ViperVisor
Member
Basileus777 said:
Like all of us were crowed around our 30" or < TVs playing GoldenEye and getting 9 FPS with all the explosions. Or multi-player/co-op Twisted Metal was the shiznit.
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NPD Sales Results for December 2008
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
Like all of us were crowed around our 30" or < TVs playing GoldenEye and getting 9 FPS with all the explosions. Or multi-player/co-op Twisted Metal was the shiznit.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
yoopoo said:
Call of Duty.
Leon S. Kennedy
Member
Arde5643 said:
I'll agree with you on the first two, but I don't think there was much time spent developing the game. The game required almost no new programming after the first level was done.
It is kind of ironic how wii trolls can simultaneously comment on how third party games dont sell on wii and in the same breath utter there is no significant amount of games that interests them on wii from third parties.
One leads to another. Third party companies are taking a LONG time to release games with even decent level of effort put into them content wise and marketing wise. And titles in the system ARE selling IN SPITE of this fact. It doesnt seem far fetched to assume that once those titles with more support and resources put behind them do emerge they will sell.
2009 seems like a change of the tides in that direction.
One leads to another. Third party companies are taking a LONG time to release games with even decent level of effort put into them content wise and marketing wise. And titles in the system ARE selling IN SPITE of this fact. It doesnt seem far fetched to assume that once those titles with more support and resources put behind them do emerge they will sell.
2009 seems like a change of the tides in that direction.
Liabe Brave
Member
Surely this doesn't mean anything like you say, at least for PS3. A "top sales" chart is always going to be biased extremely strongly toward the highest installed base. A Wii or 360 title only has to appeal to half as many potential consumers as a PS3 title in order to beat it in the charts (since PS3 has less than half the installed base of either competitor). The only reasonable expectation is for zero PS3 titles to appear in any given month, unlessOpiate said:
a) There aren't many big releases on other platforms that month; since video games are extremely front-loaded a first-month PS3 title might best a slate of older games on other platforms;
or
b) The PS3 title is a top-of-the-industry smash (COD, GTA, etc.)
Furthermore, we know how much PS3 software sales increased. According to their November PR, they did 3.5m units. According to their December PR, they did "almost six million"; let's assume a reasonable 5.8m units figure. So we're not talking +40% compared to August, but +66% compared to November. That's certainly not world-beating, but it's not nearly as gloomy as you seem to imply.
All this applies to the PS3 only. I agree that with the PSP's installed base, it should be seeing higher results.
gofreak said:I mean..360+PS3+PC...the spread of platforms one can put 'HD' games on.
Not quite as respectable as my misreading of that chart suggested
* I can't remember exactly where the two stood at the end of 07, but I vaguely recall 360 userbase was about twice PS3's then?
Gofreak is correct. Let's use an extreme example that makes the argument clear. Let's imagine the gap of 6 million users remains exactly constant.
If the PS3 has a 2 million install base and the 360 has an 8 million install base, then the market split is 20/80 in favor of the 360.
If the PS3 has a 96 million install base and the 360 has a 104 million install base, then the market split is 48/52 in favor of the 360.
In both cases, the absolute disparity between the install bases remain the same, but the market share narrows dramatically, to the point where there is effectively no difference between the two once numbers get large.
This is why, in a way, maintaining a consistent gap between the PS3 and 360 is a good thing for Sony. Of course, in a way, it's also bad, but the reasons why it's bad have been covered ad nauseum. I'm only trying to emphasize what Gofreak is saying. If the PS3 continues to increase its "HD End" market share, it makes it increasingly likely that games will remain multiplatform, not less likely, as Microsoft recently claimed.
Liabe Brave said:
That 40% wasn't intended to represent a legitimate guess at Sony's holiday increase, it was only intended to clarify the point. I thought that was made clear by using the phrase "for example," but if you suspected I was implying that 40% might actually be the August to December increase, I wasn't. It genuinely was a simple example for the purpose of clarity.
As to your main point: first, this is essentially a "relative to install base" argument, where one says that the PS3 sold software reasonably well considering its low install base. I'm not a fan of this argument, particularly because it creates a situation where one hand washes the other: we excuse the game sales because the install base isn't large enough, and we excuse the install base size because publishers aren't focusing on putting out more games on the platform. Furthermore, this argument could theoretically lead one to argue that selling 1 copy of a game to an install base of 3 people is a solid ROI, when it obviously wouldn't be, by modern publisher standards. Second, didn't Donny recently note that good Xbox / Gamecube decembers were ~10 million in software? So even by these low standards, this wasn't a good month for PS3 software. Or PSP software, as you noted.
titiklabingapat
Member
PoP marketing still probably cost about half the entire development budget for Red Steel.:lolLeon S. Kennedy said:
John Dunbar
correct about everything
szaromir said:
But see, now it doesn't count because Wii has so many third party games.
Holy crap that is bad. The PSP figure is just outright embarrassing and the PS3 figure isnt much better. From what donny said the PS3 cant even manage XBOX/GC software numbers it seems.Spiegel said:
Also the top 10 software for Wii combined outsold every single game on the PS3 combined in december :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
Jaded Alyx
Member
Good point.Link said:
A tiny aside: Crackdown is not cel-shaded. It has a cartoony color palette, hand drawn (rather than photo-realistic) textures, and most objects have a thin black outline. No actual toon shading, however. (They were going for a "graphic novel" look.)
Please continue arguing.
Please continue arguing.
What type of gamer is buying PS3's? Obviously the Wii has the mainstream and the 360 has the hardcore.
This is why 360 games and Wii games sell so well. But what about the PS3? It has to be mainstream people that buy two games a year--Madden and Call of Duty. Any other guesses?
I have all three systems and the PS3 is by far the best maching(quality wise).
Sony really looked past the importance of launching first--you get the hardcore gamers and the developers supporting your system.
This is why 360 games and Wii games sell so well. But what about the PS3? It has to be mainstream people that buy two games a year--Madden and Call of Duty. Any other guesses?
I have all three systems and the PS3 is by far the best maching(quality wise).
Sony really looked past the importance of launching first--you get the hardcore gamers and the developers supporting your system.
Narcosis said:Interesting, I was under the impression based on this chart:
that all 3 of the home consoles were selling pretty healthy 3rd party software numbers relative to install base.
I would agree that PSP software seems abysmal by all available information
That's not really healthy for the wii at all when they're comparing to the 360's number from a year ago.
The wii install base today almost doubles the 360's base from a year ago. Yet the 3rd party software sales is only slightly above. If you read MS's pr, they claim that the total 3rd party sotware sales this generation in the US for the 360 is more than those of the wii and ps3 combined.
Not sure if there is any truth to that.
360 has been using revenue in their current PR releases though while Ninty uses units sold.giuliu said:
Yes, obviously industry experts have been right all along about the gaming industry, credit card/banks and loans businesses, as well as other financial institutions.Bulla564 said:
Because they were so right in their analysis, obviously none of the industries I mentioned are having any problems at all right now, none whatsoever.
titiklabingapat
Member
That's still besides the point.giuliu said:
The chart aims to show that despite the Nintendo titles taking 40% of the software buying install base, third parties still sell better in thier ecosystem as a whole just by sheer size of userbase alone.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
giuliu said:
But you got to realize that what's in the past is done and you don't get revenue from old sales. Xbox 360 may have sold more third party software combined so far, but that doesn't change the fact that Wii sold more third party software the past two months.
While past software sales make for good PR about tie ratios, what's more important is where they can sell the most in the future. And considering the rapid growth of Wii's userbase and 20/30 of the top games being on Nintendo systems in December, I'd say there is a good chance Wii will be a lot more attractive to third parties.
Or they might just say it's for girls, whatever.
titiklabingapat
Member
They've been wrong the past three years. Just saying.Bulla564 said:
Not to mention how many times specifically the analysts from that article already made statements predicted Wii slowdown, PS3 outpacing 360 etc. only to repeat the same stuff some time later with added "this time it for realz". These peole might have huge knowledge regaring various companies' condition and assets, but they proved once and once again that they do not understand general market and reasons driving console sales.Arde5643 said:
Jaded Alyx
Member
IGN and GameDaily.farnham said:
Stoney Mason
Banned
Bulla564 said:
Flying_Phoenix
Banned
1. WII WII PLAY W/ REMOTE NINTENDO OF AMERICA
2. WII WII FIT NINTENDO OF AMERICA
3. WII MARIO KART NINTENDO OF AMERICA
4. WII GUITAR HERO WORLD TOUR* ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
5. WII ANIMAL CROSSING: CITY FOLK* NINTENDO OF AMERICA
6. WII WII MUSIC NINTENDO OF AMERICA
7. WII LINK'S CROSSBOW TRAINING NINTENDO OF AMERICA
8. WII CALL OF DUTY: WORLD AT WAR ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
9. WII SHAUN WHITE SNOWBOARDING: ROAD TRIP UBISOFT
10. WII NERF N STRIKE ELECTRONIC ARTS
Nearly half of these games are third party. And most are of quality as well. It really does seem that third parties are learning.
Wow...just wow.
Well what do you expect? It's a niche game. Hell Persona 4 didn't break the top 10 it's debut month on the PS2 list. Nothing has changed about niche games on current gen tech consoles, just the cost to make them.
Top 10 PlayStation 2 Games
1. PS2 GUITAR HERO WORLD TOUR* ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
2. PS2 MADDEN NFL 09 ELECTRONIC ARTS
3. PS2 KINGDOM HEARTS RE: CHAIN OF MEMORIES SQUARE ENIX INC
4. PS2 WWE SMACKDOWN VS. RAW 2009 THQ
5. PS2 ROCK BAND* MTV GAMES/ELECTRONIC ARTS
6. PS2 ACTION/ADVENTURE BUNDLE MULTIPLE VIDEO GAME MANUFACTURER
7. PS2 SONIC UNLEASHED SEGA OF AMERICA
8. PS2 LEGO BATMAN WARNER INTERACTIVE
9. PS2 CALL OF DUTY: WORLD AT WAR FINAL FRONTS ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
10. PS2 GUITAR HERO AEROSMITH* ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
I mean I know the game is niche and all but I really don't like the fact that Guitar Hero: Aerosmith outsold Persona 4.
I think what most people are trying to get across is that Wii owners want more then mini-games.
N64 = Strong First Party Support, Moderate Exclusive Support, Weak Third Party Support
PS3 = Strong Third Party Support, Weak Exclusive Support, Weak First Party Support
2. WII WII FIT NINTENDO OF AMERICA
3. WII MARIO KART NINTENDO OF AMERICA
4. WII GUITAR HERO WORLD TOUR* ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
5. WII ANIMAL CROSSING: CITY FOLK* NINTENDO OF AMERICA
6. WII WII MUSIC NINTENDO OF AMERICA
7. WII LINK'S CROSSBOW TRAINING NINTENDO OF AMERICA
8. WII CALL OF DUTY: WORLD AT WAR ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
9. WII SHAUN WHITE SNOWBOARDING: ROAD TRIP UBISOFT
10. WII NERF N STRIKE ELECTRONIC ARTS
Nearly half of these games are third party. And most are of quality as well. It really does seem that third parties are learning.
RSTEIN said:
Wow...just wow.
Evlar said:
Well what do you expect? It's a niche game. Hell Persona 4 didn't break the top 10 it's debut month on the PS2 list. Nothing has changed about niche games on current gen tech consoles, just the cost to make them.
Top 10 PlayStation 2 Games
1. PS2 GUITAR HERO WORLD TOUR* ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
2. PS2 MADDEN NFL 09 ELECTRONIC ARTS
3. PS2 KINGDOM HEARTS RE: CHAIN OF MEMORIES SQUARE ENIX INC
4. PS2 WWE SMACKDOWN VS. RAW 2009 THQ
5. PS2 ROCK BAND* MTV GAMES/ELECTRONIC ARTS
6. PS2 ACTION/ADVENTURE BUNDLE MULTIPLE VIDEO GAME MANUFACTURER
7. PS2 SONIC UNLEASHED SEGA OF AMERICA
8. PS2 LEGO BATMAN WARNER INTERACTIVE
9. PS2 CALL OF DUTY: WORLD AT WAR FINAL FRONTS ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
10. PS2 GUITAR HERO AEROSMITH* ACTIVISION BLIZZARD
I mean I know the game is niche and all but I really don't like the fact that Guitar Hero: Aerosmith outsold Persona 4.
Jag22 said:
I think what most people are trying to get across is that Wii owners want more then mini-games.
Relaxed Muscle said:
N64 = Strong First Party Support, Moderate Exclusive Support, Weak Third Party Support
PS3 = Strong Third Party Support, Weak Exclusive Support, Weak First Party Support