This is a really fantastic fence-sitting post, Dr. Worm.
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Pineapple Pizza Mafia |OT| The War On Fruit Pizza
- Thread starter Sophia
- Start date
This is a really fantastic fence-sitting post, Dr. Worm.
hey_monkey
Banned
This, to me, is the biggest non-town tell in all that BB is saying. I can see missing Dragonz' claim; things were going fast. But I can't buy "missing" all the discussion around Palmer's claim when there was nothing else happening at that time except semantics. I struggle with that.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
i find myself agreeing with darryls concern over burb.
his play often comes with a somewhat detactched feeling to it, but his post on day one pushed that feeling into full on 'pay as little attention to me as possible' territory.
his play often comes with a somewhat detactched feeling to it, but his post on day one pushed that feeling into full on 'pay as little attention to me as possible' territory.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
not sure i follow, too over the top to be scum or town?
He's so over the top that I feel like we're part of a performance. With the insults, I feel like he's just trying to clone my play style. Palmer has been a part of this community forever - I mean insulting people over role names? Come on - this can't be serious.
lol, you clearly never saw election where everyone acted like idiots or Anime( to a far lesser degree) or volcano where Sorian's cheating pissed me off, or whatever game weemadarthur whined to try and get me modkilled because I was hurting their feelings. I'm generally only nice to new players.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
yeah im inclined to agree with palmer of that point.
this is well within believably dickish behavior.
this is well within believably dickish behavior.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
I read it as frustrated town, for the record
But I am still obviously suspicious of his claim. But as I said, I want to see how the game unfolds, and with more information, I think the situation will finally get a resolution.
But I am still obviously suspicious of his claim. But as I said, I want to see how the game unfolds, and with more information, I think the situation will finally get a resolution.
30yearsofhurt
Member
Just took nearly 90 minutes of my lunch hour to get up to speed and I'm still in the dark.
For people asking why I unvoted Dragz and re-voted, I initially voted Dragz because of her change in behaviour from Anime. Then LL started going off on some crazy theory about starting a bandwagon and that whoever voted Dragz was complicit as scum, bla, bla, bla. I didn't want any part of this hare-brained manouver so I unvoted. Then with two minutes left I really couldn't justify voting anyone else so I went with my original gut feel of Dragz.
Now I may be wrong but when I read the write-up it sounds like someone re-directed a kill move on LL to SexyFish. Anyone want to drop a clue as to who they re-directed.
If I'm reading it wrong (and I may be going by Sophia's note that that may be fluff) then what does LL getting the pineapple pizza mean?
For people asking why I unvoted Dragz and re-voted, I initially voted Dragz because of her change in behaviour from Anime. Then LL started going off on some crazy theory about starting a bandwagon and that whoever voted Dragz was complicit as scum, bla, bla, bla. I didn't want any part of this hare-brained manouver so I unvoted. Then with two minutes left I really couldn't justify voting anyone else so I went with my original gut feel of Dragz.
Now I may be wrong but when I read the write-up it sounds like someone re-directed a kill move on LL to SexyFish. Anyone want to drop a clue as to who they re-directed.
If I'm reading it wrong (and I may be going by Sophia's note that that may be fluff) then what does LL getting the pineapple pizza mean?
I asked Sofia about the fluff specifically because i thought the same thing as you, and she confirmed in the thread that it is only fluff. Do not read into it.
hey_monkey
Banned
Yeah, was thinking the same until the clarification - that the real target was LL.
I assume we can trust the red text that assures LL is town?
I assume we can trust the red text that assures LL is town?
I hope so. I have no idea how bastard this is though. It's possible that system messages cannot be trusted 100%.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
Wait what are yall talking about though
I am so lost, how is LL town?
I am so lost, how is LL town?
SexyFish has died!
Lifeline was handed a slice of Pineapple Pizza! He is aligned with the town!
Day 2 begins
Majority is 10
Day 2 ends in:
Here, WAMD. It's easy to miss.
Red text in the day's opening post declared that Lifeline is town, and this revealation is apparently because someone handed him pineapple pizza last night.
LL is being strangely cagey about his role's details though.
hey_monkey
Banned
I'm working on a longer post but in the meantime...
I asked if we could trust the confirmation of Lifeline as town because Im finding his complete avoidance of any information about his role or what he heard or learned (if anything) about the night actions really anti-town. We need information. He probably has some and is withholding in favor of tunneling hard and demanding everyone believe him. I also really want to know about him thinking he was vanilla and he wasnt. I think he could talk about this without claiming.
Specifically though, LL, Id like to quote this post and offer these questions back to you:
When people mention bastard here, could that mean he didnt KNOW his alignment (or thought it was something different or... could it have changed?)? Is that also how he maybe misinterpreted his PM?
LaunchPad, you said you could see how it could be confusing. Mine is pretty clear, so what could be confusing?
And when I say avoidance, I mean it. Not just "No, I won't tell," but outside of "ask whoever targeted me," he's completely ignored all requests for info. And then he asked for a turbo on a day I think we're going to benefit very much from discussion.
Obviously I'm not going to vote him unless we can confirm that we can't trust that info but I find this all pretty suspect, I have to say.
I asked if we could trust the confirmation of Lifeline as town because Im finding his complete avoidance of any information about his role or what he heard or learned (if anything) about the night actions really anti-town. We need information. He probably has some and is withholding in favor of tunneling hard and demanding everyone believe him. I also really want to know about him thinking he was vanilla and he wasnt. I think he could talk about this without claiming.
Specifically though, LL, Id like to quote this post and offer these questions back to you:
When people mention bastard here, could that mean he didnt KNOW his alignment (or thought it was something different or... could it have changed?)? Is that also how he maybe misinterpreted his PM?
LaunchPad, you said you could see how it could be confusing. Mine is pretty clear, so what could be confusing?
And when I say avoidance, I mean it. Not just "No, I won't tell," but outside of "ask whoever targeted me," he's completely ignored all requests for info. And then he asked for a turbo on a day I think we're going to benefit very much from discussion.
Obviously I'm not going to vote him unless we can confirm that we can't trust that info but I find this all pretty suspect, I have to say.
hey_monkey
Banned
Public cop? Someone checks you and it displays, is that what that would mean?
It is a possibility I suppose. I didn't think about it earlier, but it would explain LL's unwillingness to discuss his role. However, it is just wild speculation on my part.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
I mean he's town so does it matter?
hey_monkey
Banned
Unless it's not true, in which case, it would.
Though I've read Arkham and it could just all be LL being LL.
30yearsofhurt
Member
Well that's the thing then. If there is no re-direct then LL wasn't targeted.
Why was Sexyfish targeted??? (am I reading this right?)
That is indeed the question. BB would have you believe Sexy was killed to throw even more suspicion on him.
hey_monkey
Banned
Dr. Worm, you started the day with another vote on BB and plead for his lynch at end of d1. Are you still feeling that now? Any shift or confirmation for you?
BlackBuzzard: you really missed the discussion about tropes in role madness? Im struggling here. You mentioned Palmers thoughts in this post after the claim. If you werent talking about his claim and everything around it, what were you talking about?
Youve also said often scum wouldnt do x, scum wouldnt do y - why cut off lines of discussion?
Darryl, Im not questioning your absence as you requested. I do question why youd then go after someone else whod been absent, and just that one person. I know you offered some reads on Burb, but what about the other light or largely fluff posters? Do you have other reads to offer? Someone youd target after Burb? (I know you said you were going to catch up and offer reads, but several people have promised things and not delivered so far in this game and its making me suspicious)
LaunchPad, I know youre getting caught up, but are you voting for Swamped? Youve pushed hard on doubting her vote. Or do you believe her explanation?
acohrs promised reads for Blarg at the very least and never did deliver. What do you think about all of the new developments, acorns? You believed Palmer based on the meta. What about now, all three of them?
Dragonz, do you have a top scum pick right now?
Blargonaut: in light of developments, would you change your read partner assignments? Would you continue that plan? Now only you are responsible for reads on me and Dr. Worm, with SF dead, and 30 and I only have one person to read. Would you be more inclined to trust Lifelines reads?
I second the calls for Burb's appearance.
BlackBuzzard: you really missed the discussion about tropes in role madness? Im struggling here. You mentioned Palmers thoughts in this post after the claim. If you werent talking about his claim and everything around it, what were you talking about?
Youve also said often scum wouldnt do x, scum wouldnt do y - why cut off lines of discussion?
Darryl, Im not questioning your absence as you requested. I do question why youd then go after someone else whod been absent, and just that one person. I know you offered some reads on Burb, but what about the other light or largely fluff posters? Do you have other reads to offer? Someone youd target after Burb? (I know you said you were going to catch up and offer reads, but several people have promised things and not delivered so far in this game and its making me suspicious)
LaunchPad, I know youre getting caught up, but are you voting for Swamped? Youve pushed hard on doubting her vote. Or do you believe her explanation?
acohrs promised reads for Blarg at the very least and never did deliver. What do you think about all of the new developments, acorns? You believed Palmer based on the meta. What about now, all three of them?
Dragonz, do you have a top scum pick right now?
Blargonaut: in light of developments, would you change your read partner assignments? Would you continue that plan? Now only you are responsible for reads on me and Dr. Worm, with SF dead, and 30 and I only have one person to read. Would you be more inclined to trust Lifelines reads?
I second the calls for Burb's appearance.
Who is your scum list right now? If you had the ability to kill 5 people right now, who would they be?
hey_monkey
Banned
While others said SF was targeted because it was unlikely he'd be protected or that it would give us little information. But BB was quick out of the gate with that explanation. Thirteen minutes into the day, in fact. 7th post after the day began. So it was either prepared or a shot in the dark.
hey_monkey
Banned
Shit! I converted to plain text and everything.
Mods, is it possible to get a mod edit to fix that for readability?
hey_monkey
Banned
Oh, or not, see Sky above.
Palmer, that's a good question and I actually have that list. I'll post it shortly. I want to doublecheck. I'd also ask it of Sky, who's moved to my town list.
I kisted it earlier in response to a question Swamped asked, but no one seems to have noticed.
I have a prelim suspected scum team of acohrs, BlackBuzzard, 30years, and Natiko. Their interactions on day 1 raised some red flags for me. I can go into more detail when I have time tomorrow.
Apologies for not being here much today, been struggling to focus on this game lately. I do want to say that I won't be here a ton this Day Phase; I've got a Final tomorrow and on Tuesday I'll be out of town all day. I'm also going to be at work up until Day End so....I'll be here when I can. Sorry, I'll try and pick up the pace the next Day Phase.
So was that before or after this post:
Here
Because the above quote makes me think you came to that decision after all the conversation but if that's the case why did you say what I linked?
To be honest most ( i.e. all ) of the early Palmer voters need some explanation for their votes here. Blarg, Isaac, and Stan since all they had going for their votes was his claim at that point and some vague reasons for why they voted.
Going to throw my two cents in on this but we have a few possibilities but we won't know for certain until we get another Night Phase to pass. It's possible he was the target of an SK and the Scum Kill was blocked but we can't know that for certain unless we get 2 Kills this coming Night Phase. Also Flavor =/= game mechanics but that doesn't rule out a Switcher possibly targeting SexyFish and whoever the original target was. It's also possible he was the original Scum Kill and was likely targeted for being quiet/a non-presence and would therefore yield little info, although why him over the other quieter players I have no idea, nothing in a quick re-read suggests anything one way or the other. He did have a vote on BB but I feel like you could argue that both ways between him and Dragonz and WIFOM it to death.
Same goes with the question of why a quiet player and not an active voice as the kill if nothing was switched/Scum killed SexyFish. It's hard to gauge anything off of one NK but if we have a pattern of quiet players being killed over loud players I'd look into the active crowd for Scum since their 'pool' is larger.
Then currently with the events that have transpired what are your thoughts on BB/Dragonz/Palmer now?
To be honest when you said you would be busy for the whole weekend I didn't question it. When it comes to those real-life excuses it's not something I usually turn around and go 'well hey wait a second...'
Does that mean you think Dragonz is Scum? Or did you just pull BB's name out?
Palmer I'm going to bop you over the head
At least explain something in regards to your vote/list besides 'yup this is it'.
You said earlier that you want to put pressure on those who voted for you early on and see how the Vanilla claims act but why do you have Isaac and Stan lower on your list than those who didn't vote for you, i.e. Burb and Nat. Similarly your thoughts on Dr. Worm and Blarg, since last I knew you voted for Blarg on Day 1 as a joking 'he annoys me' and I can't recall your thoughts on Worm.
Pretty sure somebody already asked you about Launch but why BB as least Scum?
So was that before or after this post:
Here
Because the above quote makes me think you came to that decision after all the conversation but if that's the case why did you say what I linked?
To be honest most ( i.e. all ) of the early Palmer voters need some explanation for their votes here. Blarg, Isaac, and Stan since all they had going for their votes was his claim at that point and some vague reasons for why they voted.
Going to throw my two cents in on this but we have a few possibilities but we won't know for certain until we get another Night Phase to pass. It's possible he was the target of an SK and the Scum Kill was blocked but we can't know that for certain unless we get 2 Kills this coming Night Phase. Also Flavor =/= game mechanics but that doesn't rule out a Switcher possibly targeting SexyFish and whoever the original target was. It's also possible he was the original Scum Kill and was likely targeted for being quiet/a non-presence and would therefore yield little info, although why him over the other quieter players I have no idea, nothing in a quick re-read suggests anything one way or the other. He did have a vote on BB but I feel like you could argue that both ways between him and Dragonz and WIFOM it to death.
Same goes with the question of why a quiet player and not an active voice as the kill if nothing was switched/Scum killed SexyFish. It's hard to gauge anything off of one NK but if we have a pattern of quiet players being killed over loud players I'd look into the active crowd for Scum since their 'pool' is larger.
Then currently with the events that have transpired what are your thoughts on BB/Dragonz/Palmer now?
To be honest when you said you would be busy for the whole weekend I didn't question it. When it comes to those real-life excuses it's not something I usually turn around and go 'well hey wait a second...'
Does that mean you think Dragonz is Scum? Or did you just pull BB's name out?
Palmer I'm going to bop you over the head
At least explain something in regards to your vote/list besides 'yup this is it'.
You said earlier that you want to put pressure on those who voted for you early on and see how the Vanilla claims act but why do you have Isaac and Stan lower on your list than those who didn't vote for you, i.e. Burb and Nat. Similarly your thoughts on Dr. Worm and Blarg, since last I knew you voted for Blarg on Day 1 as a joking 'he annoys me' and I can't recall your thoughts on Worm.
Pretty sure somebody already asked you about Launch but why BB as least Scum?
hey_monkey
Banned
Five people? In order, right now.
acohrs
BlackBuzzard
Blargonaut
Natiko (or replacement)
isaacnukem
Mostly this was based on my day1 reads, with some reinforcement from today's events. I have some honorable mentions, but my list is only so big because we have too many damn inactives. Tell me why you're feeling so strongly on Dr. Worm and Stanley? The former I was scumreading d1 but now I'm less sure.
And Palmer, per your own post, you gotta be scum eventually, right? ಠ_ಠ
I feel most town on Sky and Sawneeks right now.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
isaac
30years
acorn
swamped (just a gut read, I don't trust her one bit after Anime)
Track record has shown me that people who vote for me with no logical explanation are scum at best, and dumb town at worst. That's why anyone that voted me on D1 is on my list. It also applies somewhat to people who clearly talk bout voting me so they have an excuse to jump on a bandwagon later.
My D1 vote was not really a joke vote at all. I didn't intend to leave it where it was, but if Blarg had been voted off, i would have been satisfied overall. That's why I'm voting him first. At best, he's scum, at worse, I'm killing a townie who never seems useful to town(IMO). Luckily, he fits a lot of my other criteria anyway.
For burb, I already posted why. He's skating in post count, quality, and voting record. I'd quote his posts but there aren't many to even look at.
See above. I'll try to go through Stan and Dr's posts tomorrow like I did BB, but I'm calling it for the night right now. Would be nice if some more people show up to actually play this game.
What do you mean about my own post?
hey_monkey
Banned
The one where you said you're always town!
I agree more people need to turn up. And do stuff when they do.
StanleyPalmtree
Banned
i like how palmers reason for thinking that i and several others are scum is that he is completely full of himself.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
While I was posting that I was doing the internal dilemma of "do I claim? do I stir this pot, or do I wait and see what happens?" I had a feeling that his claim was BS from the beginning, but as I said during the last day phase, I wanted to wait and see. And if something came up that countered his claim or his interactions with people, then we could tackle that, as a town.
Here, here, and here.
I knew from the start that I was vanilla. I never once considered that I may be the only one, or that someone would even bring up the possibility. When he mentioned it, I didn't truly realize it was a role madness game, so it was at that point that I decided to withhold the information until the need arises / Palmer did something especially shifty / one of us flipped. I figured that if someone were to come back with some HARD PROOF that he was lying or whatever, I could, at that point, come forward and counterclaim. I saw no point in doing it that early in the day, especially when it may put other PR's at risk.
I thought it would be several days down the road before we would even get to that point, but I was wrong, because I almost ended up getting bandwagoned, and it was at that point that I figured a mislynch on my end would A) lose a town wrongly and B) if Palmer IS telling the truth, he would be target numero uno the next day.
I'm not trying to protect him, even if that's what it sounds like. My thoughts on it are this: we very well could have multiple vanillas. It's not out of the realm of possibility at this point, and I would like to see some concrete proof before jumping to that conclusion. I'm trying to keep an open mind here.
hey_monkey
Banned
I'm glad you brought this one back. at the time I read it and it felt like hammering a point to me, like ugh, but he explained his thought process! But now it feels like support for your claim.
I'm glad now my vote didn't count but I was for real over here yelling SHENANIGANS AND TOMFOOLERY at the computer at the time.
The one where you said you're always town!
I agree more people need to turn up. And do stuff when they do.
I only get angry when I'm town. My scum/neutral record is stellar.
i'm almost certainly wrong about some of them. Time will tell. In the meantime, you should consider actually contributing, cause that post is the equivalent of "lol no u".
You can do better.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
I for sure thought I was dead, so thank u based pineapple gods that it didn't <3
While I'm irritated that you didn't claim right away, I don't currently think you're lying. Your reactions to me are far more believable than the way BB's claim went down.
WhereAreMahDragonz
Banned
And I am sorry for how it went down, but I certainly wasn't going to draw out a claim for an issue that may not exist. At the time, it was too much of a risk for PRs, and I only decided to claim when I absolutely needed to.
Blargonaut
Banned
Blargonaut
Banned
VOTE: Palmer_v1
