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[Ocaso]

I'm probably gonna get shit for this but considering that the Wii U is essentially the Wii HD Pachter was completely on the money. The Wii U should have hit the market in 2010 at the latest.

I'm a Nintendo fan but I'm not gonna sugarcoat the reality that this console is in a pretty desperate situation. Nintendo have my sympathies however. What can a company do in a situation like this. Western developers just aren't interested. Even the colossal success of the Wii couldn't cultivate a friendly ecosystem for their titles.

I agree, actually. Had the WiiU launched a couple of years earlier as the WiiHD without a Gamepad, it might have better capitalized on the success of the Wii brand while still providing the upgraded processing power the devoted gamer wanted. Obviously it would have been bereft of the Gamepad, but it now seems clear that that's an innovation that isn't firing up the passions of the casual audience in quite the same way.

As for what they can do, I can't imagine anything short of a 3DS-style price drop could give the system a significant boost, but that's hard to imagine if the system actually is selling at a loss.

 

[Kyon]

Yep. Just a couple of the reasons why Vita is in a way worse place. I can't fathom who outside of Sony would work on a non-Sony funded Vita project.

Platform is on life support.

I spot some lies

There are plenty of 3rd party vita games already announced and being released this year. Not going to go into how much they will flop but yeah.

 

[Codeblue]

The "But at least Wii U/Vita isn't doing as terrible as Vita/Wii U" conversation just makes both look worse the more the comparisons drag on.

 

[SolarPowered]

What are you listening to? I missed it the first time.

This thread moved so fast that I mistakenly posted twice. This is what happens when you try to edit in here.

 

[Duxxy3]

Does Nintendo put out NPD PR every month? I hope so...

Can't wait for Nintendo Family levels of spin.

They do when it's possible to spin it.

 

[Nekofrog]

Yep. Just a couple of the reasons why Vita is in a way worse place. I can't fathom who outside of Sony would work on a non-Sony funded Vita project.

Platform is on life support.

Vita is a secondary, maybe even tertiary thought to Sony. The PS4 is going to be their pride and joy and their major focus for the next 5+ years.

You know, like the Wii U should have been for Nintendo. Instead, they put it on the backburner in favor of "saving" the 3DS.

 

[Kusagari]

The Vita appeals to nobody but the most hardcore gamers - which is why it's loved by GAF and myself as well.

I have no idea what Sony was thinking with the thing. They probably don't know either.

 

[Aquamarine]

So, the 3DO and the CD-i don't count, but rentals do?

That's some Kung Lao kind of spinning.

Regardless, I believe him when it comes to non-VB major consoles from the 90's onward.

I'm fearing that the Wii U will only hit something like 10 million WW at this point.

 

[Parham]

Times like these make me wish the old Luke Smith era 1UP Yours podcast was still around.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

When a poorly conceived console with no games flops out of the gate? Sounds like a good sign for the video game market.

Not that one can't point out reasons for 3DS, Vita, and Wii U to struggle out of the gate, but in general, it's not a good sign for the industry. I don't think they spell doom for a well-designed piece of hardware that is marketed well, but it also doesn't signal that people are just chomping at the bits to run out and buy new hardware.

 

[Dunlop]

The free ride is over Nintendo. Time to start giving a shit once again.

ding ding ding

Not sure wtf Nintendo was thinking with the Wii-U, they had a window of a year before the next xbox/playstation come out to get a foot hold.

They hype for the PS4 will be crazy in less that a week and MS is sure to follow

 

[leatherhat]

Yep. Just a couple of the reasons why Vita is in a way worse place. I can't fathom who outside of Sony would work on a non-Sony funded Vita project.

Platform is on life support.

You could easily say the same thing about third parties and WiiU. At least vita is getting some third party support. And if it fails sony doesn't care, its not part of its plans. If wiiU fails nintendo is really screwed.

 

[Delusibeta]

Ain't gonna happen.

The wii U is just not a compelling purchase. It repackages wii/3ds games with current gen graphics and an esoteric controller interface that adds few truly novel experiences. It was destined to fail, and it was obvious from the lack of mainstream buzz that it would.

While I'd be hesitant to say they will do as badly as the WiiU (55k? In five weeks? In the US? Yikes), I honestly think that there's no market for a $400+ box that sits under the TV any more, especially considering for similar money you can buy a tablet that does everything except run Call of Duty, and honestly I'd expect CoD to stick around the PS360 generation for a couple more games (gotta get maximum money out of that Quake 1 engine licence, after all). I also doubt that people will be willing to spend $400+ for a new box just for Call of Duty. This generation transition might be the thing that finally kills off that franchise if Activision isn't careful.

 

[Lambda Pie]

No, it's not.

this. it's an indicaton the Wii U is screwed, nothing more.

 

[jay]

I've been wishing for Nintendo to get a black eye and bloody nose in the industry due to my fervent disagreement with their business practices for the past 5 years, but not sure if I was wishing for numbers like that...

This is all your fault.

 

[rdrr gnr]

wrong. Watch Dogs, next-gen CoD and Bungie's Destiny alone will be enough to get the ball rolling. The reason the WiiU is doing so shit is because there's nothing for core gamers and non-gamers don't give a shit about it. Casual gamers (the CoD fanbase) don't care either.

I actually think the next-generation will sell less total than this gen (~70 million for each console) but you're right. No one gives a shit about the Wii U nor should they -- same goes for Vita.

 

[brochiller]

Averaging it out, that's 35 WiiU's per day, per State.

Wow. That really puts things in perspective.

 

[Hana-Bi]

I wonder if Nintendo could have done anything to keep the Wii audience hooked on Nintendo though. Or that Wii was just a flash in a pan. Doomed to fail after the initial hype. Which is hard to believe at 100 million sold.

I think most of the audience thought that this is just a Wii with a tablet. And for "just" this, they won't pay any dollar more. And Nintendo gave them no reason why they should consider it...

 

[Plinko]

The "But at least Wii U/Vita isn't doing as terrible as Vita/Wii U" conversation just makes both look worse the more the comparisons drag on.

Sadly, both of them are holding hands and slowly heading toward the assisted living home.

 

[Nekofrog]

This is all your fault.

I DIDN'T KNOW.


I. DIDN'T. KNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW.

 

[Kyon]

You could easily say the same thing about third parties and WiiU. At least vita is getting some third party support. And if it fails sony doesn't care, its not part of its plans. If wiiU fails nintendo is really screwed.

.

I agree with everything

 

[dreamer3kx]

I recently picked up a WiiU and Vita. : (

But Im happy with both so far so all is good.

 

[Sohter.Nura]

The question is, can a small company like Nintendo take the failure of the Wii U?

They don't have too much income besides the Wii U and 3DS, do they?

 

[Relix]

Yeah, fuck it... I am not buying a WiiU until we get a price drop and stable games come to it. Its dead in the water right now. =/

 

[Baconsammy]

What about the Vita doing worse and being a better conceived console with games?

If you're looking to me to agree that the Vita was any more well conceived than the Wii U, you're going to be disappointed.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

And the Vita deserves its place just as much too. Way too expensive for a dedicated handheld in the post smartphone/tablet market and terrible anti-consumer memory card storage situation. And most of the games being ps3 ports.

Vita got where it is by it's own accord.

I'd hardly say those issues justify its sales.

 

[Byakuya769]

While I'd be hesitant to say they will do as badly as the WiiU, I honestly think that there's no market for a $400+ box that sits under the TV any more, especially considering for similar money you can buy a tablet that does everything except run Call of Duty, and honestly I'd expect CoD to stick around the PS360 generation for a couple more games (gotta get maximum money out of that Quake 1 engine licence, after all).

A tablet in no way, shape or form does the primary things that leads to the purchase of $400 game systems.

 

[Plinko]

Wow. That really puts things in perspective.

I'm puzzled as to what that math is referring to.

 

[Aquamarine]

The question is, can a small company like Nintendo take the failure of the Wii U?

They don't have too much income besides the Wii U and 3DS, do they?

If the Wii U completely bombs, we're not seeing another major home console by Nintendo.

 

[PhoenixDawn]

I know it's been said before in this thread, but honestly what in the FUCK was Nintendo doing during the years leading up to Wii U? They certainly weren't putting out much of an effort towards Wii, which seemed to bode well for Wii U, but now we're seeing that they apparently spent that time doing jackshit instead of working on a big ticket game to release AT LAUNCH (not in this ~6 month "launch window" crap they've been trying to pull).

 

[Sandfox]

You could easily say the same thing about third parties and WiiU. At least vita is getting some third party support. And if it fails sony doesn't care, its not part of its plans. If wiiU fails nintendo is really screwed.

If the Wii U were to fail Nintendo would either just go back to the drawing board or put more money and resources into their portables.

 

[open_mouth_]

WiiU failed (so far) due to a variety of factors:

1. Customer Confusion (many think it's an expansion tablet to the Wii)

2. Poor naming. Wii 2 or Super Wii would have been better. Not too late to change btw.

3. Poor Marketing (including #1 and #2). Nothing on TV or news to make people excited.

4. Increased entertainment competition

5. Poor economic situation compared to 5 years ago

6. No true Killer launch app and nothing on the immediate horizon

7. Poor 3rd Party support out of the gate and projected

The last two gaming system launches have "failed" and 3DS almost did too early on. Doesn't bode well for PS4/720. Probably not a good time for even less consumer friendly practices or pricing...

 

[Branduil]

Holy fuck, isn't 55K like... worse than Gamecube levels? I'm not usually part of the whole "Nintendo is Doomed" thing, but this is gonna be a hell of a lot harder to turn around than the 3DS. Even with strong sellers like Mario Kart, Super Smash Bros, and Zelda, the Gamecube still ended up at around 20 million, and at least the Gamecube actually made money till it's price got slashed to 99$.

I apologize in advance if the below just sounds like incoherent rambling, I'm not really that well versed in the business side of video games. Its just that 55K just sounds so terrible that even I feel like I should say my 2 cents here!

I know comparing Nintendo to Sega isn't usually that accurate, but I do wonder if the Wii U could end up being sorta like the Sega Saturn, as in it gets killed off relatively early to make way for it's successor. Granted, I expect the Wii U to do way better than the Saturn sales wise, and I THINK Nintendo is in a far better financial situation than Sega was at the time (not sure though, I usually don't pay too much attention to this kind of stuff), but still, selling worse than the Gamecube did at this point is pretty dire. If Nintendo were to do that though, I'd really hope that they don't end up putting out the equivalent of the Dreamcast (or worse, the Wii U ends up being like the Dreamcast)!

I guess a less drastic approach would be to find some sort of way to relaunch the Wii U in a more appealing package. While the lack of Software is probably the biggest reason the sales are hitting these kinds of record lows, I don't think "Panic Mode Nintendo" alone can turn this around like the 3DS, especially since if I recall, the Wii U isn't making a profit on day 1. I almost wonder if Nintendo should do something crazy like relaunch the Wii U with a totally different controller concept, and make the gamepad just a wacky accessory. Normally I'd think that's a terrible idea (and it might still be!) due to splitting up what the user base can play, but at the same time... the tablet concept (as much as I love it) just doesn't seem to be very appealing to the general public. With the possibility of sales getting even WORSE in the near future, I wonder if the risk of splitting up the early user base could be worth it. Of course, the big issue with this approach is that Nintendo would have to come up with a new controller that has a similar sort of wide appeal that the Wiimote had, but also isn't just a retread of the Wii, and that is honestly quite a tall order!

One huge difference between Nintendo and Sega is that Nintendo still has their handheld dominance. It makes it much easier for them to deal with a failed home console, among other things.

 

[plantedunicorn]

The Wii U numbers are really terrible. The thing is what can Nintendo do to fix it and how fast can they fix it? They had a year on the other consoles and it looks like it won't benefit them at all.

The next few months of the Wii U are going to be really interesting to watch.

 

[I'm an expert]

Pachter right, as usual.

 

[Meier]

That Kevin Dent dude has only ever played games on the 360 and PC. His bias seems far too obvious for his accuracy to not be questioned.

(http://raptr.com/Chemmet/about?type=tw_sessiondigest)

 

[MikeE21286]

You could easily say the same thing about third parties and WiiU. At least vita is getting some third party support. And if it fails sony doesn't care, its not part of its plans. If wiiU fails nintendo is really screwed.

Who is Vita getting support from in the West? I know Japan has done some stuff in the past and has a couple very niche titles upcoming after Soul Sacrifce, but it seems slim to none outside of that.

 

[Strike]

Really terrible Wii U and Vita numbers. Summer is not going to be pretty.

 

[lenovox1]

So, the 3DO and the CD-i don't count, but rentals do?

That's some Kung Lao kind of spinning.

I think he meant that no major console has ever had a worse January in the US than the Wii U. The Wii U has had a stronger first three months than some other platforms in the US, but this 55,000 number is unprecedented.

 

[Scum]

The question is, can a small company like Nintendo take the failure of the Wii U?

They don't have too much income besides the Wii U and 3DS, do they?

I think they can. But don't expect a home console from them if that happens.

 

[Version 3.0]

Problem with Wii U is that it's basically a Wii, with third party support that's just as bad

Worse. Far worse. At least the Wii had a few decent games and franchise spin-offs thrown its way, along with a mountain of second-rate (to be polite) games. It had quantity, at the very least.

I think announced 3rd-party Wii U retail games, at this point, is <20 titles, several of which are ports of games already out.

 

[Kusagari]

I know it's been said before in this thread, but honestly what in the FUCK was Nintendo doing during the years leading up to Wii U? They certainly weren't putting out much of an effort towards Wii, which seemed to bode well for Wii U, but now we're seeing that they apparently spent that time doing jackshit instead of working on a big ticket game to release AT LAUNCH (not in this ~6 month "launch window" crap they've been trying to pull).

This honestly is the best question to ask. It's mind-blowing when you think about it.

The Wii has been basically abandoned by Nintendo for 2+ years and they can't even get a game like Pikmin 3 out in the Wii U launch window.

What the FUCK were they doing indeed?

 

[Ydahs]

Bloody hell. 55K?

Such a shame too since the console has massive potential. Though, I can't help but feel that Nintendo had this coming.

- Bad, confused marketing with no direction (Wii... U?)
- Rushed launch (firmware fiasco)
- Ports everywhere (no incentive for PS360 only owners to dive in)
- Development hell (final dev kits received just prior to launch)
- Four month gap between major releases (... no words)


It seems that Nintendo learned absolutely nothing from the 3DS launch. In fact, they've gone backwards.

 

[Father_Brain]

3DS and Vita are both arguably 2011 products designed for the handheld market as it existed in 2006/2007.

The difference is that Nintendo had popular handheld-friendly first-party IP to fall back on, won over most of the major Japanese third parties before the system even launched, and had the sense not to overengineer the system to the point where they couldn't afford to cut the price below $250 in the first year. Sony had no such cushion for error, with predictable results.

 

[Delusibeta]

A tablet in now way, shape or from does the primary things that leads to the purchase of $400 game systems.

It does everything else better, especially considering Microsoft's well-publicised entertainment strategy which kinda falls apart when you realise it hinges on a $60/year subscription to get stuff that's free on tablets.

 

[evangd007]

If the Wii U completely bombs, we're not seeing another major home console by Nintendo.

Eh. Sega put out one more after the Saturn.

 

[Madao]

To be fair it probably will surpass the GBA in Japan at least with it almost certainly having a longer life cycle, whether it tops the PSP isn't quite as certain but still fairly likely.

the GBA did 15 million in about 4 years in japan, 3DS is outpacing that since it has 10 million in 2 years. by 4, it should be at 20 or more (considering the upcoming games)

3DS's real trouble has been outside japan so far mostly since it hasn't taken off like GBA or DS over here.

 

[Baconsammy]

If the Wii U completely bombs, we're not seeing another major home console by Nintendo.

Maybe it just means we won't see another major home console from Nintendo with outdated hardware and incredibly anti-consumer e-commerce policies. That would be a win.

 

[Coolwhip]

I know it's been said before in this thread, but honestly what in the FUCK was Nintendo doing during the years leading up to Wii U? They certainly weren't putting out much of an effort towards Wii, which seemed to bode well for Wii U, but now we're seeing that they apparently spent that time doing jackshit instead of working on a big ticket game to release AT LAUNCH (not in this ~6 month "launch window" crap they've been trying to pull).

That's what I am wondering as well. With the mountain of money they made of Wii, Nintendo should have expanded like crazy. Iwata knew Nintendo had to carry the Wii successor, but did nothing to make that happen. I like Iwata, but he made a lot of mistakes.

 

[orioto]

The question is, can a small company like Nintendo take the failure of the Wii U?

They don't have too much income besides the Wii U and 3DS, do they?

They have money for eternity i think.
But money or not money, they won't make anything of it if they become totally irrelevant on that market.

For me they should focus on portable gaming now, till they can actually make a good portable that is also a console.