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[GDGF]

The monologue from " In The Pale Moonlight" is one of my favorites of all time. So chilling;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-YyL7X4CWw

So freaking true.

Now that the Star Trek game has gone FTP I feel like watching this again.

 

[Mgoblue201]

SF shows are, if anything, usually pushed off the air *before* their prime. Not sure why you think they all go on too long. It's pretty rare for any of them to make it past 2 seasons without a major retool, and then they die in their third if they get there. Most of the exceptions end around season 5 with only Trek and Doctor Who really pushing beyond that barrier.

As for pushing Berman off, well, the BBC managed to push producers off Who even in the heyday to make way for new blood. Granted that the last people in charge did a major fuck up job on the whole thing that killed the show for a decade+. But the thing is that in both Trek and Who's case, the break only served to allow new blood to take the reigns. It wasn't the break that was needed, it was the new blood.

Any sci-fi series that hangs on long enough to become stale obviously depends upon the precondition that it lasts long enough to become popular in the first place. When a sci-fi series does become popular, it's vulnerable, more than any other genre, to milking.

I agree that new blood is needed before a series becomes stale. It would be great if a series could retain its high quality indefinitely. However, that is an unrealistic expectation. Show-runners like Berman wield too much power to be forced off. In the short term, the incentive is also to keep everything the same. Most of the time it is only a major fuck-up that will force a reevaluation of the future direction of the series (for example, Day Another Day was followed by Casino Royale, Batman and Robin was followed by Batman Begins).

I didn't mind that so much, I think he was trying to push the point that people who argue Star Trek: The Motion Picture is somehow a more cerebral piece than The Wrath Of Khan, are wrong.

TMP is a plodding and self-indulgent recycling of an adequate episode of the original series. TWOK has some incredible character reflection and literary nods, it really is an absolutely masterful movie.

I think reading from Moby Dick was a nice way of showing the shared themes, but I can understand if some found it to be a bit jarring.

Even though TOS only lasted three seasons, one of its biggest faults was the way in which it recycled similar concepts. The initial ideas for Star Trek 2 were also nothing more than recycled ideas from the series.

 

[Timbuktu]

I can't remember much from DS9 anymore, but Voyager still seems to be constantly on TV.

There is almost no arc to speak of in Voyager, the character are inconsistent, but it was quite light and fun at times in an enjoyable way. Some standalone episodes are really quite good and memorable, but there was just so many time travel plots and everything just resets at the end.

 

[BorkBork]

Good Video Review of In the Pale Moonlight

In the Pale Moonlight Followup as well.

 

[Bloodbeard]

This thread got me interested, so I started watching and I've almost finished the series. Loved it. Thanks Gaf

 

[Magnus]

I'll always remember Voyager fondly for being the only Trek I watched beginning to end as it aired, having only become a fan in 1994, and for giving us occasionally awesome character moments (mostly Janeway, Seven, B'Elanna and the Doctor) and a couple of truly standout episodes (like Tuvix, The Omega Directive, the Seska holodeck program one, and that Conspiracy theory one). I dug the Maquis a lot so it was cool to see them come to the forefront for awhile.

But yeah, DS9 was the real deal, through and through. This thread prompted me to start watching DS9 again as soon as I was able, and Netflix provided! I just finished watching the two episodes in the OP, and remembered to come back and visit this thread again.

I'm a little stunned (in a way I wasn't when I saw this as a kid) at Sisko and the Federation's decision-making (but I guess it's war and all), and a little taken aback by how easily (relatively speaking) Ben makes peace with his actions. Likewise re: poisoning the Maquis planet a year or two beforehand.

I need to let these episodes settle a little in my mind once again to develop thoughts more properly. It has been 14 years, after all.

edit-

Continuing to watch this evening, and reached The Sound of Her Voice. Man is this ever a haunting episode.