Official 2008 Auto Racing thread (F1, Moto GP, WRC, NASCAR, etc)

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Shinobi

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Links:

http://www.formula1.com/
http://www.nascar.com/
http://www.wrc.com/
http://www.motogp.com/
http://www.americanlemans.com/
http://www.a1gp.com/
http://www.indycar.com/
http://www.champcarworldseries.com/
http://www.grandamerican.com/
http://superleagueformula.net/


http://www.autosport.com/
http://www.speedtv.com/news/
http://www.speedtv.com/schedule/
http://www.itv-f1.com/Home.aspx


http://www2.myp2p.eu


So, I've left this late again...sue me. :lol

There's been some crazy stories during the silly season, and some big stories still unfolding as things get into gear. Most notably (at least for me) is Champ Car's seemingly imminent demise, either merging with or being bought by IRL (Tony George was repoted to have offered a pretty sweetheart deal to the Champ teams a few weeks ago), or going bankrupt. It's a story that doesn't seem to have any clear answers at the moment, but we should know something concrete in the next couple weeks. The fact that nobody has said a word on either side the last few days suggests that a merger is indeed on the way, finally ending this sad, pathetic chapter of US open wheel history. It's just pathetic how much they've all screwed themselves.

WRC has already gotten underway...sadly since it hasn't been on Speed Channel in a few years I really haven't made much of an effort in following it. The deaths of Burns and McRae didn't exactly help things either, along with the small pool of manucfactuers. WRC really had a good thing going five years ago, and it's sad how badly they've fucked it up due to sheer greed (not unlike Champ Car/IRL really).

F1 of course has all sorts of things going on, coming off an incredible 2007 season that was as much soap opera as racing and technological art. I'll try and post pics of the new cars and driver lineups over the next couple weeks. Or maybe I'll just steal the posts from the end of the '07 thread. :lol

And of course there's the 50th running of the Daytona 500, which gets underway in a little under an hour. The big story is of course Dale Jr's immediate success with his new Hendrick #88, having won the Bud Pole shootout as well as one of the twin Gatorade 150 lap races (no one has won those two events and the 500 on the same weekend). He's lying third on the starting grid, behind the current back to back series champ Jimmie Johnson, and Michael Waltrip, making up for the cheating fiasco that clouded his team at this time last year. Stewart and Busch have already run into each other and been placed on probation (allegedly got into a mini-dust up in NASCAR's HQ as well, though nobody will confirm or deny it :lol), so at least we know things are starting off normally.

Anyway, same thing as last year...anything that relates to auto racing, feel free to throw it in here. There's plenty of stuff for fans of every motorsport discipline to talk about.
 
Word is that the Champ Car/IRL merger will be announced this afternoon to coincide with Daytona.

We shall see. It's about time though. the only way for open wheel racing to survive in America is with a united front.
 
SpoonyBard said:
My prediction for the year 2008: Kovalainen > Hamilton.

25 days to go...
Click to expand...

I dunno. It'll be close though. And relatively drama-free. Alonso couldn't work with equal treatment, Heikki seems far more humble and laid back.

Ferrari seem to have the title in the bag though. Their testing times are ominous to the point where they can't decide whether it's worth introducing their final aero package at the final test because last years is already fast enough.

Williams are the ones to watch though. They've shown some decent pace and look to be best of the rest behind the big two.
 
Yeah, Ferrari seems to be very strong at this point. Good thing about Williams, they have been in pretty bad shape for some time now...
 
Yeah, Williams have been annoying. On the one hand, you have to applaud their independent spirit, yet at the same time it's that same spirit which led to the split from BMW and their drop in quality.

Watching how BMW integrated with Sauber must have been painful for Frank and Patrick. Sure, BMW own the team, call the shots, spend the money. Yet the team is still recognisably Sauber in both spirit and application. Had Frank been able to manage the BMW situation better, he could have the same thing.

Now they are in the last chance saloon, with an increasingly uneasy Toyota board looking at another dismal season with the factory effort, there's never been a better time for post-BMW Williams to impress.
 
Hey Shinobi, I wondered when you would start this one :)

Just to clear things up from 2007 and so we can get on this year, and to remind the Mclaren apologists and spy case non-believers how it ended (I'm looking at you iapetus ;):
http://www.mclaren.com/latestnews/press-releases-2007.php?article=60 said:
...it has become clear that Ferrari information was more widely disseminated within McLaren than was previously communicated.
Click to expand...
 
I'm not a NASCAR fan by any stretch, but I'm a sports fan so I make it a point to watch most major sporting events, so I'll probably watch at least some of the Daytona 500. Theres just something about it that makes it exciting, despite the fact that they're racing ugly stock cars with 50s era technology on boring ovals.
 
Burai said:
Ferrari seem to have the title in the bag though. Their testing times are ominous to the point where they can't decide whether it's worth introducing their final aero package at the final test because last years is already fast enough
Click to expand...

They are so awesome. So so awesome. No mole for McLaren this year. Ferrari still won last year with the fundamental design concept of the car banned after the first race.

Plus with no TC and same tyres we can finally start to judge who is truly good in the wet.
 
skybaby said:
Just to clear things up from 2007 and so we can get on this year, and to remind the Mclaren apologists and spy case non-believers how it ended (I'm looking at you iapetus ;):
Click to expand...

My humblest apologies for actually thinking some degree of evidence was worth waiting for rather than jumping on whichever bandwagon fitted my preconceived biases. Now the evidence is there, I don't have a problem with it. Shame some others might not have been able to say the same had the facts proved different, and shame also that some people are too pathetic to get over the whole thing and see the need to do some trolling as soon as the next season's thread starts.
 
iapetus said:
My humblest apologies for actually thinking some degree of evidence was worth waiting for rather than jumping on whichever bandwagon fitted my preconceived biases. Now the evidence is there, I don't have a problem with it. Shame some others might not have been able to say the same had the facts proved different, and shame also that some people are too pathetic to get over the whole thing and see the need to do some trolling as soon as the next season's thread starts.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry iapetus, but I had no preconceived biases. As I said, I had read every deposition (even the uncensored leaked ones from gazetta della italia) and you just shrugged it off when I compiled a comprehensive list out of them. I intend no harm and don't mean to shit on this thread. If you'd like to discuss anything just PM me.

On to more pressing matters: any news on the indy/champcar merger?
 
No news yet, and it'd be friggin' stupid to announce a merger on the same day as the biggest race in America in a rival series. So with that logic, I guess they would announce it today if possible. :lol

Odds are we'll hear something in the next few days (Tuesday or Wednesday), so they get the media coverage all to themselves. If there's anything to announce at all.

Got a wild ending in store for this Daytona race...15 laps to go, with Dale, Tony and Montoya in contention for a win.
 
Ryan Newman pulls it off...Kurt Busch second. First time Penske's won the Daytona. Stewart (who I was rooting for along with Montoya) finished third. Good finish, though I bet some people call this race boring since there was no "big one" this year.
 
The first 150 laps were boring because there wasn't much racing. I fell asleep around lap 70 and woke up around 130. The last 30 or 40 laps, when people actually started racing, were pretty good.
 
I'm going to Montreal for the Canadian Grand Prix this summer... I can't wait, since the last Grand Prix I went to was the British GP at Silverstone in like 1999. Should be amazing.
 
Shinobi said:
Ryan Newman pulls it off...Kurt Busch second. First time Penske's won the Daytona. Stewart (who I was rooting for along with Montoya) finished third. Good finish, though I bet some people call this race boring since there was no "big one" this year.
Click to expand...

Excellent race. Shame about Montoya, but his car was so loose that I'm not surprised he went backward fast. You could tell something was up because nobody wanted to draft him on the restart and it only took a couple of turns before it got away from him.

The question on everyone's lips though is where the hell was Kyle Busch when Stewart needed him?

Oh, and everyone please f**k off with the spy scandal shit unless there's actually some news about it. It really is rather tiresome.
 
Speaking of Montoya... has he gone into wrestling?

Regarding F1, after last years monumental nail-biter of a season, 2008 will probably be watchingpaintdry levels of boredom. 2009 can't come soon enough, especially with the reduced downforce rules next year (or is that 2010?). Anyway, this is Ferrari's season and the only jousting for position we'll probably see will be for the final step on the podium.
 
watched a little of the Daytona last night (around the halfway point) but got bored and went to bed. Mostly I was just curious as it was being broadcast in HD on sky. Looked gorgeous. Now I'll be even more depressed when ITV start their sub-SD quality coverage of F1 :/

although they are expected to launch a HD channel in April, its too much to hope they get a HD feed for F1. Is FIA even providing one?
 
Nope, no official HD F1 feed yet :(
Countries with feeds generated by local broadcasters (Japan, Monaco and Brazil) might get HD in it's own races (like Japan did last year) but that's it.
 
Some F1 testing times for those interested:

Barcelona - 25/02/2008 said:
1 . L. Hamilton - McLaren Mercedes MP4-23 - 1:22.276 (+ 0.000 ) - 78 laps
2 . K. Raikkonen - Ferrari F2008 - 1:22.319 (+ 0.043 ) - 82 laps
3 . M. Schumacher - Ferrari F2008 - 1:22.428 (+ 0.152 ) - 83 laps
4 . K. Nakajima - Williams Toyota FW30 - 1:22.724 (+ 0.448 ) - 54 laps
5 . H. Kovalainen - McLaren Mercedes MP4-23 - 1:22.852 (+ 0.576 ) - 71 laps
6 . N. Rosberg - Williams Toyota FW30 - 1:22.974 (+ 0.698 ) - 108 laps
7 . F. Alonso - Renault R28 - 1:23.021 (+ 0.745 ) - 79 laps
8 . N. Heidfeld - BMW Sauber F1.08 - 1:23.075 (+ 0.799 ) - 75 laps
9 . A. Sutil - Force India Ferrari VJM01 - 1:23.091 (+ 0.815 ) - 62 laps
10 . M. Webber - Red Bull Renault RB4 - 1:23.115 (+ 0.839 ) - 71 laps
11 . S. Vettel - Toro Rosso Ferrari STR2B - 1:23.188 (+ 0.912 ) - 95 laps
12 . V. Liuzzi - Force India Ferrari F8-VIIB - 1:23.239 (+ 0.963 ) - 43 laps
13 . T. Glock - Toyota TF108 - 1:23.270 (+ 0.994 ) - 70 laps
14 . C. Klien - BMW Sauber F1.08 - 1:23.442 (+ 1.166 ) - 42 laps
15 . N. Piquet - Renault R28 - 1:23.609 (+ 1.333 ) - 86 laps
16 . K. Kobayashi - Toyota TF108 - 1:23.880 (+ 1.604 ) - 29 laps
17 . R. Barrichello - Honda RA108 - 1:24.460 (+ 2.184 ) - 115 laps
18 . A. Wurz - Honda RA108 - 1:24.667 (+ 2.391 ) - 109 laps
19 . D. Coulthard - Red Bull Renault RB4 - 1:24.826 (+ 2.550 ) - 25 laps.
Click to expand...


Barcelona - 26/02/2008 said:
1. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:21.234 81
2. Kovalainen McLaren-Mercedes (B) 1:21.434 68
3. Raikkonen Ferrari (B) 1:21.722 72
4. Rosberg Williams-Toyota (B) 1:22.309 75
5. Massa Ferrari (B) 1:22.513 102
6. Fisichella Force India-Ferrari (B) 1:22.516 102
7. Vettel Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:22.558 109
8. Kubica BMW-Sauber (B) 1:22.625 94
9. Button Honda (B) 1:22.659 67
10. Liuzzi Force India-Ferrari (B) 1:22.942 89
11. Nakajima Williams-Toyota (B) 1:22.977 100
12. Trulli Toyota (B) 1:23.023 98
13. Alonso Renault (B) 1:23.112 77
14. Barrichello Honda (B) 1:23.169 74
15. Heidfeld BMW-Sauber (B) 1:23.284 77
16. Bourdais Toro Rosso-Ferrari (B) 1:23.323 98
17. Webber Red Bull-Renault (B) 1:23.458 58
18. Piquet Renault (B) 1:23.467 45
19. Glock Toyota (B) 1:23.561 80
Click to expand...

McLaren going better than expected, by me anyway. HOWEVER, potential megaton ahead? Seems as if Ron might be 'pushed' out the team sometime soon: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/formula_1/article3467604.ece
 
As a sum up of winter testing: Ferrari and McLaren are in front and the consensus of opinion is that Ferrari has the slight race pace edge whereas McLaren is slightly faster in quali. Behind them it's interesting, basically any of BMW, Renault, Red Bull, Williams or Toyota could be the 3rd placed team, with Williams and BMW being the most likely to emerge behind the top two. Honda = shit, maybe even Force India and STR are ahead of them. As for Super Aguri, it's not even sure they will start, they've barely done any winter testing and apparently money is tight.
 
Shinobi, you forgot about the newly formed Superleague Formula. It's basically a competitor of the F1 and A1 in terms of cars, but each car is supported by a football team. It's supported by the FIA.

http://superleagueformula.net/

There's only six races this season, but it will quickly expand next season to include a lot more circuits.

Seems pretty promising to me.
 
IRL/Champ Car are officially merged... looks like nearly all the teams (7 out of the 9) will be running in the IRL this year and they'll add 3 of the Champ Cars races (Long Beach, Edmonton, and Australia), with likely more coming on in 2009 once the scheduling kinks get worked out. They're running with all the IRL stuff & rules, with a new car coming in 2010.
 
thefro said:
IRL/Champ Car are officially merged... looks like nearly all the teams (7 out of the 9) will be running in the IRL this year and they'll add 3 of the Champ Cars races (Long Beach, Edmonton, and Australia), with likely more coming on in 2009 once the scheduling kinks get worked out. They're running with all the IRL stuff & rules, with a new car coming in 2010.
Click to expand...

I hope it goes back to "Indy Car" and not fucking IRL.
 
Falch said:
Shinobi, you forgot about the newly formed Superleague Formula. It's basically a competitor of the F1 and A1 in terms of cars, but each car is supported by a football team. It's supported by the FIA.

http://superleagueformula.net/

There's only six races this season, but it will quickly expand next season to include a lot more circuits.

Seems pretty promising to me.
Click to expand...

Yeah, forgot all about that...I hope it becomes something decent. I'll add the link to the top post.

WRC hasn't been shown on Speed in a few years, and I doubt it'll ever return. Just download the races, or watch streams of the highlight packages.

Thanks to Forsythe's bitterness and loathing concerning Tony George, he's opting not to move his Champ Car team to IRL. Which means Paul Tracy is currently out of a ride. Paul is hoping that Forsythe will change his mind, but it's a pretty shitty thing to do considering that PT had NASCAR options a couple years ago that he chose not to act on due to Forsythe's insistence. Now he goes and leaves one of the US open wheel's biggest stars high and dry. Just isn't right to me. Funny thing is he will race at Long Beach, as they'll be using the Champ Car Panoz at that race.

Hard to believe there's just a couple weeks to go till F1 kicks off...really looking forward to it.
 
marvelharvey said:
McLaren going better than expected, by me anyway. HOWEVER, potential megaton ahead? Seems as if Ron might be 'pushed' out the team sometime soon: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/formula_1/article3467604.ece
Click to expand...

That article is saying very much that he isn't being pushed, unless I'm missing something - in fact it's saying that if it hadn't been for the Spygate fallout he'd already be gone.

Good (but not too good) McLaren performance is a good thing for this season - a season-long Ferrari victory parade would be dull. Can't help feeling that Ferrari can't be trying their hardest on the first set of times, though. How can Schumacher not be first? :P
 
I hope a lot of teams are capable of winning races this year. This was the reason 1999 and 2003 were fucking amazing seasons.

Williams have said the gap to the top two is much reduced compared to before. Toyota seem like they will surprise everyone.
 
Can't wait to the start of the F1 season, even though Melbourne is gonna be very hot next weekemd, so everyone pray for rain next week. Its gonna be 37C on friday, and 35C on saturday, no idea about sunday but i got a feeling it's going to be hot too! Lucky I don't burn easily and will most likely end up with really dark tan but i hate hot weather.

I predict Kimi for WDC II. They better have some Kimi merchandise this year! Last year I couldn't find a Kimi Ferrari cap :(
 
My view...

Ferrari has an amazing package. Everything seems to be perfect. Aerodynamics, chassis, engine, gearbox, reliability, etc.
McLaren and Toyota equal in performance, but McLaren has the experience and the better drivers. Toyota has a terrible management, will loose their position as the season progresses.
Williams could surprise. BMW seems great, but with some aerodynamical issues. Renault has a good package, but underpowered.
Red Bull great, but also underpowered (Renault engine), Toro Rosso not so great, but with the best engine (Ferrari), same goes for Force India, the old Jordan->Midland->Spyker team finally with some money.
Honda is struggling with everything.
Super Aguri doesn't even have a car yet...

As for the drivers...for the first time in many years, it looks like the field is paydriver-free.
I had my doubts about Nakajima, but he was véry fast over the winter.
 
I think it's going to be an all-Ferrari show. Massa and Kimi will duke it out and Kimi will simply win it because he's more consistent and makes far less boneheaded moves than Massa.

Mclaren will start off pretty strong behind Ferrari, but will lose their place by the end of the season to BMW.
 
F1: won't be a Ferrari redwash, they have some reliability concerns related to the back end of the car and their trick dampers, a DNF at Melb is possible.

MotoGP 1st rd quali: lolopalooza, Rossi insists on switching to Bridgestones causing untold of fuss at the end of last year. His 20 year old debutant teammate on Michelin's takes pole and only 2 of the top 9 are on Bridgies. wrofulcopter. Stoner's 4th, Vale 7th.
 
Hamilton was on Top Gear this week (I think - hard to tell what's current and what's repeats when the show seems to be on some satellite channel or another 24/7). Couple of interesting points from his lap in the reasonably priced car:

- He was the first F1 driver to take the same line as the Stig (still, naturally, the fastest entity on the track)
- He was three hundredths of a second behind the Stig's lap time - driving on a wet track. Given the normal adjustments for wet track, he'd have been the first F1 driver to beat the Stig on that track.
 
celestial body said:
F1: won't be a Ferrari redwash, they have some reliability concerns related to the back end of the car and their trick dampers, a DNF at Melb is possible.
Click to expand...

Boo. :( Okay, it's better than a completely one-sided season, but I'd rather see competition on the track than have each race decided by whether the Ferrari blows up.
 
Well typically over the last 4 years they've had reliability gremlins in the first of the flyaway races because they are so hot (Malaysia, Melbourne and Bahrain usually see 30+C) and therefore tend to expose cooling weaknesses. By the time the circus gets back to Europe they have sorted the problems out. I wouldn't expect prolonged problems but they can't afford even 1 DNF given how bulletproof the McLarens are.
 
iapetus said:
Hamilton was on Top Gear this week (I think - hard to tell what's current and what's repeats when the show seems to be on some satellite channel or another 24/7). Couple of interesting points from his lap in the reasonably priced car:

- He was the first F1 driver to take the same line as the Stig (still, naturally, the fastest entity on the track)
- He was three hundredths of a second behind the Stig's lap time - driving on a wet track. Given the normal adjustments for wet track, he'd have been the first F1 driver to beat the Stig on that track.
Click to expand...

all old repeats. new series is in the spring/summer
 
Speaking of Melbourne, race has been delayed on Sunday by an hour and a half (3:30pm local time) to help boost European TV ratings - if it helps like they think they should, '09 will see it move to a 5pm start.
 
Williams owner is a moron, confirmed:

A radical idea to improve the spectacle of Formula One and make overtaking easier has been proposed by Williams team co-owner Patrick Head.

The veteran says races can be boring and wants the fastest cars to start at the back and the slowest at the front.

"I would like to see the grids in reverse order of championship position," Head told BBC Sport.
Click to expand...

Edit: Okay, it's not quite as moronic an idea as it appeared at first glance (the article I first read seemed to imply it would be reverse order of qualifying.
 
What the hell has happened to Moto GP?

That series a few years back was awesome with all the close racing - now it's just the Ducati show. I won't be watching it anymore as I don't like that pinhead Aussie Stoner.

Also, well done to Toseland on his debut ride. :D


F1 on Sunday - Yay! Come on Honda!
c3fa6602bd.gif
 
Falch said:
Shinobi, you forgot about the newly formed Superleague Formula. It's basically a competitor of the F1 and A1 in terms of cars, but each car is supported by a football team. It's supported by the FIA.

http://superleagueformula.net/

There's only six races this season, but it will quickly expand next season to include a lot more circuits.
Click to expand...

WTF. This seems so silly to me :lol
Will probably fail big time.
 
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