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[Ydahs]

So what's the reason then for falling behind so much if not for Islam itself? Look at how much Christianity stalled western development until the reforms. It certainly appears that they made these achievments despite Islam not because of it. A restricting dogma never has advantages on free research.

The downfall of Islamic Spain was certainly a major contribution to the halt in Islamic scientific discoveries.

Many significant inventions in different fields came from Islamic Spain in what is considered the Golden Age of scientific Islam.

 

[Earthstrike]

Complete total and utter Bunk. The Islamic World today is in the third world and *no* country in the thrid world contributes anything of worth to scientific discoveries. Back in the ninth and tenth centuries it was the most dynamic and progressive. The reasons that the Islamic world fell into poverty has absolutely nothing to do with religion as should be obvious as the 'Islamic' world throughout history and today has created societies that are completely different from one another in almost every way.

I've seen this all the time. This belief that its impossible for the policies of a state to have something to do with its quality of life. Even if you attribute the problems to war or some other factor, it doesn't change the fact that different governmental policies will affect the rate of redevelopment. With this said we can look at certain policies some islamic governments have.

1. Woman can't drive.
The capacity of an individual to work and be productive is related to their ability to go to a workplace, and get there quickly and efficiently. By preventing woman from driving, this capacity is reduced and GDP is not as high as it could be.

2. You may not collect interest.
The concept of interest allows for people who have ambitions to try something out which will benefit the economy and indirectly the people within it. Without interest, less risk can be taken. Its harder for a bank to give out a loan, and therefore harder for people to try to make productive changes to an economy.

I'm sure there's others that people will probably post about but there's something else I want to address.

Just because something messed up an economy doesn't mean it can't recover.
Look at hiroshima. It had an atomic bomb dropped on it. Going by what wikipedia says it had 69% of its buildings destroyed. That's some pretty serious destruction right there, not even mentioning the psychological impact on the citizens and cost of human lives. But you look at hiroshima right now. Its been rebuilt, it economic again. The same is true of Nagasaki. I mean this belief that governmental policy is irrelevant to economic development absolutely baffles me. What is the basis of it?

Edit: I'm also reminded of a prominent neurologist in Saudi Arabia who published some of his findings, but was threatened to retract it by the government or he would be killed. (something about contradicting allah) Things like this aren't attributable to a lack of scientific development in Islamic countries? A restriction on what scientists can and can't publish?

 

[Smiles and Cries]

more questions:

Can a Muslim male not marry?

What if you are too poor to afford a dower and cannot support a family?

Do you have to change your name when you convert?

Say you are sick in bed in the Hospital for weeks, during this time how do you take care of the 5 prayers?

Can a Painter (artist) be a muslim or does he have to give that up?

sorry for so many questions

 

[AmMortal]

more questions:

Can a Muslim male not marry?

What if you are too poor to afford a dower and cannot support a family?

Do you have to change your name when you convert?

Say you are sick in bed in the Hospital for weeks, during this time how do you take care of the 5 prayers?

Can a Painter (artist) be a muslim or does he have to give that up?

sorry for so many questions

1. A Muslim Male or female HAS to marry, it is almost an obligation, unless there is a valid reason.
2. Everything can be a dowry, even a copy of the Qur'an.
3. No, only if the meaning of the name is not inline with Islam, for instance, if one is called " Ramses" etc.)
4. If that's the case, prayer can be done in within the mind, even if your four limbs are not functioning, as long as you have your consiousness.
5. No. He can be a muslim, he doesn't have to give it up.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

AmMortal thank you for answering my questions

can you recommend a good Qur'an from amazon or other online book store?

 

[AmMortal]

AmMortal thank you for answering my questions

can you recommend a good Qur'an from amazon or other online book store?

Yeah no problem, what you have to understand is that no matter what we do, reading an English version or Chinese, or Japanese etc. We still don't consider it the Qur'an itself, only the original arabic ( which is supplied on one side of each page). Is the Qur'an. The translated versions, are only snippets, of what the translator could turn into English etc.

But this is a good translation, and is widely refered to for its easy guiding of new comers:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0940368323/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Whoa, I never knew it was that expensive, try looking for other cheaper items by Abdullahi Yusuf Ali.

Also, you'll notice that the Qur'an has no chronological index, things won't make sense to you, if you don't have someone to try and explain it to you.

For instance, the chapters at the end, have actually been revealed in the beginning. They are more spiritual, and less legislation is mentioned.

 

[SuperAngelo64]

3. No, only if the meaning of the name is not inline with Islam, for instance, if one is called " Ramses" etc.)

Really? I didn't know that. Where does it say that?

So I'm fine with 'Angelo'? The meaning is pretty self-explanatory.

 

[AmMortal]

Really? I didn't know that. Where does it say that?

So I'm fine with 'Angelo'? The meaning is pretty self-explanatory.

I see nothing wrong with it.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Yeah no problem, what you have to understand is that no matter what we do, reading an English version or Chinese, or Japanese etc. We still don't consider it the Qur'an itself, only the original arabic ( which is supplied on one side of each page). Is the Qur'an. The translated versions, are only snippets, of what the translator could turn into English etc.

But this is a good translation, and is widely refered to for its easy guiding of new comers:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0940368323/?tag=neogaf0e-20

Whoa, I never knew it was that expensive, try looking for other cheaper items by Abdullahi Yusuf Ali.

Also, you'll notice that the Qur'an has no chronological index, things won't make sense to you, if you don't have someone to try and explain it to you.

For instance, the chapters at the end, have actually been revealed in the beginning. They are more spiritual, and less legislation is mentioned.

oops I did not see your edit I already ordered 3 books from the first link.

now I have questions, should I avoid the Naition of Islam? I'm black but for some reason I never really seen them as a group I would want to be part of. Maybe Sunni Islam would be a good choice to explore my intentions?

 

[AmMortal]

oops I did not see your edit I already ordered 3 books from the first link.

now I have questions, should I avoid the Naition of Islam? I'm black but for some reason I never really seen them as a group I would want to be part of. Maybe Sunni Islam would be a good choice to explore my intentions?

yes Sunni.

RUN AWAY FROM THE NATION OF ISLAM. THEY HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH ISLAM.

I'm surprised why we still haven't sued them for taking our name :lol

 

[Smiles and Cries]

yes Sunni.

RUN AWAY FROM THE NATION OF ISLAM. THEY HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH ISLAM.

I'm surprised why we still haven't sued them for taking our name :lol

they have a nice building just down the street from me... I think - I will have to go look at the sign to be sure thats them. If its not them I may walk in and ask some more questions but yeah in High School my friend wanted to join the Nation of Islam but after seeing X I understood that they really did not teach things I valued

 

[AmMortal]

they have a nice building just down the street from me... I think - I will have to go look at the sign to be sure thats them. If its not them I may walk in and ask some more questions but yeah in High School my friend wanted to join the Nation of Islam but after seeing X I understood that they really did not teach things I valued

yep.

 

[kobashi100]

I've seen this all the time. This belief that its impossible for the policies of a state to have something to do with its quality of life. Even if you attribute the problems to war or some other factor, it doesn't change the fact that different governmental policies will affect the rate of redevelopment. With this said we can look at certain policies some islamic governments have.

1. Woman can't drive.
The capacity of an individual to work and be productive is related to their ability to go to a workplace, and get there quickly and efficiently. By preventing woman from driving, this capacity is reduced and GDP is not as high as it could be.

2. You may not collect interest.
The concept of interest allows for people who have ambitions to try something out which will benefit the economy and indirectly the people within it. Without interest, less risk can be taken. Its harder for a bank to give out a loan, and therefore harder for people to try to make productive changes to an economy.

I'm sure there's others that people will probably post about but there's something else I want to address.

Just because something messed up an economy doesn't mean it can't recover.
Look at hiroshima. It had an atomic bomb dropped on it. Going by what wikipedia says it had 69% of its buildings destroyed. That's some pretty serious destruction right there, not even mentioning the psychological impact on the citizens and cost of human lives. But you look at hiroshima right now. Its been rebuilt, it economic again. The same is true of Nagasaki. I mean this belief that governmental policy is irrelevant to economic development absolutely baffles me. What is the basis of it?

Edit: I'm also reminded of a prominent neurologist in Saudi Arabia who published some of his findings, but was threatened to retract it by the government or he would be killed. (something about contradicting allah) Things like this aren't attributable to a lack of scientific development in Islamic countries? A restriction on what scientists can and can't publish?

which Muslim government does not allow the collection of interest? I pretty sure that every single Muslim government we have uses the capitalist economic system and none of them forbid interest.

Not one of them can call themselves an Islamic State..

Riba (Interest) is forbidden. There can be no compromise over this. In Islam, Banks are not suppose to be businesses out to make a profit. Banks are seen as a tool to hold the citizens wealth and also the state treasury.

If a Muslim knows that interest is forbidden why would they then want to collect interest??

Wouldn't you agree that the problem we have had in the Muslim world since the abolishment of the Khilafah state is that we have had tyrants and dictators rule over the lands with an iron fist.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

do you have to grow a beard or can you shave freely?

 

[GSG Flash]

oops I did not see your edit I already ordered 3 books from the first link.

now I have questions, should I avoid the Naition of Islam? I'm black but for some reason I never really seen them as a group I would want to be part of. Maybe Sunni Islam would be a good choice to explore my intentions?

Nation of Islam members are not muslims, their hate speech goes against Islam completely.

Although I'm a shia, but sunnis do have the largest percentage of blacks, not that it really matters because honestly, as long as you're a muslim, you're a muslim.

edit:

do you have to grow a beard or can you shave freely?

The jury's still out on that one, depending on the scholar you follow, you may or may not have to keep a beard.

 

[Instigator]

do you have to grow a beard or can you shave freely?

I think it is optional, despite disagreements.

Circumcision doesn't appear to be though...

 

[ice cream]

do you have to grow a beard or can you shave freely?

It is not necessary. There is no rule saying you have to grow a bear, but it's just a plus if you do.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

man after reading for the past few days it seems like my old Christian life was nothing compared to life as a Muslim.

I went to Church 3 times per week for 4 years (a Chruch that was 90 miles from our town) and I thought that was a strict devotion. She was Penticostal and could not wear jeans or pants and such. I was turned off by it but still drove with her to Church 3 times per week and I learned a lot. We wanted to marry but she delayed for many reasons until I broke it off since I could tell she was not very supportive of me as much I supported her life style and beliefs.


I remember when she invited me to Church I told her I wanted to learn about Islam. It has been over a year since I left the Church now and I did not want to ever think of religion again. I wanted to stop believing completely but I found out I was only lying to myself.

So as much as being devoted to a religion scared me before I am not sure why nothing I have read about Islam has shocked me or made me change my desire to learn more. This is strange.

I did not give up porn or drinking for my Christian life yet I can see the value of abstaining for such things if I were to convert to Islam. I think its the whole thing about seeing too many contradictions in my faith in the past that made it hard to stop doing things that was not good for my spiritual self.

I was just reading that I would have to remove armpit and pubic hair? I really did not know Muslims did so much to be purifide.

the more I read the more I have a growing respect for Islam.

The only fears I have is why am I drawn to it now? Is it because of my resentment of my old faith or will I really grow for this?

I also do not know what it would be like to be Muslim in America today. I am black so I do know a bit about people hating you out of ignorance but still I don't think anyone would choose to have others hate and fear him if he could help it.

I guess the other thing is I had made up my mind I would never marry.

This is a lot

How hard would it be to learn to read and speak (Arabic?)

 

[ice cream]

I think you should just continue researching and see where it goes from there. If it's not for you, then so be it, if it is then thats good.
Plus from what I've been told is that you don't have to marry it's just very very good if you and sort of frowned upon if you don't, but it's not a sin.

How hard would it be to learn to read and speak (Arabic?)

Well you don't need to speak it, just be able to read it so you can read the Qu'ran. I don't know how to speak it, just read it. Took me a few years before I could actually start reading it but I was born a Muslim anyway and started from a young age.

Plus I don't think anyone would be able too tell you were Muslim from looks.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

oh I just saw on Youtube that MJ just converted to Islam good for him

I love languages so I would take it up as a personal challenge although I have been trying to learn Japanese for many years english was not my first language
I feel good about this.

 

[Nocebo]

Has creation been brought up yet?

 

[AmMortal]

oh I just saw on Youtube that MJ just converted to Islam good for him

I love languages so I would take it up as a personal challenge although I have been trying to learn Japanese for many years english was not my first language
I feel good about this.

*looks for vid*

OMG

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=KS3V7j4jLV0

ITS REALLL!

 

[Nocebo]

oh I just saw on Youtube that MJ just converted to Islam good for him

I love languages so I would take it up as a personal challenge although I have been trying to learn Japanese for many years english was not my first language
I feel good about this.

How far did you get with japanese?

 

[AmMortal]

Dude, the Arabic I'm speaking for my prayers and saying before I do anything ("Bismillah...") are so beautiful I'm interested in learning Arabic. I want to learn at least 4 languages in my life. Might as well throw another on the pile.

I already have 4

 

[Feep]

Random question: I fail to understand why a text cannot be accurately translated. From a linguistic standpoint, there ARE certain words in other languages (most notably within my own experience, Japanese) that do not have direct translations into English. Still, with a few extra words or a sentence, the meaning of these words can still be accurately conveyed.

Words and grammar do not mean anything unto themselves; they merely communicate ideas to the reader. There is nothing that cannot be translated into English fully by a fluent speaker of both languages. Even if you believe otherwise, the text being translated is no different than someone who has learned Arabic translating the text to English in their head, so why would it even be beneficial to learn the language?

You may lose the elegant prose, perhaps, but I refuse to believe that the meaning of the Quran cannot be effectively and completely translated.

 

[AmMortal]

The Qur'an in Arabic is poetic. In English, this beauty is lost. It just reads likeany middle English text. So while you have the literal word for word, a good portion of the beauty in its writing is lost in the translation process. Word for word is not the problem. It's the sound and the writing of the arabic Qur'an that makes it special. Recite the Qur'an in English and then do it again in Arabic. The difference is night and day.

Anyways, Smiles and Cries I've read numerous books on Islam and religion during my years. I suggest you read these books if you're interested in Islam, especially in the Islam we see in today's world. It can shed light on various issues, internal and external that affect the Islamic faith.

Speaking of why the Qur'an is only the arabic one:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fyMN1lqAqoc&eurl=http://www.hamzatzortzis.blogspot.com/

here is a detailed explanation by a greek revert, I swear, after watching this, you will realize evenmore of it's beauty.

I really recommend you watch it, Duck Amuck.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

How far did you get with japanese?

not far but I love that language very much and will continue to study it.

I grew up in Haiti so I speak and read Haitian Creole. I can read and understand French but I shy away from speaking it but I can be fluent if I tried

Japanese is something I really love I love the soubd of it and the politeness and culture so I will stick with it

 

[IronicallyTwisted]

I'm also reminded of a prominent neurologist in Saudi Arabia who published some of his findings, but was threatened to retract it by the government or he would be killed. (something about contradicting allah) Things like this aren't attributable to a lack of scientific development in Islamic countries? A restriction on what scientists can and can't publish?

Most Islamic countries are theocracies, and Islamic dogma has them stuck in 700 A.D.

 

[Nocebo]

not far but I love that language very much and will continue to study it.

I grew up in Haiti so I speak and read Haitian Creole. I can read and understand French but I shy away from speaking it but I can be fluent if I tried

Japanese is something I really love I love the soubd of it and the politeness and culture so I will stick with it

Can you read hiragana and katakana at least? I agree it's a beautiful language. I'm really liking the structure.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

my life is a total mess. it needs structure and maturity. I cannot continue to live the way I have been living. I have been depressed a long time and its mostly dude to my faith and feeling like I am living a lie. I love science and wanted to leave all religious thinking behind but my inner voice kept haunting me. So I am serious about the questions I have asked here.

I am about to go to my Godmother's house for Thanksgiving she and her daughter are Catholic and also the house is full of Haitian Voodoo idols and lit candles. It is very hard to spend time with them as a Christian I stayed away from them for years just avoiding the Haitian Voodoo culture they are surrounded by.

I really need to guard myself from not only Christians but Voodoo so seriously my faith has been upside down for so long.

When I return home in a few days I am going to clean my place of the trash around me. Stop eaten pork and cleanse my mind. I will search for the nearest Islamic Center and convert. That is what I wish to do and hope that it is blessed.

A year ago I wanted to take my own life. I get very tired of feeling helpless I need to take control of my life again.

Thanks for answering my questions again

Can you read hiragana and katakana at least? I agree it's a beautiful language. I'm really liking the structure.

failed badly at that and gave up when I started to lose my vision I have many books here for learning kanji and my vision has been really a challenge I want to read it so badly

 

[Ikael]

Quite an interesting topic, congratulations to everyone. Now, I have some questions about the islam too!

Arent Hadiths what have been driving off the purity of Islam? Why you do not discard them completely?

Is the interpretation of the Qoran allowed nowadays? For what I learnt, it was a common thing during the middle ages and there were several "schools of interpretation", then they were shutted off and the islamic world began its decadence.

Is it mandatory for to push the Sharia to become an official part of the state's law? Can you be muslim without obbeying the Sharia?

Is sufism a part of the Islam or a product of the islamic world? From all the things that ever spawned from the Islam, it is the one that interest me the most.

 

[AmMortal]

my life is a total mess. it needs structure and maturity. I cannot continue to live the way I have been living. I have been depressed a long time and its mostly dude to my faith and feeling like I am living a lie. I love science and wanted to leave all religious thinking behind but my inner voice kept haunting me. So I am serious about the questions I have asked here.

I am about to go to my Godmother's house for Thanksgiving she and her daughter are Catholic and also the house is full of Haitian Voodoo idols and lit candles. It is very hard to spend time with them as a Christian I stayed away from them for years just avoiding the Haitian Voodoo culture they are surrounded by.

I really need to guard myself from not only Christians but Voodoo so seriously my faith has been upside down for so long.

When I return home in a few days I am going to clean my place of the trash around me. Stop eaten pork and cleanse my mind. I will search for the nearest Islamic Center and convert. That is what I wish to do and hope that it is blessed.

A year ago I wanted to take my own life. I get very tired of feeling helpless I need to take control of my life again.

Thanks for answering my questions again


failed badly at that and gave up when I started to lose my vision I have many books here for learning kanji and my vision has been really a challenge I want to read it so badly

Man, this week can not get any better.

I hope you find everything you need and more, and may Allah bless you.

Ameen.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

thanks for the books Duck! I will give them a read as soon as I can get them

oh one more question what about female friends? Non-Muslim women that I hung out with. You cannot hang out with women alone can you?

 

[AmMortal]

thanks for the books Duck! I will give them a read as soon as I can get them

oh one more question what about female friends? Non-Muslim women that I hung out with. You cannot hang out with women alone can you?

That's something that you shouldn't be worried about at the moment.

 

[Linkhero1]

aslam alaikum wa rahmatullah wa barukato

I have some sites that you guys can check out.

Qu'ran Reciting - Qu'ran Explorer
Fatwa's and the life of the Prophet Muhammad (saw) - IslamToday

I hope these help anyone

May Allah bless you all.

 

[plovie]

Nowhere, in the Qur'an does it deny women equal rights. "Islamic" countries, are not excersising Islamic law, and the authorities there, have there own political motives. Also, I'm not lying about the burqah part ( if that's what mean). Nowhere does it say that women are only there to support men. Remember, the majority of converts are women. Also, you'll find out how exactly "unequal" women are treated, when you actually meet a Muslim girl, toughest dames there is :lol

From Ibn Warraq's "Out of Context," Or How to Argue with a Muslim:

The context, far from helping Muslims get out of difficulties only makes the barbaric principle apparent in the offending quote more obvious, as we have seen from Sura V.32 just cited. Let us take some other examples. Does the Koran say that men have the right to physically beat their wives or not? I say yes and quote the following verses to prove my point:

Sura IV.34 : "As for those [women] from whom you fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge [or beat] them.”

This translation comes from a Muslim. Have I somehow distorted the meaning of these lines? Let us have a wider textual context:

Sura IV.34 : “Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and send them to beds apart and beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them. God is high, supreme.”

If anything, the wider textual context makes things worse for those apologists of Islam who wish to minimize the mysogyny of the Koran. The oppression of women has divine sanction; women must obey God and their men, who have divine authorisation to scourge them. One Muslim translator, Yusuf Ali, clearly disturbed by this verse adds the word “lightly” in brackets after “beat” even though there is no “lightly” in the original Arabic. An objective reading of the entire Koran (that is the total context) makes grim reading as far as the position of women is concerned.

Clearly women do not have equal rights in Islam.

 

[Linkup]

You're using Ibn Warraq as an argument?

Ibn fucking Warraq? :lol

He's joking or at least I think he is.

 

[plovie]

You're using Ibn Warraq as an argument?

Ibn fucking Warraq? :lol

Got anything besides an ad hominem?

Besides, he's quoting a translation by a muslim of the Quran, so actually I'm only using Warraq incidentally. Is this translation false? What do those verses that are quoted actually say then?

 

[IronicallyTwisted]

Men have high "authority" over women in regards to responsibility (traditional family with male as the general leader of the household, the provider). They do not have authority over women in any other way and cannot force them to do anything. This essentially means to man up and take care of your family and responsibilities. However, the rest of the quote is correct. It does say to put them in their rooms if they are disobedient. Superior isn't a right for it, and neither is "beat".

So sexism is fine as long as it isn't too harsh?

 

[IronicallyTwisted]

What sexism?

Admonish means to warn, putting a woman in her room to "think" implies possession. Whether or not you think Islam treats women "well", they don't treat them equally, the very definition of sexism.

 

[IronicallyTwisted]

http://invitation2learn.wordpress.c...ades-women-is-it-true-434-encourages-beating/

What does this have to do with anything? Am I supposed to be impressed because you don't beat your wives?

But for the sake of reality, Islamic countries have enormous domestic abuse problems.

The incidence in many Muslim-majority countries (where women hide their bruises and little is ever reported to authorities) is uncertain, but believed to be great by Muslim feminists. In some Muslim countries, such as Saudi Arabia,[27] reports indicate that domestic violence is quite widespread. One recent study, in Syria, found that 25% of the married women surveyed said that they had been beaten by their husbands.[28] One study found that half of Palestinian women have been the victims of domestic violence.[29] A WHO study in Babol found that within the previous year 15.0% of wives had been physically abused, 42.4% had been sexually abused and 81.5% had been psychologically abused (to various degrees) by their husbands, blaming low income, young age, unemployment and low education.[30] A 1987 study conducted by the Women's Division and another study by the Human Rights Commission of Pakistan in 1996 suggested that domestic violence takes place in approximately 80 percent of the households in the country.[31][32][33] In Pakistan, domestic violence occurs in forms of beatings, sexual violence or torture, mutilation, acid attacks and burning the victim alive.[34]

According to the Pakistan Institute of Medical Sciences in 2002, over 90% of married women surveyed in that country reported being kicked, slapped, beaten or sexually abused when husbands were dissatisfied by their cooking or cleaning, or when the women had ‘failed’ to bear a child or had given birth to a girl instead of a boy.[35]

Source: Wikipedia

So whether or not you think the Koran condones it, the numbers speak a different story.

 

[IronicallyTwisted]

Because of one quote, you believe that a majority of men in Muslim countries beat and batter their wife because they live in Islamic countries, without even considering that the beatings they give their wives could have little to no relevance to the religion. On the same token, we could say the same for any other country. Yes, let's use one factor as the basis of an argument. I'm sure the Inuit beat their wives because their balls are cold as hell too.

Half my family is of muslim faith, and whilst the sexist undertones are downplayed because we live in a western country, they still exist.

But I wouldn't worry about it too much. Your a man, aren't you? Slap her around a little, then when she complains tell her to go to her room and think things over. Ambiguity in the holy texts is one of the upsides to any religion.

 

[ice cream]

Hey, you know in Islam it's a man's duty to sexually satisfy his wife? Islam encourage foreplay and an active sex life.
Damn, your wife can even divorce you for the sole reason of not satisfying her sex life.

Oh and from what I've heard (I may be wrong), men and women are equal in the eyes of Allah but this does not mean they can do the same things. Allah made men and women differently. They each have different rules, guidelines and responsibilities. There's certain things only women can do in Islam whereas men can't do. It works in both ways. Why does everyone think men and women are the same? They aren't, atleast that's what we believe in Islam.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

just watched Islam in America on youtube its a series of videos it was so awesome, really helped lots of History and stories

 

[Mr.Potato Head]

Apparently im muslim, well my parents are and all my relatives are and for the most part I was raised as one and while im not totally not gung-ho about it, if someone asked me what religion I was associated with, I would say im muslim. That said, this thread has so much I didnt know about it.

No your not muslim by simply relying on the fact that your parents and relatives are muslim or any kind of religion really..this stands true. Its all about what YOU do with your life and how you live your life that determines if your "muslim" or not...im sorry buddy but your mommy or daddy or grandparents are NOT the people that will give you a ticket into eternal life/heaven or hell...its what YOU do that counts..there for, your NOT Muslim.

You know what i cant stand..people that say they are muslim or a christian,etc just because their parents are so that automatically makes them one too..Its all about your personal faith and how much you live your life according to the "word"...in which i mean by God's word.

 

[ice cream]

just watched Islam in America on youtube its a series of videos it was so awesome, really helped lots of History and stories

Wow you're actually all set, huh? Sorry I haven't been following your posts, but how long have you been thinking about converting to Islam?
And congratulations!

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Wow you're actually all set, huh? Sorry I haven't been following your posts, but how long have you been thinking about converting to Islam?
And congratulations!

thought about it on and off about 10 years ago. I was going to do it 5 years ago but instead met someone that took me to a Penticostal Church we wanted to get married so I decided to remain in that faith I was unhappy for 4 long years sat on the edge of my seat everytime I attended Church and often went home angry with the stupid stuff I heard preached. So we broke up many times and tried to make the relationship work many times. That was a year ago.

Duck's thread this week and reading this thread made me search google and youtube for all the fears I had.

I will convert soon when I can visit an Islamic Center.

I hope soon but yeah my conviction is made

 

[Earthstrike]

which Muslim government does not allow the collection of interest? I pretty sure that every single Muslim government we have uses the capitalist economic system and none of them forbid interest.

Not one of them can call themselves an Islamic State..

Riba (Interest) is forbidden. There can be no compromise over this. In Islam, Banks are not suppose to be businesses out to make a profit. Banks are seen as a tool to hold the citizens wealth and also the state treasury.

If a Muslim knows that interest is forbidden why would they then want to collect interest??

Wouldn't you agree that the problem we have had in the Muslim world since the abolishment of the Khilafah state is that we have had tyrants and dictators rule over the lands with an iron fist.

I found this article on wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_banking

I also recall Pakistan not allowing fractional reserve banking based on an article I read.

And you haven't really dealt with the matter a hand here. Whether or not Islamic laws are optimal for the development of a society and economy. And I'm aware of the pitfalls of talking about Islamic law since people will debate various interpretations of the Qu'ran but everyone can understand the reality that if a Nation were to perfectly understand that Qu'ran and institute its values in policy, that there would exist some set of political prescriptions. We can also accept that some societies are going to have more accurate approximations of these policy sets than others. What makes these policy sets optimal?

 

[Earthstrike]

thought about it on and off about 10 years ago. I was going to do it 5 years ago but instead met someone that took me to a Penticostal Church we wanted to get married so I decided to remain in that faith I was unhappy for 4 long years sat on the edge of my seat everytime I attended Church and often went home angry with the stupid stuff I heard preached. So we broke up many times and tried to make the relationship work many times. That was a year ago.

Duck's thread this week and reading this thread made me search google and youtube for all the fears I had.

I will convert soon when I can visit an Islamic Center.

I hope soon but yeah my conviction is made

Have you watched any videos that offer a counterpoint? (I mean smart videos)
You should be able to accept that there is an intellectual prudence to hearing two sides of an argument about what is and is not true.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

Have you watched any videos that offer a counterpoint? (I mean smart videos)
You should be able to accept that there is an intellectual prudence to hearing two sides of an argument about what is and is not true.

man my whole life is a counterpoint and I do not have much time left to allow others to continue to think for me. I asked questions and made up my mind on something I am drawn to that I feel would add great value to my life. That is really all it takes for me. I am a painter I have been an artist all my life and critical thinking is very important to me and a strong part of my personality.

I have been destroying myself slowly for a long time because of my mind could never understand the answers Christian feed me.

I feel like I can breathe now