcliffja
Member
Honestly, I don't think Wiggins would have done much to help them. He's not quite a bust, but he's one of the weaker #1 picks in the last 10 years.
NBA Finals 2016 |OT| - The King demands seconds. The Chef delivers.
- Thread starter Gully State
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Honestly, I don't think Wiggins would have done much to help them. He's not quite a bust, but he's one of the weaker #1 picks in the last 10 years.
calling jae a scrub basically shows that you should watch more basketball, not us.
Not the Pacers!
Remember when the Cavs picked Anthony Bennett #1 overall and he was out of the league three years later?
jordan0386
Member
LeBron James is a power forward.
SparkleMotion
Member
It's funny going back to articles when the trade first happened and seeing what analysts were saying about Love
SI
"Even though he endured six seasons without a single postseason appearance in Minnesota, the 25-year-old Love may very well be the best teammate James has ever had (Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh included)."
CBS Sports
"Love is that good. He's really, really, ridiculously good. I'd say he's top-five, maybe even top-four in the league, and his value will be even more obvious on a team like the Cavs. No one rebounds and shoots 3s like him, no one throws outlet passes like him. Most important, almost no one as talented has his basketball IQ, which is what LeBron James mentioned as the main reason he'd be excited about this. David Blatt's offense is going to be a thing of beauty with Love in the fold."
Grantland
"Love and LeBron would be diabolical right this second. The passing alone would make them the most entertaining team on earth. They wouldnt even need three other players. Just let them run a two-man weave on the entire league."
Nba.com
"But once the teams completed a conference call with the league on Saturday, there was nothing to prevent the planet's best player from aligning with the league's best power forward. Add in All-Star point guard Kyrie Irving and James is the ringleader of a trio as potentially devastating as the one with Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh he broke up last month."
USA Today
"Love also would be a great fit with James, replicating the stretch big man role played so well by Chris Bosh for James' Miami Heat's four consecutive NBA Finals runs."
SI
"Even though he endured six seasons without a single postseason appearance in Minnesota, the 25-year-old Love may very well be the best teammate James has ever had (Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh included)."
CBS Sports
"Love is that good. He's really, really, ridiculously good. I'd say he's top-five, maybe even top-four in the league, and his value will be even more obvious on a team like the Cavs. No one rebounds and shoots 3s like him, no one throws outlet passes like him. Most important, almost no one as talented has his basketball IQ, which is what LeBron James mentioned as the main reason he'd be excited about this. David Blatt's offense is going to be a thing of beauty with Love in the fold."
Grantland
"Love and LeBron would be diabolical right this second. The passing alone would make them the most entertaining team on earth. They wouldnt even need three other players. Just let them run a two-man weave on the entire league."
Nba.com
"But once the teams completed a conference call with the league on Saturday, there was nothing to prevent the planet's best player from aligning with the league's best power forward. Add in All-Star point guard Kyrie Irving and James is the ringleader of a trio as potentially devastating as the one with Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh he broke up last month."
USA Today
"Love also would be a great fit with James, replicating the stretch big man role played so well by Chris Bosh for James' Miami Heat's four consecutive NBA Finals runs."
CopperPuppy
Member
Love's actual Game 5 performance versus his +/- is sort of the perfect illustration of the weaknesses of that statistic.
I never said he was...who are you actually talking to here?
Lebron is the power forward replacement. Jae next to Bron at the 3 whew.
jordan0386
Member
Bron reluctantly played 4 in Miami. Why on earth is he doing it now, when he runs the franchise. Whew.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Because in 2016 he matches up better with PFs, and as he ages its going to be easier for him to play the 4 defensively than running around chasing wing players, and play out of the post a lot on offense. the positions are just labels, but they illustrate why it would be easier to pair LeBron with a perimeter player than another post player. LeBron and Love can't play together.
Huh? I have no clue what Lebron wants or doesn't want. Merely explaining why a player like Crowder would work next to Lebron. Playing him at the 4 will be 10 times more effective than pairing him with multiple bigs in the future.
jordan0386
Member
They play together fine and Love has accepted his role. He has said as much. Stop watching ESPN.
You sound like you should be on ESPN.
Ninja Scooter
Member
You honestly sound like your basketball analysis comes from playing NBA 2k15.
jordan0386
Member
I have two seasons of evidences showing they are fine. Yet, everybody wants him traded for lesser players.
Can you please provide your evidence?
The best player isn't always the best fit, there's not really anything hard to understand about this.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Apparently the fact that Love has merely existed in Cleveland for 2 seasons means he's fine. Everything is fine. The Cavs have had a good record the last two years so clearly everything is fine and there is no room for improvement of criticism despite the fact that Love's statistics have been completely marginalized and he is now a $20 million a year catch and shoot role player. Everything's fine.
jordan0386
Member
12-2 in the first three rounds didn't happen.
Let's trade for lesser rebounders and players with no potential to reduce offensive burden as Bron ages.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Even by ESPN standards that is the shittiest of takes. Guess since they had a winning record everybody on the team must be playing fantastic and must be the best possible fit, right?
The point of trading Love is to not spend $20 million on a guy who is a role player in their offense. Yes, you maybe trade for 2-3 lesser players, but guys that are potentially better fits, and that allow you a little more cap flexibility than to have that much money tied into a guy who continually looks worse and worse (and gets harder and harder to move) as time goes on.
I think NBA2k15 was giving you too much credit, you sound more like you won a game with LeBron/Love in NBA Jam and decided they are great together.
The thing that matters most about Love's place on the team is that he is an absolute liability against the Warriors, the team they need to beat the most. He may play great against the Pistons and Raptors but if he's useless against the best team in the league then why would you pay him so much money?
beat
Member
According to The Ringer, the best situation for Love would be... the T-Wolves alongside KAT. Which of course isn't gonna happen, but Tjarks also brought up getting Love on the Knicks alongside Porzingis. I'm not as convinced as he is that putting Melo on the Cavs solves the Cavs' problem of having too many 4s, though.
Love needs to play in an actual offense. Kyrie & Bron are great offensive players, but there's not a lot of actual offensive sets. Having Love camp out by the 3 point line to catch & shoot 3s is a waste of his skills. If (/when) the Cavs trade him, I hope it's to a team that does appropriately use his skills.
friskykillface
Banned
Love struggles with the post against Green for some reason, just do that to make Green get into foul trouble and get 'points at the line
How don't the cavs coaching staff try that, good god
Try anything to get Love going , it's the finals
How don't the cavs coaching staff try that, good god
Try anything to get Love going , it's the finals
Atomic Playboy
Member
A third option doesn't need to average 20/10; that would be absurd to expect (but damn, what a super team that would be). But after your primary scoring options, you start getting into role players. People who compliment an area of the game where other players on the team have weaknesses. A big who can give you rim protection and rebounds, spot-up shooters who help space the floor, a lockdown defender to keep opposing wing players from tearing you apart. What does Love contribute? He's never been a good defender, or even an average one, so he's not giving you much on that side of the ball. If you look at his stats in Minnesota, you expect him to be big in getting rebounds and knocking down three-pointers. He's also a very good passer. So what happens Monday? 3 rebounds, 1 assist, 2 turnovers, 0% from 3-point range. If he's not giving you rebounds, threes and assists, what value is he offering to the team?
Love's a better player than he's been in these Finals. But handwaving away his worst game of the playoffs under a "leave Kevin alone" line of defense is ridiculous. He had a bad game (he's had a bad series, really). Doesn't mean he isn't a great player. Steph Curry hasn't been great in these Finals either; doesn't mean he isn't a great player.
LyleLanley
Banned
Have you actually watched the Cavs play? I don't know if trading for Jae is the right move but they definitely should move him for a package of players that fit with the Cavs better than Love does.
Gully State
Member
Pretty much every post player struggles in the post against Green.
jordan0386
Member
Other than poor three point shooting, there is no logic behind him being a bad fit.
Breaking up a winning team isn't sound. Especially when they gonna walk to the finals every season.
LyleLanley
Banned
Other than poor three point shooting? What is he actually contributing to the team? Also, trading Love away doesn't mean your breaking up the team, it means your building a team that actually fits with your only two assets (LeBron & Kyrie).
Love is just redundant with lebron since both are essentially stretch 4's that play in the post well. It's just that Lebron does everything Love does but better.
Love is a really good rebounder, and a really good scorer who's being used horribly. His value is pretty damn low though now cause everyone else sees how bad of a fit he is with Lebron
Love is a really good rebounder, and a really good scorer who's being used horribly. His value is pretty damn low though now cause everyone else sees how bad of a fit he is with Lebron
He's a brick wall, it's crazy how hard it looks to back him down.
jordan0386
Member
The logic to trade love for cheaper and worse players is still flawed.
Your paying love to guarantee your finals spot. Pay Love 20m or a lesser talent 15m so Bron can play th four? Real hard choice there.
Finals spot is already guaranteed. Cavs still stroll through the East with LeBron and Kyrie
LyleLanley
Banned
Love is guaranteeing their spot in the finals? It felt like when Love went down last year they didn't miss a beat. For what it's worth Crowder and Bradley combined make less than $15m. I just don't see what the Cavs are getting out of Love that they can't get from other players for less while still filling out their roster so they don't have to rely on guys like Richard Jefferson and Shumpert.
Love has been pretty invaluable in the playoffs. I feel like no one here watched any of Cleveland's earlier rounds where he was lights out. This is just a bad matchup for him. Draymond can stop both his perimeter and inside games. And he ia horrible on perimeter rotations which kinda makes him unplayable against golden state.
I don't think they particularly need him as much as they need a better bench though.
I don't think they particularly need him as much as they need a better bench though.
jordan0386
Member
Jae is due for an extension. Maybe he gets 12-15 per. Bradley locked in at 8.
I would rather pay the one big 20 plus.
LyleLanley
Banned
Jae is going into year 2 of a 5 year $35M contract. But even if you don't want Jae the idea of trading Love for multiple pieces still makes sense.
jordan0386
Member
The site I looked at wasn't updated. 7 is good value. But I rather have Kevin.
The Cavs don't need help making the finals, Lebron almost guarantees that. They need help getting over the hump and he's not doing that.
This is part of it. Similar to how Draymond looked bad for most of the series with OKC because Durant is a tough matchup for him.
eBay Huckster
Member
theoretically speaking, that series is probably over already
diffusionx
Gold Member
You're right, nobody watched those games. Because they were terrible. The Atlanta series was a crime upon sporting. The East is garbage.
at least lebron would have earned it
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