Fenderputty
Banned
Accelerationism?
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New GOP National Poll. 1st Place: Trump - 41%. 2nd Place: Carson - 12%.
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Accelerationism?
First, my career is in the health insurance game and Obama is ruining it right now. Do I believe in the way the UK has it? Yes, but Obama's way is not the way it should be done.
Seriously though, do you mind telling us why?
I just don't want another democrat in office, especially Hillary. Do I have something against a woman president? Absolutely not, I would love to have one and think we should have had our first one by now.
But as I get older, I learned to separate my day to day beliefs and the politics that will effect me, and with that said , I want a republican in office.....but let's be realistic, Obama's been in office for 8 years, or will be, republicans did nothing but bitch about him, yet their selection is ass.....8 years and they have nothing, nobody.
I am NOT a fan of the two party system and I much rather have a libertarian as president, but I live in reality. Our country is going down hill. Having peace between races and religion are not going to increase or fix our economy. It's not going to generate jobs, it's not going to do anything special to be honest.
The elimination of racism shouldn't be tied up in politics, it's something we as the human race should strive for.
To circle back to Trump, he is the start of something new. For someone that is not "run of the mill" is a great opportunity for our future. There are many great people in Anerica that can be leaders , but because they are not a puppet on strings like republicans or democrats they don't get that fair chance.
I don't trust democrats, I don't trust republicans, democrats has their chance and IMO I'm sick of them
We as humans should strive for racism to be eliminated.
If we are waiting for politicians to do it for us, then we are a lost cause.
Hexa
Member
Fair enough. I think I get what you're getting at and I can respect that. I don't think you'll find many fans of it here though, especially the libertarian aspect.
How would your career in the "health insurance game" work if there was a system like the UK?
Fenderputty
Banned
Edit one: haha missed the long post
Edit two: yeah still not clear
Edit two: yeah still not clear
Don't people strive for this by voting in leaders that strive for it as well? I mean sure, human beings should be good to each other. But how do we remove institutionalized racism if we don't vote in leaders that will help remove it?
HideyoshiJP
Member
I'll admit, I wanted to say "bugger off, I need to fix dinner," but then I'd be one of those guys. I do appreciate the civil discussion. If nobody bothers being civil, or listening even when you don't agree, then nothing will ever get better. Now, off to frozen pizza and installing Windows on my new five year old graphics workstation!
I feel like I'm misunderstanding you. Increase racial and reilgious tensions in the hope that it will improve economic output?
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
The biggest effect Trump has (assuming no 3rd party run and no nomination) will basically be to fire up the extremest wing of the party, and probably dampen turnout.
Why would they go out and vote for someone like Rubio?
The question then becomes, do they finally splinter off to make 3rd party or do they go back to holding their noses and voting Republican?
Good, you have reason.
Why not use it and demand the ACA be accepted for the awkward stopgap it is and start creating social capital to demand a universal health care system even mirroring what Europe had in the late 20th century, which still mops the floor with what we have. Republicans will only regressive to the wild west "you can't get heart medicine/coverage because you have tinnitus" racket. Even Trump has suggested regressing back to that age, for he's now against universal health care.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Yeah President Hitler would be great, he's not owned by anyone!
Escape Goat
Member
Im going to enjoy some Trump steaks.
makingmusic476
Member
Guys on FREEP, etc. seemed convinced it was Romney's moderateness that cost them 2012. I saw so many people that swore off the GOP after that election, yet the next election they all came right back.
The far right is most worried about keeping the Dems out of power, I think.
You're aware that those Dems have generated jobs, right? Unemployment is lower than its been in almost a decade.
But yeah, lets trust a man with no experience in government, no knowledge of foreign affairs, and 4 bankruptcies despite his own personal fortune.
You don't wait for politicians to do it for you, you make them do it for you. Whatever form of discrimination you're striving to end -- against blacks, against Hispanics, against women, against homosexuals, against Muslims, against Jews, against anyone who isn't a straight white Christian male -- you do it through your elected officials, you do it through policy. People don't just wake up one day and suddenly to stop being racist, stop being xenophobic, stop being homophobic; they might not even realize they're doing it in the first place.
Progressive thought forces progressive legislation, which influences (or forces) non-progressive minds into the right direction. This has always been the case and always will be the case. The human race is not capable of just collectively flicking a switch in their brains and suddenly acting indiscriminate toward one another.
Well then why don't you try explaining it for him because none of that makes any goddamned sense whatsoever.
I am going to bed after this, all I will say is, when have leaders ever really had us, people in their best interest.
i don't trust Carson, I don't trust Sanders
I especially don't trust Clinton or Rubio
None of them will do anything for institutionalized racism, probably just make it worse.
everyone is saying what you want to hear, no one is actually going to follow through.
I want things to be shaken up a bit, trump is the only one that can do that. He can say he is going to ban Muslims....he won't
He could say he is going to build a wall, but he won't.
Fuck it, do I just throw my vote away on Gary Johnson again?
Idk guys, all I do know is we are spiraling down hill fast, no one running is going to fix that
Democrats have not had their chance, they've been obstructed at every turn by a republican congress and senate and Obamacare is the way it is because of them and apologies but it honestly sounds like you fundamentally don't understand the parties or the candidates. A libertarian president would be useless without a libertarian party and a libertarian party would be a joke.
Further your post is just a take on "they're both as bad as each other."
Your "elimination of racism shouldn't be political" is bullshit and naive and frankly childish.
And how the fuck is our dramatically improving country going downhill?
In summary, utter childish disingenuous horseshit from top to bottom.
RustyNails
Member
This is a canard I hear from old, disgruntled white males on talk show radio. None of them ever explains why. The country is just going down the shitter. Can you explain why? Unemployment has gone down from 10% when Obama took office to 5%, almost near the normal. Wages are increasing. We have more financial controls than before 2008, a new consumer watchdog. 30 million more Americans have healthcare today than they did 6 years ago. We are not losing 300 US soldiers in Fallujah every month. We still have lot of work to do with regards to equal pay, cheaper healthcare, etc. But pray tell, how is our country going down hill.
You just said you didn't want any politician trying to help clear racism. Do you think Donald Trump gives a shit about you or your problems? Get a fucking grip.
And Trump is not the start of something new, he's the culmination of every ugly thought and impulse shared among far-right social conservatives for the last several decades. He's not fit to be president, he has absolutely no idea about any particular policy platform (that he seems clueless about why ISIS and radicalized Muslims harbor such hatred for the West says it all), his business track record is bad enough that he would've made more money off his father's inheritance had he simply invested it all, and he's hilariously thin-skinned about it all too. Yeah, what a great fucking asset to have across the table from Putin.
So who the hell are you voting for then? You're voting for a man that won't do anything he says he'll do?
The cynical response is "well, candidates always lie, they always say whatever people want to hear, they never keep their campaign promises," but the fact is, candidates by and large DO keep the promises they make -- or most of them, anyway. And these aren't little asides, building a wall on the Mexican border and now banning entry into America for both Muslim immigrants and American Muslims abroad are major cornerstones of his foreign policy ideas. So either you're voting for a candidate who will bring on some serious unprecedented xenophobic policy, or you're voting for a candidate who says he'll do this but actually won't, in which case you've cast your vote for a total stranger and completely undermined the whole point of the campaigning process.
So who the hell are you voting for then? You're voting for a man that won't do anything he says he'll do?
The cynical response is "well, candidates always lie, they always say whatever people want to hear, they never keep their campaign promises," but the fact is, candidates by and large DO keep the promises they make -- or most of them, anyway. And these aren't little asides, building a wall on the Mexican border and now banning entry into America for both Muslim immigrants and American Muslims abroad are major cornerstones of his foreign policy ideas. So either you're voting for a candidate who will bring on some serious unprecedented xenophobic policy, or you're voting for a candidate who says he'll do this but actually won't, in which case you've cast your vote for a total stranger and completely undermined the whole point of the campaigning process.
King Tubby
Member
I was going to try to be civil but this is fucking stupid.
DataStream
Member
Explain.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
So to shake up a system with politicians who won't follow through with what they said you'll vote... for a politician who won't follow through with what he said.
?
?
Fucking trump fan and libertarian . Nothing but cognitive dissonance and that's if your charitable enough to assume no racism.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
I REALLY need to know why we need a Republican (specifically a 'businessman') to fix the economy and lower unemployment.
The current democrat regime has the economy humming and unemoloyment at a decade long low. He received a SHIT situation and came out of it with flying colors. This argument (that I constantly hear) really makes no sense to me.
The current democrat regime has the economy humming and unemoloyment at a decade long low. He received a SHIT situation and came out of it with flying colors. This argument (that I constantly hear) really makes no sense to me.
I can guess why. Trump is a protest vote, he's the Cicciolina of American politics. Democrats as far as the most important issues go like economy, labour and civil rights are almost indistinguishable from republicans. The few issues all these clowns bicker about are usually social and they usually change NOTHING when they're elected.
Did the republican fearmongering bullshit in the 2004 elections (iirc) about gay rights change anything when Bush was elected again? No, society continued to progress and eventually gay rights became an issue politicians had to agree on or at least not use as a fearmongering tactic anymore.
Trump is a grade A clown and that's the reason some people will vote for him, because they don't actually believe he will deport Mexicans or not allow Muslims to enter the country and honestly I think you guys know it too. It's just bullshit pandering to his idiot base. I would never EVER vote for him but if I had a gun to my head I would rather vote for him than Hillary who seems to be more indebted to bankers and corporate interests than the rich asshole himself. I would rather vote for an idiot that would not be taken seriously by anyone than a supposedly respected politician that in reality is corrupt to the core too. Then there are the people who are so fed up that just hope that Trump will completely unravel the US political system so they can start all over again.
Personally, I'd vote for Sanders or not vote at all. I'm done falling for the well organized and propagandized election acting performances of the so-called "representatives". The only thing they represent is corporate interests.
The GOP has done an incredible job as branding itself the party of fiscal conservatism, when they've done exactly the opposite each time a Republican was in the White House the last several decades. And despite the track records of lost jobs, stagnant wages, repressed middle class growth, wrecked budgets, surpluses turned into deficits, and so forth, they continue to convince people that they're the ones who will bring fiscal conservatism to Washington.
It's like McDonalds convincing you that you really want to eat their food despite shitting your brains out the last 10 times you ate there.
King Tubby
Member
So you're voting against politicians who represent corporate interests...by voting instead for the corporate interests directly, who you find just as disingenuous, except his defining factor is that he rallies his base by fueling their hatred for minorities?
I can't with some people
Aaron Strife
Banned
Yeah but it's not happening fast enough. Or something.
I don't know about you guys but the last time we had a Clinton as president things were pretty fucking swell. I know the Democrats aren't perfect but can we stop pretending between 8 years of Clinton, 8 years of Bush and 7 years of Obama that they're all the same? That we need someone like Trump to "shake things up"? Oh don't worry, none of the shit he says will actually happen in spite of the fact that presidents typically keep the vast majority of their promises. But who cares, it'll be funny am I right.
Eighty Deuce
Banned
Trumps a political hydra, cut one head off and two emerge.
A lot of old, disgruntled white males who have probably lost their jobs for one reason or another, and attribute their own personal losses to a bigger trend in the country as a whole.
Being unemployed and unable to get rehired doesn't sting as much if supposedly everyone's in the same boat with you.
JoeyJungle
Banned
Those numbers could be partly due to the Bradley effect (if afraid to admit who they're voting for, they're more likely to say undecided).
http://people.iq.harvard.edu/~dhopkins/wilder13.pdf
http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-future-of-polling-may-depend-on-donald-trumps-fate/
(mentioned near the very end of the fivethirtyeight piece)
Harry makes the argument that the Bradley effect isn't likely to noticeable in most polls, but in that one in particular it could be happening because of the psychology of being asked who you're voting for vs being asked who you're voting for after hearing a list of candidates.
I hear how much the country has gone to shit from people who are employed and doing fine. They have their health. Their family is doing great.
But things suck because reasons.
Elfforkusu
Member
You know what happens to this guy, right?
GOP imploding is so delicious
Hillary 2016!!!!
Byakuya769
Member
Don't worry people. Most people haven't started paying attention to the election yet! Those super informed people who don't know anything about the candidates to date are going to smarten up and surely make well reasoned choices come primary time.
Just you wait!
Just you wait!
Amen brother, trump is gonna stand up against those corporate fat cats and actually finally do something, plus he just says what we're all thinking.
RustyNails
Member
Even if they're employed, they never explain why. Obama is just a terrible president. TERRIBLE. Economy is a disaster (somehow), Shariah everywhere, our country leading from behind, Obamacare destroying jerbs, putin slapping us around, etc. Just vague, nebulous, english words cobbled together by wordsmiths in the business of making lot of money being repeated senselessly.
ehretreue.m.h
Banned
I'm imagining a scenario where Trump secures the nomination, appears to put up a good show where he effectively destroys the GOP via the election, and Hillary invites him (he shows up) and then thanks him for a job well done on national TV, revealing him to be a plant the entire time.
Trump then quietly leaves the national stage, only occasionally coming out to make liberal remarks about events.
Trump then quietly leaves the national stage, only occasionally coming out to make liberal remarks about events.
I say this time and time again here, I don't understand how the past 45 years of history in the USA can convince anyone that Republican leadership has been or will be good for the economy and/or foreign policy. I thought the failures of the Dubya presidency would have cut back on a lot of the talk, but even here I still see the same ideological bullshit.
Soapbox Killer
Grand Nagus
Until the day he accepts the Republican Nomination, I will refuse to believe people in this country are this stupid, and I am far from "liberal"
campfireweekend
Member
7DollarHagane
Banned
so the only way to fix the country is to give all the power over to one political party, that's what I've learned from GAF. Good job guys
IDK what the hell to think with the presidential elections. I'm not a fan of hilary or any of the republican candidates. I guess i should read up on sanders? idk
IDK what the hell to think with the presidential elections. I'm not a fan of hilary or any of the republican candidates. I guess i should read up on sanders? idk
So many people seem utterly politically dense just now. The best counter to Trump is silence. All the headlines played into his hands.
Vault Dweller 111
Member
The only good thing about Trump getting the nomination would be the debates. I consider him unelectable in a general election (lord help us if I'm wrong.) but seeing the THRASHING that Sanders/Hilary would give him would make me happy.
And if it encourages people to vote blue for congress then so much the better.
And if it encourages people to vote blue for congress then so much the better.
GameAddict411
Member
So, you are saying that as long as the issues that plague this country and effect a lot of people doesn't affect you, you are ok with anyone as long the "economy" is somehow improved by a republican? why do you assume a republican will have a better chance of improving the economy? And I would love to hear a plan from you of how the human race can eliminate racism without politics lol.
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