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Official Madden '16 PS4 Online league thread #2: Blink Daggers and Backflips
- Thread starter CB3
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FrenchMovieTheme
Member
Ask eznark/AT!
DCX
DCX
That's how I lost Mettenberger, Jake Mathews and my stud LB Josh Robinson. One fell swoop.Two things that I need to do more that I don't :
1) before every play you should make an attempt to guess what defense the opponent is playing. this really helps with "if X does this then Y should be open"
2) what play are you calling and more importantly why? maybe your opponent likes to blitz in a certain situation or call cover 3 on 2nd and long. so you'll call something to counter that or to try and attack a certain part of the field. people adjusted and have started doubling and tripling motes on deep coverage so I had to work him in on shorter routes
also I am not going to bench my players in my sim win. watch motes die
But losing Mettenberger has allowed Zach Phillips is rise!
Bird, can you play tonight if it advances ?
DCX
I have an extremely slim chance of getting in, but I'd have to have a lot of things break my way. Purps is in a similar situation too. We both have to win out and hope the Cowboys/Bears/NFC South teams all slip and stumble to the right opponents.
That loss to FMT is what fucked me the most. Had the lead the entire god damn game until the 4th when I was trying to play conservatively but did a horrible job of it. I could be controlling my own destiny
PS - traffic tickets fucking blow not only for the fine you have to pay but for all this other shit you have to do. the court wants money orders only and I have to get shit notarized and sent out just to get me approved to take defensive driving. for a whooping 100 dollar discount or so.
I very much hope that cop gets fucked over after the way he preached how this law was for "his safety"...your safety was you sitting in a car with your radar gun while another cop was pulling people over, for the sole reason of giving people trash tickets.
That loss to FMT is what fucked me the most. Had the lead the entire god damn game until the 4th when I was trying to play conservatively but did a horrible job of it. I could be controlling my own destiny
PS - traffic tickets fucking blow not only for the fine you have to pay but for all this other shit you have to do. the court wants money orders only and I have to get shit notarized and sent out just to get me approved to take defensive driving. for a whooping 100 dollar discount or so.
I very much hope that cop gets fucked over after the way he preached how this law was for "his safety"...your safety was you sitting in a car with your radar gun while another cop was pulling people over, for the sole reason of giving people trash tickets.
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
Not a lot. I'm just a casual football viewer and didn't play way back in HS or anything so my knowledge of the X's and O's is very limited. As Welli and others suggested going back and redoing the coverage reading skills trainers would likely be very helpful for me on both sides of the ball.
Another consensus is that my defenses are too easy to read. I'm going to bet that's because I don't modify what I pick in anyway other than to maybe press receivers or shift the DL to whatever side I think someone may be running to.
So true. Mariota never throws the ball 10+ yards away from the intended receiver in practice! lol
I HATE HATE HATE the Titans
... But a 20+ game losing streak has to be my fault.Pre-snap reads are good, but not completely essential. When I'm feeling lazy or tired, I neglect to make them (though it does cost me some games). The most important part of passing for me is anticipation. Know where your guys are going to be and read the movement of the defenders you expect to occupy that area. The first thing I do after the snap is what one particular defender (which one depend on who my first read is and what route he's running). If you see the space, throw to the space .
Pre-snap isn't essential but if you can't make quick decisions on the fly it becomes so.
Pre-snap isn't essential but if you can't make quick decisions on the fly it becomes so.
Its about time
Listen to what Wellie said, go back and do some of the skill trainers, they're well done. Once you understand how to attack a D while your O is out there, you'll learn what adjustments to make on D to slow down opponents offenses. When I'm playing well I'm reading the D presnap, there's a way to beat every coverage and you have to know where to go with the ball.
Go into practice mode, look at the safeties and how they drop back into coverage. Sometimes it's two high and it's cover 2, others cover 4, but if you watch the safeties they play differently once the ball is snapped, they don't really move in Cover 4, they sit there and take a small drop back, but fan out when in Cover 2.
I took poundings you wouldn't believe before I improved my game, but you have to keep playing to get better. Ask questions too, the Madden community is essentially dead in terms of message board talk, Reddit may be an option. When I first started playing there were a ton of Madden specific message boards and I learned a ton from other users.
Ummmm I would say the poundings you gave others (like myself) helped us all get better
Yeah, only way to get better. I learned how to play MLB by watching MWS. Would literally throw at his user, and watch him int my slants, but I learned the timing from watching him intercept me over and over.
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
Thanks LJ. This is exactly the kind of things I need to pay very close attention to when I go back to the skill trainer later on today.
It's gonna suck if I work really hard to get better and the league falls apart after this year which seems likely. At least I'll be able to come back stronger next year and with any luck won't have to be the fucking titans.
You just got the Browns.
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
Oh god... what have I done.
DCX
DCX
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Goddammit Rob, it's called a private message for a reason.
I think pre-snap reads are essential to my game since I am just not as good "in-play" as the rest of you guys are. The game does very little to help defenses disguise what they are doing and we on the offensive side of the ball should be able to take advantage. I think watching my streams you guys have seen me hot route to specific zone beaters every now and again.
Where I get myself into trouble is when I think a guy will clear a zone and throw it early/the WR gets bumped -or- I throw it in a hurry because I feel the pressure coming. Last game I threw an int I think to Bowsers LB because Gandy got hung up on him, same thing with Smokey's S the week before in a buzz zone. I saw it but threw it anyway due to a combination of trying to make a play where there was none and fucking yolo.
Listen to LJ and what he said about the safeties. What you should be doing is picking a set of defenders to watch right at the snap to be able to determine what coverage the defense is in. He watches the safeties, I watch the corners. Right away watching the corners should tell you man. C2, C3/4, C6. I would honestly practice being able to determine what you see before and after the snap. I know that with C2 I will have a soft spot on the outside between the S and CB, C3 I will have the seams and flats open and it is usually revealed by the CBs backed off and a single high safety. Cover 1 is a tighter space between the defenders and WR and the single high. There aren't a lot of variations.
I think one thing that helped me more than anything else in combination with what I mention above is I worked a lot on my pocket presence. I think the drill is crap so what I would do is I would play games against the Seahawks and the Broncos and throw exclusively mid to long passes that took a bit of time to develop. Hard to explain but it helped me a lot with keeping one eye on the pass rush, another eye progressing through receivers, another eye in the middle of the field, and my last eye in the flats. So yeah you need four eyes.
All this is why I run the ball so much btw.
This all, of course, makes me depressed I don't have time for the game I wish I did. Went from 3-0 to 3-4 the moment I stopped playing it for DOTA. Not sure how on earth you guys play so well only doing the one league game a week.I have been awful since life got way busier around this time last year when I was constantly ripping of 10-12 win seasons.
This makes zero sense to me and makes me want to vomit all over my keyboard. You mean to tell me you are putting up those numbers without even doing any pre-snap reads?
I think pre-snap reads are essential to my game since I am just not as good "in-play" as the rest of you guys are. The game does very little to help defenses disguise what they are doing and we on the offensive side of the ball should be able to take advantage. I think watching my streams you guys have seen me hot route to specific zone beaters every now and again.
Where I get myself into trouble is when I think a guy will clear a zone and throw it early/the WR gets bumped -or- I throw it in a hurry because I feel the pressure coming. Last game I threw an int I think to Bowsers LB because Gandy got hung up on him, same thing with Smokey's S the week before in a buzz zone. I saw it but threw it anyway due to a combination of trying to make a play where there was none and fucking yolo.
Listen to LJ and what he said about the safeties. What you should be doing is picking a set of defenders to watch right at the snap to be able to determine what coverage the defense is in. He watches the safeties, I watch the corners. Right away watching the corners should tell you man. C2, C3/4, C6. I would honestly practice being able to determine what you see before and after the snap. I know that with C2 I will have a soft spot on the outside between the S and CB, C3 I will have the seams and flats open and it is usually revealed by the CBs backed off and a single high safety. Cover 1 is a tighter space between the defenders and WR and the single high. There aren't a lot of variations.
I think one thing that helped me more than anything else in combination with what I mention above is I worked a lot on my pocket presence. I think the drill is crap so what I would do is I would play games against the Seahawks and the Broncos and throw exclusively mid to long passes that took a bit of time to develop. Hard to explain but it helped me a lot with keeping one eye on the pass rush, another eye progressing through receivers, another eye in the middle of the field, and my last eye in the flats. So yeah you need four eyes.
All this is why I run the ball so much btw.
This all, of course, makes me depressed I don't have time for the game I wish I did. Went from 3-0 to 3-4 the moment I stopped playing it for DOTA. Not sure how on earth you guys play so well only doing the one league game a week.I have been awful since life got way busier around this time last year when I was constantly ripping of 10-12 win seasons.
This makes zero sense to me and makes me want to vomit all over my keyboard. You mean to tell me you are putting up those numbers without even doing any pre-snap reads?
DCX
DCX
AGod, and a fleet of 95+ speed WRs bro
DietRob
i've been begging for over 5 years.
Sorry to out you Welli. I meant what I said in PM about your advice tho
I think my main issue on offense is that I get way to jumpy because I haven't been able to train myself to have eyes on 4 different things. Instead I'll maybe be able to pull off two things at the same time. That is also why I run a lot. Once the third quarter comes around and I'm getting stomped by 20+ I have to abandon that and things get ugly.
I don't even know where to start on Defense so that is something I need to practice a lot.
I think my main issue on offense is that I get way to jumpy because I haven't been able to train myself to have eyes on 4 different things. Instead I'll maybe be able to pull off two things at the same time. That is also why I run a lot. Once the third quarter comes around and I'm getting stomped by 20+ I have to abandon that and things get ugly.
I don't even know where to start on Defense so that is something I need to practice a lot.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Best OL in the game too. I am getting killed by my OLs inconsistency. Dudes just stand around and let defenders waltz by even tho they have good AWR as I showed in this vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cv0kchxQ9rs
run blocking has been fine for me this year, but pass protection has always been awful
the few times I stick it out and have time to make the right read deep my receivers decide to turn into a bunch of Davantes, so I'd much rather try to make something happen on the sticks with something shallow
the few times I stick it out and have time to make the right read deep my receivers decide to turn into a bunch of Davantes, so I'd much rather try to make something happen on the sticks with something shallow
Yeah, I constantly see my interior line just obliterate itself over strange AI moves like this.
Alot of my issues are just lack of any trust in Pass protection, which causes me to speed up throws, which means lack of defensive reads, and throwing right into routes I shouldn't throw.
Purple Cheeto
Member
I'm really scared for next year's Madden. I doubt the OL AI issues will be fixed and the Seahawks have only downgraded on the line this off season.
Edit: lulz at Wellie's video being a comedy video.
Edit: lulz at Wellie's video being a comedy video.
I was top-3 in passing with Romo and no fast WRs year one. Then Romo and Mckay year 2.
And Welli, last season I was doing a lot more pre-snap reads and exerting a lot more mental effort. This season I've been busier and more stressed by work and commuting, which could be why I'm not spending time reading the defenses before the snap and just winging it. I play at night usually when I'm already tired. I've been throwing more picks and getting sacked more as a result and may miss the playoffs.
It's been a mixture of fatigue and hubris. Though these last games I'll definitely have a little more cerebral approach because if I lose, I'm likely out.
That's what my O-line did against LJ's schemes
DCX
DCX
No fast WRs but you do have Dez Bryant :/ if you don't want Dez, send him to Atlanta!I was top-3 in passing with Romo and no fast WRs year one. Then Romo and Mckay year 2.
And Welli, last season I was doing a lot more pre-snap reads and exerting a lot more mental effort. This season I've been busier and more stressed by work and commuting, which could be why I'm not spending time reading the defenses before the snap and just winging it. I play at night usually when I'm already tired. I've been throwing more picks and getting sacked more as a result and may miss the playoffs.
It's been a mixture of fatigue and hubris. Though these last games I'll definitely have a little more cerebral approach because if I lose, I'm likely out.
That's what my O-line did against LJ's schemes
DCX
I'd like to believe, foolishly, that OL AI will be receiving a massive upgrade in the offseason. A lot of folks complain about blocksheds, including myself, but I'll take it.
Day 1 in Madden 16 a few of the Nano Blitzes from 15 carried over, I mean right off the bat, and this is after several members of the community emailed the OL AI guy a list of exploits. Now, to his credit, they patched a lot of it up quickly, and a lot of it could be protected by sliding the line. But 16 has moved on and some of the same shit is still working even after the latest patch. I have a feeling they're going to drastically reduce what a DL can and can't do, they can't account for all the permutations at this point.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Maybe I am confused. When the DL and OL are engaged it should be dice roll city for pancakes, blocksheds, or stalemates. When the OL is not engaged it should be similar to a defender in a zone seeing a ball coming - if they have the stats high enough they react to block the incoming rushers, the better the OL the larger the zone and when they engage it should go back to the rolls. It should be that simple. Allow some type of... self OL awareness so they know not to all block one dude.
Madden doesn't even allow stunts so I am completely miffed as to how they can't get the basics to work. Some guys pick up blocks from a mile out that they can't see, others stand around and do no adjusting like my guys in the video I posted.
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
Making the DL worse at pass rushing sounds good to me.
Azwethinkweiz
Member
It's already trash unless you're running a 3-4 or have LJ's line.
I know with the new patch they tried to get the OL to look left first, but that was specifically done to stop a certain blitz (Mike Scrape 3) and honestly, some guy figured out a way around it 2 weeks later and is selling it for $5 bucks, Madden community at its finest. BUY MY EBOOK!
That particular vid shows how blitz depth can fuck up the OL AI. LT/LG exchange gets brutalized and they leave the CB wide open. I feel at times the OL does a good job picking up overloads, they block towards the blitz, except if you "distract" them. What I mean by that is send another defender on a blitz opposite the overload. Now this doesn't make sense because it's no longer an overload, but the OL gets fucked up.
I fucking wrecked Bowser and FMT in back to back games using this concept. I mean I was sending 5 each time and got fantastic pressure. That shit was textbook, but it left me vulnerable, so I had to play great user and hope they were passing "deep." It worked. Just to get an idea, it was 4 attackers on the right side, I dropped the opposite end on whatever zone I wanted and blitzed the LB behind the dropping DE. LG was spinning like a top.
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
LJ youre breaking my heart
Even the best O-line in the game can't account for AI exploits
Not if you're blocking with 5! HBs tend to want to block the middle of the OL too, not the edge, dumb as fuck, so even if you block them, the edge pressure can get through. It's honestly easy to beat but when you haven't seen it. I haven't run it at all this season, or rather I have but I get lit the fuck up so I stopped.
Wellie had a great way to get Dunlap open on the edge of few years ago and I'm wondering if that was out of the Sugar Nickel Blitzes. Sugaring the gaps can fuck with the AI, but for whatever reason it doesn't of Nickel Sugar looks partly because it was so effective in the past, bet EA programmed that shit differently just for that formation.
Hey, a blitz is a blitz. I don't just sit there and let the DL do the work, I love to blitz, until I get lit up. The easiest Madden to get pressure was Madden 12 I believe. 4-3 stack, blitz the LB behind he DE and crash your DL out, aggressive pass rush. LB was hitting the B gap or DE was getting in. Had to block 6 at least and man coverage was tough as fuck. Mario at that year.
Bradham had about 15 sacks and was DROY, nuff said.
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
I just let the computer get sacks. All types of blitzes and I like to audible blitzers into coverage too so the O is never sure what theyre looking at. I think every starter on D for me has a sack.
Also there are people in this league who do 5 step drop backs out of pistol and shotgun. I also Spread my Dline for those guys, they'll just run around the T sometimes because the QB out dropbacks the T.
Also there are people in this league who do 5 step drop backs out of pistol and shotgun. I also Spread my Dline for those guys, they'll just run around the T sometimes because the QB out dropbacks the T.
I'm sure I'll create some paranoia with my comments. Honestly, I don't do any crazy shit outside of what I described, adjust some stock coverages and blitzes with some DL shifts. The OL AI just goes wonky, I swear I've seen the CPU Nano my ass with some insane B gap out of some stock Nickel Blitz. This is why I think EA will get rid of some blitz angles, or shifts, they have to limit what you can do because you can break the game too easily. They want this to be tourney ready next season, they want it in the worst way, but to get what they want they need to seriously take a long hard look at what type of game they want. You can't appeal to the hardcore tourney scene when you can hold Y and pray for an aggro catch, or hold Y on D, and you certainly don't want guys to block 7 on a 4 man blitz because the AI so wonked.
DCX
DCX
User D is key IMO. If you can "hold" the attention of the QB a little longer than they would like, any blitz will get home and coverage sacks will happen!
I have to work on my baiting. Got Bowser good in our last game but I usually don't do well with it and end up miss judging :/
I usually might the right read, just never get a chance to user pick
DCX
I have to work on my baiting. Got Bowser good in our last game but I usually don't do well with it and end up miss judging :/
I usually might the right read, just never get a chance to user pick
DCX
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
Do you manually audible a DLineman to dropback into coverage? Or is that the call and u just send another lb? Cause I feel like audibling a DLineman into coverage was banned due to this exact problem? You have to call a play with that designed in it already?
Azwethinkweiz
Member
I think you just can't drop 10 into coverage.
DCX
DCX
I believe the rule is have three rush at all times.
Which three is up to you. You can have two dline rush and one LB, or one dline and two lbs.
Like Az said, drop 9/10/11 is not legal in our league.
DCX
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
Ah okay. Forgot the reasoning behind it.
User D is key IMO. If you can "hold" the attention of the QB a little longer than they would like, any blitz will get home and coverage sacks will happen!
I have to work on my baiting. Got Bowser good in our last game but I usually don't do well with it and end up miss judging :/
I usually might the right read, just never get a chance to user pick
DCX
You're right man, if you get him to hold just a second or two more, you're good. Honestly, I'm not the best user player, but one thing I realized is that I was just dropping back, once I started following WRs into my help I got better. Follow the WR in your zone, and release him into your help. Easier said than done. Also, just jump shit. I know I'm sending my OLB on a blitz and the flat is open, take a risk and jump the underneath with a safety or LB, just get that drag or table/flat route to the HB and get the QB to hesitate or throw. Have to take a risk every once in a while.
It's never been banned to my knowledge. It's an audible in the example I gave above. But even if he was coming down and not dropping down, blitz would get home, even faster actually, I just would have no coverage in the middle of the field.
What is banned is dropping 9 guys because it's bitch made.
Edit: Honestly, the best defense to play is stock 2 man under with speedy man coverage corners. It's the toughest shit to deal with, especially on All Madden because if your WR is breathed on he's dropping the ball. Slot drag, fine, you'll eventually get picked off. If your corners can hang forget it, its the toughest D to deal with.
TheLostBigBoss
Banned
Hahahaha
Don't worry MLB is dropping soon!
Edit: I'm terrible at Street Fighter, I do no combos, I come out and just to normals and the easy special moves, I can't combo at all. Sometimes I win, but I bet if I learned how to combo I'd be pretty decent or at least not garbage. It's the same shit with Madden, take it to the next level!
I thought we couldn't route coverage LBs to blitz? or is that just manual control?
I'll change the zones, but always keep zones as zones (or some type of coverage) and blitzers as blitzers
unless I'm misunderstanding
feel like I only ever get coverage sacks - game is a piece of shit!
I'll change the zones, but always keep zones as zones (or some type of coverage) and blitzers as blitzers
unless I'm misunderstanding
feel like I only ever get coverage sacks - game is a piece of shit!
TheDrizzlerJ11
Member
What? Just manual control. And I normally do the opposite. Will call a zone blitz that brings 6 or 7 and audible a LB or Nickelback into a middle zone or something.