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One Piece Manga |OT| ZEHAHAHAHA! The Name of this Age is Blackbeard!
- Thread starter TheGreatDirector
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Well, I´ll admit the Toriko world is more interesting, but that has more to do with the fact that the focus of Toriko from the very beginning was the world, while One Piece main focus was the Journey, But as far as World Building go I´ll argue One Piece made a far better work doing it, because for me World Building in one piece refers to how the World is connected with each other and how it affects the characters, that I´ll say works better in One Piece.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
We've got a wide variety of moon critters here. Though I suppose we don't know their origins for a fact.
I don't read toriko, so idk why it would be more free, but OP is one of the least rule restrictive fictions I know of. It follows certain patterns that would be a surprise if it deviated from (the sudden appearance of the new God Haku, for example), but I can't think of anything it could do that wouldn't fit in the OP world.
would be interesting if we find out that minks are descendants of those moon pirates. if zou=sky island then that would be the similarity since skypeans seem to be descendants of the moon people.
We've got a wide variety of moon critters here. Though I suppose we don't know their origins for a fact.
Cloud Strife
Member
The best part about this is that the author explains everything like it's some kind of science when it makes absolutely no sense.
Is Toriko being forced to finish? It seems like it's going waaay to fast right now.
Anyone who enjoys One Piece might enjoy Toriko, it has some similar worldbuilding but don't expect any GODA level moments.
Cloud Strife
Member
And for some reason everyone is super ripped. It gets kinda ridiculous.
Imperial Bishop
Banned
Just wanted to let you know that those apples weren't in the lab. They were on the sleigh next to Smiley.
Thanks, I tried so long to convince friends to read toriko, and I think this phrase does discribe it the best way
Imperial Bishop
Banned
And how many people have made the same remark about One Piece? Come on.
Toriko is a very good manga in its own right with world-building on-par with OP. Don't knock it til you try it.
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
I really tried to get into Toriko but the food premise was a little too ridiculous for me. I got up to that weird bird demon thing which was super interesting, but I lost interest after that.
It's OK man, not everyone is able to hear "the voice of the ingredients."
As a culinary and fighting enthusiast, I really enjoy it. It's utterly absurd and fun.
Huh? I said for my taste? I read like 80 chapters? I've tried it?
I don't have time to make a more elaborate post at the moment, but has any definitive religion been mentioned in OP?
Zoro mentions a few times that he doesn't believe in god, but does he mean an omnipotent God like Judeo-Christianity or just supreme beings? Zoro and a lot of people are compared to demons a lot, implying belief in something of the sort. And Zoro has a little bit of animism going with his swords. Though a lot of it is scientifically verifiable too, since Going Merry demonstrably came to life (still the worst plot point of OP). The Celestial Dragons and the fact that they're called Devil fruits imply further religious overtones, and the Skypieans didn't just randomly pick the name "God" out of a hat I'm guessing. Not to mention all of Zoro's attack names named after various gods.
But for all that, no one that I recall has mentioned an actual religion that I can recall.
Zoro mentions a few times that he doesn't believe in god, but does he mean an omnipotent God like Judeo-Christianity or just supreme beings? Zoro and a lot of people are compared to demons a lot, implying belief in something of the sort. And Zoro has a little bit of animism going with his swords. Though a lot of it is scientifically verifiable too, since Going Merry demonstrably came to life (still the worst plot point of OP). The Celestial Dragons and the fact that they're called Devil fruits imply further religious overtones, and the Skypieans didn't just randomly pick the name "God" out of a hat I'm guessing. Not to mention all of Zoro's attack names named after various gods.
But for all that, no one that I recall has mentioned an actual religion that I can recall.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Kuma carries around a bible, Mihawk's sword is based on a crucifix, and chopper and ussopp have held up crosses to ward off spirits. So I would assume judeo Christian beliefs are in the background as a belief system.
To my knowledge, no one has definitively mentioned a religion. Everything surrounding Mariejois is pretty religious, though. It's called the Holy Land after all. That said, so far, it seems like a pretty stylistic choice than a definitive "religion". Like with most things, Oda just goes for what sounds cool rather than making a conscious choice here, at least as far as I can tell. I don't think there's a strong reason as to why people use the term "God" and "Devil" other than the fact that Oda thought they sound cool and that we can assume that there's some concept similar to Christianity in this world. Everything is supposed to have this golden age of pirates feel to it, and with that comes the backdrop of English Christian imperialism.
Veelk, you're reading way too deeply into something that doesn't really matter. If religion mattered in One Piece there would be a religious cult or something going on in the background, as of right now religion matters as much to One Piece as it did to Evangelion. Which is to say it doesn't.
Hm....The other stuff might just be influences taken from the real world, but the Bible suggests an actual codex of belief. That's probably the most definitive indication.
While I'm sure this is going to be met with the same tired cries of how OP doesn't need to justify it's internal world, I still feel the need to ask why would Christianity exist in OP
Can't say I agree. The same way a functioning world all but requires social norms and politics and language and art and math so on, religion is all but inescapable too. It's...literally how people defined themselves for a a very, very long time, when they had no way of knowing why things in the world happened. To exclude that is to exclude a pretty vital piece of humanity and leaves a significant gap in the world. There are obviously systems of spiritual belief in OP (as mentioned, OP has dieties, animism, fate, and so on), so they should be there. It's just a matter of I don't really see how they're organized. I can't comment on evangelion because it's been way too long since I've seen it. I think they used religious symbols for something, I just don't know what.
But having said that, (and I'm not targeting this at you specifically, B-dubs) I think I can predict replies from here on out about how it's actually not important to OP and stuff. It's the debate that repeats itself pretty much every time I try to put pressure on a point of OP's worldbuilding that it doesn't seem to have put thought in itself, and I'm tired of having to justify why I think the things I'm talking about are important parts of storytelling, so I'll try not to crowd up the thread unless someone makes a really good reply to the question.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
The religions in One Piece are clearly based/inspired to some extent by real religions but there's never any mention of them their name. In Skypedia, God was just another word for king. Sengoku's devil fruit is clearly based on Buddha and Asura is also from Buddhism I think, while other things are based on Christianity. For the record, Japan is dominated by Buddhism and Shintoism, yet I haven't seen a single reference to Shintoism and very few references to Buddhism in One Piece. Very few references to Christianity either, for that matter, and no references to any other religion. "Demons" are mentioned sometimes to make attack name sound cool, but that's it.
EDIT: Oh, Asura is from Hinduism and other Indian mythology, not Buddhism.
EDIT: Oh, Asura is from Hinduism and other Indian mythology, not Buddhism.
We didn't really saw any worship except for Skypia, but the normal people have an idea of demons, devils and gods regardless. Either we just never see people pray and all important characters are atheists or this is set in a very atheistic world that used to follow faiths of gods. Hell, for all we know that could be a plotpoint and the world nobles literally killed god/the gods in the past or something.
Cloud Strife
Member
Well according to MS there is a Martha Stewart in this universe, so take that as you will.
That's the thing. Oda doesn't justify it internally. I doubt he's ever going to be like "Oh, Christ lived in this world and that's why I have all these christian motifs everywhere". It's just because it sounds and looks cool. Oda would not be the first nor the last japanese writer to go this route.
It's like how everyone got excited about their dreams of a robot without ever probably knowing what a robot was. Oda just does things because they're funny or cool.
On another note, a random, throwaway theory I had last night: What if the Red Line is a dragon? Like, an actual, literal Dragon that fell asleep.
MS went downhill the last years imo
They love to throw slurs around and then this..Yeah, there is a lot of religious symbolism in OP but it seems like it's more 'style over substance' stuff, at least for now. Who knows what Kuma will bring to the table?
I wonder if there is a 'religion arc' planned.
Just to clarify something: I'm trying to use all the references as clues to try and figure out whatever OP has as religions, but the references themselves are not what I'm talking about.
Lets assume the references are just there to be cool. Okay, but is there anything like an actual religion that people of OP acknowledge, regardless of references. Like, a fair amount of people explicitely believe in fate, demons are referenced in descriptions of strength and horror that we can assume people believe in them, and the Celestial Dragons have beliefs of their own superiority based on what seems to be Divine Right to Rule. However, I'm just wondering if there has been any mention of an organized religion of any sort that's internal to the world of OP, not as references, but actual religions it has constructed for itself.
LonelyGreyWolf
Banned
It's not a religious arc. As noted above, in Skypedia, God is just another word for king or ruler.
Tathanen
Get Inside Her!
We're gonna find out that something fundamental to the creation of the One Piece world, perhaps events during the 100 year void, will explain the various anachronisms and out of place artifacts. Bibles, devil cults, robots, they will all be fragments from a "previous" world that was more similar to our own that was shattered, scattered about, and forgotten.
jk lol BUT it's not like this idea hasn't been used numerous times in other manga/anime, a culture built on the ruins of a mystery culture from the past. People clinging to things they don't really understand, and SURPRISE it was Earth all along.
jk lol BUT it's not like this idea hasn't been used numerous times in other manga/anime, a culture built on the ruins of a mystery culture from the past. People clinging to things they don't really understand, and SURPRISE it was Earth all along.
BobTheFork
Member
I consider it the religious arc because everyone was praying for it to end.
I think the answer lies with Mariejois, the Celestial Dragons, and Bartholomew Kuma. They're the most definitive links we have to any kind of religion. When we learn about their origins, we'll likely learn about why they view themselves as holy.
It's just kinda difficult to figure out because religion is a lot like language in that it evolves and changes through time and distance. But in OP, other than a single Skypeian word, the language has somehow been universal. So, there should be more than a single religion, but yeah, I'll take the one if there's nothing else. What baffles me is why it's gone unremarked upon up until now. The people of OP often use religious terms, so that they avoid naming an actual religion is just... Wierd.
Though it's equally possible Kuma is just carrying around Vegapunks maintenance instructions.
Lol
The arc clearly was cluttered with religious themes like praying, divine punishment and faith. Of course Enel turned out not to be a god, but the arc clearly worked with the idea. Not very good or very deep, but as I said, this is as far into religion as want One Piece to go.
Cloud Strife
Member
The only counter to this is when Zoro is asked about faith when the crew is first taken to Upper Yard and iirc Nami prays or some shit.
I would say it played around with religious iconography, but religion is some kind of working understanding of the universe and what behavior will lead to obtaining peace of one kind or another. There was nothing like that that I remember.
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Manga/anime has a weird history (in my experience) of making references to Christianity but rarely does it suggest anything deeper than aesthetics.
It's no different than how many western writers use classical mythology iconography without really going into the nitty-gritty of the religion. I can get Japan using Christianity iconography because they think it looks cool. Personally, I think they make some of the best Christianity based imagery simply because they don't hold it in any sort of reverence. Bayonetta, for example, has some of the most interesting enemy designs.
But, again, if Oda wants to use Christian imagery for coolness, fine, but I want to hear about the actual religions or belief systems he developed within his world. I doubt Christianity exists in OP. Surely there wasn't a literal jesus christ who was crucified by the Roman Empire. So what does it have?
Sibersk Esto
Banned
Brook was sent to an island of explicit Satan worshipers, and some baroque work agents were dressed as nuns.
On the flip side, residents of Skypeia worshipped giant snakes and Elbaf has their own warrior god.
On the flip side, residents of Skypeia worshipped giant snakes and Elbaf has their own warrior god.
As far as Christianity goes, there's obviously something heavily Christianity influenced, but it can't be actual Christianity. For the sake argument, let's call it Fauxianity, which has the same basic principles. I'm curious to know how many people follow it around the world, and if everything is the same about it.
As for the other ones, that's essentially the smallest part of religion, finding a worship figure, but yeah, it's something I guess.
TheGreatDirector
Banned
I've curiously thought the World Government might actually have an officially instated religion for each of the nations it controls. I remember how a lot of citizens around the world were praying during the War on Marineford so it makes sense for there to be some religion.
What if they get to Raftel and it's just Aizen sitting in the chair
KEIKAKU
I am still waiting for the reveal that Oda and One Piece never really existed and everything was just Kubos bankai. Whenever you bought One Piece it was actually Bleach.
What if the one piece is the deathnote and gold roger was really a shinigami
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