crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
you haven't answer my question does go exists or no? yes or no. There is no may be or what you believe or justification. just yes or no?
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Official Islamic Thread
- Thread starter AmMortal
- Start date
you haven't answer my question does go exists or no? yes or no. There is no may be or what you believe or justification. just yes or no?
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
I don't know.
Do you know? Can you prove your answer to be true?
Anaxagoras
Banned
I like how you are trying to play my role in this discussion.
The difference between what you are doing now and what I was doing in the previous cases is that I was able to prove that Islam is a non peaceful and a violent religion, simply because there was evidence that supported my conclusions.
Therefore I was able to ask you whether you consider Islam is a violent or a nonviolent religion with a yes or a no.
In this case there is no evidence that supports either sides of the argument and therefore I can not make any conclusion, and the same applies to you.
Whether I say yes or no, my statement in both cases will be unreasonable and pointless since it can not be proven to be true.
I stick to the fact that I, just like everybody else, do not have evidence to either prove god's existence or prove his nonexistence.
Therefore, I prefer not to make definite statements on matters that can not be proven.
The difference between what you are doing now and what I was doing in the previous cases is that I was able to prove that Islam is a non peaceful and a violent religion, simply because there was evidence that supported my conclusions.
Therefore I was able to ask you whether you consider Islam is a violent or a nonviolent religion with a yes or a no.
In this case there is no evidence that supports either sides of the argument and therefore I can not make any conclusion, and the same applies to you.
Whether I say yes or no, my statement in both cases will be unreasonable and pointless since it can not be proven to be true.
I stick to the fact that I, just like everybody else, do not have evidence to either prove god's existence or prove his nonexistence.
Therefore, I prefer not to make definite statements on matters that can not be proven.
crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
this can't be answer in yes and no. I still did say yes, you have to yes or no now.
crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
Just say yes or no.
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
I have explained the difference between those two questions.
crazy monkey said:
I can't because I lack the evidence to make any conclusions.
Provide me with evidence and I will answer your question with a yes or no.
crazy monkey
Banned
woah I just found this from website.
From the Numeric Miracles In the Holy Qur'an
The Word Meaning #of times Mentioned
Dunya This life 115
Akhera The hereafter 115
Malaekah Angels 88
Shayateen Devils 88
Hayat Life 145
Mawt Death 145
Nafee Usefulness 50
Fassad corruption 50
Nass Mankind 368
Russul Messengers 368
Iblis Satan 11
Iste'atha from iblis Ask refuge from Satan 11
Museebah Catastrophe, Calamity 75
Shukr Thankfulness, Gratitude 75
Infaque Expenditure 73
Redha Contentment 73
Adhaloon Misguided, astray 17
Almawta Deceased 17
Muslims Muslims 41
Jihad Struggle for Allah 41
Thahab Gold 8
Taraf Luxurious life 8
Asseher Magic 60
Albarakah Temptation, trial 60
zakat almsgivings, Charity 32
Barakah Benediction 32
Alaqul Mind, Brain 49
Annour Light 49
Allessan Tongue 25
Almawethah Sermon, Preachment 25
Arasghbah Desire 8
Arrahbah Fear 8
Jahr Openness 16
Alaneah Public Ness 16
Asheddah Firm 114
Assabr Patience 114
Muhammad Muhammad 4
Sharee'ah Law 4
Rajul Man 24
Marah (nisa) Woman 24
shahr Month 12
Yawm Day 365
Baher Sea 32
Barr Landmass 13
The word (Sea or Water) mentioned 32 times, and the word (Landmass) mentioned 13 times in the Holy Qur'an, if we add them together we will get 45.
Now let us do some calculations...
*
By finding the percentage of the number of the word (Sea) to the total number of the words (Sea and Landmass) we will have:
(32/45)x100% = 71.11111111111%
*
By finding the percentage of the number of the word (Landmass) to the total number of the words (Sea and Landmass) we will have:
(13/45)x100% = 28.88888888889%
We will find what Allah (swt) said in His Holy Book 14 centaury ago that the ratio of water on earth is 71.11111111111%, and the ratio of landmass is 28.88888888889%,
add them together and you will get 100%, and these are the real ratios of the Water and landmass on earth.
So what do you think? Could it be a Chance?!
Who do you think taught prophet Muhammad all of these?
I am just telling you that " Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire " so bow thankful to your Lord for being a Muslim, what you have read is a small part of the Numeric Miracles of the Holy Qur'an, there are big volumes about the miracles of the Qur'an....
From the Numeric Miracles In the Holy Qur'an
The Word Meaning #of times Mentioned
Dunya This life 115
Akhera The hereafter 115
Malaekah Angels 88
Shayateen Devils 88
Hayat Life 145
Mawt Death 145
Nafee Usefulness 50
Fassad corruption 50
Nass Mankind 368
Russul Messengers 368
Iblis Satan 11
Iste'atha from iblis Ask refuge from Satan 11
Museebah Catastrophe, Calamity 75
Shukr Thankfulness, Gratitude 75
Infaque Expenditure 73
Redha Contentment 73
Adhaloon Misguided, astray 17
Almawta Deceased 17
Muslims Muslims 41
Jihad Struggle for Allah 41
Thahab Gold 8
Taraf Luxurious life 8
Asseher Magic 60
Albarakah Temptation, trial 60
zakat almsgivings, Charity 32
Barakah Benediction 32
Alaqul Mind, Brain 49
Annour Light 49
Allessan Tongue 25
Almawethah Sermon, Preachment 25
Arasghbah Desire 8
Arrahbah Fear 8
Jahr Openness 16
Alaneah Public Ness 16
Asheddah Firm 114
Assabr Patience 114
Muhammad Muhammad 4
Sharee'ah Law 4
Rajul Man 24
Marah (nisa) Woman 24
shahr Month 12
Yawm Day 365
Baher Sea 32
Barr Landmass 13
The word (Sea or Water) mentioned 32 times, and the word (Landmass) mentioned 13 times in the Holy Qur'an, if we add them together we will get 45.
Now let us do some calculations...
*
By finding the percentage of the number of the word (Sea) to the total number of the words (Sea and Landmass) we will have:
(32/45)x100% = 71.11111111111%
*
By finding the percentage of the number of the word (Landmass) to the total number of the words (Sea and Landmass) we will have:
(13/45)x100% = 28.88888888889%
We will find what Allah (swt) said in His Holy Book 14 centaury ago that the ratio of water on earth is 71.11111111111%, and the ratio of landmass is 28.88888888889%,
add them together and you will get 100%, and these are the real ratios of the Water and landmass on earth.
So what do you think? Could it be a Chance?!
Who do you think taught prophet Muhammad all of these?
I am just telling you that " Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) Desire " so bow thankful to your Lord for being a Muslim, what you have read is a small part of the Numeric Miracles of the Holy Qur'an, there are big volumes about the miracles of the Qur'an....
crazy monkey
Banned
OH for you Nizar, Does love exist? I never seen him. Does hate exist? I believe both exist why I have felt them. Same with god.
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
There is nothing in the quran that says that the land/sea ration of earths surface is 71% to 28%
This is the result of adding up the word count of land divided by the total word count of water.
This is no miracle, one can take a harry potter book for example and count the the times the word girl and the word boy are mentioned, then divide them to resemble a percentage similar to that of the worlds population ratio of boys to girls.
Is this why you believe that Islam is true? If not, there is no need to bring this into the discussion.
So if I bring you a book that claims to be the true word of God and contains a similar word count no. list pattern, will you believe that it is true?
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
Proving love, hate and even hope's existence through the scientific method:
Bring a group of people in a closed area, divide them into two separated groups and give them an objective to accomplish.
Group A are warmed up with a hopeful speech meanwhile while group B isn't, let them start their work, if group A performs better than B then this means hope had an effect on them and thus it exists.
The same applies to love and hate but with different objectives.
crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
I asked god that please help find the ring that I lost two days ago. I find it 5 minutes in. What does that mean? I don't see hope and love and hate. To prove anything scientific you need body of evidence.
crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
Harry potter :lol :lol do the calculation and let me know.
again bring it ,it must be at least 1400 years old.Nizar said:
My that post was not for you anyways.
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
This shows how much you know about science, evidence doesn't have to be physical, If this is truly the case then dreams can not be proven to exist scientifically.
I asked harry potter to help me find my mobile phone, 5 minutes later I found it, does this mean that harry potter is a true and existing character?
crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
You see dreams that's physical. see, hear, touch, measure......
Nizar said:
Depends do you believe he does? IF you do than he is. Don't worry I will support you. Religion is all about believing.
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
So if I manage to pull out such a true ratio using word counts from the harry potter, would you believe that the harry potter books are true?
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
Dreams are physical? can you please fill me this test tube with 20 grams of dreams?
So if I believe that harry potter exists, he will exist?
crazy monkey
Banned
Nizar said:
Sure, You there you go. Can you see now? Oh in the mean time give me 20 grams of your happiness, and hope.
yes in your heart.Nizar said:
Anaxagoras
Banned
crazy monkey said:
You are not being serious, are you?
You first claim the evidence have to be physical, then you go on and claim that dreams are physical, this means that you should be able to provide a physical amount of dreams.
I stated that evidence doesn't have to be in a physical form, I never claimed that hope, happiness or love are physical, and now you are asking me to provide you with hope and happiness in a physical form?
Stop embarrassing yourself, even most of the Muslims that I know would laugh at the reasoning that you have provided in this page.
Either you provide me with evidence that prove Islam to be true or you quit embarrassing yourself with these stupid arguments.
Instigator
Banned
*yawns*
Anaxagoras
Banned
gumshoe said:
Where have I insulted anyone?
Anaxagoras
Banned
gumshoe said:
mmm.. I can't remember that, it might have happened but I apologize for that anyway.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
You guys need to take hallucinogenic drugs. They'll smash your belief in Islam and perception of reality into a million pieces.
But still you won't do it because it's prohibited in Islam to take narcotics and drugs. The things that could let you see pass this mass delusion are the very things banned by Islam and modern society... funny that.
Religion is an abhorrent man-made construction designed to keep society in order and for it to bend to the whims of it's rulers. However you can still believe in "God" without it... That is an option.
Bill Hicks said:
But still you won't do it because it's prohibited in Islam to take narcotics and drugs. The things that could let you see pass this mass delusion are the very things banned by Islam and modern society... funny that.
Religion is an abhorrent man-made construction designed to keep society in order and for it to bend to the whims of it's rulers. However you can still believe in "God" without it... That is an option.
Nizar said:
Well, if there was evidence that proved Islam to be true, it wouldn't be a faith, now would it?
Man-made, I'll give you, but in America, if you're not a Christian, or at least claim to be, you've got almost no chance in hell to be elected to a high powered political spot. Real controlling of the rulers.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Althane said:
The quran claims that it speaks the truth and it encourages the reader to advance his knowledge in the scientific field, therefore it should be testable to find out whether the Quran speaks the truth.
Anaxagoras
Banned
To make up for the silly and unserious path this discussion has taken recently, I will write a more serious and more discuss worthy post of why I believe that Islam is not true:
First of all, the Quran claims that it speaks the truth and nothing but the truth, it also claims to be perfect, error free, unedited and saved in the perfect form, this means that if someone finds an error in the Quran the whole trust system collapses.
Now science and religion are two different things, but this doesn't mean that they can not contradict.
The Law of contradiction states:
This simply means that two contradicting theories can not be both true at the same time, for example:
Davids cat is either alive or dead, it can not be both a live and dead at the same time.
Another example is X^2 = 4
In this case, X can be either 2 or 2, but it can not be both at the same time.
Another example is the physical study of light for example, there is a theory that studies light as particles and another that studies it as waves, however, these two theories can be both true because they do not contradict each other.
Accepting that two contradicting theories can be both true at the same time goes against what our mathematical and scientific knowledge because mathematics and science are based on this logical principle, hence science is based on mathematics, and mathematics is based on logic.
Now to the contradictions:
There are several contradictions between creationism in the quran and science today, one example of this is the big bang theory.
If you open the Quran and read from [41:10] to [41:12], surat فصلت, we will find the following:
This Basically states that God created the earth, at a time when the rest of the universe was smoke, and after furnishing earth with mountains and foods, he turned then to the heavens and made them into the sky we have today and created the stars.
This means that Earth is the oldest mass-object in our universe, even older than all the stars we have around us, which is a contradiction with the big bang theory.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Big_Bang#Structure_formation
Formation of the oldest star HE 1523-0901 (13.2 billion years ago).
Formation of the first galaxies (13.2 billion years ago).
Earliest formation of I stars (10.1 billion years ago).
Formation of the Milky Way galactic disk (> 10 billion years ago, < 6.5 billion years ago).
Formation of Earth (4.54 billion years ago).
Conclusion:
We have a contradiction between what Islamic creationism states and what the science today states.
Islamic creationism states that earth is the oldest object in our universe and it existed before the stars were formed.
The big bang theory, astronomical and cosmological studies state that earth is not the oldest planet in the universe and it has not existed before the formation of stars.
These two statements contradict each other and thus can not be both true at the same time.
Evidence supports the scientific statements and thus disproves the Islamic creationism.
This allows us to label Islamic creationism as false.
First of all, the Quran claims that it speaks the truth and nothing but the truth, it also claims to be perfect, error free, unedited and saved in the perfect form, this means that if someone finds an error in the Quran the whole trust system collapses.
Now science and religion are two different things, but this doesn't mean that they can not contradict.
The Law of contradiction states:
This simply means that two contradicting theories can not be both true at the same time, for example:
Davids cat is either alive or dead, it can not be both a live and dead at the same time.
Another example is X^2 = 4
In this case, X can be either 2 or 2, but it can not be both at the same time.
Another example is the physical study of light for example, there is a theory that studies light as particles and another that studies it as waves, however, these two theories can be both true because they do not contradict each other.
Accepting that two contradicting theories can be both true at the same time goes against what our mathematical and scientific knowledge because mathematics and science are based on this logical principle, hence science is based on mathematics, and mathematics is based on logic.
Now to the contradictions:
There are several contradictions between creationism in the quran and science today, one example of this is the big bang theory.
If you open the Quran and read from [41:10] to [41:12], surat فصلت, we will find the following:
This Basically states that God created the earth, at a time when the rest of the universe was smoke, and after furnishing earth with mountains and foods, he turned then to the heavens and made them into the sky we have today and created the stars.
This means that Earth is the oldest mass-object in our universe, even older than all the stars we have around us, which is a contradiction with the big bang theory.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Big_Bang#Structure_formation
Formation of the oldest star HE 1523-0901 (13.2 billion years ago).
Formation of the first galaxies (13.2 billion years ago).
Earliest formation of I stars (10.1 billion years ago).
Formation of the Milky Way galactic disk (> 10 billion years ago, < 6.5 billion years ago).
Formation of Earth (4.54 billion years ago).
Conclusion:
We have a contradiction between what Islamic creationism states and what the science today states.
Islamic creationism states that earth is the oldest object in our universe and it existed before the stars were formed.
The big bang theory, astronomical and cosmological studies state that earth is not the oldest planet in the universe and it has not existed before the formation of stars.
These two statements contradict each other and thus can not be both true at the same time.
Evidence supports the scientific statements and thus disproves the Islamic creationism.
This allows us to label Islamic creationism as false.
Instigator
Banned
I assume, Nazir, that this contradiction is not what turned you away from Islam, right?
Anaxagoras
Banned
Now that I have pointed out that creationism in the Quran is false and therefor I do not consider the quran to speak the truth, I would like to talk about the other path to religion, faith.
At this point in a discussion, the all wise experienced religious person tries to sound philosophical and deep by saying something such as faith is not based on evidence, that is why its called a leap of faith., the presence of God is something you feel when you thank, pray and worship him.
Doesnt the same apply to most if not all the different believes? this feeling that one is connected to a higher consciousness is something that all people of all different believes feel when they practice religious rituals.
The reason behind these feelings can be explained by our evolved ability of consciousness and awareness of the injustice and unfairness of life, and as a result we have developed emotions that seek justice and fairness, these emotions are connect to the most powerful that are capable of making them true, whether it was a member in a family, society or even the creator of the universe, God.
Whether my understanding is true or not, faith based evidence is not reliable because people that practice different believes experience the same feeling as a person practicing a certain religion feels, if not more, which allows us to label it us unreliable evidence.
Take this experiment for example:
If we take a group of young children, divide them into four groups, and separate them from the outside world by locking each group in its own lab, later on we teach those four groups labeled A, B, C and D, different religions that contradict each other.
30 years later we expose the individuals of those four groups and allow them mix and discuss their contradicting believes, will faith lead them to the true religion, which is A in this case?
The answer is no, and therefore one can not rely on faith to reach the true message of God.
At this point in a discussion, the all wise experienced religious person tries to sound philosophical and deep by saying something such as faith is not based on evidence, that is why its called a leap of faith., the presence of God is something you feel when you thank, pray and worship him.
Doesnt the same apply to most if not all the different believes? this feeling that one is connected to a higher consciousness is something that all people of all different believes feel when they practice religious rituals.
The reason behind these feelings can be explained by our evolved ability of consciousness and awareness of the injustice and unfairness of life, and as a result we have developed emotions that seek justice and fairness, these emotions are connect to the most powerful that are capable of making them true, whether it was a member in a family, society or even the creator of the universe, God.
Whether my understanding is true or not, faith based evidence is not reliable because people that practice different believes experience the same feeling as a person practicing a certain religion feels, if not more, which allows us to label it us unreliable evidence.
Take this experiment for example:
If we take a group of young children, divide them into four groups, and separate them from the outside world by locking each group in its own lab, later on we teach those four groups labeled A, B, C and D, different religions that contradict each other.
30 years later we expose the individuals of those four groups and allow them mix and discuss their contradicting believes, will faith lead them to the true religion, which is A in this case?
The answer is no, and therefore one can not rely on faith to reach the true message of God.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Instigator said:
This is the one that has open my mind to the possibility that the Quran might not speak the truth and thus it has encouraged me to study the subject further in depth.
I ended up putting the evidence that proves islam to be true on one hand and the evidence that proves Islam to be false on the other hand, I balanced them and reached to the conclusion that reason and evidence go against lots of what the quran teaches and the lack of evidence that proves Islam to be true forced me to disbelieve that Islam is true.
Instigator
Banned
Nizar said:
What is the evidence, if any, that proves Islam is true? I've never seen it...
Napoleonthechimp
Member
I was talking with an open-minded Muslim friend about DMT, LSD and all these various different things that fascinate me and I mentioned the higher-dimensional 'aliens' that people meet on DMT trips. He said to me: "You know what we call those in Islam? Djinns." I wonder if Islam and many religions are interpretations of these [sometimes naturally occurring] hallucinogenic experiences.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Instigator said:
I haven't seen it yet either.
But according to Muslims the fact that the prophet Mohammad and the Quran have made a couple of scientific claims ahead of their time is reliable enough to take Mohammad as God's prophet and his book the word of God.
Nizar said:To make up for the silly and unserious path this discussion has taken recently, I will write a more serious and more discuss worthy post of why I believe that Islam is not true:
First of all, the Quran claims that it speaks the truth and nothing but the truth, it also claims to be perfect, error free, unedited and saved in the perfect form, this means that if someone finds an error in the Quran the whole trust system collapses.
Now science and religion are two different things, but this doesn't mean that they can not contradict.
The Law of contradiction states:
This simply means that two contradicting theories can not be both true at the same time, for example:
Davids cat is either alive or dead, it can not be both a live and dead at the same time.
Another example is X^2 = 4
In this case, X can be either 2 or 2, but it can not be both at the same time.
Another example is the physical study of light for example, there is a theory that studies light as particles and another that studies it as waves, however, these two theories can be both true because they do not contradict each other.
Accepting that two contradicting theories can be both true at the same time goes against what our mathematical and scientific knowledge because mathematics and science are based on this logical principle, hence science is based on mathematics, and mathematics is based on logic.
Now to the contradictions:
There are several contradictions between creationism in the quran and science today, one example of this is the big bang theory.
If you open the Quran and read from [41:10] to [41:12], surat فصلت, we will find the following:
This Basically states that God created the earth, at a time when the rest of the universe was smoke, and after furnishing earth with mountains and foods, he turned then to the heavens and made them into the sky we have today and created the stars.
This means that Earth is the oldest mass-object in our universe, even older than all the stars we have around us, which is a contradiction with the big bang theory.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Big_Bang#Structure_formation
Formation of the oldest star HE 1523-0901 (13.2 billion years ago).
Formation of the first galaxies (13.2 billion years ago).
Earliest formation of I stars (10.1 billion years ago).
Formation of the Milky Way galactic disk (> 10 billion years ago, < 6.5 billion years ago).
Formation of Earth (4.54 billion years ago).
Conclusion:
We have a contradiction between what Islamic creationism states and what the science today states.
Islamic creationism states that earth is the oldest object in our universe and it existed before the stars were formed.
The big bang theory, astronomical and cosmological studies state that earth is not the oldest planet in the universe and it has not existed before the formation of stars.
These two statements contradict each other and thus can not be both true at the same time.
Evidence supports the scientific statements and thus disproves the Islamic creationism.
This allows us to label Islamic creationism as false.
Check this out Nizar...
http://www.islamicity.com/Science/iqs/sld001.htm
http://www.islamicity.com/science/
As a scientist my self, I have to realize that science is ever changing due to new research and technology available... As technology gets better we can better figure out the exact number of when things occur... Also everything in the past is an estimate of things. So realize that before jumping to conclusions.
Instigator
Banned
Nizar said:
I think this kind of revisionism is only shared by a portion of Muslims and I remember hearing figures of authority in Islam discouraging people from doing that since scientific knowledge changes over time and that embarasses Islam to hastily embrace what could be outdated knowledge at a later point.
From this thread and a few others before it, the usual arguments I hear in the case for Islam is the miracle of the Quran himself. How Mohamed was illiterate, had little or no contact with Jews and Christians and it was therefore utterly impossible that such a man could plagiarize and/or make it all up. The issue of perfection in the Quran is also vital, how it has passed through the ages unchanged, bla bla bla.
Napoleonthechimp
Member
I see that I will never get into a discussion about anything remotely interesting in here as you're all too busy chasing your own tails about questions to which you'll never have satisfactory answers.
Instigator
Banned
Napoleonthechimp said:
Bye.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Zapages said:
I am aware that scientific research changes by time to become more accurate, precise and detailed.
I like to consider myself open minded but there is no way that science can be wrong about the stars being older earth, that is as concrete as the earth being round when it comes to the evidence it is based on.
I have studied cosmology and astronomy for a while at high school and I know what conclusion I have reached to.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Napoleonthechimp said:
You are welcome to participate as long as you are contributing with something relevant to the discussion.
LSD and Djin is not a relevant here.
Nizar said:
You are jumping to the conclusion that Earth was made older than the universe... It states the earth was made when the universe was smoke... Which is true, ie. the Big Bang theory. Then everything started to join together...
High school science....:lol Dude let me know when you finish Undergrad or something then talk about science and how everything is. As you get older you get to learn and more detail on how everything works.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Instigator said:
If you follow the scientific method correctly you can't be wrong in your conclusions.
No matter how advanced science will get, earth will be round and younger than the stars, thats a given.
This can not be considered evidence that he is God's prophet nor that his book is the word of God.
That only proves that he was illiterate at start and by time managed to write a book, he had no contact with the Jews and Christians and someway managed to get information about the previous Abrahamic religions.
It is not perfect, it has a grammar error in it too if I recall correctly, I can digg it up for you if interested but most people here that speak Arabic will deny it claiming that Arabic is taken from the Quran so it can't be wrong.
There are lots of ancient texts that has passed down through the ages and are still in the original form, this in no way is supposed to mean that they carry the word of God.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Zapages said:
The conclusion here is that earth is not older than the stars as the Quran claims.
Read the verse again, it says the universe's creation has been made in this order:
Earth furnished with mountains and foods at a point were the havens was vapor.
Food on earth existed when the rest of the universe was still vapor.
After that he made the seven heavens and adorned the seventh one with starts.
This is not true according to the big bang theory, and I do not consider you a true scientist if you think that it goes hand in hand with the big bang theory for only an irrational person would make such a conclusion.
Anaxagoras
Banned
Zapages said:
I did.
Now how is it supposed to prove that my statement is false?
Instigator
Banned
Nizar said:
Stars from smoke?
Exploded into existence?
Monkeys formerly humans punished by Allah?
Beats me.
crazy monkey
Banned
How the hell do I know I am not living in Matrix? I just saw blue pills and red pills. Shit