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No one started a topic on the "...it's pretty much a white, christian party."

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Republicans are fuming! They can't believe a leader of another party would drop rhetorical bombs on their majority coalition! Have they no deceny?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8142785/

Dean told a forum of journalists and minority leaders Monday that Republicans are “not very friendly to different kinds of people, they are a pretty monolithic party ... it’s pretty much a white, Christian party.”

They want his head! But remember, electing Democrats means Al-Qaida is coming to get you!

:lol :lol
 
DarienA said:
bah... he's right.

The words sound funny but it's the truth. I dare someone to say inclusion and the republican party in the same sentence, and mean it. Can anyone tell me where the lie is in that statement?
 

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
Tommie Hu$tle said:
The words sound funny but it's the truth. I dare someone to say inclusion and the republican party in the same sentence, and mean it.
Believe it or not there is a real perception out there that the GOP is more inclusive than the Democratic party, with groups such as Log Cabins.... but of course the obvious reality is that even if such people are welcomed into the GOP, the party on a national level is currently whoring itself out to one group while ignoring all others: rich white christian fundamentalists.
 

Rocket9

Member
All the topics in the world can be resumed by a Family Guy quote

"Check it out Lois, the 2 symbols of the republican party: An elephant and a big fat white guy threaten by change"
 
Terrifyingly true.....that's why they're upset.

He really should have added "straight" to it.

White, straight, christians are the real power of the Right Wing...and the true source of its Hypocrisy.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
Rocket9 said:
All the topics in the world can be resumed by a Family Guy quote

"Check it out Lois, the 2 symbols of the republican party: An elephant and a big fat white guy threaten by change"

:lol :lol I obviously got started watching this show late.... that's a great quote.

ManDudeChild said:
Well yeah, that much is ovbious, but it's still low to take that kind of a cheap shot.

As an middle upper class black man I don't see it as a cheap shot, I just see it as a true statement that's gonna piss folks off because they know it's true and just don't like seeing it publically dragged out in the open like that.
 

impirius

Member
YEEEEEEEEEAAAAAARGH

I'd say that neither party has very much diversity of viewpoints, but it seems that the Democrats less open than the Republicans, if only for the Democratic Party's 'glass ceiling' when it comes to anti-abortion politicians. People in glass houses, etc, etc

Regardless of your take on that, Dean's speech contained the kind of boneheaded statements that exemplify a lot of what's wrong with politics in America. It's going to lead to a ton of partisan sniping which will ultimately accomplish nothing.

Being DNC Chairman is a different job than being a wacky maverick politician, and I'm not sure Dean is ever going to realize the difference.
 
triste said:
Is he really the best they can do?

and is raising record amounts of money.

Evidently so. He just didn't take the position, he was voted in. I'm glad he's firing back at Republicans, although I wish the occasional stray Democrat who gets cold feet and feels the need to broadcast that he "doesn't agree with Dean's assesment" would instead STFU.
 
impirius said:
YEEEEEEEEEAAAAAARGH

I'd say that neither party has very much diversity of viewpoints, but it seems that the Democrats less open than the Republicans, if only for the Democratic Party's 'glass ceiling' when it comes to anti-abortion politicians. People in glass houses, etc, etc

The Senate minority leader is a pro-lifer. There is no glass ceiling concerning abortion, just the right to privacy.
 

bjork

Member
Incognito said:
Evidently so. He just didn't take the position, he was voted in. I'm glad he's firing back at Republicans, although I wish the occasional stray Democrat who gets cold feet and feels the need to broadcast that he "doesn't agree with Dean's assesment" would instead STFU.

Oh, I'm all for calling a spade a spade, I just figured he was still in the shits over that yelling thing a year or two ago.

What happened to Kerry, did they just skip over him completely?
 
triste said:
Oh, I'm all for calling a spade a spade, I just figured he was still in the shits over that yelling thing a year or two ago.

What happened to Kerry, did they just skip over him completely?

Kerry or any Senator was never considered for the job, and historically speaking for both parties, they never are. Plus, Kerry still has a job in the Senate.
 
impirius said:
YEEEEEEEEEAAAAAARGH

I'd say that neither party has very much diversity of viewpoints, but it seems that the Democrats less open than the Republicans, if only for the Democratic Party's 'glass ceiling' when it comes to anti-abortion politicians. People in glass houses, etc, etc

On a grand scheme of things this is true. There is a glass ceiling when it comes to many things in politics.

impirius said:
Regardless of your take on that, Dean's speech contained the kind of boneheaded statements that exemplify a lot of what's wrong with politics in America. It's going to lead to a ton of partisan sniping which will ultimately accomplish nothing.


Was it the statement or the tone that you take issue with? The statement is true no bones about that. However I would agree I think the Dean should take a position at the table that is focused on getting Democrats to offer solutions to the problems that exist in America. That would be a better use of democratic resouces. Hating Republicans is old hat. Hating by itself lost the democrats the White House. Focus on solutions.
 

ronito

Member
sbs050607.gif
 

akascream

Banned
Hitokage said:
Believe it or not there is a real perception out there that the GOP is more inclusive than the Democratic party, with groups such as Log Cabins.... but of course the obvious reality is that even if such people are welcomed into the GOP, the party on a national level is currently whoring itself out to one group while ignoring all others: rich white christian fundamentalists.


I would consider 'whoring intself out' to be more of a pandering approach. Wait a second....
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
Tommie Hu$tle said:
Hating Republicans is old hat. Hating by itself lost the democrats the White House. Focus on solutions.

Well said, well said.
 

akascream

Banned
It's going to lead to a ton of partisan sniping which will ultimately accomplish nothing.

That's the beauty of our system =P. When they agree, they spend money and limit freedoms. I hope they loath each other forever. If we can count on one thing, it's human nature and the need for contention. Our forefathers were either brilliant or incredibly lucky! =)
 
Incognito said:
The Senate minority leader is a pro-lifer. There is no glass ceiling concerning abortion, just the right to privacy.
Gosh, I remember the outroar on liberal sites over his ascension because of his anti-abortion views.

Anyways, anyone reading newspaper accounts of Reid becoming leader would see how the writers mentioned his anti-abortion stance in the first parts of the articles...
 
I personally have no problems with the statement, but if something comprable was said of the Democratic party, I believe a larger fuss would've been made. They are usually the ones to get up in arms about political incorrectness.
 

whytemyke

Honorary Canadian.
ManDudeChild said:
Well yeah, that much is ovbious, but it's still low to take that kind of a cheap shot.

Bullshit. The GOP wrote the book on cheap shots, and if the DNC ever wants to win an election again, they're gonna have to play by the GOP rules. Bush dropping rumors that McCain fathered a bastard black child days before the Georgia party vote? puh-lease.

at least this kind of statement can be thoroughly proven with polling data.
 

sonicfan

Venerable Member
Incognito said:
More so than ever. He's the Chairman of the DNC and is raising record amounts of money.

Well, the DNC is falling behind big time in the money raising game. The head of the RNC is out fund raising Dean 2 to 1. I predicted the other day before this came out to a friend that Dean won't last a month. It's not over his mouth, but over his lack of fund raising.

Howard Dean's Raised Voice Isn't Raising Cash

One hundred days into his tenure as the high-energy, higher-decibel chairman of the Democratic Party, Howard Dean is in trouble with party moneybags. The former Vermont governor seems to be doing a better job flaying the Republicans than bridging the cash chasm between the parties. Given Dean's 2004 run as a populist crusader, moderates were never wild about his takeover of the Democratic National Committee. So some big donors are sitting on their wallets.

Dean wowed the faithful in '04 with his Web-based fund-raising magic. But major business donors still count, and in his new role as party honcho, the feisty doctor seems to be struggling to connect. After achieving money parity with the GOP in 2004, Democrats have fallen far behind. According to the Federal Election Commission, the DNC raised $14.1 million in the first quarter of 2005, vs. the Republican National Committee's $32.3 million. Dean drew about 20,000 new donors, while his rivals picked up 68,200. The bottom line: Republicans have $26.2 million in the bank vs. $7.2 million for the Dems.

Why the yawning gap? For starters, Dean is not a natural fit for the "stroke and joke" style that traditional party chiefs use to extract cash from well-heeled contributors. "It appears that the chairman has come to the conclusion that he doesn't need major donors," sniffs one fat cat. "He hasn't made any effort to reach out."

Personality factors aside, Dean's business-bashing '04 campaign makes him a hard sell in corporate circles. "There's a wait-and-see attitude from business and major contributors," says Nathan Landow, a Maryland developer and big-time donor. "This guy has some work to do to get the comfort level up." William W. Batoff, a Philadelphia real estate developer and longtime Democratic fund-raiser who backed President Bush in 2000 and 2004, is less diplomatic. "Howard Dean is the wrong person to be chair," says Batoff, who claims he will help fund the Dems' congressional efforts but will boycott the national committee while Dean reigns.

"Kind of a Dustpan"
Recent evidence of big-donor discomfort: A DNC event scheduled for May 25 at Manhattan's cavernous Jacob K. Javits Convention Center was scaled back to a smaller venue at the Essex House hotel. Bridget Siegel, the DNC's New York finance chair, says the event was moved because the new room "just worked better."

According to his defenders, Dean is doing just fine in the money wars. Internet and direct-mail appeals have started pulling in $1 million a week, says party spokeswoman Karen Finney, and the chairman "is pleased overall with [the pace of] fund-raising." Former DNC Chair Steve Grossman, a close ally, says Dean "is becoming more comfortable with [asking for money] by the day." Dean may yet find ways to build bridges to reluctant donors, but few think he'll ever be another Terry McAuliffe, the human money machine whom he replaced. "McAuliffe was like a vacuum cleaner," says Rutgers University political scientist Ross K. Baker. "Dean is kind of a dustpan."

He may be no McAuliffe, but Dean defenders note that his predecessor's golden cash register was accompanied by stinging setbacks at the polls. The new boss represents the grassroots' desire to take the fight to the Republicans. That he's doing. Still, unless Dean narrows the huge cash disparity, he may not be able to build the political dynamo he promised.

By Eamon Javers and Richard S. Dunham
 

impirius

Member
Incognito: Point taken. For some reason, Reid's breakthrough completely slipped my mind when I was making my above post. Dunno why; I was pretty happy about it!

I still hold that on the whole, the Democratic Party has no more room to brag about welcoming a diversity of viewpoints than the Republican Party.

akascream: A fan of the "Government Shutdown", were you? ;)
Tommie Hu$tle said:
Was it the statement or the tone that you take issue with? The statement is true no bones about that. However I would agree I think the Dean should take a position at the table that is focused on getting Democrats to offer solutions to the problems that exist in America. That would be a better use of democratic resouces. Hating Republicans is old hat. Hating by itself lost the democrats the White House. Focus on solutions.
Both. The statement is based in truth, but Dean decided to go for the quick and easy overgeneralization. Is it going to change anyone's mind? Democrats will cheer, Republicans will balk, and the only thing that changes is that partisans have one more non-issue to bicker about.

About offering solutions instead of hating: AMEN. *standing ovation* This is what's missing from both parties. Stances are often defined by saying, "those other guys are wrong!" (Exhibit A: Bush's Social Security non-plan) I'd rather hear about why the alternative is right.
 
impirius said:
About offering solutions instead of hating: AMEN. *standing ovation* This is what's missing from both parties. Stances are often defined by saying, "those other guys are wrong!" (Exhibit A: Bush's Social Security non-plan) I'd rather hear about why the alternative is right.


Agreed. What people don't seem to realize is that the status quo keeps the polices we don't like in power and that is exactly what people that have the lead on both sides are hoping for. Resloution and agreement put them out of a job.
 
I blogged about this over at Political Plumage .

I really wish people would take a look at the rest of the comment and not just the white Christian remark. Dean is attempting to whittle away at the GOP "brand" in an era where politics and advertising go hand in hand in election cycles.

His message: The GOP desire complete conformity but will happily use you for votes if you want to give them to us. Just don't expect us to change for you, unless your voting block gets so important-then it's PANDERING XTREME time.

There's no "big tent" in the GOP. There's a very small tent with a lot of people in it, and the rest of the people are getting rained on but just don't choose to notice.
 
sonicfan said:
Well, the DNC is falling behind big time in the money raising game. The head of the RNC is out fund raising Dean 2 to 1. I predicted the other day before this came out to a friend that Dean won't last a month. It's not over his mouth, but over his lack of fund raising.

Howard Dean's Raised Voice Isn't Raising Cash

Uhh, Republicans always outraise the Democrats. In fact, last year's election was the first time in quite awhile that the Democratic Party actually outraised the Republicans and ended up with money in the bank.

As for Dean and his fundraising:

Despite the polemics that were sure to follow Dean's assuming the role of party chairman, his primary duty is to raise money. Though the Republican National Committee has raised money at a rate of 2-to-1 on Democrats in the first quarter of 2005, Dean himself has been effective. In the first four months, under Dean's stewardship, the DNC has raised nearly $19 million -- more than under any other Democratic chairman in an off-election year.
 
Hito: Yah, I finally got around to it last night. My GF kept telling me that if I did, at least 1/2 of the stuff on it would have to be environmental issues because she can't stand US politics. Which is fine with me, because there's always something interesting to talk about.

Cheesy but fun.

One of the side effects of Dean's latest remarks is that he's keeping the attention on him and not on stuff in the Senate. That's buying some cover for the Senate and the House caucuses to get some things done "under the radar".
 

Dan

No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
On the other hand, it seems Republican Senators are having a field day with these comments and touting Janice Rogers Brown's nomination as evidence that they're an open party. "Ooh, look, we like this black woman and you're the ones protesting her." The Dems counter with a speech from Obama trying to put the focus back on her decisions and statements.
 

iapetus

Scary Euro Man
e pluribus scrotum said:
hating didnt hurt the democrats nor did a lack of Solutions. what hurt them was that they didn't Hate As Good as the republicans Did.

Quoted for truth, justice and the American way.
 
The point is that if they were really a party that wasn't mostly white Christians, then they wouldn't have to play the pony show with their token minorities. Sure, it's nice to have ethnically diverse appointees, but what about actual politicans? That's where the rubber meets the road.

Furthermore, what are the Republicans going to say to refute that? That they aren't a party of white people, all alike? Please, this has been something that comedians have made fun of for years and that everyone knows but few people are willing to talk about directly. Identity politics without proper codewording gets the media's attention FAST.
 

DarienA

The black man everyone at Activision can agree on
Sokar said:
Racism only applies when it's muttered by whites against insert ethnitic minority here.

That's the truth.

Actually no it's not... nice try though... Blacks screamed racism when the President of Mexico made a comment a bit back...
 

AssMan

Banned
More so than ever. He's the Chairman of the DNC and is raising record amounts of money.


Too bad he doesn't speak for all democrats. I think Dean is an idiot and the things he said about Rush Limbaugh(even though I don't like him) were mostly lies.
 
Sokar said:
Racism only applies when it's muttered by whites against insert ethnitic minority here.

That's the truth.

Uh dominant Southeast Asians have long discriminated against highland groups who don't act or look the same. In fact, some, like the Hmong, have paler skin than the lowland groups.

Or how about the discrimination that Japanese have against darker skinned people?

Or how about the historical racism between the blacks and the Indians in Peru?
 
DarienA said:
Actually no it's not... nice try though... Blacks screamed racism when the President of Mexico made a comment a bit back...

Does that change the perception of racism being exclusive to whites in North America? Nope. Every ethnicity can be racist, but the PERCEPTION is that whites and ONLY whites can be racist.

Hammy said:
Uh dominant Southeast Asians have long discriminated against highland groups who don't act or look the same. In fact, some, like the Hmong, have paler skin than the lowland groups.

Or how about the discrimination that Japanese have against darker skinned people?

Or how about the historical racism between the blacks and the Indians in Peru?

I'm talking about the concept of racism in America. The perception is that racism is exclusive to whites. It certainly isn't as you have pointed out.

Is there something wrong with the fact the Republican party for the most part is made of white Christians? Dean thinks so, that's the problem with his statement.
 
Sokar said:
Does that change the perception of racism being exclusive to whites in North America? Nope. Every ethnicity can be racist, but the PERCEPTION is that whites and ONLY whites can be racist.

I'm talking about the concept of racism in America.
Really? Then why did you say that, "racism only applies when it's muttered by whites against insert ethnitic minority here"? Is your view so US-centric that the incredibly broad word "only" applies only to the US?

The perception is that racism is exclusive to whites. It certainly isn't as you have pointed out.
Again, are we talking about just the US or the world?

Anyways, that question is moot. I'll give you an example of things I've seen in my life called out as racist:
1. Korean shopkeepers against blacks and vice-versa (remember the LA riots?)
2. Philipino doctors not trusting blacks because of their skin
3. Asian parents who have problems with their kids dating black or Latino kids (but not white)

And no, this isn't some secret. The first was definately in the news. The second two are common knowledge in my circle of acquaintainces.

Is there something wrong with the fact the Republican party for the most part is made of white Christians? Dean thinks so, that's the problem with his statement.
Where does he say that? Kind of ironic considering he's a white Christian himself.
 

Macam

Banned
Sokar said:
Is there something wrong with the fact the Republican party for the most part is made of white Christians? Dean thinks so, that's the problem with his statement.

When you match the current Republican agenda with that assertion, there IS something wrong with that.
 
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