Tallshortman
Member
If they're having trouble already differentiating the Wii U from the Wii to casuals, good luck when it's main hook is removed.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
NPD January 2013 Sales Results [Up7: Wii U 57K (CNET), Vita ~35K, PS3 201K]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
If they're having trouble already differentiating the Wii U from the Wii to casuals, good luck when it's main hook is removed.
I agree that it probably would have been better than what they have now. 2 years earlier would have likely meant even less grunty machine and therefore it'd look even less appealing to core gamers but with a 2-3 year headstart that might have been OK. They'd only be 203 more years from the next machine.
No compelling software. I really don't think it's more complicated than that.
2-3 weeks more like it.
Nintendo better hope Lego City is gonna help give Wii U a slight boost in hardware sales or else their fucked for March too. At this rate, sales won't potentially pick up until after Spring, and by then, Nintendo may need to take some drastic measures because unlike Sony, Nintendo's willing to do what's necessary to save their platform. It's just unfortunate that they'll likely wait too long to enter panic mode. I've lost count of how many apologies Iwata has made, but I'm sure we'll hear another one soon enough.
Father_Brain
Banned
I don't have access to Sony's internal accounting, so I can't say with absolute certainty that Sony is losing money on Vita right now. But those who insist that the opposite is true should probably at least acknowledge that economy of scale is a thing that exists.
For Nintendo? No, I think their handheld business will be their last pillar. If any part of that company crumbles, it will be the console space. If that really, truly is going, then Nintendo as the company they are now will no longer be the same when that happens. They may as well be just another Sega.
You don't get it at all. I'm sure it's nowhere close to making back its R&D money, but at this point the hardware is probably about break-even so there's no reason to stop selling it.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
This is astoundingly terrible.
Damn, Iwata.
Proof positive there ain't no masterplan behind this. This is just Nintendo screwing up far worse than anyone expected.
Duxxy3
Member
Yamauchi is still alive.
walking fiend
Member
I sense an ambassador program looming in the air...
But I also know Nintendo is stubborn enough not to do it after they have released their first party games, maybe in the Christmas.
But I also know Nintendo is stubborn enough not to do it after they have released their first party games, maybe in the Christmas.
I just get the impression that the Wii U was a thrown together console. Nintendo wanted to replicate its success with the Wii by having an underpowered console with some gimmick. The problem, however, is that motion control was attractive with the Wii, and seemed very innovative. The Wii U, though, just has a second screen, which seems to be Nintendo's usual last resort when they can't think up something better.
Well that certainly didn't go as expected... Now if only nintendo land was bundled with both versions.
Price drops would certainly help the Wii U and Vita to some extent, but as many have pointed out the biggest problem by far is software. A $50 drop on both would be nice, but ultimately would probably move only fractionally more units.
Unless something drastic happens in the next few months I expect Iwata is gone, regardless how much this is (or isn't) his direct fault. I personally give it a 50/50 on him lasting until E3, which is sad because I love Iwata
It is ALL his fault. 100% of it, when you are CEO you are responsible for the entire company. The chance of him being CEO by years end is probably almost non-existent at this point. He is a dead man walking.
I don't think the Wii U could have released 2 years ago. It was obvious they weren't ready one bit. If anything, they should have released it this December or January. They should have delayed it when they realized that software they were making is going to be delayed.
Davey Cakes
Member
After doing the same thing (playing those two games) I'm actually more convinced that I want the Wii U to thrive, and I want to continue playing it (alongside the 3DS).
Nintendo Land is fucking amazing, at least in the right context.
Warm Machine
Member
Is that really a hook? If it is, a lot of good its doing them hey?
I'd love to see the metrics of people who are actually buying a console to hook up to a tv so they can play it on a tablet screen. Most games barely use the tablet screen effectively as it is.
The core hardware is reasonably sound. They already have a standard controller. This way they don't have devs struggling to force the tablet into the game and they don't have to bear the cost of the screen.
Don't underestimate Google Street View.
The WiiU is burying itself though...
Unfortunately Nintendo's corporate culture (or way of business) predates Iwata.
Father_Brain
Banned
Dunno. Nintendo's board is made up pretty much entirely of old Japanese men, and I've heard that they have a fair amount of veto power over Iwata. But who knows.
Across the board, I feel, dedicated handhelds are slowly going to fade into irrelevance, as users replace such 'added baggage' in their pockets and purses with an all-in-one device like a Phone that also plays games, or an iPad or other tablet.
I don't think Nintendo or Sony really have a way to overcome this because most people don't like games enough to buy a handheld system dedicated to it, versus the casualness of just using games on a device they may already own. And it's only going to get worse from here.
I don't get it, you're right. I mean I appreciate what you're saying here, and you may even be right, but it seems to me that the more marketing dollars they throw and development dollars they spend on a system that is never going to sell more than 2 copies, the bigger the waste becomes.
NintendoLand didn't catch the world on fire, third parties bailed out, and Nintendo's own games weren't ready when they needed them to be. You can't necessarily predict that kind of stuff, but now, Iwata-san, it's time for Plan B.
What about game development costs, marketing costs, distribution, etc, etc. Overhead.
Steve Youngblood
Member
It's not that they're weak. After all, I think even the most optimistic of Nintendo fans assumed that the numbers would be pretty bad. What's of note is just how awful these numbers are.
Did someone debunk that Wii U launch < Saturn launch after 3 months statement yet? The Saturn was officially sold in North America for 3 years and I don't think it even reached 2M shipped LTD. It also launched in May. Zero chance it was anywhere close to 900k consoles sold by August.
That said, 55k is a horrendous January number.
That said, 55k is a horrendous January number.
Oh I agree he's ultimately responsible, I just meant how much of this were his personal decisions or whatever.
And yeah I agree with your year end assessment. Assuming something completely fucking insane doesn't happen to turn this shit around in an unprecedented manner I'm basically torn on whether or not he steps down/gets fired/whatever before E3, or if he does the E3 conference and sometime after E3 leaves (a la Peter Moore and Microsoft).
How so?
brochiller
Member
Yeah it's definitely not good, but people are jumping to conclusions. If the console is still not selling well when it has good games coming out (see: Vita), then we have reason to worry.
CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
PhoenixDawn
Member
Hopefully when (if?) Iwata resigns he stays on for the Iwata Asks or a similar type of programming. You can tell he has a great passion for video games and definitely enjoys discussing them and playing them. It's unfortunate that he doesn't seem to have much finesse in actually running the hardware/management part of the company though...
C'mon, Opiate. Got any tips for Iwata-san? Or are you prepping your CV for when he is ejected from his seat?
Their usual last resort? All of Nintendo's consoles apart from Wii were traditional consoles. I think they made a mistake of trying yet another 'gimmick' with Wii U though. They should have built upon Wii, with motion controls. If 100 million bought the first, I'm sure a Wii 2 could have done at least half. And then it would have been a smash hit.
Low sales, even at the absurdly low 55k level don't surprise me. I've been visiting a lot of shops recently looking for Fire Emblem and the retail presence for the Wii U is horrifyingly bad. In many shops it looks like the system is joining the PSP on its way out, not like a brand new system that we should all be excited about.
These are disasterous sales, not weak sales. Worse than the Vita's third month, and worse than the PS3 ever did.
Who exactly are they going to sell it too? There comes a point where the inventory itself will be a big burden.
If you get fired/resign disgracefully from a CEO position you don't stick around.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
At least Nintendo desperately rushing out their future games will probably stop Skyward Sword long delays I guess.
Maybe Nintendo will be desperate enough to have their main studios make major new IPs.
Ehh.
Maybe Nintendo will be desperate enough to have their main studios make major new IPs.
Ehh.
gamergirly
Member
We know very little about Nintendo's Wii U 2nd half 2013 schedule. Way too early to be thinking he's gonna be gone by years end. I feel like this is 3DS all over again with the early doom mongering
StreetsAhead
Member
The point is once lost, momentum can be hard to regain. Especially in the early days.
Will Lego, Monster Hunter and Need for Speed be enough to pull up hardware sales? I don't, but February will be just as bad if not worse than this month.
Father_Brain
Banned
Per a source on another forum I probably shouldn't link to: DmC < 200K
In a territory where handhelds are supposedly pretty much dead.
Four_Chamber
Member
Holy crap, I knew the Vita was dying but 35K in a 5 week month?!
I remember the orgasms in the thread about how "good" a value the Vita was at the time. The GAF consensus was absolutely wrong about the Vita (but right about the WiiU). Again, this shows that enthusiasm here does not always equal real world success.
The thing is absurdly priced with the idiotic memory card pricing. Not only that, the assumption that Sony made regarding simply translating AAA console franchises to the Vita (CoD and AC) would pick up the average gamer was clearly wrong. 7k Vita's a week? Absurdly bad. Sony needs to cut their losses- I know they don't want to, but its time to end this. I know they want to recoup all of that R+D money but damn- enough is enough. They needed strong Japanese sales and those clearly aren't coming- interpolating the NPD data, the rate at which Vita's are being sold in the US is the same as Japan (in non-holiday periods at least).
I remember the orgasms in the thread about how "good" a value the Vita was at the time. The GAF consensus was absolutely wrong about the Vita (but right about the WiiU). Again, this shows that enthusiasm here does not always equal real world success.
The thing is absurdly priced with the idiotic memory card pricing. Not only that, the assumption that Sony made regarding simply translating AAA console franchises to the Vita (CoD and AC) would pick up the average gamer was clearly wrong. 7k Vita's a week? Absurdly bad. Sony needs to cut their losses- I know they don't want to, but its time to end this. I know they want to recoup all of that R+D money but damn- enough is enough. They needed strong Japanese sales and those clearly aren't coming- interpolating the NPD data, the rate at which Vita's are being sold in the US is the same as Japan (in non-holiday periods at least).
Neuromancer
Member
Well at least it beat the Vita. Perhaps Nintendo can take some solace in that.
The 3DS situation has not been turned around, that is part of the problem for him. 3DS is still doing mediocre numbers outside of Japan, they have missed every single sales target they have set for 3DS even after constantly lowering their projections.
MikeE21286
Member
You're saying two different things here kind of.
The razer blade model is commonly referred to when selling the hardware at a loss while recouping this loss in software,accessories,etc.
While on the other hand you're saying that Sony can drop the price and still be profitable.
The answer with whether or not they should drop the price comes down to whether that drop can move the needle from a hardware sales side. Dropping the price $50 (25%) for a 5% incremental increase in sales doesn't make sense from a profit perspective obviously. They need to know the incremental increase in sales from a price drop will be equal to or greater than the the price drop. I don't have the answer to that.
Also they might want to focus on building market share and drop the price to solely focus on that to make the Vita viable. If they thought a $50 price cut, for example, would increase incremental sales by say 80-100% then this makes sense (even if they are losing money at that price). This would show the Vita as viable to develop for and would garner third party support potentially.