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[jamesinclair]

If this an example of financial thinking in America, than god help us all. If the city of Boston is having to pay over 150K overime due to an event that was unforseen and unbudgetted, that is going to affect their revenue for next year, not including the effect that this has had on local buisness and the taxes they pay. Decreased revenue and increased costs? Not good for City.

Comparing that to a 45 million tax cut meant to pay off in the long run is a stretch. If that investment works they could pay that off in a short amount of time.

1) They dont have to pay any overtime. 3,000 are protesting. How many people flood the mall every weekend? Do cops descend on the mall for crowd control?

2) The whole damn job of the police is to respond to "the unforeseen". Your line of thinking "there was a fire? fucking hell, now the fire department has to get off their ass and go fix that. Ugh, think of the cost of gas, insurance, labor....ugh"

3) A protest = less tax revenues? Uh, sure. That makes sense.

Yeah, Im sure the 45 million tax break for the wealthy firm will come back. It always does. Thats why as soon as these tax breaks run out, the companies mvoe, every time.

Ask Fidelity how they rewarded Mass for their massive tax cuts. (Hint, they fired a bunch of people and elft the state once the cuts expired)


And how many mom and pop businesses get targeted 45 million cuts to expand their store? Does the local chinese place, the laundromat, the taco shop....do they get tax cuts to add jobs?

No, they cant afford to pay for hundreds of lobbyists and bribes.

 

[gcubed]

Christ GAF has a shitload of bitchy little whiners crying about protests.

 

[akira28]

Christ GAF has a shitload of bitchy little whiners crying about protests.

Be nice to Enron. He didn't do anything to you did he? Take that bad attitude out of here, mister.

 

[Higgy]

Higgy: Opie and Anthony are kinda jerkwaddish. I really wouldn't want to mix them and this protest together. So he went down there and didn't feel the wind up his skirt?

Like I said he went down hoping to be inspired and pretty much saw Burning Man Manhattan. He has a bullhorn on a huge radio show and like I said was ready to jump in on support but couldn't take it serious after spending 4 hours walking the whole event.

He's a fair guy and is asking anyone that can counter point what he posted in his vids hit him up at his twitter at http://twitter.com/#!/OpieRadio. And he's only talking the New York protest.

 

[XMonkey]

Christ GAF has a shitload of bitchy little whiners crying about protests.

It's seriously pathetic the ways they try to undermine people exercising their right to protest.

 

[Door2Dawn]

I doubt anyone gives a shit if this Opie and Anthony behind the movement or not.

 

[Bulbo Urethral Baggins]

It's seriously pathetic the ways they try to undermine people exercising their right to protest.

Were you here defending the tea partiers?

 

[cartoon_soldier]

Like I said he went down hoping to be inspired and pretty much saw Burning Man Manhattan. He has a bullhorn on a huge radio show and like I said was ready to jump in on support but couldn't take it serious after spending 4 hours walking the whole event.

He's a fair guy and is asking anyone that can counter point what he posted in his vids hit him up at his twitter at http://twitter.com/#!/OpieRadio. And he's only talking the New York protest.

So he has no idea what the protest is about to begin with.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

Like I said he went down hoping to be inspired and pretty much saw Burning Man Manhattan. He has a bullhorn on a huge radio show and like I said was ready to jump in on support but couldn't take it serious after spending 4 hours walking the whole event.

He's a fair guy and is asking anyone that can counter point what he posted in his vids hit him up at his twitter at http://twitter.com/#!/OpieRadio. And he's only talking the New York protest.

I love me some O&A. I was listening to them before they got fired the first time in Boston. I still don't really trust them for any political insight. They constantly gave Hannity a fucking forum to mouth breath his way through his shitty beliefs and rhetoric. That is some interesting video though.

 

[Ether_Snake]

So if those people did vote, and they lost then how can they protest and say they represent the majority of Canada?

By the same token, they do represent the majority, because no one is protesting in greater number to claim they do not.

Don't be foolish.

Were you here defending the tea partiers?

Sorry to burst your bubble but in one day there were more people protesting across the world in favor of OWS than there has ever been protesting in favor of the Tea Party.

Good luck trying to undermine a global protest by the middle class. It's only the beginning, and it no longer matters if it falls in the US if it rises everywhere else. Victory is, in a way, already achieved.

 

[gcubed]

Were you here defending the tea partiers?

Did they protest? I honestly don't know, I thought they just had a bunch of rallies?

 

[XMonkey]

Were you here defending the tea partiers?

Tea party has the right to protest same as anyone else, that's perfectly fine. That doesn't mean I have to agree with their message. If there were an official Tea Party |OT| I surely wouldn't be in there shitting it up, either.

 

[Higgy]

I doubt anyone gives a shit if this Opie and Anthony behind the movement or not.

Never said I did. Just saying that that park is full of unemployed hippies who don't work. I just think its funny that they want the rich to pitch in more then they do but was has tattoo face man pitched in? I find it hard to believe him or the guy who's sleeping at 1:00 in the afternoon pitch in any tax money to the system. Any of their hard work produce taxes that help build that bridge they used to get to that park to party for 2 weeks? I doubt it.

 

[coldvein]

people are equating occupy with the tea party movement?

 

[NathanMcMahon]

Tea party has the right to protest same as anyone else, that's perfectly fine. That doesn't mean I have to agree with their message. If there were an official Tea Party |OT| I surely wouldn't be in there shitting it up, either.

This is a great point that's lost on a lot of the naysayers here.

 

[akira28]

Like I said he went down hoping to be inspired and pretty much saw Burning Man Manhattan. He has a bullhorn on a huge radio show and like I said was ready to jump in on support but couldn't take it serious after spending 4 hours walking the whole event.

He's a fair guy and is asking anyone that can counter point what he posted in his vids hit him up at his twitter at http://twitter.com/#!/OpieRadio. And he's only talking the New York protest.

What if Stern went down there?

I feel like the comedian with the asshole partner who shares a radio show would have either seen a bunch of Kumbaya hippies, or a bunch of hipsters at Burning man, because anything else would have been a drag to talk about on their show. Y'know, since they can't tell listeners to call in while having sex in the back of churches during services anymore, I doubt their listening audience would want to hear about how he went down to OWS and suddenly felt the spirit. That's just me, though.

 

[Door2Dawn]

Just saying that that park is full of unemployed hippies who don't work.

If you believe that, then thats foolish.

 

[NathanMcMahon]

What if Stern went down there?

I feel like the comedian with the asshole partner who shares a radio show would have either seen a bunch of Kumbaya hippies, or a bunch of hipsters at Burning man, because anything else would have been a drag to talk about on their show. Y'know, since they can't tell listeners to call in while having sex in the back of churches during services anymore, I doubt their listening audience would want to hear about how he went down to OWS and suddenly felt the spirit. That's just me, though.

Ahhh, c'mon man. That was a great bit.

 

[Higgy]

So he has no idea what the protest is about to begin with.

Wait.... He goes down to a protest because he personally believes Wall Street greed has fucked over the working guy. Instead he finds a Grateful Dead concert. So it's his fault?

 

[Door2Dawn]

Wait.... He goes down to a protest because he personally believes Wall Street greed has fucked over the working guy. Instead he finds a Grateful Dead concert. So it's his fault?

It's his fault because he sees a few people who can't articulate what the movement is, and then paints the whole entire thing as a joke. Fuck him, and fuck anyone else who is stupid enough to think the same.

The movement doesn't need his support.

 

[eBay Huckster]

I just think its funny that they want the rich to pitch in more then they do but was has tattoo face man pitched in?

are you literally saying their points are invalid because they're not employed

are you literally saying this

I just want to know just how out of touch with reality you are

 

[Higgy]

What if Stern went down there?

I feel like the comedian with the asshole partner who shares a radio show would have either seen a bunch of Kumbaya hippies, or a bunch of hipsters at Burning man, because anything else would have been a drag to talk about on their show. Y'know, since they can't tell listeners to call in while having sex in the back of churches during services anymore, I doubt their listening audience would want to hear about how he went down to OWS and suddenly felt the spirit. That's just me, though.

One Stern is lazy and would never do it. I just know that this was a sincere opinion he had and it wasn't a bit. That's why he even is willing to let people prove him wrong. But he pretty much is convinced after spending 4 hours walking the whole grounds its impossible to do so.

 

[remnant]

1) They dont have to pay any overtime. 3,000 are protesting. How many people flood the mall every weekend? Do cops descend on the mall for crowd control?

2) The whole damn job of the police is to respond to "the unforeseen". Your line of thinking "there was a fire? fucking hell, now the fire department has to get off their ass and go fix that. Ugh, think of the cost of gas, insurance, labor....ugh"

3) A protest = less tax revenues? Uh, sure. That makes sense.

Yeah, Im sure the 45 million tax break for the wealthy firm will come back. It always does. Thats why as soon as these tax breaks run out, the companies mvoe, every time.

Ask Fidelity how they rewarded Mass for their massive tax cuts. (Hint, they fired a bunch of people and elft the state once the cuts expired)


And how many mom and pop businesses get targeted 45 million cuts to expand their store? Does the local chinese place, the laundromat, the taco shop....do they get tax cuts to add jobs?

No, they cant afford to pay for hundreds of lobbyists and bribes.

1) Malls have private security, and even then it is a known variable.

2) they deal with unpredictable, but not the unforseen. Emergency services take into account the rate at which services are used and scale it accordingly.

For example in Socal wildfires go ablaze on a yearly basis. This is taken into account when budgetted and often no overtime is paid. Same thing with concerts, celebrations, etc etc.

3k people protesting out of nowhere was unexpected, and the mayor is not going to say a shitton of people living in a park is going to be completely ignored, especially when they are marching up and down the neighborhood everyday.

3) you really think this will have no effect on the local economy? There was a story earlier in this thread about a local shopowner who lost revenue becuase of this, but it was completely ignored.

But hey if that's your position stand by it. Well have a conversation when this over whether or not the local shops, resturants, etc saw their profits rise or fall.

As far as the tax break goes, I don't know the details of either tax breaks, but almost every city, state whatever has a economic development agency that tries to attract buisness to their state. A tax break to a company is budgetted and put forward as an investment that will pay off in the future. Whether or not they stay is irrelevant if the buisness they put in state helped the state grow.

 

[akira28]

Never said I did. Just saying that that park is full of unemployed hippies who don't work. I just think its funny that they want the rich to pitch in more then they do but was has tattoo face man pitched in? I find it hard to believe him or the guy who's sleeping at 1:00 in the afternoon pitch in any tax money to the system. Any of their hard work produce taxes that help build that bridge they used to get to that park to party for 2 weeks? I doubt it.

Your words are just tied so tightly, full of knotted imagery, I think you've already made up your mind. Lots of those "hippies" have jobs, lots of these OWS supporters have jobs, have had jobs, have been taxpayers, continue to pay taxes any time they make a purchase, etc. You seem to think that getting sprayed by mace and ordered by cops to walk in circles because you're not allowed to stay in one place longer than 15 minutes is a party? At one point they told the people the literally couldn't have sleeping bags or sit down or stand still because that would be loitering, that they could stay for as long as they want, as long as they were constantly moving. They would arrest anyone with a bullhorn, saying $5000 a day permit was required. They didn't just take bullhorns, they were arresting anyone who looked like a leader. I mean, what the hell kind of stupid, letter of the law, abuse of city ordinances is that? Business as usual for an establishment that needs to be challenged.

 

[bengraven]

Anyone who unironically uses the term "hippie" as a deragatory term automatically loses any type of relevance to me. And their opinion is invalidated.



Seriously, who are you? Fucking Archie Bunker?

 

[Higgy]

are you literally saying their points are invalid because they're not employed

are you literally saying this

I just want to know just how out of touch with reality you are

If they are unemployed like most of these people look like on purpose then yes that's what I'm saying. So if I lay around in a park unemployed by my own choice and I demand that people who work pitch in more money to the system that makes sense in any form?

Of course if you lost your job you have every right to protest and should protest. WATCH the videos! These fucking don't got no jobs. It's because the don't want to work. They want to play drums and complain about the man and eat free pizza from the food line and party at night. This isn't Flint Michigan with workers who lost their shit from a plant closing. This is young Billy living off mom and dads dime partying in the park.

 

[Kevtones]

Anyone who unironically uses the term "hippie" as a deragatory term automatically loses any type of relevance to me. And their opinion is invalidated.



Seriously, who are you? Fucking Archie Bunker?

Please travel to Eugene, Oregon.

 

[Higgy]

If you believe that, then thats foolish.

Prove it then. I'm an open mind! Show me some videos of the New York of the occupation at that park where its full of hard hat American's. Not the day the unions brought them down to march. I'm talking about the actual people occupying everday.

 

[Old Gimlet Eyes]

If they are unemployed like most of these people look like on purpose then yes that's what I'm saying. So if I lay around in a park unemployed by my own choice and I demand that people who work pitch in more money to the system that makes sense in any form?

Of course if you lost your job you have every right to protest and should protest. WATCH the videos! These fucking don't got no jobs. It's because the don't want to work. They want to play drums and complain about the man and eat free pizza from the food line and party at night. This isn't Flint Michigan with workers who lost their shit from a plant closing. This is young Billy living off mom and dads dime partying in the park.

Unemployed by choice? Lol.

 

[akira28]

If they are unemployed like most of these people look like on purpose then yes that's what I'm saying. So if I lay around in a park unemployed by my own choice and I demand that people who work pitch in more money to the system that makes sense in any form?

Higgy, you realize that they don't want any money from you right? You realize they're going after billionaires and Wall Street? That you're not next?

The way you make it sound, you're pitting the working Americans against these protestors, when the protestors are going after the richest billionaires of Wall Street. Can you explain that?

 

[eBay Huckster]

Hrm, yes, Higgy, clearly there is no merit in calling for higher tax rates on a socioeconomic demographic that hasn't had this low of an effective tax rate since fucking 1928 unless you are one of the 80%* of the labor force lucky enough to earn enough money to actually have a positive tax rate.

* - plus or minus 5%, given that the combined unemployment/underemployment rate is 17% and more than 40% of the current unemployed haven't been able to find work in two years of searching.

If they are unemployed like most of these people look like on purpose then yes that's what I'm saying.

Then whatever point you're trying to make is deserving of nothing more than mockery.

So if I lay around in a park unemployed by my own choice

If you are counted as one of the unemployed - and especially in the case of the 99ers, who make up HALF OF THE CURRENT UNEMPLOYMENT RATE - it goes without speaking that you are not "unemployed by your own choice" and it's absolutely laughable that you'd try posting that drivel here.

and I demand that people who work pitch in more money to the system

Remind me again why Jim Hedge Fund Manager, literally gambling money to make seven, eight, nine figures in profit, doesn't need to be pitching in more tax money proportionally than me. (Or my dad, who ironically makes about $80K working for an outsourcing company.)

Or why Jeffrey Immelt deserves to be paying less in taxes than me when I've shipped approximately 50,000 less jobs overseas in the past few years than he has. Really, just ENLIGHTEN me.

Of course if you lost your job you have every right to protest and should protest.

And if I can't get a job because absolutely fuck all is driving consumer demand thanks to all of these self-same rich folks shipping every last job off to China, India and Mexico? Should I just sit back and say "welp, guess I shouldn't get mad about this at all, since I'm not a business or engineering major and I'm absolute shit at all of the trades"?

WATCH the videos! These fucking don't got no jobs. It's because the don't want to work. They want to play drums and complain about the man and eat free pizza from the food line and party at night.

I've been watching the live streams of OWS for the past three weeks, thanks. Would you like a drink with your logical fallacies?

 

[rdrr gnr]

people are equating occupy with the tea party movement?

The discourse associated with either conflating their separate philosophies versus relegating them to different levels of political validity is absolutely hilarious.

Tea Party is a fucking joke. OWS is objectively, less of a joke.

 

[Higgy]

Anyone who unironically uses the term "hippie" as a deragatory term automatically loses any type of relevance to me. And their opinion is invalidated.



Seriously, who are you? Fucking Archie Bunker?

Dude............ My head is going to explode. I grew up in a hippie house......Never mind. Having an honest discussion in society is a scary motherfucking thing. Someone always twist you into something to discredit your opinion.

My mother.

 

[Averon]

People are unemployed by choice? So the massive job losses several years ago and the weak economic recovery is all a figment of our imaginations?

 

[Higgy]

I"M NOT SAYING TAKING MORE FROM THE RICH IS WRONG. I'm saying it's bullshit when you fucking don't have a job on fucking purpose and still fucking demand it. It's fucking dumb!

 

[coldvein]

i want your mom's shirt.

 

[Alpha-Bromega]

The discourse associated with either conflating their separate philosophies versus relegating them to different levels of political validity is absolutely hilarious.

Tea Party is a fucking joke. OWS is objectively, less of a joke.

OWS has also blossomed into a worldwide movement of every demographic. check and mate

when the world has joined in solidarity with eachother as brothers/sisters with a common goal, i'd say that's a pretty big fucking success.


how the fuck can you, in a thousand years, compare that to the racist, Randian ramblings of a fringe group who hold rallies? it's erroneous at the least, and downright fucking moronic in any sense

edit: this isn't at all in direct response to MuseMan, just the general idea that some people out there, probably media, compare the two groups erroneously.

 

[eBay Huckster]

I"M NOT SAYING TAKING MORE FROM THE RICH IS WRONG. I'm saying it's bullshit when you fucking don't have a job on fucking purpose and still fucking demand it. It's fucking dumb!

The socioeconomic status of the person demanding it is completely irrelevant and really just makes it look like you're blindly attacking the unemployed.

And honestly, I haven't seen anything that tells me you're not doing so.

 

[Higgy]

People are unemployed by choice? So the massive job losses several years ago and the weak economic recovery is all a figment of our imaginations?

I'm talking about the New York people living in the park. Not the whole country.

 

[coldvein]

is it full on class warfare time yet?

 

[Alpha-Bromega]

is it full on class warfare time yet?

only the antagonists want it to be framed as such. At it's core its simply the population of nations who are finally fed up with being collectively trampled on by their governments and the systemized greed of those who collude with them.

 

[Kevtones]

It's pretty clear that Occupy Wall Street needs to articulate its message better. There's a reason a large amount of educated people are looking at it as the Whine Party.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Seriously, sorry naysayers. OWS has already won. It will just be a victory spread on a few months, or maybe years, and all to its own benefit.

When a protest becomes global, it must fall everywhere at once to be ended.

Good luck with that.

It's pretty clear that Occupy Wall Street needs to articulate its message better. There's a reason a large amount of educated people are looking at it as the Whine Party.

There is no need for that. The protest is against lack of social justice. The details themselves are local.

So if you want a clear message, it's two words: Social Justice.

 

[coldvein]

i'm part of the occupy movement. i have pretty simple demands.

 

[railGUN]

Seriously, sorry naysayers. OWS has already won. It will just be a victory spread on a few months, or maybe years, and all to its own benefit.

When a protest becomes global, it must fall everywhere at once to be ended.

Good luck with that.



There is no need for that. The protest is against lack of social justice. The details are local.

I have to agree - It was all over Canadian news channels all day today. Dismissing it isn't really an option anymore.

 

[HurricaneJesus]

I'm talking about the New York people living in the park. Not the whole country.

This is a logical fallacy. The people who have jobs cannot be occupying 24 hours a day. The people without jobs can stay longer. Of course you are going to notice them.

 

[ezrarh]

I"M NOT SAYING TAKING MORE FROM THE RICH IS WRONG. I'm saying it's bullshit when you fucking don't have a job on fucking purpose and still fucking demand it. It's fucking dumb!

Well no shit but that says nothing about the current economic situation. You think there's 9% unemployed and more under employed because they don't want a job? Get real. Just because there's a few guys like that doesn't take anything way from the situation at hand.

 

[Alpha-Bromega]

It's pretty clear that Occupy Wall Street needs to articulate its message better. There's a reason a large amount of educated people are looking at it as the Whine Party.

good for those pseudo intellectuals, what have they done besides posturing and criticism?

for the time, until that figurehead presents himself, a display of discontent and "we're not going to take this shit" is enough

 

[Kevtones]

There is no need for that. The protest is against lack of social justice. The details are local.

The message appears muddled to me. It needs focus or it's just going to escalate into attrition.

 

[Higgy]

Seriously, sorry naysayers. OWS has already won. It will just be a victory spread on a few months, or maybe years, and all to its own benefit.

When a protest becomes global, it must fall everywhere at once to be ended.

Good luck with that.



There is no need for that. The protest is against lack of social justice. The details themselves are local.

So if you want a clear message, it's two words; Social Justice.

So when this victory happens shortly what will be the result? If victory is assured now that its went global tell me how my life will change in the next 2 years. This sounds revolutionary and that means my day to day life should be profoundly different.