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[NemesisPrime]

I just watched a Sorcery video on youtube. If that's the flagship Move title then, it's time to abandon ship. It doesn't look bad, but IMO that's not going to convince anyone to buy Move.

True.

Maybe if they attached Harry Potter to the game... but now... not a system seller (but could be a great game).

 

[Ashes]

What those 200 k sales show is that move doesn't have legs. If you can't sell at Christmas, you're not going to sell later.
edit: if bluray was the bulk of price back at launch, surely the sales of blu-ray standalone show that the ps3 can really shift a gear in price as well.

 

[Gadfly]

Is there an archive of previous NPD results (not predictions)?

 

[duk]

The "troll" from Kobun's twitter (which was just taken from the article he linked) was right - the NPD was unspinable. Sony pushed and shoved a bit, but it didn't muster a slow twirl, much less spin. My favorite line is about how the strong debut of Move (a few months ago) will set the stage for a strong 2011 - skipping over the present results entirely. Nothing to see here, move along.

The 360 has a 9,283,589 unit lead over PS3 in US/NA according to NPD, which will likely surpass 10m by Jan 1, 2011. S/W favors the 360 as always and now with Kinect, Move is an after thought for most. Nothing looks to change this in 2011. The delta continues to grow.

BTW, Wii has been a huge success for Nintendo imo. Well deserved.

 

[Psychotext]

Is there an archive of previous NPD results (not predictions)?

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/NPD_sales_figures

 

[Gadfly]

http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/NPD_sales_figures

Sorry, I meant GAF threads.:lol

 

[Opus Angelorum]

A while back I suggested Sony were playing safe with the release of Move.

It was positioned as an accessory, something that complimented the platform.

This was much less a risk than Kinect, which was being marketed as the new Xbox experience.

The problem with this safe approach is that Move appears to be appealing only to the existing audience. As Microsoft create unique (if unoriginal) games from scratch that highlight the new interface, Sony seem more than happy to apply Move to existing titles (with a few exceptions).

Now clearly Sony are working on titles that embrace Move from the ground up. However until they release the title that really sells the technology, I believe Kinect is going to garner much more attention and by proxy more sales simple because the you are the controller selling point (gimmick to some) is immediately apparent to the average Joe.

 

[legend166]

It could be doing even better if Sony made any effort at all to maintain a nice library on shelves. PS2 game sections at major retailers are just sad, sad affairs; A few copies of Aragorn's Quest and Secret Agent Clank, maybe a lingering GH copy of God of War 2, some old Guitar Hero games, and a spotty mess of horrific shovelware.

I don't understand why Sony doesn't do something like their $9.99 PSP Essentials initiative with PS2. It's a travesty that a system with such an amazing library is represented by the anemic leftovers above, people shouldn't be forced to trawl through Gamestop bins for incomplete copies of a system's best games while that system's still on the market.

Tell me about it. I only bought a PS2 for the first time a couple of years ago. I thought "This is going to be so awesome. I'm going to go down to the store and just pile up on cheap awesomeness." Bzzzzzzzzzzzz, wrong. Shovelware as far as the eye could see. It was so disappointing.

 

[starsky]

Sorry, I meant GAF threads.:lol

Just google "NPD Sales Results" and you'll get most of the threads. If you're looking for specific one then add the month and year to your query.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

It really does amaze me at how well the 360 is performing. Seriously, hats off to Microsoft.

 

[Baki]

A while back I suggested Sony were playing safe with the release of Move.

It was positioned as an accessory, something that complimented the platform.

This was much less a risk than Kinect, which was being marketed as the new Xbox experience.

The problem with this safe approach is that Move appears to be appealing only to the existing audience. As Microsoft create unique (if unoriginal) games from scratch that highlight the new interface, Sony seem more than happy to apply Move to existing titles (with a few exceptions).

Now clearly Sony are working on titles that embrace Move from the ground up. However until they release the title that really sells the technology, I believe Kinect is going to garner much more attention and by proxy more sales simple because the you are the controller selling point (gimmick to some) is immediately apparent to the average Joe.

I think the main reason why Kinect is selling a lot faster than MOVE can simply be attributed to the fact that MS is pouring a lot more money into the product. They are far more committed, however their position was far more risky.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I think the main reason why Kinect is selling a lot faster than MOVE can simply be attributed to the fact that MS is pouring a lot more money into the product. They are far more committed, however their position was far more risky.

I'd say the gulf between utilizations is the "main" reasons. The storied marketing budget, as has been definitively proven, is for long term marketing plans (there's literally not enough TV time to spend $500 million on Marketing just for the holidays). And there are Move commercials on all the time.

The "main" reason is because it is a different product and is more appealing to the marketplace. All the marketing in the world won't make a fundamentally undesirable product desirable.

 

[Redbeard]

I'd say the gulf between utilizations is the "main" reasons. The storied marketing budget, as has been definitively proven, is for long term marketing plans (there's literally not enough TV time to spend $500 million on Marketing just for the holidays). And there are Move commercials on all the time.

The "main" reason is because it is a different product and is more appealing to the marketplace. All the marketing in the world won't make a fundamentally undesirable product desirable.

I haven't seen a videogame product marketed as much as Kinect this entire generation.

The marketing, along with the 'you are the controller' tagline, is the reason it's successful for the short term.

EyeToy was also 'different' back in the day, but it wasn't a success in the US.

 

[duk]

Well I think Move's marketing is still very 'me too' ala Wii-like vs Kinect's which sets it apart from other waggles. I really like Kevin Butler commercials, they are funny and attention grabbing, however I like Butler more than the products they are trying to showcase :lol

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

I haven't seen a videogame product marketed as much as Kinect this entire generation.

The marketing, along with the 'you are the controller' tagline, is the reason it's successful for the short term.

EyeToy was also 'different' back in the day, but it wasn't a success in the US.

There is a core logical problem to your argument, in that you're purporting that the marketing is the sole reason for its success. That all the positive impressions and word of mouth are just some kind Manchurian Candidate type trick, that perhaps some of the marketing budget went into little nanomachines that have been deposited into the North American water supply, and that they whisper, softly, but constantly "Buy Kinect. Buy Kinect. You must buy Kinect." Even though every fiber of every person's core being is telling them "NO. There is NO merit to this product whatsoever."

I just don't buy it.

 

[Dabanton]

There is a core logical problem to your argument, in that you're purporting that the marketing is the sole reason for its success. That all the positive impressions and word of mouth are just some kind Manchurian Candidate type trick, that perhaps some of the marketing budget went into little nanomachines that have been deposited into the North American water supply, and that they whisper, softly, but constantly "Buy Kinect. Buy Kinect. You must buy Kinect." Even though every fiber of every person's core being is telling them "NO. There is NO merit to this product whatsoever."

I just don't buy it.

It's Redbeard. If you've seen him in any 360 related thread you know his mindset. :lol

Also to a certain type of poster, This 500m thing has become a bit of a back handed compliment to the 360.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

What those 200 k sales show is that move doesn't have legs. If you can't sell at Christmas, you're not going to sell later.

agreed.

but perhaps people bought move solely to play the games they'd already buy/play with a controller, vs Move-designed games?

either way, it's certainly not going to inspire developers to target the Move platform.

 

[Lebron]

EyeToy was also 'different' back in the day, but it wasn't a success in the US.

Well, not having Dance Central will do that to ya.

 

[RSTEIN]

It's Redbeard. If you've seen him in any 360 related thread you know his mindset. :lol

Yes, it is Redbeard, so everyone needs to take what he says and basically crumple it up and light it on fire. However, in this case he isn't entirely wrong.

Sony's Move marketing look pathetic against Kinect's. I live in Toronto and the ENTIRE Dundas Square (our version of Times Square) was full of Kinect stuff with live Kinect performers and demo stations. It was amazing. Sony had a single wall advert in the Dundas subway station with the tagline "Buttons. Yay!" I felt really embarrassed for Sony! How do they even expect to compete?

Then the actual story is so much more compelling and easier to tell than Move. Then the positive reviews and word of mouth just compounds things.

 

[clashfan]

They main problem with move is it just seems like a copycat of wii. Sony put themselves in a position of looking like a market follower and not leader.

 

[PSGames]

It's a shame how Move is being handled. Being an optional control scheme won't broaden their audience. It won't boost console or software sales (those same people would play those same games with a controller). Unless they are making a lot of profit off each one sold there's no point.


They need Move exclusive games that showcase the benefits of the device while appealing to the mainstream. Catering to the hardcore with Move gets them nothing but extra controller sales and that's it.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

It's a shame how Move is being handled. Being an optional control scheme won't broaden their audience. It won't boost console or software sales (those same people would play those same games with a controller). Unless they are making a lot of profit off each one sold there's no point.

they took a very safe approach. doing differently would have meant significantly more risk...more potential losses sunk into a platform that has a long history of losing money.

I'm sure that would have been a tough sell.

 

[Mindlog]

The Law of Sales-Age Marketing Analysis continues unabated.

I don't mean to pick on any posters. I just grabbed the first Kevin Butler - Neogaf thread that google gave me. This was a commonly shared sentiment at the time.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=390472

This is Sony's most enjoyable, effective advertising campaign in years. Its funny, playful, and knows how to really get the fanboys attention. This shit should have been ready at launch.

The original? thread.
http://neogaf.net/forum/showthread.php?t=372409

Now compare that to the current campaign commentary. The same thing will happen if (when?) Kinect sales slow. "It was inevitable that plowing $500m into advertising instead of technology would doom them in the end."

How do we properly examine the potential impact of a marketing campaign when we consistently change our analysis to match the numbers?

 

[a Master Ninja]

I'd say Mama Robotnik's comment is consistent with the "Kevin Butler ads are for fanboys that already own a PS3" assessment. I see a lot of "I like these ads" comments but not a lot of "these ads will get the mainstream to buy PS3s."

 

[RSTEIN]

The Law of Sales-Age Marketing Analysis continues unabated.

I don't mean to pick on any posters. I just grabbed the first Kevin Butler - Neogaf thread that google gave me. This was a commonly shared sentiment at the time.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=390472



The original? thread.
http://neogaf.net/forum/showthread.php?t=372409

Now compare that to the current campaign commentary. The same thing will happen if (when?) Kinect sales slow. "It was inevitable that plowing $500m into advertising instead of technology would doom them in the end."

How do we properly examine the potential impact of a marketing campaign when we consistently change our analysis to match the numbers?

What does Kevin Butler have to do with this? Kevin Butler is awesome and is Sony's best marketing move to date.

Kevin Butler is cool but he got steamrolled by the MS Kinect train. There's no amazing analysis going on here. It's reality.

 

[Maxwell House]

I think the main reason why Kinect is selling a lot faster than MOVE can simply be attributed to the fact that MS is pouring a lot more money into the product. They are far more committed, however their position was far more risky.

I think a more important reason Kinect is outselling Move is that Kinect appears to be a brand new control scheme to most people, very innovative. Move appears to just be Wii waggle part 2. There is no buzz about it at all because people have already experienced relatively the same type of game play and control scheme already. It is hard to sell Move to parents who already have a Wii in the household. That isn't the case with Kinect.

The nature of the device is a much bigger reason for Kinect's success than the marketing effort.

 

[PopcornMegaphone]

I think Kevin Butler is good (but a bit tiresome) if you're selling traditional games to traditional gamers. For something like Move he was the wrong choice.

Although MS has done a good job marketing Kinect, I don't think that's the big reason the device is selling big. Kinect actually delivers and people love it.

 

[Elios83]

I'd say Mama Robotnik's comment is consistent with the "Kevin Butler ads are for fanboys that already own a PS3" assessment. I see a lot of "I like these ads" comments but not a lot of "these ads will get the mainstream to buy PS3s."

Probably the only ad that will make mainstream people go buy PS3 is "Now at 199$"

 

[OldJadedGamer]

I'd say Mama Robotnik's comment is consistent with the "Kevin Butler ads are for fanboys that already own a PS3" assessment. I see a lot of "I like these ads" comments but not a lot of "these ads will get the mainstream to buy PS3s."

Yeah, the ads are targeted to people who already own the system and are already going to buy the games they are advertising. Marketing is there to get you to buy something new. Spending money on advertising to the kid who already is sold on your product is a waste of money on their side.

I think they had a few "ha ha's" with the KB ad campaign and can't think of anything new so the old white guys running SCEA keep beating the same drum in denial that the campaign has over stayed it's welcome and they need to go with something fresh... and Marcus isn't it.

 

[Skiesofwonder]

I gotta imagine Epic Mickey is doing at least pretty well. I know singe retailer information doesn't really mean anything in the grand scheme of things, but alongside the tons of pre-orders my Gamestop had when I picked up; I have noticed tons of advertising on TV, a BUNCH of Epic Mickey demo kiosks, and tons of Epic Mickey posters everywhere.

Hell, even at my smalltown Wal-Mart Epic Mickey is everywhere! Not only is it the first Third-Party Wii game I have seen to be available to actually play in their demo kiosk, but they also have posters all over the place and a huge stand painted with Epic Mickey artwork (and the list of awards it won at E3). It is smack dab in the middle of the electronics with tons of copies of Epic Mickey (like literally over a hundred, the most I have ever seen for a game at my Wal-Mart) and lots of Wii bundles. Obviously they (or someone who is high up) sees it as a system seller.

I also happened to notice that in the glass window where they keep the games... two games had zero copies left, and one (Epic Mickey) had only one copy left. The two games with zero copies: Just Dance 2 and The Michael Jackson Experience. One title we know sold a butt-load and another that I totally expect to.

Note: One thing I would like to point out, Epic Mickey had TWO rows for it, while Just Dance 2 and MJE had only one.

Spoiler

Sorry, I have nothing else to do while I greatly anticipate actually playing Epic Mickey on Christmas day (bought the Collection Edition as a present to m....HMPH.... my sister)! And yes I have seen the Gaf thread already I still have hope!

 

[chubigans]

Probably the only ad that will make mainstream people go buy PS3 is "Now at 199$"

This is correct. The PS3 will be third place for December and the rest of next year, no matter how amazing the 2011 lineup is, until the price gets lowered (I'm talking only about the US).

I can walk into a store and buy a Wii for $200. I can also buy a 360 for $200. But the price of entry for the PS3 is $300. Given the lack of exclusive holiday titles sans GT5, there's little incentive to go for a PS3 this holiday season if you're the average consumer, given that:

-It doesn't have the Blu-Ray player appeal. Whereas you could easily rationalize buying a $400 PS3 two years ago for Blu-Ray, it's not quite so clear cut anymore. The PS3 was the only standalone player that was not only the best performing, but one of the few that was going to be easiest to upgrade during the lifespan of BD.

But given the 400k sales of Blu-Ray players in November at a median price of under $200, the PS3 is no longer a realistic viable option for buying as a standalone player/game console...it simply has faded into the bulletpoints of features for the PS3 (free online! BD play! Internet Browser!) that may or may not sway consumers. If you want to get into Blu-Ray, there are far cheaper/better choices than a PS3.

-The standalone PS3 is directly competing with the standalone 360/Kinect bundle at $300. Given the massive ads that MS has built around Kinect, it makes the PS3 look like a somewhat sour deal, especially with the Move bundle at $400.

-There aren't any major first party exclusives to ramp up PS3 sales this Christmas. GT5 can only do so much for the system, though Sony squandered most of that with the most dongled up launch I've ever seen.

I think that the avalanche of PS3 games next year and the lack of first party 360 support for core gamers might boost the PS3 up a tad...but I don't see the PS3 gaining any more steam at this point until the price is lowered.

And you better believe Microsoft won't lower the price of the 360 to counter the PS3. That argument is absolutely absurd. If MS is making huge sales each month, they're not going to squander their profits simply to pull "ahead" in a price war slash. $200 is the bare minimum you'll get a 360/PS3 for until the next generation arrives (the next step MS is going to be taking is getting a Kinect/360 bundle for less than $300).

 

[Ashes]

I think if sony does take a price hit on the ps3, they ought to advertise that they have. Obvoiusly spin it, like in these rough times etc...
Thing is I don't see why they don't already do this in pr spins. They take the hit for you, works so much better, then month over month sales increase from oct to november. good god that was embarassing to say the least.

 

[duk]

This is correct. The PS3 will be third place for December and the rest of next year, no matter how amazing the 2011 lineup is, until the price gets lowered (I'm talking only about the US).

I can walk into a store and buy a Wii for $200. I can also buy a 360 for $200. But the price of entry for the PS3 is $300. Given the lack of exclusive holiday titles sans GT5, there's little incentive to go for a PS3 this holiday season if you're the average consumer, given that:

-It doesn't have the Blu-Ray player appeal. Whereas you could easily rationalize buying a $400 PS3 two years ago for Blu-Ray, it's not quite so clear cut anymore. The PS3 was the only standalone player that was not only the best performing, but one of the few that was going to be easiest to upgrade during the lifespan of BD.

But given the 400k sales of Blu-Ray players in November at a median price of under $200, the PS3 is no longer a realistic viable option for buying as a standalone player/game console...it simply has faded into the bulletpoints of features for the PS3 (free online! BD play! Internet Browser!) that may or may not sway consumers. If you want to get into Blu-Ray, there are far cheaper/better choices than a PS3.

-The standalone PS3 is directly competing with the standalone 360/Kinect bundle at $300. Given the massive ads that MS has built around Kinect, it makes the PS3 look like a somewhat sour deal, especially with the Move bundle at $400.

-There aren't any major first party exclusives to ramp up PS3 sales this Christmas. GT5 can only do so much for the system, though Sony squandered most of that with the most dongled up launch I've ever seen.

I think that the avalanche of PS3 games next year and the lack of first party 360 support for core gamers might boost the PS3 up a tad...but I don't see the PS3 gaining any more steam at this point until the price is lowered.

And you better believe Microsoft won't lower the price of the 360 to counter the PS3. That argument is absolutely absurd. If MS is making huge sales each month, they're not going to squander their profits simply to pull "ahead" in a price war slash. $200 is the bare minimum you'll get a 360/PS3 for until the next generation arrives (the next step MS is going to be taking is getting a Kinect/360 bundle for less than $300).

Pretty good post there. One thing I must say is that we don't really know all the MS games coming out next year as MS doesn't like to announce until things are must closer sans GOW3 (which will sell boatloads). MS rides on 3rd party games, exclusive or not, they will sell better on 360 as seen in the last 4 years with a handful of exclusives/1st party games. I am excited to see what 2nd gen Kinect games have in store that will start to use Kinect in a much better way.

I don't forsee MS getting into price war with Sony, they never have needed to this gen unless sales start to slide the other way. That's a huge ace up their sleeve not having to worry about price point but can drop price if need be. But I do think by end of this gen, we'll see a $150 core 360 sku.

 

[Whipped Spartan]

This is correct. The PS3 will be third place for December and the rest of next year, no matter how amazing the 2011 lineup is, until the price gets lowered (I'm talking only about the US).

I can walk into a store and buy a Wii for $200. I can also buy a 360 for $200. But the price of entry for the PS3 is $300. Given the lack of exclusive holiday titles sans GT5, there's little incentive to go for a PS3 this holiday season if you're the average consumer, given that:

-It doesn't have the Blu-Ray player appeal. Whereas you could easily rationalize buying a $400 PS3 two years ago for Blu-Ray, it's not quite so clear cut anymore. The PS3 was the only standalone player that was not only the best performing, but one of the few that was going to be easiest to upgrade during the lifespan of BD.

But given the 400k sales of Blu-Ray players in November at a median price of under $200, the PS3 is no longer a realistic viable option for buying as a standalone player/game console...it simply has faded into the bulletpoints of features for the PS3 (free online! BD play! Internet Browser!) that may or may not sway consumers. If you want to get into Blu-Ray, there are far cheaper/better choices than a PS3.

-The standalone PS3 is directly competing with the standalone 360/Kinect bundle at $300. Given the massive ads that MS has built around Kinect, it makes the PS3 look like a somewhat sour deal, especially with the Move bundle at $400.

-There aren't any major first party exclusives to ramp up PS3 sales this Christmas. GT5 can only do so much for the system, though Sony squandered most of that with the most dongled up launch I've ever seen.

I think that the avalanche of PS3 games next year and the lack of first party 360 support for core gamers might boost the PS3 up a tad...but I don't see the PS3 gaining any more steam at this point until the price is lowered.

And you better believe Microsoft won't lower the price of the 360 to counter the PS3. That argument is absolutely absurd. If MS is making huge sales each month, they're not going to squander their profits simply to pull "ahead" in a price war slash. $200 is the bare minimum you'll get a 360/PS3 for until the next generation arrives (the next step MS is going to be taking is getting a Kinect/360 bundle for less than $300).

you could buy a 360 kinect bundle and a $100 blu ray for $400!

 

[FrankT]

We'll see a price cut from MS by next fall almost without question. How much, that is a different beast. They would be hard pressed to go without one for 3 years. Post Kinect launch and no core exclusives they will coast for the year until that cut. They can most likely afford a $50 cut on the 4gb at any time so if Sony goes $199 with a new revision I see MS answering right back. Of course they will continue to go the added value route as well, bigger HDD and all. Btw is it even technically possible MS could put a BR drive in a 360 just for BR movie purposes? Could see some big sales with that and a 500GB drive next fall if they could pull it off. I also see at least one more form factor change before the next generation.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

This is correct. The PS3 will be third place for December and the rest of next year, no matter how amazing the 2011 lineup is, until the price gets lowered (I'm talking only about the US).

I can walk into a store and buy a Wii for $200. I can also buy a 360 for $200. But the price of entry for the PS3 is $300. Given the lack of exclusive holiday titles sans GT5, there's little incentive to go for a PS3 this holiday season if you're the average consumer, given that:

-It doesn't have the Blu-Ray player appeal. Whereas you could easily rationalize buying a $400 PS3 two years ago for Blu-Ray, it's not quite so clear cut anymore. The PS3 was the only standalone player that was not only the best performing, but one of the few that was going to be easiest to upgrade during the lifespan of BD.

But given the 400k sales of Blu-Ray players in November at a median price of under $200, the PS3 is no longer a realistic viable option for buying as a standalone player/game console...it simply has faded into the bulletpoints of features for the PS3 (free online! BD play! Internet Browser!) that may or may not sway consumers. If you want to get into Blu-Ray, there are far cheaper/better choices than a PS3.

-The standalone PS3 is directly competing with the standalone 360/Kinect bundle at $300. Given the massive ads that MS has built around Kinect, it makes the PS3 look like a somewhat sour deal, especially with the Move bundle at $400.

-There aren't any major first party exclusives to ramp up PS3 sales this Christmas. GT5 can only do so much for the system, though Sony squandered most of that with the most dongled up launch I've ever seen.

I think that the avalanche of PS3 games next year and the lack of first party 360 support for core gamers might boost the PS3 up a tad...but I don't see the PS3 gaining any more steam at this point until the price is lowered.

And you better believe Microsoft won't lower the price of the 360 to counter the PS3. That argument is absolutely absurd. If MS is making huge sales each month, they're not going to squander their profits simply to pull "ahead" in a price war slash. $200 is the bare minimum you'll get a 360/PS3 for until the next generation arrives (the next step MS is going to be taking is getting a Kinect/360 bundle for less than $300).

You shouldn't need to clarify you're talking about US sales in an NPD thread.

Good post and mostly true. I bought a stand alone Blu-ray player with Neflix and Pandora *last year* at Xmas for only $99 bucks. Playing Blu-ray movies being a selling point is pretty much gone at this point. Also, a parent would want a stand alone player over a game system with one built in because the kids are going to be taking up time with the machines playing games while Mom and Dad want to watch a movie.

Also, I didn't even realize it until you just posted it for some reason but yeah... the PS3 at it's price is going up against a Kinect Bundle. So parents see that they can get just a system... or a system AND the new hot toy everyone is talking about for the same price and the value looks better in their eyes.

I think the exclusive games next year for the PS3 are going to be selling to the same crowd who already own a system. I agree that there isn't going to be anything that brings new owners in until a price cut happens.

We'll see a price cut from MS by next fall almost without question. How much, that is a different beast. They would be hard pressed to go without one for 3 years.

I don't know if it's impressive or insulting that they haven't had a price drop on the 360 in almost 3 years.

 

[jedimike]

Doesn't seem like a troll, it's just reality; so tired of every negative opinion on someone's favorite multi billion dollar company being considered a "troll." The PS3 has been a disaster for Sony, and they've botched nearly every aspect of it. From the launch to the games to the gimmicks (remember how the gyro shaking controller was going to change everything, alongside Lair?). They've essentially given the young male/college kid demographic to MS. MS is making some headway into Wii's casual market, but ultimately that demographic isn't reliable. In a few years the Kinect, like the Wii, will mainly come out of people's closets for Thanksgiving and Christmas parties. People who aren't interested in videogames remain that way; they'll jump on the latest fad or big electronic device because that's what casuals do.

Sony is essentially in no man's land right now.

Yep... and MS even tried to hand it over to them with the RROD debacle and Sony still couldn't pick up the ball and run with it.

 

[duk]

I don't know if it's impressive or insulting that they haven't had a price drop on the 360 in almost 3 years.

I think it's because they keeping on adding more features and thus 'value' to the machine at the same price point (which very likely makes more financial sense). If PS3 sales doesn't pick up, we may just see more features added and a modest price drop across the 360 line.

 

[Pride]

Wow, total Move software sell thru is less than 200k? Ouch! I thought Dance Central would be successful, but I didnt think it alone would outsell every stand alone Move game combined.

For what it's worth, I dont think the advertising alone is driving the success of Kinect over Move (I see a ton of Move commercials). I think a lot has to do with the WOW factor. I was in Best Buy this past weekend and there was a decent crowd (17 or so) ppl standing around watching the Kinect demo. It really seemed like a group activity as 3 ppl played Dance Central together. That said, I know this is anectodal so take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Pooya]

I think next step for Microsoft is to drop prices of Kinect bundles to $200 and $300 and make them the only SKU on the market.

 

[bigtroyjon]

I think next step for Microsoft is to drop prices of Kinect bundles to $200 and $300 and make them the only SKU on the market.

Won't happen until Kinect stops selling. Other wise nobody would buy the stand alone units and the systems would get sold second hand.

They make too much on the hardware at this point to lose all those sales. One thing I could see is them only having the arcade and the bigger hard drive system only be available with Kinect.

Maybe next fall it would be 150 4gb , 250 4gb Kinect and 350 250 gb Kinect. In this scenario Kinect is still selling at 150.

Obviously if Kinect sales drop off a cliff things could go in a much different way.

 

[modulaire]

Are there a lot of MOVE-ads in the US? If that's the case the sales are disappointing.

Considering how many TV-ads there are in Continental Europe sales must be much better here.

 

[NemesisPrime]

I'd say the gulf between utilizations is the "main" reasons. The storied marketing budget, as has been definitively proven, is for long term marketing plans (there's literally not enough TV time to spend $500 million on Marketing just for the holidays). And there are Move commercials on all the time.

The "main" reason is because it is a different product and is more appealing to the marketplace. All the marketing in the world won't make a fundamentally undesirable product desirable.

Indeed, because we all know that spending a lot on marketing always works.

 

[Stripper13]

We'll see a price cut from MS by next fall almost without question. How much, that is a different beast. They would be hard pressed to go without one for 3 years. Post Kinect launch and no core exclusives they will coast for the year until that cut. They can most likely afford a $50 cut on the 4gb at any time so if Sony goes $199 with a new revision I see MS answering right back. Of course they will continue to go the added value route as well, bigger HDD and all. Btw is it even technically possible MS could put a BR drive in a 360 just for BR movie purposes? Could see some big sales with that and a 500GB drive next fall if they could pull it off. I also see at least one more form factor change before the next generation.

I don't think Blu-Ray is necessary or something they are even considering at this point in the generation. If, and that's a big IF, Microsoft decided to use that format, it wouldn't be until their next console assuming they didn't have something better up their sleeves (no idea what it would be). I think most consumers are more than happy with a games console AND a movie player (DVD/Blu-Ray)... for the people that want both? Well they've had 4+ years to make their choice and likely already have... I don't see many people suddenly picking up a 360 because they just realised they want a 2 in 1 media device.

As far as the large hard-drive goes... I've said it before about the PS3's shitty marketing, and I'll say it about the 360 if it happens too... but the mainstream consumer doesn't give a fuck about the size of the hard-drive. They understand it no doubt, and all things equal, will take/buy the bigger HDD SKU assuming the deal is right... but the difference between a 60gb, 120, 160gb etc PS3, means nothing to anyone but the tech-savvy... and let's face it, they almost certainly have a console of choice at this point too.

I only say this because I frequently see some PS3 deal (in Australia) with a HDD that is only a bit bigger (relatively) than the lower SKU, yet it somehow has a $80+ premium over the lower SKU even with the deal. Who the fuck are they kidding? I sure hope no one is swooning over something like that and it is honestly boosting Sony's sales... otherwise my faith in humanity dwindles further.

 

[Agent Icebeezy]

Are there a lot of MOVE-ads in the US? If that's the case the sales are disappointing.

Considering how many TV-ads there are in Continental Europe sales must be much better here.

I know I see Kevin Butler a lot.

 

[TheOddOne]

There is a core logical problem to your argument, in that you're purporting that the marketing is the sole reason for its success. That all the positive impressions and word of mouth are just some kind Manchurian Candidate type trick, that perhaps some of the marketing budget went into little nanomachines that have been deposited into the North American water supply, and that they whisper, softly, but constantly "Buy Kinect. Buy Kinect. You must buy Kinect." Even though every fiber of every person's core being is telling them "NO. There is NO merit to this product whatsoever."

I just don't buy it.

Cue Metal Gear theme :lol Snake, Snake, Snaaaaaaaaake...

 

[Brashnir]

Are there a lot of MOVE-ads in the US? If that's the case the sales are disappointing.

Considering how many TV-ads there are in Continental Europe sales must be much better here.

I've seen tons and tons of TV ads. I've definitely seen Move on TV more than Kinect. I've seen lots more Kinect advertising at Point of Sale, and in places you might not expect like cereal boxes.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

I've seen tons and tons of TV ads. I've definitely seen Move on TV more than Kinect. I've seen lots more Kinect advertising at Point of Sale, and in places you might not expect like cereal boxes.

this is what I've found as well.

Sony is spending big bucks on TV advertising.

 

[Jomjom]

Sony has been incredibly foolish not to have released a 4GB PS3 for $200 yet. Casual users do not see the difference between a 120GB system and a 4GB system, they only see the $100 difference in price.

Also, gift givers could care less what HDD a system has. They will buy the cheaper system to give as gifts and let the recipient worry about upgrading the HDD or whatever themselves. This is the major reason why Sony is getting killed during the holidays.

 

[NemesisPrime]

Sony has been incredibly foolish not to have released a 4GB PS3 for $200 yet. Casual users do not see the difference between a 120GB system and a 4GB system, they only see the $100 difference in price.

A 4gb ps3 would not even work. A lot of games need an install.