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[Genio88]

There is rumours from LPVG that the dock will actually enhance the performance... In some way. Most likely like laptops that can have multiple performance modes depending what kind of power source you are using.

Ah now I understand, that doesn't mean that the dock has additional power at all(like Nintendo said), it's just that being the console plugged in the charger it could run the CPU at higher clock speed resulting in better performance, while when you are not charging it the CPU could run at lower clock to save battery, but again the hardware is all into the console, also if that's the case, it's possoble that, just like in laptops, Nintendo will allow to modify your power settings, so that the CPU would run at the highest clock available even when not plugged to the charger, of course that would mean having even worse battery life than Switch will already have

 

[Shogmaster]

Stoked about the RAM 'confirmation' -- 4GB for a Nintendo system is pretty good if you look at it in that context alone. All I'm thinking about is how much more games like Breath of the Wild can do with double the RAM when they are already breathtaking on the Wii U

4GB in retail Switch is fantastic IMO. It's max of what I expected from Nintendo in a mobile form factor for 2017.

 

[EDarkness]

Ah now I understand, that doesn't mean that the dock has additional power at all(like Nintendo said), it's just that being the console plugged in the charger it could run the CPU at higher clock speed resulting in better performance, while when you are not charging it the CPU could run at lower clock to save battery, but again the hardware is all into the console, also if that's the case, it's possoble that, just like in laptops, Nintendo will allow to modify your power settings, so that the CPU would run at the highest clock available even when not plugged to the charger, of course that would mean having even worse battery life than Switch will already have

I think that's the real question about that. We don't know if simply having it plugged into a power outlet will allow it to change the clock speed. It may need to be in the dock specifically for that to happen. We know that it can be charged outside of the dock, but whether or not that does anything is something we don't know yet.

 

[ShadowFox08]

I'm honestly a bit dissapointed. Sure that's fantastic for a handheld, but it looks to be even weaker to the current gen consoles then we thought. If we're lucky, it will be 2x as weak as xbone. sigh. It better be some fast RAM with a lot of bandwidth and edram, unlike the Wii U.

 

[Genio88]

4GB in retail Switch is fantastic IMO. It's max of what I expected from Nintendo in a mobile form factor for 2017.

Yes that should be enough to guarantee awesome first party titles, I just hope they did their counts right and left enough RAM for the OS, I want it to be smooth and quick to navigate, especially quicker to enter the Shop and Miiverse

 

[Genio88]

I think that's the real question about that. We don't know if simply having it plugged into a power outlet will allow it to change the clock speed. It may need to be in the dock specifically for that to happen. We know that it can be charged outside of the dock, but whether or not that does anything is something we don't know yet.

Yes indeed, we can just speculate right now, my guess is that it should increase the clock speed even when charging with a standard USB charger, cause I don't see that dock to have a technology which does something more than a standard charger

 

[Rolf NB]

Wasn't there a confirmation the dock would let the console know when it was sitting on it so it could run games natively as opposed to "handheld" mode where it would downclock and save battery and such?

Could have sworn I read it somewhere.

The handheld can figure out if it's docked without the dock doing anything in particular.

Just like a laptop can figure out it is connected to a charger without the charger doing anything in particular. With any generic-ass charger designed and made by someone else entirely.

Yes indeed, we can just speculate right now, my guess is that it should increase the clock speed even when charging with a standard USB charger, cause I don't see that dock to have a technology which does something more than a standard charger

I don't expect a standard USB connector will work for charging.

Alt implementation for the dock "informing" the handheld is two open contacts on the handheld shorted by a piece of wire on the dock. Bam. Technology.

 

[EDarkness]

Yes indeed, we can just speculate right now, my guess is that it should increase the clock speed even when charging with a standard USB charger, cause I don't see that dock to have a technology which does something more than a standard charger

Well, there's something going on in the dock since it has the HDMI ports and the USB ports. How it interacts with the main device is something I'm sure we'll find out in January. I still think that if they want this thing to a "console" then there should be some meaningful communication between the dock and the handheld part. It may know it's connected and adjust accordingly. Especially if it knows to turn off the screen and such. Of course, I'm just throwing stuff out there, but this "accessory" thing that they were talking about makes me wonder about that a bit.

 

[MuchoMalo]

I'm sticking with Nintendo having the A57 and Maxwell in the final unit. It's just their proven technology philosophy at work. They don't care about performance or efficiency as much as they care about knowing that stuff works, so Pascal, 16nm, and the A72 were all unrealistic from the start. It's a slightly modified X1 and nothing more. The best we can hope for is that the modifications they worked on were for the A53s to handle OS functions.

As for the time spent working on it from Nvidia, remember that Nvidia helped on the software side too, so that's included. Hell, maybe the X1's total development time was included. Also, the "top-performing" marketing drivel sounds a lot like when IBM claimed that the the tech behind Watson was powering Wii U; let's avoid falling for that again, shall we?

I'm honestly a bit dissapointed. Sure that's fantastic for a handheld, but it looks to be even weaker to the current gen consoles then we thought. If we're lucky, it will be 2x as weak as xbone. sigh. It better be some fast RAM with a lot of bandwidth and edram, unlike the Wii U.

The only option for RAM is LPDDR4. It's most likely 64-bit, so the 25 GB/s in the OP is the max unless they threw in eSRAM. If they did do that though, they're completely incompetent and truly obsessed with this "proven technology" bullshit.

 

[antonz]

I'm sticking with Nintendo having the A57 and Maxwell in the final unit. It's just their proven technology philosophy at work. They don't care about performance or efficiency as much as they care about knowing that stuff works, so Pascal, 16nm, and the A72 were all unrealistic from the start. It's a slightly modified X1 and nothing more. The best we can hope for is that the modifications they worked on were for the A53s to handle OS functions.

As for the time spent working on it from Nvidia, remember that Nvidia helped on the software side too, so that's included. Hell, maybe the X1's total development time was included. Also, the "top-performing" marketing drivel sounds a lot like when IBM claimed that the the tech behind Watson was powering Wii U; let's avoid falling for that again, shall we?

A72 was never realistic. Even Parker still uses the A57.

 

[Genio88]

I'm really curious about what battery did they put into Switch, for example my Nvidia Tegra K1 Xiaomi tablet has a 6700mah battery, and battery life is pretty solid, especially considering it has a bigger screen 7.9 vs 6.2 inch and a way higher resolution, 1536x2048 vs 1280x720p, also Switch looks quite thicker too, I hope they went big with that battery, speculation about 3 hours max could be not reflecting the retail version, the devkit should be clocked higher than it, and it has the dock already included in the tablet, so that could cause a worse battery life

 

[Roo]

The handheld can figure out if it's docked without the dock doing anything in particular.

Just like a laptop can figure out it is connected to a charger without the charger doing anything in particular. With any generic-ass charger designed and made by someone else entirely.

I don't expect a standard USB connector will work for charging.

Alt implementation for the dock "informing" the handheld is two open contacts on the handheld shorted by a piece of wire on the dock. Bam. Technology.

Anyway, this has really nothing to do with my initial question. I just said "docked mode" because I needed a name for it.

 

[Otakumegane]

With the amount of memory bandwidth LPDDR4 has anyway won't that result in a bottleneck and more than 4Gb of RAM be unnecessary? I mean unless we're willing to stomach longer load times.

 

[MuchoMalo]

A72 was never realistic. Even Parker still uses the A57.

Yup, exactly. People need to realize that Nintendo has never and will never truly care about being as efficient as possible.

I'm really curious about what battery did they put into Switch, for example my Nvidia Tegra K1 Xiaomi tablet has a 6700mah battery, and battery life is pretty solid, especially considering it has a bigger screen 7.9 vs 6.2 inch and a way higher resolution, 1536x2048 vs 1280x720p, also Switch looks quite thicker too, I hope they went big with that battery, speculation about 3 hours max could be not reflecting the retail version, the devkit should be clocked higher than it, and it has the dock already included in the tablet, so that could cause a worse battery life

Just accept Switch for what it is. It's not using Parker, so the battery life won't be better. And no, dev kits are not clocked higher than retail units. That's a myth.

 

[cinqpesetas]

I'm sticking with Nintendo having the A57 and Maxwell in the final unit. It's just their proven technology philosophy at work. They don't care about performance or efficiency as much as they care about knowing that stuff works, so Pascal, 16nm, and the A72 were all unrealistic from the start. It's a slightly modified X1 and nothing more. The best we can hope for is that the modifications they worked on were for the A53s to handle OS functions.

As for the time spent working on it from Nvidia, remember that Nvidia helped on the software side too, so that's included. Hell, maybe the X1's total development time was included. Also, the "top-performing" marketing drivel sounds a lot like when IBM claimed that the the tech behind Watson was powering Wii U; let's avoid falling for that again, shall we?

I don't know what Nvidia has put inside the switch but i imagine that the work of 500 engineers goes beyond making a custom X1 for Nintendo

But creating a device so fun required some serious engineering. The development encompassed 500 man-years of effort across every facet of creating a new gaming platform: algorithms, computer architecture, system design, system software, APIs, game engines and peripherals. They all had to be rethought and redesigned for Nintendo to deliver the best experience for gamers, whether they’re in the living room or on the move.

https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/

 

[Genio88]

I don't know what Nvidia has put inside the switch but i imagine that the work of 500 engineers goes beyond making a custom X1 for Nintendo

But creating a device so fun required some serious engineering. The development encompassed 500 man-years of effort across every facet of creating a new gaming platform: algorithms, computer architecture, system design, system software, APIs, game engines and peripherals. They all had to be rethought and redesigned for Nintendo to deliver the best experience for gamers, whether they’re in the living room or on the move.

https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/

Yes indeed, you are underestimating this Nvidia chip a bit too much, I'm not talking just about power but also about battery life and scalability, this will be the first Nvidia chip in a console after a while, and they surly want to do things right, it's gonna be a heavily custom chip, I trust them to do a great work

 

[EDarkness]

Yes indeed, you are underestimating this Nvidia chip a bit too much, I'm not talking just about power but also about battery life and scalability, this will be the first Nvidia chip in a console after a while, and they surly want to do things right, it's gonna be a heavily custom chip, I trust them to do a great work

This is my thought as well. I think they'll do a great job and that it'll turn out be something interesting in the end. This is why I think we will see current gen games on the system.

 

[MuchoMalo]

I don't know what Nvidia has put inside the switch but i imagine that the work of 500 engineers goes beyond making a custom X1 for Nintendo

But creating a device so fun required some serious engineering. The development encompassed 500 man-years of effort across every facet of creating a new gaming platform: algorithms, computer architecture, system design, system software, APIs, game engines and peripherals. They all had to be rethought and redesigned for Nintendo to deliver the best experience for gamers, whether they’re in the living room or on the move.

https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/

You're right. The thing is that both me and what you just quoted go into that already. The chip was only one of the things they worked on. Look at what you posted again:

"But creating a device so fun required some serious engineering. The development encompassed 500 man-years of effort across every facet of creating a new gaming platform: algorithms, computer architecture, system design, system software, APIs, game engines and peripherals. They all had to be rethought and redesigned for Nintendo to deliver the best experience for gamers, whether they’re in the living room or on the move."

So, basically, most of the time was spend on things other than the main SoC. It's that simple. It's literally what they're telling us here. A slightly modified X1 isn't only possible; it's the most logical outcome. If it were Pascal, Nvidia would not be so vague on the architecture.

 

[Zil33184]

Just accept Switch for what it is. It's not using Parker, so the battery life won't be better. And no, dev kits are not clocked higher than retail units. That's a myth.

Nintendo could possibly downclock the retail version in mobile mode. Since the TX1 level hardware isn't competitive with the other consoles to begin with, I'd rather have the extra battery life.

 

[Rolf NB]

Anyway, this has really nothing to do with my initial question. I just said "docked mode" because I needed a name for it.

Ok.
I think the term "docked mode" is totally appropriate. I was hanging myself up on the "dock informing something something" part, and expect them to solve the mode transition in the most technically trivial way imaginable.

Curious about the gap between docked and portable performance myself.
Is portable mode still a step up from Wii U?
What kind of step up from a Vita?

All we really know is that the amount of RAM is extraordinary for a handheld.

 

[NippleViking]

You're right. The thing is that both me and what you just quoted go into that already. The chip was only one of the things they worked on. Look at what you posted again:

"But creating a device so fun required some serious engineering. The development encompassed 500 man-years of effort across every facet of creating a new gaming platform: algorithms, computer architecture, system design, system software, APIs, game engines and peripherals. They all had to be rethought and redesigned for Nintendo to deliver the best experience for gamers, whether they’re in the living room or on the move."

So, basically, most of the time was spend on things other than the main SoC. It's that simple. It's literally what they're telling us here. A slightly modified X1 isn't only possible; it's the most logical outcome. If it were Pascal, Nvidia would not be so vague on the architecture.

Isn't it also possible that Nvidia simply doesn't want to associate their premium new tech with low performance (which relative to PCs and consoles, it will be)? May be reaching, but tech companies are often very sensitive about how their products are perceived.

 

[LordKano]

Just accept Switch for what it is.

Just like we needed to accept that the NX wouldn't be revealed until January, and that it was going to be as or even less powerful than the Wii U, and a bunch of other things from all the past NX threads that ended to be bollocks.

 

[BBboy20]

I think her source is in NTD or Nintendo in general. All/most of her info is very internally focused.

It's almost like somebody doesn't want to be laid off or be stuck working on mobile if things go south again.

I think Wii U allocated 1 gig for the OS, but it never actually used it.

Wait, what?

In NERD I trust, their Wii U browser is stellar.

True dat.

 

[Durante]

So now the leakers have come around to this? Interesting.

15 pages ago some people were telling me that these specs are totally unrealistic

For a Nintendo system? Very real.

At least, nothing in the specs in the OP screams fake to me like so many other "leaks" do.

 

[ShadowFox08]

And let me be clear that I'm mainly upset about how it will affect 3rd party publishers/devs being on board with this. I wonder how the 3rd party ports will look. At the very least, the ports can't be half assed. They should have all the content. Also 720p games with worse textures galore. >_>

From a console perspective, merely being 3x more powerful is hardly significant if at all.

Something tells me this Switch will be one of multiple devices though.. Meaning there could be different versions with more power and focused on home(like PS4 Pro). I'm not really believing in the SCDs at this point.

 

[oti]

And let me be clear that I'mmailny upset about how it will affect 3rd party publishers/devs being on board with this. I wonder how the 3rd party ports will look. At the very least, the ports can't be half assed. They should have all the content. Also 720p games with worse textures galore. >_>

From a console perspective, merely being 3x more powerful is hardly significant if at all.

Something tells me this Switch will be one of multiple devices though.. Meaning there could be different versions with more power and focused on home(like PS4 Pro). I'm not really believing in the SCDs at this point.

Nintendo Home
Nintendo Switch
Nintendo GO

 

[Dagobert Duck]

Wait we know that NERD makes the OS?

 

[EDarkness]

Isn't it also possible that Nvidia simply doesn't want to associate their premium new tech with low performance (which relative to PCs and consoles, it will be)? May be reaching, but tech companies are often very sensitive about how their products are perceived.

Or it could be some custom thing that doesn't fit nicely in any of their categories. Doesn't mean it's not a nice piece of tech at the end of the day (or a crappy one, for that matter). I trust Nvidia to do a good job with this, though. They have a lot at stake here so I imagine they want to get the details right.

 

[Schnozberry]

If it were Pascal, Nvidia would not be so vague on the architecture.

It's not their information to reveal. They said what was allowable within their NDA. We found out after this statement that we wouldn't hear any hardware specs until January. Using your logic, they could have just said it was the TX1. It's an already released product that they'd have no vested interest in hiding.

 

[Vampirolol]

Wait we know that NERD makes the OS?

No, I'm confident they are at least making the browser though.

 

[TwilightPrincess]

And let me be clear that I'mmailny upset about how it will affect 3rd party publishers/devs being on board with this. I wonder how the 3rd party ports will look. At the very least, the ports can't be half assed. They should have all the content. Also 720p games with worse textures galore. >_>

From a console perspective, merely being 3x more powerful is hardly significant if at all.

3x more powerful with a much more modern tech, no power pc, more and faster ram, it would be significant.

 

[ASIS]

Nintendo Home
Nintendo Switch
Nintendo GO

So if switch is go + home doesn't that mean Nintendo Switch = Nintendo Go Home?

 

[vern]

No, I'm confident they are at least making the browser though.

Why?

 

[ElTorro]

And let me be clear that I'mmailny upset about how it will affect 3rd party publishers/devs being on board with this. I wonder how the 3rd party ports will look. At the very least, the ports can't be half assed. They should have all the content. Also 720p games with worse textures galore. >_>

I still believe that the Switch will be a machine for remasters.

The primary reason so many third-partys are on board is not that they are going to port all their upcoming games to the Switch. They will begin by porting all their PS360 remasters and see where things go from there. And for remasters the specs are fine. For ports of new (performance-pushing) releases? Not so much. CPU and memory limitations alone will prohibit it, especially in mobile mode.

 

[oti]

I still believe that the Switch will be a machine for remasters.

The primary reason so many third-partys are on board is not that they are going to port all their upcoming games to the Switch. They will begin by porting all their PS360 remasters and see where things go from there. And for remasters the specs are fine. For ports of new (performance-pushing) releases? Not so much. CPU and memory limitations alone will prohibit it, especially in mobile mode.

Yup. I can see Skyrim, Shadow of Mordor, Saint's Row etc. on this. Just older games that people would want to play (again) on the go. Publishers have to be smart about allocating their resources. Pouring everything into this machine would be bad Business for them. It makes sense.

Conclusion: If you want stable 3rd party support, buy those remasters.

 

[jaina]

I still believe that the Switch will be a machine for remasters.

The primary reason so many third-partys are on board is not that they are going to port all their upcoming games to the Switch. They will begin by porting all their PS360 remasters and see where things go from there. And for remasters the specs are fine. For ports of new (performance-pushing) releases? Not so much. CPU and memory limitations alone will prohibit it, especially in mobile mode.

A portable version would be enough of a USP to get plenty of people to double-/triple-dip, so I expect those ports as well.

 

[Durante]

Prediction: If you want stable third party support, don't depend on the Nintendo Switch as your only gaming platform.

 

[N.Grim]

Nintendo Home
Nintendo Switch
Nintendo GO

Nintendo Go Home, you are Switch

 

[EDarkness]

Yup. I can see Skyrim, Shadow of Mordor, Saint's Row etc. on this. Just older games that people would want to play (again) on the go. Publishers have to be smart about allocating their resources. Pouring everything into this machine would be bad Business for them. It makes sense.

Conclusion: If you want stable 3rd party support, buy those remasters.

Wait...isn't Shadow of Mordor a current generation game? If they were going to do that, then why not just port more recent games, too? I can understand what you're saying if you're talking about games that were 360/PS3 ports.

 

[oti]

Prediction: If you want stable third party support, don't depend on the Nintendo Switch as your only gaming platform.

Oh that too. Why would one limit themselves to this weird machine anyway if a PS4 is 200€ at this point.

 

[nikatapi]

Prediction: If you want stable third party support, don't depend on the Nintendo Switch as your only gaming platform.

I think everyone knows and expects that. But hopefully stronger support than the WiiU will be there.

 

[ElTorro]

Yup. I can see Skyrim, Shadow of Mordor, Saint's Row etc. on this. Just older games that people would want to play (again) on the go. Publishers have to be smart about allocating their resources. Pouring everything into this machine would be bad Business for them. It makes sense.

Conclusion: If you want stable 3rd party support, buy those remasters.

The Switch is really benefitting from the trend towards remasters. Without that trend I don't think that the third-party situation would different from the one on the Wii U when it comes to home console games.

Personally, I am absolutely fine with it. The Switch fits perfectly into my current life situation. I am staying in hotels four days a weeks, and going through my large last-gen backlog on a portable device powerful enough to run old games at stable frame rates and with reasonable IQ sounds great.

Everything beyond that will depend on the Switch's success. But I'd not expect too much.

 

[KingBroly]

Wait, what?

I meant all of it. I don't think Wii U's OS took ever took up the entire 1 gig it was allocated.

 

[michaelius]

Prediction: If you want stable third party support, don't depend on the Nintendo Switch as your only gaming platform.

Yeah - I don't see most of current big AAA games making it to switch. It will have 3rd party support that is sum of 3DS+Vita+Wii U third parties plus more releases of indie games.

 

[oti]

Wait...isn't Shadow of Mordor a current generation game? If they were going to do that, then why not just port more recent games, too? I can understand what you're saying if you're talking about games that were 360/PS3 ports.

Sure. WB and Nintendo worked together for the Wii U as well so there could be another deal here. Just an older game that people would still buy today.

 

[KratosEnergyDrink]

If it were Pascal, Nvidia would not be so vague on the architecture.

NVidia is not allowed to tell technical details now, obviously.

It was already clarified that the "leaks" in the OP are fake. The would be "leaker" only mentions the technical data from a standard x1 kit, that everyone can buy, has nothing to do with the Nintendo Switch.

 

[EDarkness]

Sure. WB and Nintendo worked together for the Wii U as well so there could be another deal here. Just an older game that people would still buy today.

If we're going that route, then Batman Arkham Knight would be a better candidate. I think people still like that game and Nintendo systems have gotten pretty much all the recent Batman games except that one. I wouldn't even be surprised if that game was announced in January.

Still, I think it all comes down to sales. If games sell well and are of good quality for people to buy, then I think they'll do fine. I'm even confident that the hardware will run current games fairly well, too. Gotta admit, I'd love to see something like FFVII:R on it. On top of that, if FFXV is released on the NS, I'd definitely pick that up as well.

 

[vern]

NVidia is not allowed to tell technical details now, obviously.

It was already clarified that the "leaks" in the OP are fake. The would be "leaker" only mentions the technical data from a standard x1 kit, that everyone can buy, has nothing to do with the Nintendo Switch.

Where was it clarified that it was fake?

 

[LordKano]

Where was it clarified that it was fake?

She never knew anything about the Switch.

 

[oti]

If we're going that route, then Batman Arkham Knight would be a better candidate. I think people still like that game and Nintendo systems have gotten pretty much all the recent Batman games except that one. I wouldn't even be surprised if that game was announced in January.

Still, I think it all comes down to sales. If games sell well and are of good quality for people to buy, then I think they'll do fine. I'm even confident that the hardware will run current games fairly well, too. Gotta admit, I'd love to see something like FFVII:R on it. On top of that, if FFXV is released on the NS, I'd definitely pick that up as well.

Wii U's pitch for PlayStation owners was intriguing but not enough. "You can play while watching something on TV" is fine, but not enough. Switch as a full handheld is a way more intriguing device.