-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PoliGAF 2011: Of Weiners, Boehners, Santorum, and Teabags
- Thread starter PantherLotus
- Start date
- Status
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Tamanon said:
We don't live in a normal world it seems. Everything is a fight and everything needs to be picked apart.
I lose faith in this country more and more with every passing month. Now Obama will give the speech before one of the most highly ranked football games of the year and liberals will be extra pissed off, because Beohner wanted to it moved 24 hours.
*sigh*
Clevinger said:
What? 40 or 50 years? When even progressives are afraid to call themselves liberals, and the left is looked at as one step away from communism, you're not going to get a "real" progressive president for a very long time. Again, the general public thinks that Obama is far left when in fact he's center right.
Karma Kramer
Banned
mckmas8808 said:
We certainly don't live in a normal world... a world where individuals put blind faith in someone because of their party... *cough*
To complain that liberals are pissed off too much, is to say dissent is unpatriotic. Our attitude should always be aggressive when it comes to policy and strategy. It isn't about showing love to the side you like more, its about molding your side to your beliefs. Democracy.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Measley said:
If you got a progressive in the WH, many of the left would think he's not progressive enough. And then when their stuff doesn't pass do to a Congress that's not as left as that progressive President, they'll blame him/her instead of the further to the right Congress.
They can't help themselves.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Karma Kramer said:
I'm not saying liberals are pissed off too much. Dissent all you want. Fuck if I care. I agree mold your side to your beliefs. That's how it's done.
But moving the speech to Thursday is something stupid to be mad about. We just learned about it like 12 hours ago and now it's changed. Big deal. Shouldn't we care more about the details and amount of spending in the speech?
Anybody thinking that the speech won't get a high rating it crazy if the White House can work out a way to get it on TV before the NFL game. I care more about the details. Guys like you should want to shape those and not what day it's seen on TV.
Karma Kramer
Banned
mckmas8808 said:
mckmas8808 said:
These two posts contradict each other. Unless you think Obama's lack of progressive defense is beneficial and leads to progressive policy? I don't see much evidence to back this up though.
empty vessel
Member
Karma Kramer said:
Look no further. There is none. Progressive policy was never once made by keeping quiet.
Frank the Great
Banned
seriously. there is no substantial progressive political movement in this country. the reason obama is a center-right president is because the electorate is center-right. it is not rocket science. if you want a progressive president, a strong progressive movement needs to be built up.
it shouldn't really even be that hard, theoretically. polls show that most americans do tend to fall on the progressive side of many issues (like the infamous public option.) the problem is that these people don't vote. the ideas are out there, people just need to get involved and start voting. as long as the majority of the electorate is elderly white people, politicians will have to cater to them.
that being said, my problem with obama on a personal level is that he is an incompetent leader and makes very poor political choices. i do not resent him for being too conservative; as outlined above, he isn't at fault for this. guy needs to get re-elected. but ffs, grow some balls man, stop being bitched around by your opponents.
it shouldn't really even be that hard, theoretically. polls show that most americans do tend to fall on the progressive side of many issues (like the infamous public option.) the problem is that these people don't vote. the ideas are out there, people just need to get involved and start voting. as long as the majority of the electorate is elderly white people, politicians will have to cater to them.
that being said, my problem with obama on a personal level is that he is an incompetent leader and makes very poor political choices. i do not resent him for being too conservative; as outlined above, he isn't at fault for this. guy needs to get re-elected. but ffs, grow some balls man, stop being bitched around by your opponents.
Karma Kramer
Banned
Frank the Great said:
It is very difficult to get a progressive movement when the media is owned by 5 corporations. Tea Party gets all the coverage, but massive protests from the left barely get a blip.
Karma Kramer
Banned
Clevinger said:
Haha, kind of proves the point. I am positive I have read of large progressive movements outside of the whitehouse that don't get mentioned at all in the media. But I will need to do some digging to give you specific examples. You can't deny the heavy tilt of coverage to the corporate funded tea party movement and movements of the opposite, I guess such as... http://www.pdamerica.org/
Perhaps you could argue that size matters in this circumstance, but you would think an objective news organization would want to frame the tea party narrative with more balance. As it stands, it seems like the only people active in changing government right now are the insane right.
Interestingly, the right says that Obama is a dictator who refuses to compromise and rams through legislation that ruins the country. Meanwhile, the left says that Obama is a weakling who gives the Republicans everything they want and compromises on everything.
As always, the truth lies somewhere in the middle....
As always, the truth lies somewhere in the middle....
speculawyer
Member
Why is this high school squabble relevant?
Karma Kramer
Banned
Clevinger... http://www.commondreams.org/view/2011/04/15-12
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Frank the Great said:
And this is the answer. But you're right there isn't a progressive push in the country like I wish there was. Sadly I've seen too many times were DEMs would say that the Recovery Act (ie the stimulus) failed.
Saying things like that when they aren't true doesn't help the progressive cause. I hope the refinancing some homeowners mortgages and turning some Fannie Mae forecloused homes into rental makes it into the WH's plans for 2011 though.
It'll do the country good and it'll also be something that progressives can get behind. How can the GOP push back on something like helping out people that are about to lose their homes, when the Congress gave the banks access to $700 Billion?
Invisible_Insane
Member
It's not an issue of huge significance, to be sure, but it is another point of evidence for people who see Obama as an incompetent tactician/negotiator. If he had wanted to poke the Republicans in the eye by upstaging their debate, he could have done so. Instead, you have a situation where his intent to upstage is made known, but he does actually succeed in executing it because the Republicans simply hold the line. A "high school squabble" is an apt way to describe this, but if you're going to pick such a fight, you should (given the amount of leverage he could have brought to bear) be able to win it.speculawyer said:
Story: Obama admin sends a letter to Congress asking to make a speech on Sept. 7. The Speaker of the House says okay but can we wait a day, bro? Sure thing, says the President.
Media Filtered Story: "Today President Obama has fired a shot across the bow of the GOP, demanding time for a speech on major new jobs initiatives. Republican John Boehner has returned fire, and called for a MASSIVE 24-hour delay. Is Speaker Boehner challenging the Constitution itself, and is the President risking his very election on this speech? So far neither Obama nor Boehner will back down, and continue to be fighting a political battle that may change the fate of the entire nation. Who will cave, and who will devour their opponent's still-beating heart? Stay tuned to this thrilling political theater.............BREAKING NEWS: Barack Obama surrenders Presidency to John Boehner. Sasha and Malia to be offered as hostages. Bo Obama to be delivered to Michelle Bachmann, completing her Portuguese Water Dog fur coat."
Media Filtered Story: "Today President Obama has fired a shot across the bow of the GOP, demanding time for a speech on major new jobs initiatives. Republican John Boehner has returned fire, and called for a MASSIVE 24-hour delay. Is Speaker Boehner challenging the Constitution itself, and is the President risking his very election on this speech? So far neither Obama nor Boehner will back down, and continue to be fighting a political battle that may change the fate of the entire nation. Who will cave, and who will devour their opponent's still-beating heart? Stay tuned to this thrilling political theater.............BREAKING NEWS: Barack Obama surrenders Presidency to John Boehner. Sasha and Malia to be offered as hostages. Bo Obama to be delivered to Michelle Bachmann, completing her Portuguese Water Dog fur coat."
AlteredBeast
Fork 'em, Sparky!
Yeah, I rarely swear, but I FUCKING hate the media.
They all need to die in a fire and return to straight reporting of the facts.
That is why 9 times out of 8, PBS and NPR get it right. No sensationalism, no pandering to driving home story after story about one kidnapped white girl, a monkey who can play the banjo, or other inanities of popular news coverage. Just the facts.
Up the hell out of funding for PBS and NPR, then, only allow them on press junkets to the White House, Congress, etc.
I am tired of the game of politics. I am half tempted to run for city council of the small town where I currently live, but just so I can tell everyone to screw off. Then run my reelection campaign on the slogan of "None of the Above"
They all need to die in a fire and return to straight reporting of the facts.
That is why 9 times out of 8, PBS and NPR get it right. No sensationalism, no pandering to driving home story after story about one kidnapped white girl, a monkey who can play the banjo, or other inanities of popular news coverage. Just the facts.
Up the hell out of funding for PBS and NPR, then, only allow them on press junkets to the White House, Congress, etc.
I am tired of the game of politics. I am half tempted to run for city council of the small town where I currently live, but just so I can tell everyone to screw off. Then run my reelection campaign on the slogan of "None of the Above"
Yeah. This scheduling thing is a non-story. Someone fucked up (by either missing the sched conflict or doing it intentionally). They moved it now we can move on. Media wants to make this debt ceiling 2.0 :/
With that said I do like Ezra Kleins idea of giving his speech to an audience of unemployed Americans, rather than congress. Let them ask questions at the end. F congress, they are going to do the same thing in the end whether or not the pres addresses them.
With that said I do like Ezra Kleins idea of giving his speech to an audience of unemployed Americans, rather than congress. Let them ask questions at the end. F congress, they are going to do the same thing in the end whether or not the pres addresses them.
This whole thing has been stupid from end to end. Obama's initial stance, the Republican rejoinder, Obama's modified stance, the media coverage of it all, and people's reaction to it. Just completely fucking brain dead. Manufactured outrage on all sides.
There are plenty of reasons to dislike Obama or the Republicans, and this isn't close to being one of them. I know it's silly season, but really...
There are plenty of reasons to dislike Obama or the Republicans, and this isn't close to being one of them. I know it's silly season, but really...
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Throw in LeBron in the 4th quarter and you got yourself a bumper sticker.Puddles said:
TacticalFox88
Banned
Lebron is titleless though.LovingSteam said:
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
Way to ruin it!!!TacticalFox88 said:
jamesinclair
Banned
Breaking News:
Obama to use September 8 speech to reveal new national flag.
Apparently, the stars and stripes are too violent and divisive.
There will be photo ops
Obama to use September 8 speech to reveal new national flag.
Apparently, the stars and stripes are too violent and divisive.
There will be photo ops
It is truly shocking to see how much PhoenixDark hates the President. He should just donate to Romney or something, maybe it'll help him feel better.
"98/2" - lol. Boehner would have said that no matter what happened to assure his base he has his shit together. It's really easy to say Obama caved on the debt ceiling deal when it's all said and done.
Those in the Congressional GOP leadership say a lot of things, so I think it's funny that all of the sudden liberals are taking Boehner and McConnell at their word after 3 years of nothing but misleading the public. Quite frankly these lies are no different.
If Obama didn't pass anything they would have found a way to shift blame onto him and allow default to occur by throwing their hands up and saying "it's up for the President to sign this, not us." The Tea Party trolled all of Washington.
I can see that the GOP's strategy of demoralizing anyone who isn't a Republican is finally starting to work. No matter what the President puts forward it's not going to pass because the GOP is hellbent on stopping everything that comes their way from Democrats.
Since day one the Republicans have gone far beyond challenging Obama; it's full-on political assault on a scale not seen since the build-up to the Civil War. Go on a demoralizing campaign and it'll eventually take its toll on you. And it has, from the WH all the way down to the everyday voter. What's happening in this country right now is really fucked up, you just don't realize it because it's the norm.
I think if, even 10 years ago, people woke up and could see how Washington works today they'd be absolutely sick to their stomach and in a state of utter shock and disbelief.
"98/2" - lol. Boehner would have said that no matter what happened to assure his base he has his shit together. It's really easy to say Obama caved on the debt ceiling deal when it's all said and done.
Those in the Congressional GOP leadership say a lot of things, so I think it's funny that all of the sudden liberals are taking Boehner and McConnell at their word after 3 years of nothing but misleading the public. Quite frankly these lies are no different.
If Obama didn't pass anything they would have found a way to shift blame onto him and allow default to occur by throwing their hands up and saying "it's up for the President to sign this, not us." The Tea Party trolled all of Washington.
I can see that the GOP's strategy of demoralizing anyone who isn't a Republican is finally starting to work. No matter what the President puts forward it's not going to pass because the GOP is hellbent on stopping everything that comes their way from Democrats.
Since day one the Republicans have gone far beyond challenging Obama; it's full-on political assault on a scale not seen since the build-up to the Civil War. Go on a demoralizing campaign and it'll eventually take its toll on you. And it has, from the WH all the way down to the everyday voter. What's happening in this country right now is really fucked up, you just don't realize it because it's the norm.
I think if, even 10 years ago, people woke up and could see how Washington works today they'd be absolutely sick to their stomach and in a state of utter shock and disbelief.
GREAT article debunking the myth that Jimmy Carter taxed and regulated the economy to death and Reagan unshackled it:
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-carterreagan.htm
Recommended reading for everyone in this thread. I'll be using this in a few debates, I'm sure.
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-carterreagan.htm
Recommended reading for everyone in this thread. I'll be using this in a few debates, I'm sure.
cartoon_soldier
Member
Puddles said:
A few people will get enlightened, majority of Americans still think of Reagan as their big savior
Austin woman gets 30 years for smuggling guns to Mexican gangs.
In Washington? You get a new job.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/opini...peration-fast-and-furious-probe#ixzz1WiGMyRhz
In Washington? You get a new job.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/opini...peration-fast-and-furious-probe#ixzz1WiGMyRhz
500 Michigan bar and restaurant owners to ban state lawmakers from premises.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wT08ka1Nve4
Fucking awesome.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wT08ka1Nve4
Fucking awesome.
worldrunover
Member
Hokuten said:
That's a funny post. But here's my problem: Let's go on the premise that Obama knew there was a debate Wednesday. Let's just go out on a limb and say that someone told him about it. So he purposely chose that date and time, for what reason? If he wanted to stick it to the GOP, then he should stick it to the GOP and stick hard to the date and make Congress oblige. He's the PRESIDENT for Christ's sake. Instead he acquiesced and is made to look like he is either A) disorganized for not knowing about the debate or B) wanting to pick a fight until Boehner slaps him in the mouth, causing him to give in.
I don't see either scenario being particularly flattering.
PhoenixDark
Banned
http://www.hamiltonplacestrategies.com/in-the-news/articles/when-going-negative-isnt-enough/
The only way Obama gets re-elected is if Bachman wins the nomination, or maybe Perry.
worldrunover
Member
GaimeGuy said:
Bullshit. He has people working 24/7 on the optics of everything he does. This wasn't made willy nilly.
Dude Abides
Banned
eznark said:
And not a single fuck will be given about bar owners outraged that their patrons will no longer smell like ashtrays at the end of the night.
- Status