The perfect Dark
Banned
the hand holding-during the first four hours (so far) is driving me insane. Especially when you've played something like Zelda BOTW before.
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Persona 5 |OT2| Someone must have been helping you go to bed early. Talk!
- Thread starter BRSxIgnition
- Start date
JadedWriter
Member
Well I'm at palace
. Took a break to try to finish off Mementos since I'm at Sheriruth. I'm level 55 I think and I'm sort of tearing through the place unless I get a fucked up combo of Kumbhanda and those old witches with fucking Curse. Should this area be easy though or did I over level or just stay up to date on my Persona's?
7
It's *really* frustrating for the first 5 hours and still somewhat frustrating for the next three-four as it gradually starts removing the guard-rails.
They need to do quicker intros in these games. I can think of a few things that could be easily trimmed (I think all these are in the first four hours -
lots of kamoshida stuff - the shiho and ann scenes are good and should stay, but all the stuff where ryuji wants to get testimony from the palace were just obnoxious, same with all similar school scenes. Only a couple attempts are needed to ensure we're convinced real-world methods won't work.
It's not like Suikoden 5 or something where you need hours of build-up for scenes that actually pay off, or any really substantial world-building.
SirNinja
Member
Futaba
she hasn't started high school yet
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
Imagine doing NG+ of Persona 4 on PS2 where it didn't have scene skip. You could hold the triangle button to make scenes go faster, but it still takes a while to reach free exploration of Yukiko's castle.
Phoenix944
Member
At what level can I hope to beat the NG+ boss?
I tried at lvl 55 for the fun and... damn x)
I tried at lvl 55 for the fun and... damn x)
ShadowSoldier89
Member
I did NG+ here and the only text I ended up skipping was the class questions
Which means I ended up with one of the highest total playtimes
Probably depends on your strategy I would think. I was around the 20's or lower I think when the boss first was available and I tried it and was destroyed. I took some time to go through the story and then discovered there is a reaper exploit for the early game in NG+ so I went up to level 71 and then faced off against the boss.
The perfect Dark
Banned
Yeah, completetly agree
My god this game is a slog.
Feels like a cookie clicker game. Press X to scroll text.
I seriously cannot understand these scores so far. Every other game would get smashed for an intro (6 hour intro so far!!) like this.
Don't get me wrong, I can already see there's a great game somewhere and I want to play that great game. But so far it's hidden behind unnecessary long dialogue, hand-holding and game design more linear than any COD game, lol. And yes, I'm saying unnecessary long dialogue because they're talking 10 minutes about things I can explain in 5 seconds. So far the dialogue in Catherine is far superior.
And this is after 6 hours. Keep that in mind. I won't stop playing yet.
I just want to play this great game but I'm not sure how long I can suffer this tutorial. ^^
The perfect Dark
Banned
Don't take it too seriously
I like this game so far, it's just...the intro ...god damn ^^
I hope you can skip most of it in NG+
Skipped everything except some critical main story and confidante stuff in NG+ but have more play time than you. ¯\_(ツ
_/¯Spent a lot of time doing stuff in the velvet room I guess.
Drillary Clinton
Banned
Looking at the last few posts, it's almost like some people have never played a JRPG before. Not that the criticisms aren't valid tho.
The perfect Dark
Banned
So, enemies respawn if you save your game in dungeons?
KnightBuster
Member
Yes, if you save and reload from a Safe Room, that refreshes all enemy spawns (at least on that floor).
Drillary Clinton
Banned
Yeah, it can be a pain but it's also useful
Yup.
I got into a bad situation with that at the end of the 3rd dungeon. I was right at the end of it, but I didn't realize the mechanism to end the level was right there and I hadn't saved in a while, so I went back to a safe room. But I had almost run out of SP because I was doing the entire dungeon in one day, so then I had to get thru the final floor of the dungeon with no SP left.
Of course, I could have quit the dungeon and returned the next day with max SP for all characters, but that would have wasted a precious day of the calendar.
The perfect Dark
Banned
Thanks, that's fine. I've played enough souls games so it doesn't bother me at all ^^
Oh, so you should leave the dungeon sometimes? That's good to know!
The enemy respawns can be annoying in some areas but it's not that bad. The game's stealth is super forgiving and even the dungeon crawling sometimes gives you an option to fast travel when backtracking.
Like, sometimes the game will outright go "Ok, we've hit this switch. Do you want to go back to that door right away? Yes/No."
It's a really nice touch.
Like, sometimes the game will outright go "Ok, we've hit this switch. Do you want to go back to that door right away? Yes/No."
It's a really nice touch.
Yes, the dungeons are generally not meant to be cleared in one session. You *can* marathon a dungeon (it's what I started trying to do later because then it frees up more time for me to spend on other things), but the game encourages you to pace yourself and not take unnecessary risks if your party is too low on SP. You have a time limit to clear a dungeon, so as long as you beat it before the deadline, taking multiple trips in is fine.
You can leave the dungeons. But if you buy enough SP restoring items from the vending machines and eventually SP restoring accessories from the doctor, you shouldn't have to. And you will have extra days to do other things.
It's also extremely satisfying to get to the leaving dungeon results screen and have a huge list of completed tasks that pop up one after the other.
Yeah, that's what I started to do once I could
afford the SP regen patches from the doctor
Dragon1893
Member
Just read about the reaper exploit, can't believe it's that easy.
I gotta take note of those dates.
I gotta take note of those dates.
klabautermann
Member
Yeah pretty much my immediate thoughts when reading those haha.
I always really enjoyed the character interactions in the Persona games, so I never really felt bothered by any of the long dialogue sequences.
KnightBuster
Member
Managed to do all the palaces up to 4 in one run (minus story exits), but some (like Kamoshida) got dicey because my party was running dangerously low on SP. Thank goodness for SP vending machines.
the_sun_king
Member
You can tell who has and hasn't played a Persona game before. These are story heavy games; the introduction is always necessary set up and exposition. And P5's intro is easily the best of the Hashino directed entries.
I don't really understand the complaints about the intro, I've played through it 3 times now. It's plot. Slowly showing you each new mechanic once you get in the first dungeon for real is where the "tutorial" is, but you will have seen all those screens in an hour or so of dungeon crawling, with other mechanics popping up later here and there, but not a lot.
It really is, especially with Ambient Aid. I plan on getting to level 99 just because why not.
It really is, especially with Ambient Aid. I plan on getting to level 99 just because why not.
klabautermann
Member
Agree with this 100%. The opening with the Casino really helps you get involved from the get go, because you know what point the story is moving towards. I adore Hashino's other Persona games a ton, barely less than P5, but the intros in those games are much slower and less interesting. That doesn't make them bad, but I think P5 opens very strongly.
Hm. Plotwise, P5's intro is really compelling. But there is a lot of redundant dialogue, moreso than previous games.
The rather flat translation doesn't help it all that much either.
The perfect Dark
Banned
Now this game is starting to get really interesting. I'm finally in the first real dungeon! Way less hand-holding now...yay!
I love Persona 5, it's my favorite modern Persona game and I think it has the best intro out of the three, but that doesn't mean it's entirely good. Sure the Casino and prologue are pretty damn good, but what follows is around 15 hours of tutorials with semi free gameplay in between. Some of which straight up aren't necessary because they teach you to do stuff you already did back in the casino section... It's bad.
Like yeah these are games with lots of systems going and a handful tutorial screens are inevitable, but P5 goes a bit overboard with making sure the player fully understands absolutely everything, without even offering veteran players the option to skip them.
I recently started a NG+ hard run of Nocture, another game directed by Hashino, and the entire battle system and demon negotiation tutorials last 20 minutes, and it's all hinted with gameplay and in-game hints without any screens spelling things out to you. Stuff like that shows the team has confidence in how the game itself can teach its mechanics, something Persona is lacking for sure.
If anything having newcomers point out these things makes the problem even more obvious to me. Sure it's better than in 3 and 4, but it's still bad and downright patronizing.
Like yeah these are games with lots of systems going and a handful tutorial screens are inevitable, but P5 goes a bit overboard with making sure the player fully understands absolutely everything, without even offering veteran players the option to skip them.
I recently started a NG+ hard run of Nocture, another game directed by Hashino, and the entire battle system and demon negotiation tutorials last 20 minutes, and it's all hinted with gameplay and in-game hints without any screens spelling things out to you. Stuff like that shows the team has confidence in how the game itself can teach its mechanics, something Persona is lacking for sure.
If anything having newcomers point out these things makes the problem even more obvious to me. Sure it's better than in 3 and 4, but it's still bad and downright patronizing.
Interestingly, I think the game doesn't spend a whole lot of time on actual gameplay tutorials. What pads out the beginning is a lot of repeated dialogue about the events that we're already aware of.
Elaugaufein
Member
Enemies don't reswpan if you into a safe room / save. They do respawn if you go through something that requires a loading screen though, so Quick Travel generally causes respawns. I don't know if they respawn when you load a game though.
But some dungeons might have a respawn trigger on the way back.
Ambient Aid shouldn't matter. Flu despair doesn't use the normal infliction method because the Reaper is immune to Despair being inflicted normally. Likewise none of the other (Ambient boosters) should matter because the Reaper never attacks if he has the Flu and you can't possibly kill the Reaper in 3 rounds even with boosted damage.
But some dungeons might have a respawn trigger on the way back.
Ambient Aid shouldn't matter. Flu despair doesn't use the normal infliction method because the Reaper is immune to Despair being inflicted normally. Likewise none of the other (Ambient boosters) should matter because the Reaper never attacks if he has the Flu and you can't possibly kill the Reaper in 3 rounds even with boosted damage.
Dundar
Member
So, having maxed all confidants except Haru (still needs a few days) on the 10th of November..... what do I do now? What is the best option? Go to the gym? Trophy hunting (games, books)? Is there actually something useful to do?
Since it's the first run I don't want to use mementos exploits, both for money and exp. If I'm beating the reaper, it's gonna be legit.
Shit Fortune rank 7 was so totally OP for confidant boosting it made it a cakewalk to reach 100%.
Since it's the first run I don't want to use mementos exploits, both for money and exp. If I'm beating the reaper, it's gonna be legit.
Shit Fortune rank 7 was so totally OP for confidant boosting it made it a cakewalk to reach 100%.
Elaugaufein
Member
Games , Books, Fishing (catch the Guardian, get the best rod which carries to NG+, and maybe an extra black cloth ), Home Run. Save the Training / Gym for NG+ you can't do enough of it to make much difference.
Dundar
Member
Already did the fishing trophy, and got a black robe. If the rod carries over i'm gonna do a few more to pop it.
Home run, did it already.
Guess I'll read and play games. Just like IRL. Yeah :/
I may have just been unlucky then the first time I tried it without, then read about it elsewhere when I googled. Some reapers may just be more prone to catching flu. Generally speaking though I can get it within 3 tries.
Elaugaufein
Member
I found it pretty random too. I'd get 2 or 3 in a row , then no despair for like 7+ battles.
Cannon_Fodder
Member
For me, it wasn't the time spent on gameplay tutorials, but rather how they were spaced out. I remember the time it took to be able to take cover and perform an all-out attack as being particularly bad.
I agree that the biggest problem with the beginning is the repeated dialogue though.
Elaugaufein
Member
I suspect it's a factor of the long ass development this had and all the stuff that must have gone wrong behind the scenes. They seem to have integrated Golden and didn't really add any of the QoL stuff from games after that , just added their own stuff.
Juliano2016
Member
Completed my first play through with 104 hours clocked. I got my eyes wet with that ending!
Amazing game
I loved Satanael appearing at the end, super epic. And I was sad that Morgana vanished, I was just like Ryuji in the end, thinking: that cat was annoying but... y'know.
I also really like that their group is a group of misfits that bonded over their tragedies. They are not a group of best friends but instead, they are like a real family. They laugh, fight, banter, bully, all at the same time, a real family.
I also really like that their group is a group of misfits that bonded over their tragedies. They are not a group of best friends but instead, they are like a real family. They laugh, fight, banter, bully, all at the same time, a real family.
Amazing game
MudoSkills
Volcano High Alumnus (Cum Laude)
The Eternal Lockpick is trolling me.
First game I actually spent a couple of hours grinding in Mementos to get the materials for it, and when I crafted it, the crafting went well so I ended up with 2, which is completely redundant
NG+, I crafted it in class. Like a regular lockpick, it gives you 3 of them.
First game I actually spent a couple of hours grinding in Mementos to get the materials for it, and when I crafted it, the crafting went well so I ended up with 2, which is completely redundant
NG+, I crafted it in class. Like a regular lockpick, it gives you 3 of them.
The perfect Dark
Banned
Man, the first dungeon is really hard. I'm still playing on normal an just beat a small boss in the "gym". But my SP is gone again and I need to leave the palace and come back later.
edit: Only 50% done with the first dungeon???? WHAT, lol. How do I finish a dungeon in one day? This seems impossible, lol.
edit: Only 50% done with the first dungeon???? WHAT, lol. How do I finish a dungeon in one day? This seems impossible, lol.
klabautermann
Member
Gets easier when you stockpile SP items or get the SP regenerating accessories from Takemi. Or you grind to the point you can kill most demons with just normal attacks.
Juliano2016
Member
A few things I found that not everyone might have found or realised, might be useful for new players (a lot of those I only learned about it here, or very late into the game):
-The recycling shop at Yogen will sell you a TV, a console, and ultimately a laptop
TV allows you to watch DVDs, console to play games, both will increase stats. You can read books to gain more points out of both
Laptop can be fixed to give you access to a special shop
-There's a crossword puzzle at the Cafe sometimes. You can complete it for knowledge points
-If you watch TV everyday, sometimes it will have a quiz, if you answer correctly, you will receive points
-If you hang out with confidants without they being ready to rank up, and you go somewhere with then, they usually give you gifts you can decorate your room with
-The priest in the church is an NPC to recover abilities
-If you read a book that enables the shrine, you can pray on the shrine to have your bond with a confidant deepened
-There's a book you can read to enabler he fishing pond for the fishing mini-game
-The recycling shop at Yogen will sell you a TV, a console, and ultimately a laptop
TV allows you to watch DVDs, console to play games, both will increase stats. You can read books to gain more points out of both
Laptop can be fixed to give you access to a special shop
-There's a crossword puzzle at the Cafe sometimes. You can complete it for knowledge points
-If you watch TV everyday, sometimes it will have a quiz, if you answer correctly, you will receive points
-If you hang out with confidants without they being ready to rank up, and you go somewhere with then, they usually give you gifts you can decorate your room with
-The priest in the church is an NPC to recover abilities
-If you read a book that enables the shrine, you can pray on the shrine to have your bond with a confidant deepened
-There's a book you can read to enabler he fishing pond for the fishing mini-game
Napalm_Frank
Member
I don't remember if I asked this before but since I'm closing in on the later parts of the game (summer vacation ending) around what time should I start doing extra saves for true ending or is it super obvious. Also is the normal/bad end or whatever (how many endings there even are?) worth even seeing.
Drillary Clinton
Banned
Right, the life sim aspect is honestly the biggest chunk of the game. I would also argue it usually does a really good job of making meaningful use of dialog and word economy. Persona is really a game that respects your time, even if it does have a slow start.
Cannon_Fodder
Member
Super obvious. I'd say the normal/bad ends are pretty interesting in theory, but I'm not sure they're worth going through. I just watched them on YouTube and was satisfied.