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NFL 2017 Week 5 |OT| Free fallin', I'm-a free fallin'

S

Slo

Member
JABEE said:
Or a player is just down in that situation. Not sure how you would do it.
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I'm not sure either. Seems like I'm constantly seeing defenders aiming at hip-level but by the time contact is made the ball carrier has dropped their head to hip level.
 
D

Doominated

Member
TheCochese said:
There are many examples of players having to wait on the call or never getting it because their careers were cut short by injury. I don’t know of an example of what you suggested. A few voters have talked a little about the conversations that have taken place during these votes, and to my knowledge it hasn’t come up in that manner.

He seems like a great human being. AFAIK that isn’t going to come up in the voting.
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Has there ever been a case of a player as good as Watt not getting in because of an injury shortened career though?

Like TD is probably the closest example. Three all pro years, one all time great year. TD won an mvp award at running back, but so have 16 other players. TD made three all pro teams in a row, but so have almost a dozen running backs. TD won a super bowl mvp, but so have 6 other running backs. And at the end of the day, TD got in.

TD was great and his career was cut short, but he was never seen as some kind of head and shoulders above everybody best at his position kind of player. He had one year where he could make that argument, and it’s not like he was THAT much more dominant in that year than Barry Sanders or Emmitt Smith were during the 90s.

Watt’s 4 years were a level of dominance that has literally never been seen before. Nobody, not even Lawrence Taylor, has won 3 DPOY’s in 4 years. LT did 3 in 6.

Watt was also cut down literally in his prime. Yeah, it doesn’t mean anything in the sense that he has no additional numbers to show for it, but it’s very possible that we never even saw Watt at his absolute best. We saw a precursor, and it was arguably still the most dominant stretch for a defensive player the league has ever seen. That’s greatness. That’s what gets people into the Hall of Fame.

Dwight Freeny and Terrell Suggs are going to (deservedly) be first ballot hall of famers one day. Are we even going to try to pretend that either of them were ever even CLOSE to as good as Watt was from 2012-2015?
 
B

Basileus777

Member
The Texans aren't going to get back in this game running the option, but I suppose if they tried to air it out this would probably just get uglier.
 
C

captive

Joe Six-Pack: posting for the common man
Basileus777 said:
The Texans aren't going to get back in this game running the option, but I suppose if they tried to air it out this would probably just get uglier.
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Their offensive success the last two games have come from being successful running the ball and misdirection. Dropping back and throwing it with a rookie and this offensive line would be moronic and a disaster
 
B

Basileus777

Member
captive said:
Their offensive success the last two games have come from being successful running the ball and misdirection. Dropping back and throwing it with a rookie and this offensive line would be moronic and a disaster
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The former is basically conceding the game anyway.
 
C

captive

Joe Six-Pack: posting for the common man
Basileus777 said:
The former is basically conceding the game anyway.
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Meh of they can run it a little they can still throw the ball, there's plenty of time left. Also both Miller and Foreman are capable of hitting a home run on any play.

But the way the line is getting rocked right now that's a long shot.
 
T

TheCochese

Banned
Doominated said:
Has there ever been a case of a player as good as Watt not getting in because of an injury shortened career though?

Like TD is probably the closest example. Three all pro years, one all time great year. TD won an mvp award at running back, but so have 16 other players. TD made three all pro teams in a row, but so have almost a dozen running backs. TD won a super bowl mvp, but so have 6 other running backs. And at the end of the day, TD got in.

TD was great and his career was cut short, but he was never seen as some kind of head and shoulders above everybody best at his position kind of player. He had one year where he could make that argument, and it’s not like he was THAT much more dominant in that year than Barry Sanders or Emmitt Smith were during the 90s.

Watt’s 4 years were a level of dominance that has literally never been seen before. Nobody, not even Lawrence Taylor, has won 3 DPOY’s in 4 years. LT did 3 in 6.

Watt was also cut down literally in his prime. Yeah, it doesn’t mean anything in the sense that he has no additional numbers to show for it, but it’s very possible that we never even saw Watt at his absolute best. We saw a precursor, and it was arguably still the most dominant stretch for a defensive player the league has ever seen. That’s greatness. That’s what gets people into the Hall of Fame.

Dwight Freeny and Terrell Suggs are going to (deservedly) be first ballot hall of famers one day. Are we even going to try to pretend that either of them were ever even CLOSE to as good as Watt was from 2012-2015?
Click to expand...

I never once argued that Watt wasn't going to one day be in Canton. I just disagreed that he would go in on the first ballot, because even with the examples you gave, shortened careers are held against players. This is a known quantity. Short, but great careers aren't usually looked upon on the same level with very good and lengthy careers. TD did get in, but it took him a very long time.

Is it possible he gets in first ballot in 2022 (2023?) if that's the case? I suppose. You also have to look at who else is on the ballot, considering there's not unlimited spots. I don't think he's done, though. He's shown the drive and willingness to come back before, and he's in incredible shape, and he's fairly young. In the end, this argument will probably be moot because he;ll put in a handful more years in the top tier and be a lock.
 
G

Generate

Banned
"A tibial plateau fracture is a bone fracture or break in the continuity of the bone occurring in the proximal part of the tibia or shinbone called the tibial plateau; affecting the knee joint, stability and motion."
 
D

Doominated

Member
TheCochese said:
I never once argued that Watt wasn't going to one day be in Canton. I just disagreed that he would go in on the first ballot, because even with the examples you gave, shortened careers are held against players. This is a known quantity. Short, but great careers aren't usually looked upon on the same level with very good and lengthy careers. TD did get in, but it took him a very long time.

Is it possible he gets in first ballot in 2022 (2023?) if that's the case? I suppose. You also have to look at who else is on the ballot, considering there's not unlimited spots. I don't think he's done, though. He's shown the drive and willingness to come back before, and he's in incredible shape, and he's fairly young. In the end, this argument will probably be moot because he;ll put in a handful more years in the top tier and be a lock.
Click to expand...

Fair enough, I think I misread and thought you meant he wouldn’t be in the Hall no matter what, first ballot or not haha.
 
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