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[gcubed]

Taxes are way too low to be funding the social programs we have in this country. We need to get rid of the SS cap, add new tax brackets for millionaires, and raise the capital gains tax in order to fund SS, medicare/medicaid, and pensions.

we shouldnt be offering pensions anymore, why can't the gov't do a 403b with matching like other non-profit businesses and get out of the pension game? (besides the current obligations they have)

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Well, I'm all for public workers contributing more, too, but as for alternatives as you've mentioned, I know nothing about them. What is a 403b?

 

[Invisible_Insane]

There's already a thread about it, but rumors are going around that Société Générale is going to declare bankruptcy today and default on its obligations. It is the 2nd largest bank in France and the 8th largest bank in the eurozone. Stock is down over 20% and the rumor is the cause of the 400+ point Dow drop today.

oh, wow. What's driving them over the brink?

 

[Jackson50]

Wow, arguments against global warming and evolution have finally merged.

Or is it the 2nd law of thermodynamics creationists cite? I don't remember anymore.

Yeah. That was my initial reaction. They use those damn laws of thermodynamics to refudiate everything.

Huntsman’s Big Endorsement: Jeb Bush Jr.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/08/huntsmans-big-endorsement-jeb-bush-jr.php?ref=fpblg

Hahaha.

When I stated Huntsman's only chance to win the nomination was to dominate the shadow primary, I imagined more prominent endorsements.

 

[ToxicAdam]

he might be popular in Florida, but on a national level, being related at all to George W is not an advantage, it's a very large disadvantage.

Huntsman is running for the Republican nomination. GWB still has decent approval ratings among them.

Not that it matters. Herman Cain has more of a shot at the nomination than Huntsman does. Which is a shame, because I think the guy is good. (at least at giving speeches and 'getting it')

 

[mckmas8808]

Out of that line up KERRY is the one you're worried about?

.

Only because he's an unknown. I do worry about Baucus too like the rest of you guys, but I'm expecting a bunch of BS from him.

 

[Invisible_Insane]

Only because he's an unknown. I do worry about Baucus too like the rest of you guys, but I'm expecting a bunch of BS from him.

John Kerry is an unknown?

Huntsman is running for the Republican nomination. GWB still has decent approval ratings among them.

Not that it matters. Herman Cain has more of a shot at the nomination than Huntsman does. Which is a shame, because I think the guy is good. (at least at giving speeches and 'getting it')

Are you talking about Cain or Huntsman?

 

[gcubed]

Well, I'm all for public workers contributing more, too, but as for alternatives as you've mentioned, I know nothing about them. What is a 403b?

similar to a 401k but for a non profits / public education

 

[aronnov reborn]

That'd be so awesome if they lost both. I'd be dancing in the streets. As is, I'm glad the taxpayers of this state have finally broken the back of the public unions and their corrupt relationship with the Democrats, having a seat on both sides of the bargaining table to negotiate contracts. I live in Wisconsin. I have kids in the school system. My school system went from MASSIVE deficits, to a million dollar surplus because of the budget repair bill. Overnight. All they did was switch from the corrupt WEAC insurance, which was FAR more costly than normal insurance, and now class sizes are going DOWN in my district.

So taxpayers saved money. We hired more teachers. Bad teachers can now be fired. Money is no longer flowing directly from the teachers paycheck into the union coffers and then on to elect Democrats to negotiate more bad deals with the unions.

It's truly a win, win, win. I simply can't understand why we would want bad teachers to be protected to the point that they can't be fired. I can't understand why we wouldn't want teachers contributing the same amount the private sector does to their lavish retirement and health benefits. I can't understand why we wouldn't want to reward good teachers with higher pay. None if makes sense when you think about it. Wisconsin voters have seen the light.

I'll end on this. I was driving down the street today and I saw a giant sign supporting one of the Republican Senators being recalled (who won) and it was on a farmer's private property. Last night someone spray painted over his private property "RECALL". I think it's that attitude from public sector unions that ultimately helped Republicans win the day. People are fed up with the way unions are behaving. From the fraudulent doctor notes, to schools having to cancel classes because the teachers cut class, to private property being vandalized, to seeing teachers behave like crazed lunatics at the capital, I think it was a real eye opener. In the end, I think this result proves just how bad things are for Obama. I don't think he can win this state in 2012, and he won this state BIG a few years ago. We would need unemployment down around 7 percent for him to have a shot at it, and that's all but an impossibility at this point. If he can't win Wisconsin, he sure can't win Ohio, and Michigan looks bad, and PA even looks bad. I think this spells the end of his presidency.

I love you sir..

Suddenly i don't feel so alone here.

 

[gcubed]

I love you sir..

Suddenly i don't feel so alone here.

if you have any thoughts of being taken seriously, thats not the way

 

[empty vessel]

I love you sir..

Suddenly i don't feel so alone here.

Just a word of warning: drakesfortune is a delusional crazy person. And that is not a normative political statement; it's an empirical one.

 

[zero_suit]

I love you sir..

Suddenly i don't feel so alone here.

You don't know who he is, do you?

 

[aronnov reborn]

damn 3 straight replies.

I didnt know there was a history I was going by that one post.

 

[Dr. Pangloss]

There can only be one master and one apprentice. That is the way of right wing poligaf.

 

[speculawyer]

Yeah. That was my initial reaction. They use those damn laws of thermodynamics to refudiate everything.

And I'm sure 98% of the audience has no clue as to what the laws of thermodynamics are . . . it just sounds 'sciency' to them.

I have no idea what the First law has to do with climate change at all. Global warming has to do with the heat balance between what we absorb from the sun and what we re-radiate out. What 'work' is involved?

 

[gcubed]

damn 3 straight replies.

I didnt know there was a history I was going by that one post.

if you are bored and you want a good laugh, go for a search through post history

 

[ToxicAdam]

Are you talking about Cain or Huntsman?

Huntsman.

I have no idea what the First law has to do with climate change at all. Global warming has to do with the heat balance between what we absorb from the sun and what we re-radiate out. What 'work' is involved?

I'm pretty sure it is in reference to the recent Roy Spencer paper. Which many right-winger's said 'blew a hole' in the global warming theory. When actually, it was just meant to show how flawed current modeling is.

http://www.drroyspencer.com/2011/07/rise-of-the-1st-law-deniers/

 

[_Xenon_]

I just found this article pretty interesting (from WSJ):

‘Made in China’ Taking Over U.S.? Not By a Long Shot

What does it all mean? There’s good news and there’s bad news. The good news is that the China threat that looms so large in U.S. political debate is overstated. China’s exports as a share of U.S. consumption might have grown quickly, but they are still a small fraction of the total. U.S. workers and companies are also taking a fair chunk of change from the process.

The bad news is that hopes of a stronger yuan creating more space for U.S. manufacturers to sell to the domestic market – already overplayed – appear even less credible. If most of the cost of “made in China” imports actually accrues to U.S. workers and companies, yuan appreciation will have only a limited impact on competitiveness.

So after all these years' propaganda of "China is stealing your jobs" "China is buying the US", it turns out to be a pile of bullshit?

 

[eznark]

damn 3 straight replies.

I didnt know there was a history I was going by that one post.

Don't let them hinder your forbidden love. Feel free to embrace drakesfortune.

Plus, if EV doesn't call you a delusional crazy person you are probably doing something wrong.

 

[reggieandTFE]

we shouldnt be offering pensions anymore, why can't the gov't do a 403b with matching like other non-profit businesses and get out of the pension game? (besides the current obligations they have)

Because 401(k)s and 403(b)s are glorified savings accounts that have helped funnel billions of dollars to Wall Street while destroying retirement security in this country? How can some one look at the insanity of the Dow over the last couple of weeks and be advocating to put more money into that rigged system?

 

[planar1280]

considering where the country is. Obama's numbers are good:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/10/usa-poll-idUSN1E7790RQ20110810

Aug 10 (Reuters) - Americans by a large majority believe the United States is on the wrong track and nearly half think the worst is yet to come in the economy, a Reuters/Ipsos poll said on Wednesday.

U.S. President Barack Obama's approval rating dropped to 45 percent from 49 percent a month ago, according to the poll conducted from last Thursday to Monday -- a period that included a historic downgrade of America's credit rating, new recession fears and the start of a stock market sell-off.

The poll found that 73 percent of Americans said the United States is on the "wrong track," and just 21 percent said the country is headed in the right direction.

This is the highest figure measured so far since Reuters/Ipsos began polling American public opinion in February 2009.

The survey of 1,055 adults found that 47 percent of respondents said "the worst is yet to come" in the U.S. economy, an increase of 13 percentage points from a year ago when this question was last raised. This is the highest measure since March 2009, when concern peaked at 57 percent, at the height of the recession.

While Americans believe blame is shared among many in Washington, Republicans appear to be suffering most following the debt-limit deal reached last week after anguished negotiations between Obama and congressional leaders that displayed the deep divide between the two major U.S. political parties and an inability to compromise.

The survey found 42 percent of Americans held a negative view of the loosely organized conservative Tea Party movement, closely tied to many Republican lawmakers, in the wake of the debt deal.

House of Representatives Speaker John Boehner, the top Republican in Congress, was viewed negatively by 37 percent of respondents in the poll.

The survey was performed just after Obama and the U.S. Congress concluded the deal that averted a government debt default but did not stop the U.S. credit rating from being downgraded by Standard & Poor's.

During the poll period, Americans were also digesting new data showing stubbornly high unemployment and pointing to renewed weakness in the economy, which sent U.S. stocks into a tailspin.

 

[empty vessel]

Plus, if EV doesn't call you a delusional crazy person you are probably doing something wrong.

Hey, I call 'em like I see 'em. If you cannot describe the physical, observable world reasonably accurately, and also do not care whether your empirically testable statements (i.e., non-normative statements) reasonably accord with the external world, you are both delusional and crazy. And that's just a fact about the world!

 

[Invisible_Insane]

Romney gonna get in that ass.

 

[eznark]

House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) has appointed Ways and Means Committee Chairman Dave Camp (R-Mich.), Energy and Commerce Chairman Fred Upton (R-Mich.) and House Republican Conference Chairman Jeb Hensarling (R-Texas) to serve on the deficit supercommittee.
Hensarling will serve as the co-chairman of the supercomittee.

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) appointed his deputy Sens. Jon Kyl (R-Ariz.), former Bush budget director Rob Portman (R-Ohio), and Tea Party favorite Sen. Pat Toomey (R-Penn.)

Triggers are as good as.....triggered?

 

[Invisible_Insane]

Triggers are as good as.....triggered?

Pretty much.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Letting the tea party anywhere near that team is going to taint it with inaction and controversy.

I would have thought McConnell was smarter than that

 

[eznark]

Letting the tea party anywhere near that team is going to taint it with inaction and controversy.

I would have thought McConnell was smarter than that

I told you guys the minute the deal was revealed that the goal of the GOP would be to force the triggers.

Also, we're already done with Wisconsin?

 

[Invisible_Insane]

Letting the tea party anywhere near that team is going to taint it with inaction and controversy.

I would have thought McConnell was smarter than that

You're assuming McConnell is interested in seeing the the group reach a compromise.

I told you guys the minute the deal was revealed that the goal of the GOP would be to force the triggers.

Also, we're already done with Wisconsin?

Will they attack the president for slashing defense even though he didn't write the bill? Probably.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

You're assuming McConnell is interested in seeing the the group reach a compromise.

I'd hope he'd be interested in the well being of his own party.

The Tea Party is not favored at all these days.

 

[eznark]

Will they attack the president for slashing defense even though he didn't write the bill? Probably.

As I said, the GOP won't be hit nearly as hard as dems will be attacked for cutting entitlements.

 

[Barf_the_Mog]

I told you guys the minute the deal was revealed that the goal of the GOP would be to force the triggers.

Also, we're already done with Wisconsin?

Yeah, didn't you hear? Resounding Democratic victory. Walker administration practically impotent at this point.

 

[besada]

Huntsman’s Big Endorsement: Jeb Bush Jr.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/08/huntsmans-big-endorsement-jeb-bush-jr.php?ref=fpblg

Hahaha.

I wonder if he fired his campaign staff because they told him this was futile? Seriously, Jeb Bush, Jr.? Is his next endorsement going to be the dim Bush twin? Michael Reagan? Barry Goldwater's second-cousin twice removed?

 

[Patrick Klepek]

I told you guys the minute the deal was revealed that the goal of the GOP would be to force the triggers.

Also, we're already done with Wisconsin?

No, two votes next week, IIRC.

 

[Vanillalite]

On a side note I assume the Wisconsin election results last night weren't within the realm of the percentage needed to have the voter fraud looked into. I'm not versed into this kind of shit so does that mean the dems will probably just drop the allegations or will they try and push them still?

 

[ReBurn]

Yeah, didn't you hear? Resounding Democratic victory. Walker administration practically impotent at this point.

I hear there was record voter turnout, too.

 

[eznark]

No, two votes next week, IIRC.

Yeah, I meant done with discussion about it.

The two democrats next week are in quite a bit of trouble. Holperin is essentially boned.

On a side note I assume the Wisconsin election results last night weren't within the realm of the percentage needed to have the voter fraud looked into. I'm not versed into this kind of shit so does that mean the dems will probably just drop the allegations or will they try and push them still?

There is no threshold for investigation. If there was fraud they can investigate no matter the outcome of the election. The state Democratic Party backed off the unfounded allegations last night already.

 

[A Human Becoming]

Triggers are as good as.....triggered?

Can't they actually ignore the trigger? It's happened before.

 

[Barf_the_Mog]

Yeah, I meant done with discussion about it.

The two democrats next week are in quite a bit of trouble. Holperin is essentially boned.

This has been bothering me all last night. What minor victory the Dems are claiming now is surely premature. I'm 90% certain that Simac will win and Steitz may just pull off an upset. This entire recall may just be a wash.

 

[eznark]

This has been bothering me all last night. What minor victory the Dems are claiming now is surely premature. I'm 90% certain that Simac will win and Steitz may just pull off an upset. This entire recall may just be a wash.

I haven't really seen much victory claiming from the left outside of Leroidys on here. Even if they defend both seats next week, they are in the exact same spot they were in February. The only place the state GOP has had breaks is with the budget fix and that shit is sailed. Everything on the rest of the agenda will go party lines. The only thing the state dems got was a larger bill at whichever Rockford hotel they decide to flee to if another contentious bill comes up.

Hell, even Mordecai Lee (big time lefty professor go-to political analyst in Milwaukee) is giving up the ghost on a Walker recall. Flat out, it was a defeat for the democrats. Splitting the senate would have been a small win but the goal was to take the senate.

There is still a tiny, slim chance that should both democrats win next week Dale Schultz will flip (he voted against the GOP on the budget fix) in which case you'd have to revisit last night.

 

[ronito]

I wonder if he fired his campaign staff because they told him this was futile? Seriously, Jeb Bush, Jr.? Is his next endorsement going to be the dim Bush twin? Michael Reagan? Barry Goldwater's second-cousin twice removed?

Yeah, I actually like Huntsman. He's the only republican in the running that I'd consider. Too bad he's running a terrible campaign so far.

 

[Chichikov]

I told you guys the minute the deal was revealed that the goal of the GOP
would be to force the triggers.

Please, every person in the world could've seen that.
The real question is whether Obama will look surprised or disappointed when it happens.

Also, we're already done with Wisconsin?

I still have money riding on you fuckers winning the division.
Good job last night.
I can almost taste it.

 

[tokkun]

The vote totals are really surprising. For LibGAF there is at least one huge benefit to this; Feingold will probably run for Kohl's seat instead of against Walker in a Quixotic recall attempt.

I don't see this result as making a Walker recall unlikely. Dems won two seats that Republicans had originally taken in a huge Democratic year, and Walker's approval ratings are still terrible statewide.

 

[eznark]

I don't see this result as making a Walker recall unlikely. Dems won two seats that Republicans had originally taken in a huge Democratic year, and Walker's approval ratings are still terrible statewide.

I hope I'm wrong, these recall elections were far more entertaining than I had imagined. I think it's unlikely because 1. it's hard as hell to recall a governor (half a million petition signors? good luck) and 2. I don't think the unions will be willing to back a challenger after pissing away so much money on these recalls.

I think Wisconsin should just descend into a perpetual election/recall season, with votes once a month or so.

 

[demon]

I think Wisconsin should just descend into a perpetual election/recall season, with votes once a month or so.

My walk to work in Madison every day involves crossing the capitol square. Fuck that.

 

[markatisu]

I hope I'm wrong, these recall elections were far more entertaining than I had imagined. I think it's unlikely because 1. it's hard as hell to recall a governor (half a million petition signors? good luck) and 2. I don't think the unions will be willing to back a challenger after pissing away so much money on these recalls.

I think Wisconsin should just descend into a perpetual election/recall season, with votes once a month or so.

You would be amazed at what Unions will piss away to prove a point

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

So why did the recent London riots happen? Sorry but I just find the source of all of it.

I understand using teenagers unemployment as an indicator for the overall health of the economy given the way our job market is constructed, but on a higher level, I believe that having more teenagers in the workplace is generally not a good thing.

I completely agree that it wouldn't be good to have too many employed teenagers taking jobs away from adults looking to get a second job to support their children or pay rent. But too many unemployed paints a very bleak future for a specific generation trying to make it.

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Source

Wisconsin Republicans Fend Off Democrats, Retain State Senate Control

09:04 am

August 10, 2011

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by Frank James
Wisconsin state capitol, March 2011.
Enlarge Justin Sullivan/Getty Images

Wisconsin state capitol, March 2011.

It was certainly closer than Wisconsin's Republicans would have preferred, but in the end they successfully repelled Democrats who sought to wrest away control of the state Senate and break GOP dominance over the Badger State's government.

Democrats fell one Senate seat short of the three they needed to take over that chamber in the state's largest recall election ever in which six seats were contested.

The election drew not just national but international attention as Wisconsin became an important flashpoint in a partisan war that pitted not just Republicans against Democrats but corporate interests against organized labor.

At least $30 million was spent by special-interest groups on both sides of the fight with significant sums coming from outside the state.


Befitting the importance that was placed on the recall election, Tuesday saw Wisconsin voters stream to polling places in numbers normally seen in statewide races for governor.

Keeping control, if only by one seat, was a victory for Gov. Scott Walker, Wisconsin's controversial Republican governor. Walker, with his GOP allies in the legislature enacted controversial laws that reduced the power of public-employee unions in the state. Republicans said the measures were needed to reduce the state's large fiscal deficit.

For the state's Democratic lawmakers and their organized labor supporters, Tuesday's results were just the latest setback.

Earlier in the year, state senate Democrats fled Wisconsin in an ultimately failed effort to stop the anti-union laws from being passed.

Then Wisconsin Democrats lost a court challenge to the new anti-union legislation They also lost an effort to unseat a Republican on the state Supreme Court.

Now it's Democrats who will be on the defensive. Next week two Democratic senators face a recall election and Republicans are likely to be feeling even more feistier now that they have withstood the best shot Democrats could throw at them.

Democrats claimed a moral victory Tuesday by saying the two seats they managed to pick up were normally Republican seats.

But, again, any pleasure Democrats could take from gaining those two seats was tempered by the Republican governor signing into law on Tuesday, just hours before Wisconsin's polls closed, redistricting legislation that should redraw legislative lines to make it easier for Republicans to not only keep but expand their legislative majorities next year.

Walker himself faces a recall election in 2012. The battle leading up to Tuesday's election as well as the results were just a foretaste of that coming fight.​

 

[mckmas8808]

Ulairi is like the conservative answer to Mcmackis back in 2008.

You talking bout me son?

 

[Averon]

With these GOP picks and Baucus on the Dems side, Dems are pretty much screwed with this super committee.

 

[gcubed]

Pat Toomey? As if i'm not embarrassed enough that my state elected that brainless hack.

Dems picked members who are open to cutting entitlements with tax raises.

GOP picked members who will refuse to budge on anything relating to taxes and require crippling entitlements.

This is going to be fabulous. The only hope is that since the debt ceiling talk seems to have backfired on the GOP more so then the Dems, this will just double down on that