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[lifeexpectancy]

Who said anything about Trump? This goes far beyond Trump.

The party has toxic candidates at every level of government: Federal, State and municipal.


Hell Trump wasn't even the scariest candidate they put forward, that was the guy who finished second, Ted Cruz.

The modern GOP is literally built on a foundation of bigotry.

Then hope none of the craziest ones get elected, and do your part to ensure that. Hell, maybe even run for a local seat yourself and try to make a difference. But don't tell others how they should use their vote. Not saying you personally are doing that, but that's the subtext I'm getting from some folks here

I mean you can call someone crazy for voting republican "because ignorant", "because ill informed", whatever, but not "because black". That is just the worst kind of argument to make.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Then hope none of the craziest ones get elected, and do your part to ensure that. Hell, maybe even run for a local seat yourself and try to make a difference. But don't tell others how they should use their vote. Not saying you personally are doing that, but that's the subtext I'm getting from some folks here.

I'm Canadian sooo.

They've already gotten elected. Have you seen the House and Senate over the past few years?

Also voting isnt some benign thing. I can and will forever critcize those who enable hatred...

And don't tell others how to vote is literally what an election campaign is about.

Honestly you act like political preferences aren't much different than what kind entertainment you like.

Politics aren't like just a difference of opinion like a favorite colour or food.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

Not sure how he can moral grandstand over Gawker then support Trump. Sounds like a piece of shit. You have to be to support that guy.

 

[lifeexpectancy]

I'm Canadian sooo.

They've already gotten elected. Have you seen the House and Senate over the past few years?

Also voting isnt some benign thing. I can and will forever critcize those who enable hatred...

And don't tell others how to vote is literally what an election campaign is about.

Honestly you act like political preferences aren't much different than what kind entertainment you like.

Politics aren't like just a difference of opinion like a favorite colour or food.

Fair point. Thankfully the only people I know voting for those types of candidates are coworkers and one family member I almost never see. So I don't have to make the unenviable choice to end a friendship over extremist political views.

Didn't know you were Canadian, so there's that. I do think telling someone how to vote, or demanding it or whatever, is different than trying to convince them why to change their vote. Some people are just plain ignorant and really don't see how negative a candidate is on other issues because they have their blinders on and are focused on only one issue.

I mean some people will flat out always vote republican "because religion", assuming all democrats support abortion. They literally don't care about any other issue. The opposite is also true, but to a lesser extent.

 

[excelsiorlef]

Not sure how he can moral grandstand over Gawker then support Trump. Sounds like a piece of shit. You have to be to support that guy.

I mean he thinks Welfare and women getting the right to vote destoyed Democracy sooo... Yeah he's fucking garbage

 

[nephilimdj]

Not sure how he can moral grandstand over Gawker then support Trump. Sounds like a piece of shit. You have to be to support that guy.

Hes a multi-billionaire secret angel, who also runs a bunch of companies including servicing the CIA. Not like he sits on r/donald all day

 

[wildfire]

An intelligent man at making money is a fool at living life.

 

[Htown]

Centralized government?  Nope, I prefer the states have more power than the fed.

Do you want racial discrimination? Because that's how you get racial discrimination. Crack a history book.

Hell, read a newspaper for that matter, and see how quickly a bunch of states tried to suppress minority votes this year.

 

[nomster]

Under the type of tax I am referring to, the ultra wealth pay taxes on their income. If they make investments that lose money, that is their problem. You are taxed strictly on your income alone (wages, dividends, rental income, etc). There are no tax write offs. It's pie in the sky stuff anyway, as it will never happen.

Great, that still doesn't address the most problematic part of those taxes - that the poor bear a far heavier burden.

 

[Already Torn]

This is gonna pay for a lot more memes.

 

[mugurumakensei]

Great, that still doesn't address the most problematic part of those taxes - that the poor bear a far heavier burden.

Yea. he seems to be ignoring that.
let's do some calculations with some really optimistic scenarios

At 15k - 1.5k = 13.5k

13.5k / 12 = 1125 per month

1125
- 600 for rent

525
-125 for electrify and utilities

400
-80 for car insurance or public transport

320
-120 for groceries

200
-30 for car maintenance and registration fees.

170
if not using public transport
-80 for gas

90
Don't get sick bro cause even with the 170 above that's one doctor visit you can before you are in debt.

if you have a family at this level, you'd already be in the negatives. thats 1500 more debt they had to accumulate so he can have his flat tax.

 

[AntraxSuicide]

Then hope none of the craziest ones get elected, and do your part to ensure that. Hell, maybe even run for a local seat yourself and try to make a difference. But don't tell others how they should use their vote. Not saying you personally are doing that, but that's the subtext I'm getting from some folks here

I mean you can call someone crazy for voting republican "because ignorant", "because ill informed", whatever, but not "because black". That is just the worst kind of argument to make.

90% of the GOP has been a part of the Southern Strategy for decades. How can you deny that the GOP stands as a white nationalist party when they advocate for racial discrimination, religious prejudice, voting restrictions, and less police accountability?

My mom also votes Republican. I hate to break this to you, but a lot of the "welfare queen, lazy, criminal immigrant" stuff appeals to more people than you think. If your mom has been voting Republican for years, it's because she actually is racist or she cares more about her taxes than the well-being of minorities. There aren't really other options with the GOP.

 

[entremet]

Not a fan of Trump at all, but I like Thiel--mostly for his business philosophy. Meaning, his ideas on how to run businesses, not government, which I believe are not good ideas. Stick to the private sector, Peter.

I have no problem with the donation, but we do need to have real campaign finance reform and Citizen United needs to be overturned.

 

[Brakke]

This.

Thiel going for the ultimate long shot - The 'Black Swan' bet.



He can afford to flush his money down the toilet if it doesn't work out as planned. But if there's an election upset then it puts him in an incredibly strong position.

What are you talking about? "Incredibly strong" how? When has Trump shown any loyalty to anyone who's given him money? Trump is a fickle baby.

 

[Shiggy]

I went to a lecture series by Thiel. It was one of the most boring lectures, and based on the content it made me wonder how he made so much money. Cannot recommend his book to anyone.

 

[KonradLaw]

Not sure how he can moral grandstand over Gawker then support Trump. Sounds like a piece of shit. You have to be to support that guy.

And everybodu who whined about Thiel killing Gawker has no right to criticize Trump now?

 

[Blader]

You're absolutely right it's incredibly reductive. It's also incrediby reductive to reduce the entire republican party to a bunch of minority-hating elitists, like so many posters are doing in this thread. Take this classic example right here:



They (people of color) don't have to be democrat, but certainy shouldnt be republican? Please enlighten me as to WHY a black person's political affiliation is any business of yours, without being "incredibly reductive", or painting half the country as your personal, stereotyped view of what a republican is. I ask because my mom is a republican, and I certainly don't think she fits the profile of the type of person you're alluding to. She was poor as shit when we were kids, and worked three jobs at once to make sure we had everything we needed. She doesn't harbor a bigoted bone in her body toward people of any race or nationality, either. And she sure as hell isn't priviledged. Yet somehow she has been a republican her entire life. So again, please enlighten me.

The Republican Party is built on a platform of, to put it politely, exclusion. It has been that way for nearly 50 years, since Nixon's southern strategy. The GOP is well aware of this, hence the 2012 post-mortem (that, in very explicit terms, said the party needs to be more open and inclusive or else it'll continue to lose presidential elections) and all the hand-wringing among Republicans about Trump's campaign feeding their worst caricatures. Trump's rhetoric on minorities from African Americans to Hispanics to Muslims, and the degree to which that shit is being lapped up by ~40 percent of the electorate, is why you have people here who can't reconcile why a person of color would vote Republican. Maybe that is a reductive conclusion to make about all Republicans, but when you have a major party that is so openly racist and bigoted -- and a statistically proven trend of racial resentment among Republicans that feeds into their worldviews -- I don't think it's a wildly unfair conclusion to initially jump to.

I don't know your mom, and I'll take your word that she doesn't have a bigoted bone in her body. But whether a voter is personally bigoted or not really makes no difference if the outcome is electing a bigoted president. My mom is a life-long Republican too, but it's a self-fulfilling party ID: she grew up with Republican parents and has always associated herself with voting Republican politicians, so she just keeps voting Republican, never really engaging the idea that maybe the Republican Party she grew up has changed (more than once) in her lifetime. I suspect a lot of "lifelong Republicans" are that way.

Although both of my hardcore Republican parents sound pretty conflicted about the election this year, which is the first time in my memory they weren't automatically pulling the lever for R.

To be perfectly frank I'm not voting for POTUS this year. I'll vote for congress and senate, and for state legislature. I dont think either of the candidates are fit to serve as president, even remotely. People voting for either of them are either delusional, or choosing between the lesser of two evils.

You're doing that reductive thing again.

 

[TalonJH]

I will never understand log cabin Republicans. He must disrespect women as much as Trump does.

You would think that they would get the message that a large portion of their base doesn't want them.

 

[collige]

I mean he thinks Welfare and women getting the right to vote destoyed Democracy sooo... Yeah he's fucking garbage

That's not what he said at all though.

 

[Frozenprince]

Funny you should say that since several states have legalized a drug that is a schedule 1 controlled substance federally. Weird how the feds dont just rush in there and use their power to qwell that little rebellious streak on the states' part. More power than the fed might not be the right choice of words, but I do prefer if the bulk of the governance is done by each individual state rather than a centralized government. Not the world we live in for the most part, but I wish it were.



Progressive taxation is ideal in theory. But in our current progressive taxation system, only the ultra wealthy are able to game the system and pay an effecitvely lower % tax rate than lower income people. Flat taxes with no writeoffs or loopholes means everyone pays their fair share, and billionaires don't coast by paying a lower % than you. Bruh.

Uuuuuuuuuuuuuuh.

They do do that? Dispensaries raids are exceptionally common.

 

[Apathy]

The money that is given directly to the campaign has to be used but all that money in the super pact just sends like it's going to go straight into trumps pocket with no oversight.

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

90% of the GOP has been a part of the Southern Strategy for decades. How can you deny that the GOP stands as a white nationalist party when they advocate for racial discrimination, religious prejudice, voting restrictions, and less police accountability?

My mom also votes Republican. I hate to break this to you, but a lot of the "welfare queen, lazy, criminal immigrant" stuff appeals to more people than you think. If your mom has been voting Republican for years, it's because she actually is racist or she cares more about her taxes than the well-being of minorities. There aren't really other options with the GOP.

Plenty of Republicans genuinely think that a too-robust social safety net and a too-large government decreases individual initiative and crowds out private investment that could help poor communities in a more lasting way. Prob not the majority, but you can both care about your taxes and also think the policies of the other party are the main driver of a lot of problems, racially. That would be factually wrong, of course, but to equate wrongness with, essentially, a moral failure is a dangerous road to walk down.

 

[excelsiorlef]

That's not what he said at all though.

The full quote

The 1920s were the last decade in American history during which one could be genuinely optimistic about politics. Since 1920, the vast increase in welfare beneficiaries and the extension of the franchise to women — two constituencies that are notoriously tough for libertarians — have rendered the notion of “capitalist democracy” into an oxymoron.

 

[Apathy]

But hey let's just assume someone does vote trump. Why shoudnt you be ok with that? That's their right. You can try to convince them otherwise. I've tried to convince a few coworkers they are voting for a lunatic (Trump), but at the end of the day that is their right and their vote. I may not like it, but I have to be ok with it. Unless he is removed from the ballot, people who care enough need to 'get out the vote' I suppose,and try to make sure he doesnt win. I dont think he stands a snowball's chance in hell of winning anyway, and dont like Clinton either, so I'm abstaining.

"Hey someone can vote for Hitler that's their right you should be ok with it"


The hell are you going in about. Yes it might be someones right to vote for a candidate but no we don't have to be OK with it and of course they can be criticized for it. If a candidate is a bigot that is threatening minorities and people vote just because he's from a specific party or because of one issue but ignores the glaring terrible side of the candidate of course that person can be criticized. My god where have we gotten to in this election cycle where people think that's an argument.

 

[kitchenmotors]

"Hey someone can vote for Hitler that's their right you should be ok with it"


The hell are you going in about. Yes it might be someones right to for a candidate but no we don't have to be OK with it and of course they can be criticized for it. If a candidate is a bigot that is threatening minorities and people vote just because he's from a specific party or because of one issue but ignores the glaring terrible side of the candidate of course that person can be criticized. My god where have we gotten to in this election cycle where people think that's an argument.

Great post. Some of the mental gymnastics people use this election cycle are crazy. At least it weeds certain people out.

 

[necrosis]

They (people of color) don't have to be democrat, but certainy shouldnt be republican? Please enlighten me as to WHY a black person's political affiliation is any business of yours, without being "incredibly reductive", or painting half the country as your personal, stereotyped view of what a republican is.

it's not a fucking "stereotype" when the republican party is built on a platform of minority subjugation and innumerable republican politicians -- including their presidential candidate (who enjoys upwards of 80% support within the party) -- have made a career out of hating blacks and other minorities

and it's my fucking business because i'm looking out for myself and my family

 

[Captain Tuttle]

Would a trump news network even be successful?

I mean its not a good time for media. Glenn Beck's the Blaze is going down in a blaze right now.

Oprah's network is limping along and she's a genius. A Trump News Network would fail, there's just not the critical mass and he's an idiot

 

[Ponn]

If you have a flat tax with a fixed % of 10% or whatever, how is that screwing over poor people? How is it fair that anyome have ZERO tax burden? Federal income tax supports all the programs that low income families utilize. If someone makes $15k a year and pays 10% of that, they are paying a whopping $1500 in income tax. Compare that to how much they get back from a system that isn't bankrupted via social support programs like food stamps, subsidized healthcare, rampant war spending in places we have no business being, etc, and they are coming out ahead. Our current system is unsustainable. We're running up the national debt to astronomical levels all in the interest of keeping taxes low, among other reasons. Sooner or later something has to give. And if the system fails fiscally, those same social programs low and no income people rely on will disappear or be scaled back considerably. Hopefully MIC spending will be scaled back too, but it always seems like the low hanging fruit getsaxed first.
.

If you are making $15,000.00 a year that is roughly an income of $1250 a month. You are taking a whole months pay away from someone on your flat tax program. Have you actually thought about that at all? How can you seriously ask how that hurts the poor? If you are getting government help you are generally not paying taxes because that is the most redundant thing. I will be honest, you sound like the type that is just pissed off poor people are getting help. I made it so why the hell can't they, right? Everyone is the same, bootstraps and all that.

That's not even taking consideration how spending scales with income. Rich hoard money for a reason. And it just sits there in off shore accounts helping no economy at all.

Under the type of tax I am referring to, the ultra wealth pay taxes on their income. If they make investments that lose money, that is their problem. You are taxed strictly on your income alone (wages, dividends, rental income, etc). There are no tax write offs. It's pie in the sky stuff anyway, as it will never happen.

Ultra wealthy wouldn't be paying taxes on that system. Hint - look at how ultra wealthy get paid. Most like CEO's get paid through shares and other methods now for a reason. Instead of whining about "Wah, people are ganging up on me when i bring up reasons why I vote Republican and its unfair they expect me to discuss, defend and think about my positions" try being that rare unicorn that actually tries to discuss and think about their position instead of cherry picking posts to respond to, whining and running away.

 

[lifeexpectancy]

If you are making $15,000.00 a year that is roughly an income of $1250 a month. You are taking a whole months pay away from someone on your flat tax program. Have you actually thought about that at all? How can you seriously ask how that hurts the poor? If you are getting government help you are generally not paying taxes because that is the most redundant thing. I will be honest, you sound like the type that is just pissed off poor people are getting help. I made it so why the hell can't they, right? Everyone is the same, bootstraps and all that.

That's not even taking consideration how spending scales with income. Rich hoard money for a reason. And it just sits there in off shore accounts helping no economy at all.



Ultra wealthy wouldn't be paying taxes on that system. Hint - look at how ultra wealthy get paid. Most like CEO's get paid through shares and other methods now for a reason. Instead of whining about "Wah, people are ganging up on me when i bring up reasons why I vote Republican and its unfair they expect me to discuss, defend and think about my positions" try being that rare unicorn that actually tries to discuss and think about their position instead of cherry picking posts to respond to, whining and running away.

Never once said I vote strictly republican. I've voted for candidates on both sides, including clinton (bill) in the those presidential elections. Get your eyes checked mate.

Also never "ran away". I simpmy dont live on these forums like some. I also don't recall the earlier poster giving a valid, non racist reason for why black republicans must suffer from self hatred. That's an indefensible position, because it makes assumptions about black people, regardless of what the republican party stands for.

 

[The Albatross]

Well, now I feel kind of dirty for being Pro-Thiel in the Gawker v. Hogan case, though I think that was more motivated from me being anti-Gawker.

 

[Stinkles]

Well, now I feel kind of dirty for being Pro-Thiel in the Gawker v. Hogan case, though I think that was more motivated from me being anti-Gawker.

A broken digital clock is not even right twice a day. I don't know how that applies but it is deep.

 

[platocplx]

The republican party of the last 50 years has solely been the party that makes gov look inept by defunding programs etc so they can slowly capitalize and allow special interests to privatize parts of govt.

I finally understand the long con thats been going on with the lower taxes and "small" govt. ideas.

It doesnt work based on how our society is setup. If there was a large middle class then the tax bases could change a lot, but our society is grossly top heavy financially. Flat taxes and other stuff does not work until salary is more reasonable for lower and middle class citizens.

 

[13ruce]

Trump should pay it himself it's pocket change for him cmon. These donations are crazy.

 

[Shaanyboi]

 

[Omegasquash]

Fuck you, Peter.

 

[geestack]

Well, now I feel kind of dirty for being Pro-Thiel in the Gawker v. Hogan case, though I think that was more motivated from me being anti-Gawker.

thiel is the much much much greater evil. dude has his hooks in a lot of shady shit like palantir and a startup that makes money by funding lawsuits.

 

[Servbot24]

I wonder what the reasoning is for donating to someone who is clearly going to lose. Maybe he's trying to get an in with Trumps's post election ventures.

 

[TestOfTide]

But hey let's just assume someone does vote trump. Why shoudnt you be ok with that? That's their right. You can try to convince them otherwise. I've tried to convince a few coworkers they are voting for a lunatic (Trump), but at the end of the day that is their right and their vote. I may not like it, but I have to be ok with it. Unless he is removed from the ballot, people who care enough need to 'get out the vote' I suppose,and try to make sure he doesnt win. I dont think he stands a snowball's chance in hell of winning anyway, and dont like Clinton either, so I'm abstaining.

No one is suggesting that Trump voters be thrown in jail for voting for Trump. We are simply pointing out the proven fact that Trump voters are all different categories of deplorables.

With regards to your lack of vote for Clinton, I'm just going to let you know best argument for why that's a bad idea even IF we assume she is guaranteed to win. See, ten years from now, someone ten years younger than yourself WILL inevitably ask you who you voted for in the 2016 presidential election and they are going to ask in the context of what they learned from their history classes, which will likely focus on 3 things:

1) Hillary Clinton being the first woman POTUS

2) Hillary Clinton being one of the most qualified and experienced people to become POTUS

3) The horrors of the Donald Trump campaign.

And here are the answers you can give and how they WILL react to each answer:

"I voted for Hillary Clinton."
Reaction: "Wow that must have been awesome to get to vote for her."

"I voted for Trump."
Reaction: "Wow you were one of the deplorables."

"I voted for neither."
Reaction: "Well you aren't one of the deplorables, but that's really disappointing that you didn't take part in history."

The only vote that you will be proud of 10 years from now is a vote for Hillary Clinton. Anything else will be something that will embarrass you 10 years from now.

 

[Kater]

I actually heard of him before, had to look the name up though. (Co-founded PayPal, that's where I know his name from.)

I suppose for him that's probably just change then? Typical young, rich and white douche.

 

[lifeexpectancy]

I can promise you I will not be embarassed about not voting for either of them 10 years from now. I don't regret decisions I make, and being embarassed about anything, ever, is not in my nature.

 

[jello44]

Well, now I feel kind of dirty for being Pro-Thiel in the Gawker v. Hogan case, though I think that was more motivated from me being anti-Gawker.

Nah, they're still a shitrag. Thiel is too, but he has a right to privacy and they should have thought of that before outing him before he decided when his time to do so was right.

 

[ReAxion]

bring back gawker

 

[LiK]

Giving away money to a loser. Trump scams someone else.

 

[PlayALLtheGames]

FWIW - Hilary is gonna win, but I think she's an idiot.  But I wouldn't vote for Trump's dumb ass in a million years, because he's worse than she is.

Clinton may be this or that but one thing she is not is an idiot. Perhaps a dictionary is in order.

 

[Apathy]

Clinton may be this or that but one thing she is not is an idiot. Perhaps a dictionary is in order.

It's really weird seeing a decorated lawyer of all things be called an idiot. A person who worked as the secretary of state being labeled an idiot. Only on the internet.

 

[TestOfTide]

I can promise you I will not be embarassed about not voting for either of them 10 years from now. I don't regret decisions I make, and being embarassed about anything, ever, is not in my nature.

You say that now, but 10 years from now those 3 things I listed are what the history books will have about this election. The history books aren't going to care about Wall Street speeches or Benghazi or OMG CLINTON IS S WARMONGER (I can guarantee you they won't talk about that last one because they don't talk much about Teddy Roosevelt in the context of the Spanish-American war).

So you go ahead and make your decision, but like I said, 10 years from now you will forced to choose between lying about your 2016 vote or embarrassing yourself as an almost-Nader-type voter.

 

[Ponn]

Never once said I vote strictly republican. I've voted for candidates on both sides, including clinton (bill) in the those presidential elections. Get your eyes checked mate.

Also never "ran away". I simpmy dont live on these forums like some. I also don't recall the earlier poster giving a valid, non racist reason for why black republicans must suffer from self hatred. That's an indefensible position, because it makes assumptions about black people, regardless of what the republican party stands for.

No, but you are definitely avoiding discussing your stated policy beliefs and addressing peoples counterpoints. The things that answer your last part there. If you don't get why Republican policies, even the ones you listed that people have been dissecting, are bad for groups of people and minorities then...alright then. Many, many people and groups who vote Republican are accused of voting against their own best interests, not just black people. Old people in Florida who constantly get screwed over by GOP medicare and SS policies (even vote in a Gov. who was part of a HUGE medicare scandal), vets and military who traditionally vote GOP despite consistently being used by them and thrown away, LGBT, etc etc. What a party stands for is a huge part of that assumption, not "regardless" Connect the dots.

 

[thelatestmodel]

Way, way, way too late for this. Although to be honest doing it at any point in time is still a waste.

That's $1.25 that's effectively been set on fire and thrown in the garbage.

 

[PlayALLtheGames]

Way, way, way too late for this. Although to be honest doing it at any point in time is still a waste.

That's $1.25 that's effectively been set on fire and thrown in the garbage.

I'm sure Trump will find good use for it - purchasing of his hats or book to give out, etc.

Fuck Peter Thiel.

 

[lifeexpectancy]

You say that now, but 10 years from now those 3 things I listed are what the history books will have about this election. The history books aren't going to care about Wall Street speeches or Benghazi or OMG CLINTON IS S WARMONGER (I can guarantee you they won't talk about that last one because they don't talk much about Teddy Roosevelt in the context of the Spanish-American war).

So you go ahead and make your decision, but like I said, 10 years from now you will forced to choose between lying about your 2016 vote or embarrassing yourself as an almost-Nader-type voter.

If asked a decade from now I'll answer quite frankly and say I didn't vote this year. You can assume all you want that this will somehow be embarassing to me, but it won't. What embarasses you doesn't necessarily embarass others. I haven't been embarassed a moment in my life since I was a child. You presume far too much if you think you can dictate to me how I'll feel about answering a simple question with a simple answer. I couldn't care less what others think of me, and therefore do not embarass by virtually anything that might embarass you or others that take so much stock in others' opinions.

I'll give you an example. A lot of folks are embarassed by passing gas in public. I am not. It isn't something I go out of my way to do, but after having had cancer back in 2004 I developed severe stomach issues. Said issues often cause flatulence that simply isn't feasible to try and run to a restroom and hide. Hell, sometimes I can't even stop if from coming out at all. Thankfully the stool itself is controllable, or I'd be buying a lot of new pants all the time. But on the odd occassion that a fart escapes me in mixed company, I merely pardon myself and carry on about my business. No shame, no blushing, and certainly no embarassment. This is a rather benign example and certainly not in the realm of politics, but I hope it gives you a bit of an idea how I might respond to questions about my voting.

Did you vote for Hilary that year sir? Nope, didn't vote for either of them. Doesn't it bother or embarass you that you weren't part of history? Lol... nope. Give me a break.