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NHL January 2015 |OT| A team wearing the Maple Leaf won something at the ACC

C

Coldnoodle

Member
Lone_Prodigy said:
Do any Caps fans see similarities between Kessel and Ovechkin? Both are incredibly talented goal scorers with questionable defensive abilities.

I assume Ovechkin has had trouble with his coaches; how many has he had in his career so far? Some tried to turn him into a two-way player, others gave him the green light to do whatever. But one consistent narrative is the lack of playoff success. Is it Ovechkin, his teammates, the system, or the coaching? Does coaching and management build a team around Ovechkin to maximize his abilities or is he just a cog in a wheel? Sometimes I've even seen "trade Ovechkin" articles when the team is struggling because he doesn't seem to fit in.

I think the same can be applied to Kessel. Do they design a team and system around getting Kessel to score enough goals to win games, or do they develop a team that possesses the puck and is solid at both ends of the rink, with Kessel expected to buy in?
Click to expand...

Ovechkin's 4th in playoff ppg and 1st in playoff gpg since he came into the league.

61 pts in 58 games.

Next closest teammate is Backstrom with 43 pts in 57 games.

The problem in Washington was the fact that McPhee never built around our star players.

He never believed in spending money on defensemen or getting a 2C behind Nicky.

Ironically the same problem Bouds had in Washington followed him to Anaheim except his GM got him Kesler while ours got Eric Belanger and fucking Brendan Morrison.

Also:

“Yeah, he is [coachable],” Hunter said today on Hockey Central (audio). “You know something though? He’s just – he’s not no Bob Gainey out there defensively… I’ve watched the last couple of games. Trotzy’s doing a good job with him. He’s picking up the right guys. So you need star players. They’re not all going to be Selke winners and he’s not going to be a Selke winner, but you still need goals and he’s trying to figure out his defense a little bit more and that’s the only thing that coaches sometimes question him a bit about.”

Hunter added that, when he was coaching the Capitals in 2011-12, Ovechkin “never said anything back to me. He never back-talked. He listened to the video. He never said nothing. So definitely he was coachable that way where he tried to do what I told him. He could have given me attitude – he had none. He listened.”
Click to expand...

Extra reading on why Adam Oates was the worst:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...c8ede6-c0f5-11e3-b195-dd0c1174052c_story.html
 
C

Cactus

Banned
I don't think Kessel is a coach killer. He's just a very enigmatic sniper that wants to do his thing without distraction. It's not like he's asking to be on the ice for entire powerplays or cherrypicking in the neutral zone while his teammates are playing D. If the Leafs had a bunch of other talented forwards, I don't think he would be targeted nearly as much by the media.

Basically, Carlyle 's moronic coaching was the team's biggest issue. Now that he's gone, focus will shift to the multitude of smaller issues. I think Kessel will adapt to whatever changes are made in the next year, but if he doesn't, that will be dealt with in time. Before that's even considered, it's time to improve the systems.
 
D

Dastardly Jerks

Banned
Cactus said:
I don't think Kessel is a coach killer. He's just a very enigmatic sniper that wants to do his thing without distraction. It's not like he's asking to be on the ice for entire powerplays or cherrypicking in the neutral zone while his teammates are playing D. If the Leafs had a bunch of other talented forwards, I don't think he would be targeted nearly as much by the media.

Basically, Carlyle 's moronic coaching was the team's biggest issue. Now that he's gone, focus will shift to the multitude of smaller issues. I think Kessel will adapt to whatever changes are made in the next year, but if he doesn't, that will be dealt with in time. Before that's even considered, it's time to improve the systems.
Click to expand...

HAHA YEAH GOOD ONE RANDY
 
R

Red_Man

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
Successful teams aren't built on wingers. Instead of trying to turn Kessel into the next Hossa, get him a true #1 C that can handle two way play.
 
Q

Quick

Banned
People say Kessel doesn't get along with pretty much any coach given to him, but it's been just the opposite in that he remains consistent in his production.
 
R

Red_Man

I Was There! Official L Receiver 2/12/2016
DopeyFish said:
sooooo.... kadri?
Click to expand...
They've put them together for a few games this season right? How did their numbers look? Why didn't they keep them together? Seems to be their only option right now, Leafs don't have the pieces to trade for a #1 C.
 
Z

zroid

Banned
I need Don Quick to tell me how to feel about this

Red_Man said:
They've put them together for a few games this season right? How did their numbers look? Why didn't they keep them together? Seems to be their only option right now, Leafs don't have the pieces to trade for a #1 C.
Click to expand...

sample size way too small to make any conclusions unfortunately. Carlyle sucks.
 
C

Coldnoodle

Member
Red_Man said:
They've put them together for a few games this season right? How did their numbers look? Why didn't they keep them together? Seems to be their only option right now, Leafs don't have the pieces to trade for a #1 C.
Click to expand...

I think they do but who's going to trade a #1C?
 
D

Dastardly Jerks

Banned
We need Marvie's Hot Take on the situation, but he's too busy playing INXS - Original Sin while stumbling around the loungeroom in his underwear and throwing empty bottles of Jack Daniels at a Roszival cardboard cutout.

Quick said:
People say Kessel doesn't get along with pretty much any coach given to him, but it's been just the opposite in that he remains consistent in his production.
Click to expand...

It's almost like Kessel is a good as heck player that produces a lot or something.
 
D

DopeyFish

Not bitter, just unsweetened
Red_Man said:
They've put them together for a few games this season right? How did their numbers look? Why didn't they keep them together? Seems to be their only option right now, Leafs don't have the pieces to trade for a #1 C.
Click to expand...

the only real time he's been on the ice with kessel this year is when they put him on the point on the PP a couple times
carlyle tried his best to never put kadri and kessel together
 
B

bonesmccoy

Banned
Red_Man said:
Successful teams aren't built on wingers. Instead of trying to turn Kessel into the next Hossa, get him a true #1 C that can handle two way play.
Click to expand...

Yep, but I don't see how the Leafs get a 1C without moving a cherished piece.

... or they could just put Kadri up there and tell him and Phil and JVR to make it work.
 
S

ShaneB

Member
Coldnoodle said:
The problem in Washington was the fact that McPhee never built around our star players.
Click to expand...

Just focusing on this because it's mainly what I was going to say. As much talent as Ovi can show at times, I've never felt like he's the sort of player that makes everyone around him better.

He can be the center piece of the team has they've been trying to do, but he needs every bit of help around him too.
 
M

Marvie_3

Banned
Dastardly Jerks said:
We need Marvie's Hot Take on the situation, but he's too busy playing INXS - Original Sin while stumbling around the loungeroom in his underwear and throwing empty bottles of Jack Daniels at a Roszival cardboard cutout
Click to expand...

tumblr_mt965cIeB91ruxwvqo1_500.png


YOU LEAVE MICHAL ROSZIVAL OUT OF THIS
 
D

Dastardly Jerks

Banned
Marvie_3 said:
YOU LEAVE MICHAL ROSZIVAL OUT OF THIS
Click to expand...

I DON'T SEE YOU *DENYING* THIS VERY PLAUSIBLE SITUATION, MARVIE.

*Fox News logo appears down bottom right*

ShaneB said:
Just focusing on this because it's mainly what I was going to say. As much talent as Ovi can show at times, I've never felt like he's the sort of player that makes everyone around him better.

He can be the center piece of the team has they've been trying to do, but he needs every bit of help around him too.
Click to expand...

Ovi makes Ovi better.
 
Z

zroid

Banned
this is a delightfully scathing piece on Carlyle and Nonis by Greg Wyshynski

my favourite part:
One possesses a melting snowflake longer than the Leafs possessed the puck. One watched in utter amazement as Carlyle gave ice time to Neanderthalic enforcers and chased away skill players like Mikhail Grabovski and Clarke MacArthur, both of whom criticized the Leafs’ style after their departure. One waited for this defense-minded coach to, you know, mind the defense.
Click to expand...
 
S

Sanjuro

Member
Charlie Jacobs at his press conference for his promotion to CEO of the Bruins shits on the team. Claude responds in the manner of "I'm already PAID, bitch!"

Krug and Marchand get into a fight at practice.

...

IT'S HAPPENING!
 
C

Coldnoodle

Member
ShaneB said:
Just focusing on this because it's mainly what I was going to say. As much talent as Ovi can show at times, I've never felt like he's the sort of player that makes everyone around him better.

He can be the center piece of the team has they've been trying to do, but he needs every bit of help around him too.
Click to expand...

He used to be that guy in his first five years or so :(

Check Chris Clark's and Dainus Zubrus' stats playing on a line with Ovi during his rookie and sophomore years.

Clark: 50 goals and 43 assists for 93 points in 152 games.

Rest of his career: 53 goals and 67 assists for 120 points in 455 games.

Zubrus: 43 goals and 66 assists for 109 points in 131 games.

Rest of his career: 180 goals and 290 assists for 470 points in 1071 games.

He was still that guy in 2010-11 when he had 53 assists but only 32 goals.

God I wish we had Forsberg.

EAT A DICK MCPHEE
 
A

Acid08

Banned
Coldnoodle said:
He used to be that guy in his first five years or so :(

Check Chris Clark's and Dainus Zubrus' stats playing on a line with Ovi during his rookie and sophomore years.

Clark: 50 goals and 43 assists for 93 points in 152 games.

Rest of his career: 53 goals and 67 assists for 120 points in 455 games.

Zubrus: 43 goals and 66 assists for 109 points in 131 games.

Rest of his career: 180 goals and 290 assists for 470 points in 1071 games.

He was still that guy in 2010-11 when he had 53 assists but only 32 goals.

God I wish we had Forsberg.

EAT A DICK MCPHEE
Click to expand...

Martin Erat!!!!!!!!

:(
 
K

Kave_Man

come in my shame circle
Whichever mod did this (I bet his names starts with a B) is a sad person.

With no championships at all from their hockey team!
 
L

lamaroo

Unconfirmed Member
Coldnoodle said:
He used to be that guy in his first five years or so :(

Check Chris Clark's and Dainus Zubrus' stats playing on a line with Ovi during his rookie and sophomore years.

Clark: 50 goals and 43 assists for 93 points in 152 games.

Rest of his career: 53 goals and 67 assists for 120 points in 455 games.

Zubrus: 43 goals and 66 assists for 109 points in 131 games.

Rest of his career: 180 goals and 290 assists for 470 points in 1071 games.

He was still that guy in 2010-11 when he had 53 assists but only 32 goals.

God I wish we had Forsberg.

EAT A DICK MCPHEE
Click to expand...

Everyone's stats were inflated that first season after the lockout.
 
S

ShaneB

Member
Coldnoodle said:
He used to be that guy in his first five years or so :(

Check Chris Clark's and Dainus Zubrus' stats playing on a line with Ovi during his rookie and sophomore years.

Clark: 50 goals and 43 assists for 93 points in 152 games.

Rest of his career: 53 goals and 67 assists for 120 points in 455 games.

Zubrus: 43 goals and 66 assists for 109 points in 131 games.

Rest of his career: 180 goals and 290 assists for 470 points in 1071 games.

He was still that guy in 2010-11 when he had 53 assists but only 32 goals.

God I wish we had Forsberg.

EAT A DICK MCPHEE
Click to expand...

I know I know, there are some stats to back up that he did have that in him, but none of it matters when the wins didn't come in the big moments. Not even with just the Caps too, Ovi's failure with the Russian teams have been glaring as well, just big time flops in the big moments.
 
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