Eteric Rice
Member
TheGreatDave said:
Not to mention we've been showing "emotion" etc, since the SNES. Though, we did it through simpler means.
It's also funny because most emotion and whatnot in RPGs are shown through CG now adays.
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NPD Hardware Sales Results for February 2007
- Thread starter sonycowboy
- Start date
Not to mention we've been showing "emotion" etc, since the SNES. Though, we did it through simpler means.
It's also funny because most emotion and whatnot in RPGs are shown through CG now adays.
plagiarize
Banned
just for all the people that go 'if you compare the first x months of the 360 to the first x months of the PS3'...
the same was said in defense of the original Xbox, which tracked ahead of the PS2 for it's first five months... but it didn't matter because the PS2 outsold them by a substantial margin every month. that's all anyone saw.
what matters isn't how a console is selling compared to another console a year ago, but how a console is selling *right now*.
publishers don't make that comparison. the only people that do are fanboys (and i guess Sony PR, but they have an excuse, it's their job). fanboys can't make or break a system. publishers on the other hand...
every month the 360 outsells the ps3, the gap between the systems *increases*, and what any system sold a year ago doesn't change that.
to catch up you have to start outselling what the other systems are doing *today*.
the same was said in defense of the original Xbox, which tracked ahead of the PS2 for it's first five months... but it didn't matter because the PS2 outsold them by a substantial margin every month. that's all anyone saw.
what matters isn't how a console is selling compared to another console a year ago, but how a console is selling *right now*.
publishers don't make that comparison. the only people that do are fanboys (and i guess Sony PR, but they have an excuse, it's their job). fanboys can't make or break a system. publishers on the other hand...
every month the 360 outsells the ps3, the gap between the systems *increases*, and what any system sold a year ago doesn't change that.
to catch up you have to start outselling what the other systems are doing *today*.
pixel monkey
Banned
dark10x said:
I can understand and agree with what you're saying...to a point. Gears is absolutely friggin' gorgeous, and it did raise the bar.
But, man...Zelda was just so phenomenal. It was the game we'd all been waiting for since that Spaceworld tease and it ABSOLUTELY met (and exceeded) all my expectations. Even graphically, I thought it was quite beautiful. Artistically speaking.
Best not to fire it up right after a round of Gears though, certainly. :lol
Pureauthor
Member
17 pages.
Sheesh.
Sheesh.
plagiarize
Banned
but, if it wasn't for high sales of more mass market games driving the platform, the PS2 wouldn't have received as many games like Shadow of the Colossus.dark10x said:
Merovingian
Banned
TheGreatDave said:
Yeah that's why they are called VIDEOgames.
Don't like Videogames? Go play board games, or some football.
I like videogames and games, thats why i play chess, practice sports (football), and play videogames.
Souldriver said:
Yeah let's ban the guy that doesn't share our opinion. Let's ban the guy that is worryed about his favority hobbie going to a place he doesn't want to.
Yeah...that's really awesome.
First 12 months (still currently slated for Wii):Shig said:
Zelda: TP
Wario Ware Smooth Moves
Super Paper Mario
Fire Emblem: Goddess of Dawn
BWii
Super Mario Galaxy
Metroid Prime 3
Dragon Quest Swords
Wii Sports
Super Smash Brothers Brawl
I'm also leaving off Animal Crossing which is scheduled to be released in Japan this year but probably not NA/Europe, and I'm leaving off some lower-profile games that have been well received here (Excite Truck and Trauma Center for instance). We have sequels to all four of Nintendo's core console franchises, new games in three other franchises (four if you count SPM), and a major S-E release. This is about on par with what the Cube got out of these franchises throughout its lifespan, with the exception of Metroid Prime getting an extra game on the Cube.
This is not a weak line-up.
Eteric Rice
Member
Merovingian said:
They're games that play on your television... Cripes, man.
And Go > Chess.
Hi first post here just trying to enlighten:
Courtesy of Morgan Stanley Research:
March 14, 2007
Sony
Strategy in Game Business
Quick Comment
Conclusion: We attended the game business
presentation given by Sony Computer Entertainment
Chairman and group CEO Ken Kutaragi, President and
group COO Kazuo Hirai, and Deputy President and
group CFO Masaru Kato. There were no new
announcements, but some light was shed on (1) the
long-term possibilities for PS3, and the stance on (2)
game semiconductor investment and (3) PS3 sales
price and penetration.
Highlights: Our reading of CEO Kutaragis message on
PS3 was (1) that unlike the standalone consoles of the
PS1 and PS2 generations, this is built on an open
platform linked to networks, and that (2) as a result, the
potential market that can be created is incomparably
larger than that of PS1 and PS2. No one believed
originally that the hardware up to the PS2 generation
would sell more than 100 million units. He emphasized
that it is no surprise to hear skepticism about the PS3s
success at this stage. Kutaragis tone was bullish as
usual, but we had the impression that there will not be
excessive investment in the next-generation platform.
Similarly, regarding semiconductor investment there
were comments that business models in the game
industry which allow growth through miniaturization are
confined to memory. The suggestion was that this is not
a model Sony should follow in this business, since it
would bring massive investment in memories. This is
consistent with what emerged from the recent briefing
on semiconductor business strategy.
For the PS3 hardware sales and pricing strategy, SCE
indicated that as with PS2 the hardware sales volume is
critical, and that with an elastic pricing model it would
lower prices at the optimal times. Transparency for
memory prices has improved since the PS2 era,
however, and we glimpsed confidence about hardware
cost reductions. On the other hand, the company did say
too that it would not chase volume to the extent of incurring
large losses on hardware.
Implications: Our impression was that there is a clear division
of managerial responsibilities, with CEO Kutaragi charged with
exploring the limits of PS3 business potential and COO Hirai
focusing on the operational side, including PS2 and PSP.
Indications are that the life of PS3 can be extended a long way,
and that investment in the next generation represented by PS4,
including semiconductors, is an extremely low possibility. The
business model is to be founded on networks, and Kutaragi
closed by saying that software and services are seen as future
revenue streams.
Courtesy of Morgan Stanley Research:
March 14, 2007
Sony
Strategy in Game Business
Quick Comment
Conclusion: We attended the game business
presentation given by Sony Computer Entertainment
Chairman and group CEO Ken Kutaragi, President and
group COO Kazuo Hirai, and Deputy President and
group CFO Masaru Kato. There were no new
announcements, but some light was shed on (1) the
long-term possibilities for PS3, and the stance on (2)
game semiconductor investment and (3) PS3 sales
price and penetration.
Highlights: Our reading of CEO Kutaragis message on
PS3 was (1) that unlike the standalone consoles of the
PS1 and PS2 generations, this is built on an open
platform linked to networks, and that (2) as a result, the
potential market that can be created is incomparably
larger than that of PS1 and PS2. No one believed
originally that the hardware up to the PS2 generation
would sell more than 100 million units. He emphasized
that it is no surprise to hear skepticism about the PS3s
success at this stage. Kutaragis tone was bullish as
usual, but we had the impression that there will not be
excessive investment in the next-generation platform.
Similarly, regarding semiconductor investment there
were comments that business models in the game
industry which allow growth through miniaturization are
confined to memory. The suggestion was that this is not
a model Sony should follow in this business, since it
would bring massive investment in memories. This is
consistent with what emerged from the recent briefing
on semiconductor business strategy.
For the PS3 hardware sales and pricing strategy, SCE
indicated that as with PS2 the hardware sales volume is
critical, and that with an elastic pricing model it would
lower prices at the optimal times. Transparency for
memory prices has improved since the PS2 era,
however, and we glimpsed confidence about hardware
cost reductions. On the other hand, the company did say
too that it would not chase volume to the extent of incurring
large losses on hardware.
Implications: Our impression was that there is a clear division
of managerial responsibilities, with CEO Kutaragi charged with
exploring the limits of PS3 business potential and COO Hirai
focusing on the operational side, including PS2 and PSP.
Indications are that the life of PS3 can be extended a long way,
and that investment in the next generation represented by PS4,
including semiconductors, is an extremely low possibility. The
business model is to be founded on networks, and Kutaragi
closed by saying that software and services are seen as future
revenue streams.
Souldriver
Member
No, that's called TV.Merovingian said:
The problem that is still haunting Nintendo is the utter lack of anything worth playing from 3rd parties. I don't see why people are crying foul in a Nintendo dominated future when they have yet to demonstrate an ability to support 3rd parties...couple that with the fact that games sell (1st and 3rd parties) on the 360 like gangbusters that it doesn't matter.Souldriver said:
If you're a Nintendo fan, none of this matters as you will be happy with what Ninty offers...hence a "Gamecube-Like line up" with little to no 3rd party games worth playing.
dark10x said:
Actually my question about playing everything on a crappy TV was a serious one. It depends, of course, on how much you value not being annoyed by the graphics in God of War 2 and all the othe last gen and Wii games as opposed to the reward you get from the next graphics hit.
Eteric Rice
Member
3rdman said:
If it's anything like the DS... BRING ON THE NINTENDO FUTURE!
Pureauthor
Member
dark10x said:
...Why do you think others (the sane people, anyway), are in this thread?
plagiarize
Banned
the quirky and unique games will go wherever the mass market sales go though... believe.dark10x said:
Pureauthor
Member
Merovingian said:
You want to know why?
Because in this very thread, someone else is sharing the exact same sentiments that you do, only he does so in a manner open to conducive debate.
You, however, do not.
So you guys destroyed my hobbie for 8 years with this whole graphic stuff and nothing really new...Merovingian said:
Wii does something for me that no other system could
Why would your opinion really matters to me?
All you have to do is not buy the damn system...
Just like i did with PS2/Xbox/GC..
pixel monkey
Banned
plagiarize said:
Let's hope that translates to a widescreen 480p Okami on the Wii.
norinrad21
Banned
dark10x said:
Thats alright, Its Nintendo. wii doesn't cost much and i'm waiting for a 360 price drop. I can not go wrong with Nintendo/Microsoft
TheGreatDave
Banned
Merovingian said:
They're called videogames because they output a video signal. Not because they're something that should make me put the controller down and watch a 5 minute, poorly acted cutscene.
I'm not totally opposed to story in games, I'm exagerating. But the fact is I don't think graphics are as important as people make out for the simple reason I don't really care what I see, as long as I'm having fun.
plagiarize
Banned
pixel monkey said:Let's hope that translates to a widescreen 480p Okami on the Wii.
Pureauthor
Member
plagiarize said:
As far as I'm concerned, this is the correct direction for the indust - I mean, this thread.
speculawyer
Member
NHL 2K7 says "Hi!"hadareud said:
dark10x said:
You realize that one thing the HD gaming is doing is pretty much crushing those out with an iron first, at list in the full game form (the only ones being produced at all are platform-holder's prestige projects... all two of them).
Remember beginning of Xbox? It had quite a few unique games there - from PD Orta to Deathrow. Look at 360? Where are they now? Third parties just cannot afford an HD sized flop nowdays.
Next gen may be defended on other grounds, but sorry, not on the grounds of quirky and unique games.
Boilerbird
Member
Didn't we have this very same argument in the PSP/DS wars, back when they were competitive? "OMFG NON-GAMES ARE RUINING THE INDUSTRY," etc. etc.?
In all honesty, Sony, and to a much lesser extent Microsoft, have advanced technology to the point where it's no longer feasible for the average game consumer to purchase one of their consoles. People here are complaining that the rise of Nintendo means that there won't be any new advances in hardware. That isn't true. It just means advances in hardware will, in the future, more closely follow what consumers will pay for that hardware.
In short, the market can't support Sony's $600 price. That much is blatently obvious. HD graphics and enhanced DVD (Blu-ray) should've been released when Sony could price it at $300/console. The Wii pretty much came in and took Sony's market, because Sony decided not to sell to their market anymore.
In all honesty, Sony, and to a much lesser extent Microsoft, have advanced technology to the point where it's no longer feasible for the average game consumer to purchase one of their consoles. People here are complaining that the rise of Nintendo means that there won't be any new advances in hardware. That isn't true. It just means advances in hardware will, in the future, more closely follow what consumers will pay for that hardware.
In short, the market can't support Sony's $600 price. That much is blatently obvious. HD graphics and enhanced DVD (Blu-ray) should've been released when Sony could price it at $300/console. The Wii pretty much came in and took Sony's market, because Sony decided not to sell to their market anymore.
I always did say to wait and see how the Wii sold in the non holiday months, because recent Nintendo hardware spiked in Nov/Dec and sold average to waaaay below average in Jan/Oct. Seems like Wii has eclipsed the 'fad' stage, and is here to stay.
Dark10x I think you are worrying too much and completely underestimate the Xbox 360. I don't know why 3rd party publishers will start bailing out anytime soon. It actually looks like the market may be shifting into two different directions, and both succeeding. Perhaps the market is expanding indeed. Look at all the heavy hitter games that are selling on Xbox 360, do you really think they would have the same impact on Wii? No they would not. Publishers know this, and software sales on Xbox 360 are amazingly strong so while the Wii is doing fantastic, it isn't going to impact the 360 that much. Of course if you truly only meant PS3 when talking about next gen visuals then I can see why you are disappointed, but the X360 is more than capable enough of holding its own alongside the PS3 and support is not going to dry up anytime soon.
Dark10x I think you are worrying too much and completely underestimate the Xbox 360. I don't know why 3rd party publishers will start bailing out anytime soon. It actually looks like the market may be shifting into two different directions, and both succeeding. Perhaps the market is expanding indeed. Look at all the heavy hitter games that are selling on Xbox 360, do you really think they would have the same impact on Wii? No they would not. Publishers know this, and software sales on Xbox 360 are amazingly strong so while the Wii is doing fantastic, it isn't going to impact the 360 that much. Of course if you truly only meant PS3 when talking about next gen visuals then I can see why you are disappointed, but the X360 is more than capable enough of holding its own alongside the PS3 and support is not going to dry up anytime soon.
Pureauthor
Member
Can anyone in the know tell me if technology depreciates at a faster rate than inflation?
Because if so, theoretically we could have bigger jumps every generation in hardware at the same pricepoint... or something.
Because if so, theoretically we could have bigger jumps every generation in hardware at the same pricepoint... or something.
Kabuki Waq
Member
the only problem i have with Nintendo in the lead is i dont want future machines to go for the weakhardware + gimmicky/novelty factor.
**** that shit. Wiimote has not demonstrated that the control scheme is so revolutionary that it makes up for last gen graphics. In I find the Wiimote to be pretty unresponsive with a lot of games.
**** that shit. Wiimote has not demonstrated that the control scheme is so revolutionary that it makes up for last gen graphics. In I find the Wiimote to be pretty unresponsive with a lot of games.
Merovingian
Banned
Souldriver said:
That doesn't even make any sense. You watch a videogame as much as you play it. I'm sorry if like to get connected to what i'm doing on a bigger level than just doing math on my head. Sorry if ever since the PS1 i trully fell in love for videogames, because here it was, a medium that would let you experience adventures, be a hero, a medium that would be the next step in interactive entertainment.
Sorry if i want more than tetris and super mario bros. I trully am sorry. Sorry if i don't want to feel disconnected from the world in a videogame. But i aknowledge that i do have very different opinions from the normal nintendo fan, just the other day some nintendo fan in this board was saying how Online gaming didn't matter. And that just....it confuses me.
See i don't believe that coming home and not spending time with my family or go out and spend more time with my friends, playing sports and whatever...to play what i believe is a very very minimalistic game, specially when you add in the factor of no online, is a good thing. The only kind of games that are a good excuse to do that for me, are the ones that get me involved in some way, either by how awesome the damm online multiplayer is, wich will actually make me play it with friends, or if the single player is an immersive edge of your seat experience.
There's very simple examples to illustrate this. GRaw 2 on the 360, i loved that game, it was immersive and fun...i can't imagine that game working on the Wii. Because the Wii doesn't have the capability to deliver that kind of experience.
It's a very simple example of a game that isn't close to being the best game of the year or anything like that. Trauma Center? Excite truck? Its the kind of games that i would see me playing in home when i was a kid, or now in my DS when i'm out of the house and want to kill some time.
If this passes as a troll post, if i am banned because i state my honest opinion of what i think, my hobby should be like...well, what can i say? You guys can be there saying what you want, saying how the future should be like, and then a guy comes in and says "No, i don't want it to be like that" and suddenlly he's the problem, he doesn't belong here.
I'm sorry but when i come to this forum i don't see "Nintendo World" in the front page. I own every console on the market because i can, and i only buy the games worth buying, i'm not a defender of any console, i'm a defender of games and features, and sorry if yesterday i had a smile on my face because the future of the industry seemed exciting, and now it doesn't.
I'm terribly sorry.
Pureauthor
Member
Mononofu
Member
(Today, 11:13 PM)
*shifty eyes*
Hey, I see it.
At least, I think I see it...
Addressed this already. Great game, but you don't have to buy a Wii to play it. Just as much a feather in GC's cap as it is in Wii's.The Sphinx said:
Disappointing.
Looking forward to it, but I have a strange sense it may be another for the "disappointing" column.
Okay.
Doesn't have a favorable pedigree, does not qualify as a "solid" release.
Looks aces.
May not be 2007.
May not be 2007 in US.
As I said, only relevant in multiplayer, and even then gets dull pretty fast. If it was sold seperately from the system, I'd pass.
May not be in 2007.
No, it's not. But it's not ZOMG far and away better than the GC's entire library like you were making it out to be.
plagiarize
Banned
so you want it to go with the higher price point to pay for a feature most people don't need route? (HD stuff... it applies to the 360 too).Kabuki Waq said:
Boilerbird
Member
Kabuki Waq said:
Read my post above. The problem is that "next-gen" graphics have gotten too expensive for the average consumer. They'll buy into full HD when it doesn't cost an arm and a leg.
Everyone who's willing to pay $600 for ultra-realistic sweat on their NBA Live players will just have to deal.
sonycowboy
Member
My take
DS: I'm am still stunned by the DS performance. Almost 500k units in February. I know there were shortages, but DAMN! Given that the PS2 is still selling well in the US and Europe after 6 1/2 years, it probably won't have the longevity to pass the PS2. But, it's certainly had the best 2 year performace ever.
Wii: The Wii is still supply constrained and right now, looks like the system to beat in all 3 regions. It's clearly #1 in Japan and Europe and I don't doubt once it gets past it's shortages in the US that it will still have high demand and be ahead of the 360, at least until a price drop.
PS2: Still great numbers and still not at $99. This system will end up selling 130M units by the time this generation is over.
360: A good showing. The number in and of itself isn't great, but it is February and these system has been @ $400 for 16 months now, it's doing quite well.
PSP: Good HW numbers, given it's now at 2 years with no real price drop, but as we all know SW numbers are horrible. At this point, I see no reason for publishers to do anything with the system. There's absolutely no reward and significant risk.
GBA: Slowing down, but still putting money in Nintendo's pockets.
PS3: Worse than anyone could have imagined months ago. I felt it would be bad, but still bumped up my prediction to 160k. I was going to go with 150k. Motorstorm, F1, & Oblivion will likely severely underperform as they aren't going to sell systems and from what I've heard, March sales are just as bad as February's to this point. Only a price drop might help, but a) I don't know if Sony can afford it and b) I don't know how much still having a $500 system is going to help as the premium is what folks think they want.
IMO, the DS and the Wii are the next-gen leaders by a fairly large margin. 360 may have the installed base, but the Wii has ALL of the momentum and could pass the 360 by the end of the year easily. Things can change, but I don't see how Sony being able to significantly better their competitive issues in 2007 and just hope they can stay in the Wii & 360's rear view mirror.
DS: I'm am still stunned by the DS performance. Almost 500k units in February. I know there were shortages, but DAMN! Given that the PS2 is still selling well in the US and Europe after 6 1/2 years, it probably won't have the longevity to pass the PS2. But, it's certainly had the best 2 year performace ever.
Wii: The Wii is still supply constrained and right now, looks like the system to beat in all 3 regions. It's clearly #1 in Japan and Europe and I don't doubt once it gets past it's shortages in the US that it will still have high demand and be ahead of the 360, at least until a price drop.
PS2: Still great numbers and still not at $99. This system will end up selling 130M units by the time this generation is over.
360: A good showing. The number in and of itself isn't great, but it is February and these system has been @ $400 for 16 months now, it's doing quite well.
PSP: Good HW numbers, given it's now at 2 years with no real price drop, but as we all know SW numbers are horrible. At this point, I see no reason for publishers to do anything with the system. There's absolutely no reward and significant risk.
GBA: Slowing down, but still putting money in Nintendo's pockets.
PS3: Worse than anyone could have imagined months ago. I felt it would be bad, but still bumped up my prediction to 160k. I was going to go with 150k. Motorstorm, F1, & Oblivion will likely severely underperform as they aren't going to sell systems and from what I've heard, March sales are just as bad as February's to this point. Only a price drop might help, but a) I don't know if Sony can afford it and b) I don't know how much still having a $500 system is going to help as the premium is what folks think they want.
IMO, the DS and the Wii are the next-gen leaders by a fairly large margin. 360 may have the installed base, but the Wii has ALL of the momentum and could pass the 360 by the end of the year easily. Things can change, but I don't see how Sony being able to significantly better their competitive issues in 2007 and just hope they can stay in the Wii & 360's rear view mirror.