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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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Yoboman

Member
Idk, I've checked many of thier linkedin accts, and plenty held senior and lead positionsat ND, insomniac and Santa Monica. I doubt MS would grab folks just to "promote them" for positions they aren't qualified for, regardless of past accolades
People move jobs into higher positions across all industries. The example in this thread is a guy moving from head of melee animation (a specific part of the animation team) to lead of gameplay animation (working across the whole animation spectrum). Sometimes you just can't move up in your current company because that position is already filled, or the company is not looking to promote you

And the thing with game developers is most of them aren't really expanding. They may work on 1 to 2 games at a time for years

I haven't looked at any of the people in that list, but the likely scenario for a lot of them is that it's a rare opportunity to get in at the ground level of a studio and increasing your value in salary and position is what everybody strives for across any industry

I work in HR, the most common reason people leave is for more money or for a bigger title. Third would be working conditions: they hate their job or boss or burn out. But thats a lot less common
 

44alltheway

Member
So it has been a while since I have posted here, I am gonna give my thoughts on next-gen consoles
1)PS5 regular and digital is going to outsell Xbox Series X/S, but will not outsell the PS4.
2) Microsoft's play for Gamepass will push for more "GAAS" type games, but they will have more single player games than they did during the Xbox One generation.
3) Sony will put more focus on animated games like ratchet and clank, sly Cooper, and jak and dexter. They noticed the sales from both crash and Spyro and couldn't refuse to dip in as well!
 
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Three Jackdaws

Unconfirmed Member
There was a leak recently which "supposedly" featured the GTA 6 map, it was an island and lot of it was green however the the coastal area was all urban, as is the case with many GTA games however what many people pointed out was how "dense" the urban area was, which is interesting because people have speculated that it might mean more or even all the buildings in the game will be enterable, this would be interesting considering that such a feature would benefit a lot from SSD's, I do remember a developer talking about this quiet a while back but can't seem to find it now.

That also makes me wonder about Spiderman 2, I think they game will be built ground up for the PS5 and I don't think we'll see till around 2022-23. Like GTA, it's open world design would benefit heavily from an SSD especially when it comes to traversal, loading times and no duplication of assets + much more.
 

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Deleted member 775630

Unconfirmed Member
i bet you own a onesie though :messenger_grimmacing_
You know it!

3116777-xboxonesiesresized_018.jpg


Stop it, just stop it please. Here is Dirt Rally 2.0 on current gen consoles on Xbox One X and PS4 Pro (not sure which is which exactly):
I play games mate, not graphics.

I have no interest in playing "Let's shit on the 3rd party game that has a marketing deal with the other console manufacturer-game" with you. Have a great life, I'll put you on ignore, that's easier for the both of us.
 

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
Gen passed and I cannot be happier that we are F-I-N-N-A-L-Y dissing that signature Driveclub look, keep at it bois. onRush was great no hate to Evo.
dcbeta-8-1024x576.jpg
 
I must be lucky to play lots of games, never cleaned my PS4 base 2013-2016, then didn't clean my pro 2016-present and still have it extremely silent. It's not just me, all of the PS4's I've seen in person are extremely silent and you can only know they're on from the light bar, even in shitty situations and even open air like camps and so where friends gather and play with humidity hitting 100% and drizzles with lots of mist during the monsoon season.





No worries, I've cleaned it from the outside after the video, lol. I tell the house maid to not even touch the spot, as I find the console open sometimes for hours without noticing it. And I'm a lazy ass so I rarely clean that holy spot. I don't really touch it as I'm 100% digital since late 2014.

I think we got some good ones. It seems to depend on the country? Some countries are getting from one factory or another. Because I've seen more than 100 PS4's here in shitty situations and all of them are quite. Only one was jet and very noisy is actually my sister's OG PS4, US version from the gray market.

Problem with noise is that how people sense/hear/take the noise, is subjective.

Same noise can be annoying as hell to one person, while another doesnt even notice it. While both hear it, one also notices it as it penetrates his conscious mind, and second ones brain just "filter it out".

Then same noise can be "loud" to one, and silent/normal to another.

Also the type of noise affects the perception, like there is dude playing music outside of your apartment.
Person 1 likes russian trance techno that the dude plays = he doesnt mind it that much
Person 2 hates russian trance techno = he wants to murder the dude


As an example, one of my friend said "my ps4 is silent, weird", when I complained how fucking loud my second unit were (launch unit were as loud as my hoover, second unit loud enough to be heard from wc, 7-8m + one door between). Well I wanted to check his to know if my second one is defective, went to his house. He opens the door.. and I could easily hear his ps4 screaming from 10m away from his living room :messenger_beaming:

And after I pointed it out to him(the noise) he were like "ohh, I really didnt notice it before, but yeah it is loud, damn!"

So his brain just filtered it out.

Example of volume levels: I have Sony WH-1000XM3 headphones, they can output around 104 decibels, which is almost 20 times more than 85 dB(which is used as level of too loud, causes hearing damage) because of logarithmic scale. They are really loud even at 40-50% and I usually use mine at 10-25%

And yet almost daily I read at reddit how crazy idiots cry how they are not loud enough, like they literally use them at 100% volume(basically any headphones WILL cause hearing damage at 100% volume, unless they or source is broken) and still somehow(I have no idea how, they should cause pain) think it is not loud enough, probably already broken ears from playing music too loudly.

So, some people just dont have same kind of senses, some get annoyed from tiny noises, some ruin their ears with playing music too loudly and dont even notice how crazy it is.




My point: while it is nice to compare experiences, without noise measurements made by professional equipment and professional/good person, they are just experiences but not the 100% truth.

I havent personally ever seen quiet PS4, all I have seen have been clearly audible at annoying levels, like masking what characters are talking about. units vary from launch to 2 years old, OG and pro modelts. And most have been on space where they have plenty of air, like top of a desk.

(cant say anything about xbox one systems, because nobody I know owns them)

Not saying your experiences are false, it is possible that you have perceived them as "almost silent", while they could have been the same as most, kind of noisy.

One possible explanation is, that in your country houses have air condition, or road noises come from outside, something that masks the fan noise so when you dont notice it above other noises = it is "silent".


Even Nintendo Switch outputs enough noise on docked mode to be heard from 2-3 metres away, in non-noisy room. So I find it out REALLY hard to believe that any console with moving parts would be anywhere near of being objectively silent.

Normal quiet room(not silent) have background noise levels around 25-35 decibels, which is no loud by any means, so for ps4/console to be so quiet that it would be perceived as silent, it would have to output not much more than 20-40 decibels, depending how far the listener is. Noise levels drop roughly 6 db when distance is doubled. Like if it is 50 dB@1m, it is 44dB@2m and so on.


So even the noisy ones can be "pretty silent" if user sits far enough.

I made my Master degree thesis about noise measurements, and took many courses at university. And while I'm not super expert of the subject, I think I know enough to give "scientific view" to it.

And I am HUGE Sony fanboy, almost all my equipment are from Sony + I collect Sony stuff, so I am not biased in any way :messenger_savoring: Being noisy is the only fault on playstation consoles, and I really hope that PS5s are much more quiet :)

Even ps2 fat units had huge variation, so it is possible that some PS4s are "silent" on certain environments, but I have yet seen but 10-20 noisy ones, so unless some factories output just noisy ones, I find it difficult to believe that you have met only the best units. (ours are made in china, voxcon? unit

tl:dr How we perceive noise is subjective, and we should not trust what others perceive, only professional measurements can give us some kind of base level to use in comparisons. But from the looks, PS5 is most probably better than ps4 on noise levels
 
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Zoro7

Banned
You know it!

3116777-xboxonesiesresized_018.jpg



I play games mate, not graphics.

I have no interest in playing "Let's shit on the 3rd party game that has a marketing deal with the other console manufacturer-game" with you. Have a great life, I'll put you on ignore, that's easier for the both of us.
You say you play game not graphics but you’re always saying how games will look better on Series X. Now suddenly after seeing a couple of games on Series X you’ve changed your tune to “I play games not graphics”.
 

Lunatic_Gamer

Gold Member
Cage: Many Devs Will Prefer Ray Tracing @1080p Rather Than Limited Lighting @4K; We’ll Have a New Engine
I believe that the next battle will be about lighting more than polycount or even resolution. In the past, the polycount was considered as the most important thing to increase visual fidelity, then resolution was the next big thing, but today, most developers know that lighting is what matters the most. Many will prefer to have ray tracing in Full HD rather than limited lighting in 4K. Ray tracing, realistic lighting and reflections, advanced shaders, optical effects and advanced image treatment are the features our R&D is currently implementing in our Next Gen engine.

There are, of course, many other features made possible by the power of the new generation of consoles, like advanced AI and physics, dynamic destruction and new animation features. Rendering is just one of the many technical challenges that developers have to face. The fact that we have our own proprietary tech is a challenge but also a significant advantage, as it allows us to develop whatever features our titles require and to tailor them to our needs.

Developing our own technology and engines has been a major part of the studio’s culture
for 23 years. We always used proprietary technologies for all our titles, initially because
there was no off-the-shelf middleware available. Today, we continue to create our own
tech because we feel it contributes to making our games visually unique. We also have
specific needs regarding cinematography and pipelines, and we want to keep control of
the most advanced features. The team really likes this control over the tech: we can have an idea about a new feature and decide to implement it without needing anyone else’s support. So yes, all our next titles will feature our tailor-made and completely new engine.
 
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Deleted member 775630

Unconfirmed Member
You say you play game not graphics but you’re always saying how games will look better on Series X. Now suddenly after seeing a couple of games on Series X you’ve changed your tune to “I play games not graphics”.
How so? XSX will still be the best system to play 3rd party games on, graphically. BUT this specific game, that is being dragged down due to a marketing deal with Microsoft, a game that's focused on gameplay, why would I then focus on graphics.

There's a big difference between specific games, and all games in general.
 

Dodkrake

Banned
Watch dogs is looking good on the Series S. Wasn't too impressed with the version youtubers are playing (don't know what version it is), but that one looked smooth.
 
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Zoro7

Banned
How so? XSX will still be the best system to play 3rd party games on, graphically. BUT this specific game, that is being dragged down due to a marketing deal with Microsoft, a game that's focused on gameplay, why would I then focus on graphics.

There's a big difference between specific games, and all games in general.
My point was if your all about gaming then what kick do you get out of constantly saying games will look better on series X.
Also aren’t all games focused on gameplay?
 

martino

Member
you do realize it is a new pipeline that is not available in most of the PCs, right? on paper it looks great, but we will need to wait for another 2-3 years to see the fruit of it. as long as Sony doesn't go full retarded to port games to PC day and date, we may see PS5 uses the new pipeline earlier.

UE5's nanite is also a new pipeline, btw. i don't have the details on how nanite takes advantage of the mesh geometry engine. fingers crossed.
me :try to explain xsx cu organisation
fanboy : whatever will never be used quick enough. ps5 is besttttttttttttt

really great speculation thread.
 

J_Gamer.exe

Member
Cage: Many Devs Will Prefer Ray Tracing @1080p Rather Than Limited Lighting @4K; We’ll Have a New Engine


They should all just sack 4k off and be 1440 with next gen upscaling and 60fps with RT, real next gen leap in graphics.
 
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Deleted member 775630

Unconfirmed Member
My point was if your all about gaming then what kick do you get out of constantly saying games will look better on series X.
Also aren’t all games focused on gameplay?
Because I believe there is a difference between comparing two systems and discussing one game. When comparing two systems, and games on that system, well in case of 3rd party games the gameplay will be the same, but visually there might be a small difference. So it makes sense to discuss that. But when it comes to 1 specific game, not looking at Xbox or Sony, gameplay should be more important than the graphics. At least for me.

Does that makes sense?
 

reksveks

Member
Are we assuming that every game on both consoles are going to have a day one patch? That's going to be painful for the networks.

When do we think that the ps5 start going out to journalists especially given that they will have to review games?
 
If I was to compare this image of Driveclub to Dirt 5...would It be unfair 🤷‍♂️

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The difference of Drive club & Dirt 5 is what happens when you don't have Playstation tools & funding.Just what it is. PS tools funding is legit serious stuff.

Man this definitely has my attention now, hoping for an E3 2021 reveal at least.

Oh no you didn't just say wait till E3. I know your not a xbox guy but brah. This shit again. Just don't say wait till E3. It always ends the same.

What PS5 games officially have ray tracing?

Miles Morales
Demon Souls
Godfall
DMC5SE
GT7
COD.
 

Yoboman

Member
Cage: Many Devs Will Prefer Ray Tracing @1080p Rather Than Limited Lighting @4K; We’ll Have a New Engine

I wont knock any dev who does this to go all out on ray tracing. Mid gen upgrades can bring back the resolution anyway
 
They should all just sack 4k off and be 1440 with next gen upscaling and 60fps with RT, real next gen leap in graphics.

They should hit middle ground 1440p with RT, Im sure they will. But they got to sell 4K TV's to get everyone to 4K land. Otherwise we going to stay in 1080p forever. The happy medium will arrive. But it ain't happening until 4K screens are widely adopted. Eventually middle ground will show up.
 

Lunatic_Gamer

Gold Member
U.S. Video Game Spending This Holiday Projected to Reach a Record $13.4 Billion
U.S. consumer spending on video games is projected to reach $13.4 billion in the combined November and December 2020 holiday period, an increase of 24 percent when compared to a year ago. Growth is expected to be driven by console hardware, headsets, gamepads, mobile, digital full-game and post-launch content on console and PC, and subscription. Annual U.S. consumer spending on video games may exceed $50 billion in 2020, which would constitute a new record high for the U.S. market.

 

kikkis

Member
Cage: Many Devs Will Prefer Ray Tracing @1080p Rather Than Limited Lighting @4K; We’ll Have a New Engine

I disagree on polycount being solved. Realisticly each triangle needs to cover 8 pixels to get good performance which is large area considering how small details they are trying to represent. As such its also problem for lods. Unreal 5 shows good way forward in this regard.
 
How so? XSX will still be the best system to play 3rd party games on, graphically. BUT this specific game, that is being dragged down due to a marketing deal with Microsoft, a game that's focused on gameplay, why would I then focus on graphics.

There's a big difference between specific games, and all games in general.

How can you at this point in time say that with a straight face? We have seen literally nothing so far that would give weight to that assumption and we're less than a month away from these consoles releasing. At the very least wait until you have anything to back up your opinion.
 

J_Gamer.exe

Member
How so? XSX will still be the best system to play 3rd party games on, graphically. BUT this specific game, that is being dragged down due to a marketing deal with Microsoft, a game that's focused on gameplay, why would I then focus on graphics.

There's a big difference between specific games, and all games in general.

Still no guarantee it will be better, it may well be but so far there isn't a major game announced that runs differently.

The actual evidence so far is not matching Microsoft claims of power and a pure teraflop advantage.

We saw this narrative Sony were shocked and had to overclock to keep up but actually I think its Microsoft who's been shocked by what Sony are getting out of a lesser on paper GPU.

Microsoft knew what sony were doing, hence them saying to DF its locked frequency before Sony had revealed it. I bet they also thought they had them beat hence all the bragging about most powerful.

But in reality by utilising the variable clocks, but in a new way that isn't based on thermals but on workload they are pushing way more out of the GPU. Its very clever. Add in the cu utilisation, cache scrubbers, caches running faster etc and so far they are performing seemingly about the same as the world most powerful console.

Which is an L for Microsoft given that bragging and claims so far.

More cu's being harder to fully utilise may be another factor in that GPU not being as far ahead as people expected.

That crytek dev did say that it might only be achievable in ideal conditions .

We also have the ram at high and lower bandwidth which we heard may be an issue by a few different people. What happened when the game is over 10gb and can both be accessed at the same time? Or does it slow down the effective bandwidth?

Let's remind ourselves what he said.

'If I understood correctly, is Traflaps the final defining factor over GPU power? Or what do these floating points mean? How would you describe it for a user who doesn't understand all of these?

I think it was a bad PR move to put all these information out. This technical information does not matter to the average user and is not a final judgement over GPU power.

Graphics cards, for example, have 20 different sections, one of which is Compute Units, which performs the processing. If the rest of the components are best put to use in the best possible way, and there are no other restrictions, there is not bottleneck in memory, and as long as the processor has the necessary information, 12 Tflops can be achieved. So in an ideal world where we remove all the limiting parameters, that's possible, but it's not. ( he means we cannot remove all bottlenecks and 12 Tflpos only remains on paper)

A good example of this is the Xbox Series X hardware. Microsoft two seprate pools of Ram. The same mistake that they made over Xbox one. One pool of RAM has high bandwidth and the other pool of RAM has lower bandwidth. As a result, coding for the console is sometimes problematic. Because the total number of things we have to put in the faster pool RAM is so much that it will be annoying again, and add insult to injury the 4k output needs even more bandwidth. So there will be some factors which bottleneck XSX’s GPU'
 
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sircaw

Banned
Still no guarantee it will be better, it may we will be but so far there isn't a major game announced that runs differently.

The actual evidence so far is not matching Microsoft claims of power and a pure teraflop advantage.

We saw this narrative Sony were shocked and had to overclock to keep up but actually I think its Microsoft who's been shocked by what Sony are getting out of a lesser on paper GPU.

Microsoft knew what sony were doing, hence them saying to DF its locked frequency before Sony had revealed it. I bet they also thought they had them beat hence all the bragging about most powerful.

But in reality by utilising the variable clocks, but in a new way that isn't based on thermals but on workload they are pushing way more out of the GPU. Its very clever. Add in the cu utilisation, cache scrubbers, caches running faster etc and so far they are performing seemingly about the same as the world most powerful console.

Which is an L for Microsoft given that bragging and claims so far.

More cu's being harder to fully utilise may be another factor in that GPU not being as far ahead as people expected.

That crytek dev did say that it might only be achievable in ideal conditions .

We also have the ram at high and lower bandwidth which we heard may be an issue by a few different people. What happened when the game is over 10gb and can both be accessed at the same time? Or does it slow down the effective bandwidth?

Let's remind ourselves what he said.

'If I understood correctly, is Traflaps the final defining factor over GPU power? Or what do these floating points mean? How would you describe it for a user who doesn't understand all of these?

I think it was a bad PR move to put all these information out. This technical information does not matter to the average user and is not a final judgement over GPU power.

Graphics cards, for example, have 20 different sections, one of which is Compute Units, which performs the processing. If the rest of the components are best put to use in the best possible way, and there are no other restrictions, there is not bottleneck in memory, and as long as the processor has the necessary information, 12 Tflops can be achieved. So in an ideal world where we remove all the limiting parameters, that's possible, but it's not. ( he means we cannot remove all bottlenecks and 12 Tflpos only remains on paper)

A good example of this is the Xbox Series X hardware. Microsoft two seprate pools of Ram. The same mistake that they made over Xbox one. One pool of RAM has high bandwidth and the other pool of RAM has lower bandwidth. As a result, coding for the console is sometimes problematic. Because the total number of things we have to put in the faster pool RAM is so much that it will be annoying again, and add insult to injury the 4k output needs even more bandwidth. So there will be some factors which bottleneck XSX’s GPU'

FFS if you Continue with all this technical shit they will never shut this thread down. "lollipop_disappointed:

WTF are you thinking :messenger_grinning:
 
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J_Gamer.exe

Member
They should hit middle ground 1440p with RT, Im sure they will. But they got to sell 4K TV's to get everyone to 4K land. Otherwise we going to stay in 1080p forever. The happy medium will arrive. But it ain't happening until 4K screens are widely adopted. Eventually middle ground will show up.

Yeah, I mean these upscaled games, maybe like demon souls 60fps mode look like 4k anyway, if indeed that's what it is doing.

Maybe if they do have a patented next gen upscaling they could call it a fancy marketing 4k name to sell it.

Also Bo_Hazem Bo_Hazem i wonder where nx gamers demon souls video from your thread analysis went that was meant for last week?
 
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sircaw

Banned
How can you at this point in time say that with a straight face? We have seen literally nothing so far that would give weight to that assumption and we're less than a month away from these consoles releasing. At the very least wait until you have anything to back up your opinion.

Digital foundry WILL find an extra blade of grass on the xbox, even if they need to delay there first video, its coming in hot with one extra blade at 800% zoom.

You KNOW IT. "lollipop_disappointed:
 

Dibils2k

Member
Yeah, I mean these upscaled games, maybe like demon souls 60fps mode look like 4k anyway, if indeed that's what it is doing.

Maybe if they do have a patented next gen upscaling they could call it a fancy marketing 4k name to sell it.

Also Bo_Hazem Bo_Hazem i wonder where nx games demon souls video from your thread analysis went that was meant for last week?
he realized Bo_Hazem Bo_Hazem was talking nonsense and cancelled the video :messenger_grinning_squinting:
 

J_Gamer.exe

Member
FFS if you Continue with all this technical shit they will never shut this thread down. "lollipop_disappointed:

WTF are you thinking :messenger_grinning:

Lol some things like what he said and the cerny bible just age so well over time.

What the crytek guy said seems more and more plausible to me, maybe its part of the answer to what we have seen or in some cases not seen, in xbox struggles and failure to show anything running better than Sony.
 
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