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Pillars of Eternity |OT| You must gather your party before venturing forth.
- Thread starter EviLore
- Start date
loganclaws
Plane Escape Torment
The stronghold is a silly idea and never really works unless there are unblockable quests that keep it fresh as you progress through the game.
One thing I would've enjoyed, unrelated to the Stronghold, is a bigger gameplay impact from companion interactions.
I haven't finished all of their quests so maybe it does happen, but something like in P:T where Dak'kon became stronger through the dialogues or the ability to learn spells at the cost of Hp from Ignus would've been cool.
Or even more interconnected dialogue choices, like the way Fall-From-Grace opened some interactions with Morte.
There is at least one instance where this kind of happens at the end of Edér's quest, but it was pretty minor.
I haven't finished all of their quests so maybe it does happen, but something like in P:T where Dak'kon became stronger through the dialogues or the ability to learn spells at the cost of Hp from Ignus would've been cool.
Or even more interconnected dialogue choices, like the way Fall-From-Grace opened some interactions with Morte.
There is at least one instance where this kind of happens at the end of Edér's quest, but it was pretty minor.
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
Expand on the prisoner thing but for other characters. Sending back animancers, wizards, etc that you can hire to work on your keep and they come up with their own side quest over time.
I'd classify side quests/companion as relevant optional content that the game is stuffed full of. You don't have to do any of it, but if you choose to do them they're rewarding for their own sake. The Stronghold should be similar--hell, stick a string of sidequests in there revolving around you upgrading and keeping keep prestige up, or side quests with story available from the random visiting NPCs. Make it a more reliable way to level up/get money and treasure from sidelined companions. It just needs to do something. Right now it's just a heap of mechanics that isn't even particularly rewarding for its own sake, and that's a problem.
Alcoremortis
Member
Yeah, I feel that Aloth in particular should have had some ability changes as a result of finishing up his quest.
I'm not done with the game yet... but I think it would have really been great to have a few background/home country/race related quests. Like, it wouldn't even have to be a separate quest per, it could just be a few quests (like each one is home country related with different options based on race/background) or something.
On the plus side, though... I have no doubt that when the modders get ahold of this, there will probably be a few quests like that.
Dsyndrome
Member
This different from Friday's hotfix for the lockpicking?
There are plenty of ways to make it work, they just weren't in the game.
You should be recruiting people from the world to man completed structures instead of just buying everything straight out of a menu. Merchants should be selling more unique and powerful items, materials, and recipes. Visiting NPCs should have more tangible effects. Some structures themselves should have sidequests, like collecting all the plays for the forum or doing something that lets you combine all the rest bonuses into a single option, making it the best rest option available. Raids and such should be actual events that can randomly occur and in which you can intervene.
Those are just a few ideas straight off the top of my head, so I'm sure that Obsidian has thought of all of that and more but didn't have the resources to implement it all. I guarantee you future expansions in the game will have plenty of those features. As is, it's an interesting base to expand on.
Nope, the last time I played was saturday.
Or... maybe yes, it's just weird that for me it downloaded just now.
I got a new ~500mb one in the last 18h.
Shake Appeal
Member
I like having a home base, but they actually need to feel like home. Having a big drafty, largely cosmetic castle in a corner of the overworld isn't interesting to me.
If you had a set of rooms over a shop in Defiance Bay, I'd like it more.
If you had a set of rooms over a shop in Defiance Bay, I'd like it more.
Yeah, a soul powered one. Would give you something to do with all those gold plated weirdos.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Exactly my thoughts. I love having a keep too, but the execution is severely lacking. Just a big, dumb empty space that you can dump money into to get some cosmetic changes. All of that is cool, but there needs to be some reason for it to exist. And designed to cut down on the loading screens to get from one place to the next. This is basically the keep from Dragon Age: Inquisition, but that had quests to unlock the customization items and there were dozens of some of them. This is just a timelocked menu.
As you say, if they knew they couldn't do it right (and there is no way they looked at that and was completely satisfied, they should have just given us an inn in Defiance Bay. I could have waited until PoE2 for a fully fleshed out keep.
Pretty sure its the same one.
I mean, they could have totally given you a Silent King type of option in Defience Bay where you drive out the competition by flooding the market with under-priced arms and armor and assume your rightful place as the merchant-king.
Well, I got it twice then.
I just got to the
*very early game spoiler*. What level is suitable for this? I'm like level 4 but I just get slaughtered when caught sneaking.
Edit: I can talk my way out of like 4 situations. There's this chick though who gets me. Not sure if I can avoid her.
castle to kill that King (forgot name sorry)
Edit: I can talk my way out of like 4 situations. There's this chick though who gets me. Not sure if I can avoid her.
Hendrick's
If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
This game would be so much better if it was turn based. This real-time with pause stuff is silly.
Nah it wouldnt.
Let's not point to the Mass Effect series as an example of how to deal with loot. After ME1, the series dealt with its loot system issues by removing "loot" entirely. Which, frankly, I never understood all the complaints about the first games inventory - it's an RPG, what do you expect? That's one of the things I really enjoy about RPGs, finding new badass loot to equip my characters with throughout the game.
I would hate it if Pillars was streamlined to the point where there was all of 5 different weapons and 2 armor pieces you could find for your character at set points throughout the game. That's an incredibly boring and misguided way to deal with inventory issues, in my opinion.
Is it kinda ridiculous that we can pick up 5000 xaurip spears in one dungeon and then sell them all in town and get filthy rich? Maybe. But it's really not difficult to differentiate between trash loot and useful loot in this game. And Pillars really doesn't have an overwhelming amount of loot anyways, compared to most RPGs.
BrokenFiction
Member
I don't hate it, but I prefer turn based. I like laying out moves like chess and then executing them. Then feeling the stress as I get blasted into oblivion while I wait for my move again.
Yeah, the Stronghold is one of the weaker aspects of the game. However, I personally also wasn't particularly fond of the strongholds in either BG2 or NWN2.
If you want to do that concept right you have to look at Suikoden
I just want a cool single building base with a cave system underneath. I'm tired of getting keeps or castles. Especially for reasons that pretty much melt down to "you are the protagonist and special, have a castle."
I expect an inventory system that isnt shit. If a bunch of other RPGs have shit inventories that doesnt make this one not shit.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
It wouldn't be better, it would be a totally different game. I'm glad it kept the same style/mechanics as it's predecessors, because that was sort of the whole point.
Regarding the stronghold: I kind of agree with the general "meh" feeling. Fun idea, mediocre implementation. The only noteworthy thing I got out of it was the giant chunks of XP the first four bounties get you if you do them around level 6/7.
Huh, I'll have to try this. Maybe I only hovered over the line instead of clicking.
This goes along with my wish for a drive-through window on the Gilded Vale inn, or the ability to travel directly from the map as long as you're not in a hostile town and you've already explored the exit. =P
That depends on what your definition of a "shit" inventory system is.
I have a hard time understanding complaints about inventory if your argument is "I don't like reading", or "I can't be bothered to understand weapon stats".
The rest bonus at the Stronghold should have been all the bonuses at the same time. It's a +1 so it's not that powerful and it's actually useful.
Also, random merchants should never leave before you said Yes/No to their offer. They are also slightly easy to abuse by just reloading before they arrive which nets you a different item each time.
Also, random merchants should never leave before you said Yes/No to their offer. They are also slightly easy to abuse by just reloading before they arrive which nets you a different item each time.
Hendrick's
If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
It would be better, because RTwP is a really bad mechanic. It's not like you can actually play through combat in real time with a party of six. So you basically have to create your own awkward turn-based combat.
Your well argumented reasoning has clearly showed the error of everyone's way with your great amount of proof supporting your claim.
People aren't actually enjoying the combat even if they think they are, truly.
I just read this as most RPGs have shit looting/inventory systems and we should keep it that way. I am sure there is some happy medium between Mass Effect 2/Shadowun: Returns remove loot entirely and what most RPGs use.
Before Pillars I would of agreed with you, but after Pillars I actually don't think RTwP is so bad. Being able to slow down the combat speed helped quite a bit for me. Now I can let it run and see what is going on and when need to pause the game to issue commands. In older games you would have to constantly pause the game every few seconds which meant the game might as well of been turn based.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
idontlikething.jpg
Hendrick's
If only my penis was as big as my GamerScore!
You will play Torment soon and have your proof.
Fine Ham Abounds
Member
Eroge, duh
Of what?
Of turn based being a good system too?
I don't need to wait for anything, I've played and loved turn based wrpgs for more than a decade.
Doesn't exactly impact my enjoyment of rtwp systems.
The proof that it's a different game? Your preference for turn-based combat doesn't make it better. I'm sure there will be some people in the Torment threads complaining that they didn't use the RTwP system as well. And they will get the same responses that you're getting.
Chairman Yang
if he talks about books, you better damn well listen
Josh Sawyer, the lead on the game, agrees with you. I wouldn't be surprised if future Obsidian Kickstarter projects go turn-based.
It's kind of annoying. Wasteland 2--to pick an example--would've probably been better with RTWP combat. It has lots of repetitive, trashy encounters and not many combat abilities for each character. Pillars combat, on the other hand, with its focus on positioning and relatively large number of active abilities, might have benefited a lot from being turn-based (although don't get me wrong, it's still top-tier as it is).
ME1 inventory was shit because it fit seven items in merchant screen, five items in equipment screen, usually having many duplicates of the same item.
Imagine only being able to see 5 Xaurip spears in your stash at once, and having to scroll through a list to get to the rest, instead of a grid with icons
Edit: though I'll admit, the merchant screen isn't much better in PoE
PoE might have benefited more from some actual encounter design
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
You can't run around in circles and shoot and escape, and then come back, and then escape again, and the sneak on the monster again with turns, so I take RTwP over it for games with a sneak attack feature.
Did Sawyer agree with that point? Last I saw he defended RTwP on its own merits and said one isn't necessarily superior to the other. Tim Cain was the one I recall who really wanted turn-based, but maybe Sawyer's changed his mind since.
Chairman Yang
if he talks about books, you better damn well listen
PoE had some good encounter design. Some of the bounties and fights against enemy adventuring parties, for example. Being turn-based would've made that obvious; as it is, they kind of went by too fast, even with slow mode and frequent pausing.
I would like a wrpg that adopted a turn based system similar to Frozen Synapse with a planning phase followed by a results phase in which all the plans for both sides (or however many sides there are) happen at the same time with the interactions between the units resolving automatically when they directly engage each other.
Not what I said at all, actually.
I'm sure there is a happy medium - that's why I said let's not pull a ME2 and just get rid of loot entirely, i.e. The extreme other end of the spectrum.