• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

PoliGAF 2014 |OT| Kay Hagan and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad News

Status
Not open for further replies.
Watching Maddow getting rabbid over the VA stuff.

Greatest Healthcare System in the world, right?

The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."

It's been like that since the dawn of our nation. We ask them to fight for us then stiff them when it comes time to pay the medical bills. With how we seem to revere our military you'd think we could do a better job taking care of them.
 

benjipwns

Banned
I like the part in the conclusion where they admit it was a stupid endeavor and were told better ways to do things but studying policy results is a lot harder so fuck that shit wooooo single composite independent variables.
 

benjipwns

Banned
The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."
Look, it's just a few little clerical errors:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ike-a-crime-syndicate-whistleblower-says.html
New whistleblower testimony and internal documents implicate an award-winning VA hospital in Texas in widespread wrongdoing—and what appears to be systemic fraud.

Emails and VA memos obtained exclusively by The Daily Beast provide what is among the most comprehensive accounts yet of how high-level VA hospital employees conspired to game the system. It shows not only how they manipulated hospital wait lists but why—to cover up the weeks and months veterans spent waiting for needed medical care. If those lag times had been revealed, it would have threatened the executives’ bonus pay.

What’s worse, the documents show the wrongdoing going unpunished for years, even after it was repeatedly reported to local and national VA authorities. That indicates a new troubling angle to the VA scandal: that the much touted investigations may be incapable of finding violations that are hiding in plain sight.

“For lack of a better term, you’ve got an organized crime syndicate,” a whistleblower who works in the Texas VA told The Daily Beast. “People up on top are suddenly afraid they may actually be prosecuted and they’re pressuring the little guys down below to cover it all up.”

...

In Cheyenne, Wyoming, Chicago, and Albuquerque, more VA whistleblowers came forward claiming that the same fraudulent scheduling was being used in the hospitals where they worked. At last count, the VA inspector general’s investigation had expanded to 26 separate facilities.

...

“If [VA] directors report low numbers, they’re the outlier. They won’t stay a director very long and they certainly won’t get promoted. No one is getting rewarded for honesty. They pretty much have to lie, if they don’t they won’t go anywhere,” the whistleblower added. Weighted more heavily than other performance measures, the wait time numbers alone “count for 50% of the executive career field bonus, which is a pretty powerful motivator.”

Though VA hospitals may be struggling with increasing patient loads and inadequate resources—including too few medical providers—they are punished for acknowledging those problems. The VA’s current system appears to reward executives’ accounting tricks that mask deep structural issues and impede real solutions.

...

After the warning from Harper and questions about scheduling from several other doctors, including Spann, the final comment in the thread concerns Dr. Vincent. The message reads: “It doesn’t help if you insist on a date that doesn’t meet their 30-day criteria. Vincent just cancels the order. End of story. ”

In other words: it never mattered what was entered to show the “desired date” requested by the patient or the medical provider treating them. Despite Harper’s protestations, if the entry didn’t help meet the VA’s performance objectives it never made it into the system.

Nevertheless, the VA recently cleared Vincent of wrongdoing and, while acknowledging scheduling malpractice, blamed it on mistakes made by lower-level clerks.

On the ultrasound request form, Dr. Vincent writes that he canceled the order because it was “entered in error.” But that would have come as news to the medical provider who actually interacted with the veteran and entered the date based on their evaluation of the patient’s needs. The real reason for canceling it, according to both Dr. Spann and the whistleblower who spoke with The Daily Beast, was to meet the VA’s performance objectives—whatever the cost.

Meeting the performance objectives, which made executives eligible for bonuses and put them in line for promotions, became the overriding imperative among VA executives, according to both Spann and the whistleblower.

The VA’s 2012 performance plan, provided to The Daily Beast by the whistleblower, contains five critical elements to evaluate success, each one containing multiple sub-criteria. But critical element No. 5, the “Results Driven” component that contains the “wait time” criteria, is worth 50% of the overall score. That’s as much as all the other elements combined.

And scoring high on the performance measures is of paramount consideration in a VA hospital. “This is what your bosses, the executives, are being evaluated for,” the whistleblower said. “So if you work for them you must support this because that’s how they’re prioritizing their evaluation of your job.”

The VA’s performance measures were originally established to provide uniform criteria for evaluating employees. The idea was to use the grading system to reward those who met the standard with bonuses and identify those who were lagging behind. But over time, VA executives realized that the wait time numbers they reported were almost more important than anything else—including the actual care they provided veterans—in how they were judged by the VA’s leadership. At that point the measures became a perverse incentive, encouraging VA facilities across the country to hide problems by cheating their numbers. Eventually, cooking the books became an alarmingly regular procedure—a standard that might have remained if it hadn’t been exposed in Phoenix and unraveled over the past month.

Best part:
The inspector general’s report from January 2012 stated that, according to the hospital’s own staff, “appointments were routinely made incorrectly by using the next available appointment date instead of the patient’s desired date.” The improper scheduling “led to inaccurate reporting of GI [gastro-intestinal] clinic wait times,” the report concluded. But the IG stopped there, blaming the practice on lower-level scheduler error—and ignoring evidence that shows the fraudulent scheduling practices were pervasive and consciously directed by higher-level executives.

“Every doctor, nurse, and clerk in the hospital knows it’s true, but the VA’s investigative team wasn’t able to find any evidence,” the clinician said. “They didn’t interview any of us or really try to find out what was going on. This was reported in 2011 and it’s still not fixed today.”

The Central Texas management parroted the inspector general’s findings when the hospital applied for a “Robert W. Carey Performance Excellence Award.” According to the clinician, in the hospitals award application they actually listed as an accomplishment that they had found “front line staff” incorrectly using desired dates in the scheduling process and fixed the problem. It must have been convincing. Despite the OIG investigation, the hospital won the award.
 

kehs

Banned
The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."

The VA system is still influenced by the rest of the shitty healthcare system. I can appreciate the fact of the influx will make things worse, but t the same time, it's really shitty that the government can plan to send thousands of soldiers to war, but not give a fuck about their well being.

Irregardless, if they can't plan for it, there should be a defacto healthcare system to take care of it and pick up the slack.
 

Chumly

Member
The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."

I've seen a few half assed articles trying to push the blame away from funding but the fact is that we just had two wars that lasted a long time. We have a significant influx of new VA patients from that in addition to the Vietnam population hitting 65+ and needing a lot of medical attention. Keeping the status quo for funding isn't going to do jack shit and unfortunately the budget needs significant increases in ADDITION to reforms. Maybe republicans should have thought about that before being so eager for war.
 

Aaron

Member
It's been like that since the dawn of our nation. We ask them to fight for us then stiff them when it comes time to pay the medical bills. With how we seem to revere our military you'd think we could do a better job taking care of them.
Daily Show had a good bit on this. The US has been stiffing veterans since before the Civil War.
 
The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."

No, they won't have to face that fact. Maybe that's how the world used to work. Maybe that's how the world should work. I don't know. But I know exactly how the conversation would happen, were this debate to take place.

Person A: "Democrats/Obama are screwing over our veterans."
Person B: "But Republicans are the ones who voted no for funding."

Then you'll get one of three responses from Person A.
-"Then both parties suck. Throw them both out. Tea Party 2016."
-"It doesn't matter who started it, Obama said he'd finish it and he's lied to the American People again."
-"How surprising! Democrats blaming another issue on Republicans. Bush's term ended 6 years ago! When will Obama start accepting blame for the country he ruined!"

It's their favorite kind of argument on the right. The ideal scenario. Both sides are in the wrong. Their side may be more responsible. But the moment you try to explain this nuance to the people, it's time to move on to the next topic. Benghazi!
 

Chichikov

Member
Irregardless isn't an actual word fyi.
Of course it's a word, what else would it be?
Many people consider it nonstandard or even vulgar, but that's about it.

p.s.
It's been used since at least the 18th century, I blame Jethro Tull and his seed drill, stupid technology rotting kids' minds.
His music was also terrible.
Ambassador Stevens never even got a chance to be denied care through a phony wait list by the VA.
I like you.
I think you're crazy and I often want to punch your posts in the throat, but I like you.
 
I've seen a few half assed articles trying to push the blame away from funding but the fact is that we just had two wars that lasted a long time. We have a significant influx of new VA patients from that in addition to the Vietnam population hitting 65+ and needing a lot of medical attention. Keeping the status quo for funding isn't going to do jack shit and unfortunately the budget needs significant increases in ADDITION to reforms. Maybe republicans should have thought about that before being so eager for war.
Like they give a shit.
 
benjipwns said:
Best part:
The inspector general’s report from January 2012 stated that, according to the hospital’s own staff, “appointments were routinely made incorrectly by using the next available appointment date instead of the patient’s desired date.” The improper scheduling “led to inaccurate reporting of GI [gastro-intestinal] clinic wait times,” the report concluded.

I think "next available" should be the right time for a health care appointment. Are the VA hospitals having it held against them that a later date was scheduled by the patient ?
 

benjipwns

Banned
I think "next available" should be the right time for a health care appointment. Are the VA hospitals having it held against them that a later date was scheduled by the patient ?
No, what they were doing is putting patients on secret wait lists until an appointment could be scheduled within 14 days (or whatever benchmark, Arizona's was 14 days), then scheduling the patient and reporting only that appointment as the one requested by the patient.

So say June 1st I request an appointment, they put me on a wait list that's not officially recorded and later destroyed. Then say June 16th they have an opening for June 30th. On June 16th they record me as requesting an appointment and schedule it, thus meeting the benchmark, when in reality I waited the entire month.
 
The VA stuff is kinda weird. Clearly there is a scandal about people fudging the numbers to make their wait times look smaller. But on the other hand, they are just overloaded with work. And if this "gift from god" scandal (as Ben Carson called it) is pursued by the GOP, they'll have to face the fact that they voted "No" for increase VA funding.

Just face it . . . governments Dem & GOP try to give the VA as little as they can. Or as the veterans like to joke "Nothing is good enough for our veterans."

But funding isn't the issue, it's been steadily raised for years. It's a systematic issue, from the way they file claims to staff sizes. Allowing vets to go to private hospitals is a good temporary decision, but the goal should be fixing the VA in nearly every way. If there was ever something that needed reform, it's this. And I continue to disagree with people who claim the GOP wouldn't support such measures. They have no accomplishments to run on, who wouldn't want to be able to say they began the process of fixing the VA/giving vets the care they need/talking points blah blah blah.

This isn't about handing them more money; that alone ensures some GOP support. It reminds me of The Wire where the mayor was advised to ignore the school system since "if you try to fix it, you must have broken it." Nobody wants that responsibility so the VA remains shit for decades.

The baffling thing is that Obama can't get anything accomplished yet there are multiple domestic things he could tackle, either with GOP (the VA) help or unilaterally to address issues (the bloated government contract issue, specially in relation to IT), yet nothing is done.
 

AndyD

aka andydumi
But funding isn't the issue, it's been steadily raised for years. It's a systematic issue, from the way they file claims to staff sizes. Allowing vets to go to private hospitals is a good temporary decision, but the goal should be fixing the VA in nearly every way. If there was ever something that needed reform, it's this. And I continue to disagree with people who claim the GOP wouldn't support such measures. They have no accomplishments to run on, who wouldn't want to be able to say they began the process of fixing the VA/giving vets the care they need/talking points blah blah blah.

This isn't about handing them more money; that alone ensures some GOP support. It reminds me of The Wire where the mayor was advised to ignore the school system since "if you try to fix it, you must have broken it." Nobody wants that responsibility so the VA remains shit for decades.

The baffling thing is that Obama can't get anything accomplished yet there are multiple domestic things he could tackle, either with GOP (the VA) help or unilaterally to address issues (the bloated government contract issue, specially in relation to IT), yet nothing is done.

Although funding has steadily increased, the impression I get from reading is that it has not increased sufficiently to increase staff to cope with the huge influx of veterans. So they cut some staff positions altogether, have trouble retaining existing staff (not always competitive pay) and have a difficult time recruiting new staff. Much like most government programs that get slowly starved for money, they fall behind compared to similar private institutions. And a huge influx of veterans in the past decade does not help a bit.
 
Although funding has steadily increased, the impression I get from reading is that it has not increased sufficiently to increase staff to cope with the huge influx of veterans. So they cut some staff positions altogether, have trouble retaining existing staff (not always competitive pay) and have a difficult time recruiting new staff. Much like most government programs that get slowly starved for money, they fall behind compared to similar private institutions. And a huge influx of veterans in the past decade does not help a bit.

I'd love to see an audit to see how they're spending money. Given the war funding increase between Bush and Obama they should have enough. I hate to sound like a conservative here but a lot of government money is wasted due to inefficient shit, like many private hospitals to be fair.

Basically lurches from scandal to scandal, politicians promise to fix things, the issue is patched up, and the next administration has a scandal blow up; remember Walter Reed in 2007?
 

zargle

Member
Although funding has steadily increased, the impression I get from reading is that it has not increased sufficiently to increase staff to cope with the huge influx of veterans. So they cut some staff positions altogether, have trouble retaining existing staff (not always competitive pay) and have a difficult time recruiting new staff. Much like most government programs that get slowly starved for money, they fall behind compared to similar private institutions. And a huge influx of veterans in the past decade does not help a bit.

I thought Chris Hayes had a decent take on it, using a public school analogy pretty much from the Wire, where a school that adequately serves its neighborhood will suffer if a couple of high-rise apartment buildings are built in the area and its resources and institutional capacity are not able to match the influx of students and the need. So VA patient visits rise 50% while physician hires goes up 9% and the needs cant be met as fast as we need to, for whatever reason.

Anecdotally, a friend of mine just graduated from medical school and she was talking about the various rotations she had to do and she said that her 2 months at a VA hospital were by far her worst and most stressful. It was just nonstop stress and overwork and just a horrible experience for everyone involved.
 

kehs

Banned
You know they the current congress is opposed to doing anything that has to do with stimulus or spending?

It's because the ARRA was so tightly tracked and monitored, they're rather just not do anything at all.
 
New whistleblower testimony and internal documents implicate an award-winning VA hospital in Texas in widespread wrongdoing—and what appears to be systemic fraud.

Emails and VA memos obtained exclusively by The Daily Beast provide what is among the most comprehensive accounts yet of how high-level VA hospital employees conspired to game the system. It shows not only how they manipulated hospital wait lists but why—to cover up the weeks and months veterans spent waiting for needed medical care. If those lag times had been revealed, it would have threatened the executives’ bonus pay.

What’s worse, the documents show the wrongdoing going unpunished for years, even after it was repeatedly reported to local and national VA authorities. That indicates a new troubling angle to the VA scandal: that the much touted investigations may be incapable of finding violations that are hiding in plain sight.

“For lack of a better term, you’ve got an organized crime syndicate,” a whistleblower who works in the Texas VA told The Daily Beast. “People up on top are suddenly afraid they may actually be prosecuted and they’re pressuring the little guys down below to cover it all up.”

...

In Cheyenne, Wyoming, Chicago, and Albuquerque, more VA whistleblowers came forward claiming that the same fraudulent scheduling was being used in the hospitals where they worked. At last count, the VA inspector general’s investigation had expanded to 26 separate facilities.

...

“If [VA] directors report low numbers, they’re the outlier. They won’t stay a director very long and they certainly won’t get promoted. No one is getting rewarded for honesty. They pretty much have to lie, if they don’t they won’t go anywhere,” the whistleblower added. Weighted more heavily than other performance measures, the wait time numbers alone “count for 50% of the executive career field bonus, which is a pretty powerful motivator.”

Though VA hospitals may be struggling with increasing patient loads and inadequate resources—including too few medical providers—they are punished for acknowledging those problems. The VA’s current system appears to reward executives’ accounting tricks that mask deep structural issues and impede real solutions.


...

After the warning from Harper and questions about scheduling from several other doctors, including Spann, the final comment in the thread concerns Dr. Vincent. The message reads: “It doesn’t help if you insist on a date that doesn’t meet their 30-day criteria. Vincent just cancels the order. End of story. ”

In other words: it never mattered what was entered to show the “desired date” requested by the patient or the medical provider treating them. Despite Harper’s protestations, if the entry didn’t help meet the VA’s performance objectives it never made it into the system.

Nevertheless, the VA recently cleared Vincent of wrongdoing and, while acknowledging scheduling malpractice, blamed it on mistakes made by lower-level clerks.

On the ultrasound request form, Dr. Vincent writes that he canceled the order because it was “entered in error.” But that would have come as news to the medical provider who actually interacted with the veteran and entered the date based on their evaluation of the patient’s needs. The real reason for canceling it, according to both Dr. Spann and the whistleblower who spoke with The Daily Beast, was to meet the VA’s performance objectives—whatever the cost.

Meeting the performance objectives, which made executives eligible for bonuses and put them in line for promotions, became the overriding imperative among VA executives, according to both Spann and the whistleblower.


The VA’s 2012 performance plan, provided to The Daily Beast by the whistleblower, contains five critical elements to evaluate success, each one containing multiple sub-criteria. But critical element No. 5, the “Results Driven” component that contains the “wait time” criteria, is worth 50% of the overall score. That’s as much as all the other elements combined.

And scoring high on the performance measures is of paramount consideration in a VA hospital. “This is what your bosses, the executives, are being evaluated for,” the whistleblower said. “So if you work for them you must support this because that’s how they’re prioritizing their evaluation of your job.”

The VA’s performance measures were originally established to provide uniform criteria for evaluating employees. The idea was to use the grading system to reward those who met the standard with bonuses and identify those who were lagging behind. But over time, VA executives realized that the wait time numbers they reported were almost more important than anything else—including the actual care they provided veterans—in how they were judged by the VA’s leadership. At that point the measures became a perverse incentive, encouraging VA facilities across the country to hide problems by cheating their numbers. Eventually, cooking the books became an alarmingly regular procedure—a standard that might have remained if it hadn’t been exposed in Phoenix and unraveled over the past month.

The inspector general’s report from January 2012 stated that, according to the hospital’s own staff, “appointments were routinely made incorrectly by using the next available appointment date instead of the patient’s desired date.” The improper scheduling “led to inaccurate reporting of GI [gastro-intestinal] clinic wait times,” the report concluded. But the IG stopped there, blaming the practice on lower-level scheduler error—and ignoring evidence that shows the fraudulent scheduling practices were pervasive and consciously directed by higher-level executives.

“Every doctor, nurse, and clerk in the hospital knows it’s true, but the VA’s investigative team wasn’t able to find any evidence,” the clinician said. “They didn’t interview any of us or really try to find out what was going on. This was reported in 2011 and it’s still not fixed today.”

The Central Texas management parroted the inspector general’s findings when the hospital applied for a “Robert W. Carey Performance Excellence Award.” According to the clinician, in the hospitals award application they actually listed as an accomplishment that they had found “front line staff” incorrectly using desired dates in the scheduling process and fixed the problem. It must have been convincing. Despite the OIG investigation, the hospital won the award
.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ike-a-crime-syndicate-whistleblower-says.html

Disgusting, systematic problems over the course of years, including another faux IG report in 2012 that didn't change anything.

BTW these greedy executives should destroy the idea that privatization is the only/best solution, but of course some republicans will never let that talking point go.
 

Wilsongt

Member

benjipwns

Banned
No, what they were doing is putting patients on secret wait lists until an appointment could be scheduled within 14 days (or whatever benchmark, Arizona's was 14 days), then scheduling the patient and reporting only that appointment as the one requested by the patient.

So say June 1st I request an appointment, they put me on a wait list that's not officially recorded and later destroyed. Then say June 16th they have an opening for June 30th. On June 16th they record me as requesting an appointment and schedule it, thus meeting the benchmark, when in reality I waited the entire month.
Realized I should add to this that, say there's an appointment available June 21st when I first request, they wouldn't schedule me for it because it's outside the benchmark, and once it falls within it it's probably going to be earmarked for someone they wait listed two weeks earlier than me.
 
badnewsforsomeone_zps3576374d.png


This, I'm sure, is bad news for someone

Interestingly the Republicans aren't doing much better than they were during the shutdown, so hopefully Democrats can start rebuilding their amazing lead they had over the summer.
 
badnewsforsomeone_zps3576374d.png


This, I'm sure, is bad news for someone

Interestingly the Republicans aren't doing much better than they were during the shutdown, so hopefully Democrats can start rebuilding their amazing lead they had over the summer.
Eek. Wonder why the democrats hit the steep curve near the ceiling.
 

Wilsongt

Member
The party of inclusiveness.

Texas GOP Blocks Gay Conservatives From Having Booth At State Convention

The Texas Republican Party denied requests from the Log Cabin Republicans, a group representing gay conservatives, to host a booth at its annual convention next week.

Jeffrey Davis, chairman of the Log Cabin Republicans of Texas, said Thursday in a written statement that the Texas GOP denied the group's "several attempts" to apply for a booth, "citing archaic language in the party platform" as justification.

"We deserve to occupy a booth just like anyone else, and it’s time that the Texas GOP’s hypocritical policies and procedures are replaced by new ones that match the general opinion of Texan Republican voters," he said.

Gregory T. Angelo, the Log Cabin Republicans' national executive director, added that the group's beef with the Texas GOP goes beyond the party's anti-gay marriage platform.

"This isn’t about disagreements we may have on civil marriage; this isn’t about the party platform — this is about an anti-gay wing of the party that hates gay people so much they can’t even stand to see us acknowledged as a necessary part of a winning Republican coalition," he said, adding that in an election year, the state party's failure to be inclusive could contribute to turning Texas blue.


Steve Munisteri, chairman of the Texas Republican Party, confirmed to TPM that the group's application was denied because of its stance on gay marriage. He explained that the Texas GOP has a formal policy against allowing groups that advocate positions contrary its platform to have booths at conventions.

The booth was denied not because they were gay Republicans," he said in a phone interview. "The booth was denied because of the association with the promotion for gay marriage, which is not supported in the current party platform."

Lesson learned here today: If you want to promote equality, don't vote Republican.
 
From everything I've read about Ben Franklin, I imagine he'd be like Onion Biden if he was ever elected to public office. Only with more French hookers.

He'd probably be better than Biden because he'd be spending his time conducting cool, wacky scientific experiments and coming up with cool shit.
 

Mike M

Nick N
I don't understand Log Cabin Republicans at all. I mean sure, cue that scene from The Newsroom where Santorum's gay black policy advisor goes off on Jeff Daniels about how he is not defined by his race or sexuality, but I just can't put my mind in the headspace where I would value all other aspects of the Republican platform over the fact that if they had their way they would criminalize my existence.
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
I don't understand Log Cabin Republicans at all. I mean sure, cue that scene from The Newsroom where Santorum's gay black policy advisor goes off on Jeff Daniels about how he is not defined by his race or sexuality, but I just can't put my mind in the headspace where I would value all other aspects of the Republican platform over the fact that if they had their way they would criminalize my existence.

I don't really get it either but I assume it has something to do with trying to change the establishment from the inside. Well, that or they believe that the rest of the platform is so much more important to the country as a whole that it needs to be implemented regardless of personal well being.
 

Tamanon

Banned
I don't understand Log Cabin Republicans at all. I mean sure, cue that scene from The Newsroom where Santorum's gay black policy advisor goes off on Jeff Daniels about how he is not defined by his race or sexuality, but I just can't put my mind in the headspace where I would value all other aspects of the Republican platform over the fact that if they had their way they would criminalize my existence.

It all depends on priorities really. Maybe some of them see short-term suffering to ensure a better future.
 

Wilsongt

Member
I don't really get it either but I assume it has something to do with trying to change the establishment from the inside. Well, that or they believe that the rest of the platform is so much more important to the country as a whole that it needs to be implemented regardless of personal well being.

Comes off ad classic Stockholm syndrome, honestly.

Now imagine being a black, lesbian, Republican. Yikes.
 
I don't understand Log Cabin Republicans at all. I mean sure, cue that scene from The Newsroom where Santorum's gay black policy advisor goes off on Jeff Daniels about how he is not defined by his race or sexuality, but I just can't put my mind in the headspace where I would value all other aspects of the Republican platform over the fact that if they had their way they would criminalize my existence.

Yeah, it is kinda hard not to go for the "a Jew in Hitler's army" analogy. What is it that keeps them in GOP? Huge greed for tax cuts? Self-loathing? Religion?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom