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PoliGAF 2016 |OT8| No, Donald. You don't.

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M

Makai

Member
People like you guys don't care about their top issues like blocking TPP. How better to get you to pay attention than to hijack the DNC on live TV?
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
i-am-not-a-member-of-any-organized-political-party-i-am-a-democrat-will-rogers.jpg
 
T

teiresias

Member
Bernie supporters at the convention are so insufferable I'm mentally making them all look exactly like Augustin from Looking in my head.
 
B

Boke1879

Member
Makai said:
People like you guys don't care about their top issues like blocking TPP. How better to get you to pay attention than to hijack the DNC on live TV?
Click to expand...

Well, them booking Rep. Cummings when he's talking about Civil Rights doesn't make me want to listen to anything these people have to say. I'm cool with them protesting, But if they are going to boo every speaker. They aren't even doing themselves any favors.
 
B

Boke1879

Member
Makai said:
So you reject the premise that a protest is meant to give issues exposure, not change persuade people?
Click to expand...

What issue? No one even really knows what these people are protesting about. It'll just be broadly painted that they are protesting Sanders didn't get the nomination. Which just comes off as petty and childish.
 
R

royalan

Member
Suikoguy said:
If he can't keep his insane supporters in line now... I think you need to take a break and go catch Pokemon or something ;)



Fair enough, my underlying point is Sanders is probably most to blame for the current situation. Several of us have had this concern since he went negative, and were told that things got more ugly in the 2008 primary. People failed to realize the type of negative matters. His line of negative attacks went at the legitimacy of the election.

You said it was "how the DNC was run during the election".
Sanders was by far the primary creator of that perception, not the DNC.
The list of reasons you came up with, were not even the primary reasons brought up by the Sanders campaign.
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CAN YOU SAY THE BOLDED AGAIN.
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
I'm sad that Trump never said "You little fuck, I got money stacks bigger than you." to Rubio.

What a missed opportunity.

Georgia poll:

Trump: 46
Hillary: 44

.... Okay.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
I mentioned this in chat, but it's not even up in the air. The people that are booing and chanting are far louder when a person of color or a woman is speaking.

I'm not sure what that means or what that says about these idiots who do not represent liberals, progressives or even Bernie's ideas.
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
adam387 said:
I mentioned this in chat, but it's not even up in the air. The people that are booing and chanting are far louder when a person of color or a woman is speaking.

I'm not sure what that means or what that says about these idiots who do not represent liberals, progressives or even Bernie's ideas.
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Let me quote a Bernie or Buster I live with.

"Fuck the blacks. They don't decide this election."
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Kristoffer said:
Let me quote a Bernie or Buster I live with.

"Fuck the blacks. They don't decide this election."
Click to expand...

LITERALLY INACCURATE

Also, I mentioned this in chat, but the only thing I blame Bernie for here is really bad delegate selection. Just total fuckup if he knew he would eventually need to concede to not choose delegates with loyalties to him personally and not to THE MOVEMENT.
 
T

TheFatOne

Member
Just like I thought Cenk is fucking delusional. If you concede anything to these guys they will point out something else,and then you are in this game that whatever concession you give is not good enough.
 
N

NYCmetsfan

Banned
pigeon said:
LITERALLY INACCURATE

Also, I mentioned this in chat, but the only thing I blame Bernie for here is really bad delegate selection. Just total fuckup if he knew he would eventually need to concede to not choose delegates with loyalties to him personally and not to THE MOVEMENT.
Click to expand...

yup
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
pigeon said:
LITERALLY INACCURATE
Click to expand...
My dad is not quantitatively inclined or evidence seeking. I show him the demographics of this election, I show him how barrack lost 58% of the white vote, I show him how there are more minorities now and they've coalesced even moreso around Hillary, and he still doesn't care. He's white so he feels left behind by the special interest groups.
 
F

Fox318

Member
Suikoguy said:
Fair enough, my underlying point is Sanders is probably most to blame for the current situation. Several of us have had this concern since he went negative, and were told that things got more ugly in the 2008 primary. People failed to realize the type of negative matters. His line of negative attacks went at the legitimacy of the election.

You said it was "how the DNC was run during the election".
Sanders was by far the primary creator of that perception, not the DNC.
The list of reasons you came up with, were not even the primary reasons brought up by the Sanders campaign.
Click to expand...

I just think blame can be spread around.

Brenie probably should have backed Hillary sooner
My memory might be fuzzy but I seem to remember the attacks on obama being WAY worse than anything Bernie did so I think thats a little overstated.
And Hillary + Obama should have told DBS to pack her bags after 2014 campaign or the second the emails were leaked out. Optics of that controlled the narrative for the people going nuts right now.

I just belive that Bernie doesn't get the support and platform of a farther left vote if it wasn't down to 2 canidates.

If Bernie doesn't run Hillary clinches the nom in Iowa and I don't think thats healthy for a party to drum up support and get people registered.

Crocodile said:
A) The lack of candidates had nothing to do with the DNC. Most people decided they didn't feel like running what would be a losing campaign. Clinton was more qualified than she was 8 years ago and her campaign staff was better than it was 8 years ago.

B) The Democratic debates were never going to catch headlines like the Republican debates because at no points were there going to be 17 candidates and the shit-flinging was never going to get so bad. It's one thing to argue there should have been more debates or at different times but there is nothing to suggest they would have made a lick of difference.

C) Are you arguing its the DNC's fault they got hacked and that they deserved it? I'm not sure I follow.

D) There's a difference between differing ideas and petulant children who don't seem to get how politics work or even understand how half the systems they are complaining about work (free trade, banks, etc.). Again we are talking about the fringe.It's not much different than the far-right complaining about Mexicans and Muslims - they just want an easy target for their hate, they don't want to understand the actual source of their woes.

E) You've brought up same-sex marriage more than once. Why? That isn't an idea that Sanders supporters brought with them. That's something Democrats have been working on for a while. Sorry that politicians that have been at this for decades had to navigate an anti-SS marriage electorate a few decades ago?



Holy fucking shit enough of this nonsense. Is this like "diabolising" to the 10th degree? Yes let's give it to the man who has never been seriously vetted, ran an inferior campaign, has a myopic campaign message, has less experience building coalitions, can't answer FP questions worth a damn most of the time, etc.
Click to expand...

A) I think the lack of candidates was the main cause to Bernie's rise. You don't go into an open primary with only 1 option. Obama would have never ran in 2016 and thats a shame.
B) They left a void in a space that was filled by the plethora of Trump debates. Democrats let the GOP control the narrative of politics for a full year.
C) The leaked emails either confirmed superstitions on how the DNC was favoring a certain candidate or lead people to belive that. The President and the Clinton Campaign not getting the resignation for a postilion that most people couldn't name if it was a trivial pursuit question was dumb
D) I'm with you with many of the people acting like children I just feel like the DNC and others sat on their hands and prayed that everyone would forget about the email scandle. DWS should have resigned or gone on public tv to admonish the comments in the strongest possible language then follow it up with her resignation. Instead she wanted to slam a hammer.
E) I bring up same sex marriage because an issue like that was viewed as too extremist for the democratic party to adopt and only changed recently. I want people who question issues like that as part of my party and questioning whether or not something is right or wrong. Society moves forward and I have no idea what will be the next social change we lean towards but I want to hear the ideas in the party.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Nice to see Charles Rangel going away. Don't know much about Adriano Espaillat but he can't be any worse.
 
G

gcubed

Member
Fox318 said:
I just think blame can be spread around.

Brenie probably should have backed Hillary sooner
My memory might be fuzzy but I seem to remember the attacks on obama being WAY worse than anything Bernie did so I think thats a little overstated.
And Hillary + Obama should have told DBS to pack her bags after 2014 campaign or the second the emails were leaked out. Optics of that controlled the narrative for the people going nuts right now.

I just belive that Bernie doesn't get the support and platform of a farther left vote if it wasn't down to 2 canidates.

If Bernie doesn't run Hillary clinches the nom in Iowa and I don't think thats healthy for a party to drum up support and get people registered.



A) I think the lack of candidates was the main cause to Bernie's rise. You don't go into an open primary with only 1 option. Obama would have never ran in 2016 and thats a shame.
B) They left a void in a space that was filled by the plethora of Trump debates. Democrats let the GOP control the narrative of politics for a full year.
C) The leaked emails either confirmed superstitions on how the DNC was favoring a certain candidate or lead people to belive that. The President and the Clinton Campaign not getting the resignation for a postilion that most people couldn't name if it was a trivial pursuit question was dumb
D) I'm with you with many of the people acting like children I just feel like the DNC and others sat on their hands and prayed that everyone would forget about the email scandle. DWS should have resigned or gone on public tv to admonish the comments in the strongest possible language then follow it up with her resignation. Instead she wanted to slam a hammer.
E) I bring up same sex marriage because an issue like that was viewed as too extremist for the democratic party to adopt and only changed recently. I want people who question issues like that as part of my party and questioning whether or not something is right or wrong. Society moves forward and I have no idea what will be the next social change we lean towards but I want to hear the ideas in the party.
Click to expand...

the cult got their candidate last time, so it wasn't an issue. Its an issue when the cult doesn't get what it wants.
 
T

TheFatOne

Member
Fox318 said:
I just think blame can be spread around.

Brenie probably should have backed Hillary sooner
My memory might be fuzzy but I seem to remember the attacks on obama being WAY worse than anything Bernie did so I think thats a little overstated.
And Hillary + Obama should have told DBS to pack her bags after 2014 campaign or the second the emails were leaked out. Optics of that controlled the narrative for the people going nuts right now.

I just belive that Bernie doesn't get the support and platform of a farther left vote if it wasn't down to 2 canidates.

If Bernie doesn't run Hillary clinches the nom in Iowa and I don't think thats healthy for a party to drum up support and get people registered.


A) I think the lack of candidates was the main cause to Bernie's rise. You don't go into an open primary with only 1 option. Obama would have never ran in 2016 and thats a shame.
B) They left a void in a space that was filled by the plethora of Trump debates. Democrats let the GOP control the narrative of politics for a full year.
C) The leaked emails either confirmed superstitions on how the DNC was favoring a certain candidate or lead people to belive that. The President and the Clinton Campaign not getting the resignation for a postilion that most people couldn't name if it was a trivial pursuit question was dumb
D) I'm with you with many of the people acting like children I just feel like the DNC and others sat on their hands and prayed that everyone would forget about the email scandle. DWS should have resigned or gone on public tv to admonish the comments in the strongest possible language then follow it up with her resignation. Instead she wanted to slam a hammer.
E) I bring up same sex marriage because an issue like that was viewed as too extremist for the democratic party to adopt and only changed recently. I want people who question issues like that as part of my party and questioning whether or not something is right or wrong. Society moves forward and I have no idea what will be the next social change we lean towards but I want to hear the ideas in the party.
Click to expand...

Although you can spread the blame around 90% of it is on Sanders. The optics of the DWS is just an excuse. These guys have planned this for a month plus now. Don't buy into the optics of the DWS/Emails bullshit. They planned this and have been vocal about doing this for a while now. Bernie Sanders has been talking about taking the fight to the floor for a long ass fucking time. This is a direct result of that. He talked about how the system is rigged, how he wont stop, and how important it was to take the fight to the floor. Yes Clinton deserves some blame, yes DWS deserves blame, but the vast majority of the blame is on Sanders and his camp. Weaver and Devine went unchecked the entire fucking campaign and kept spouting heinous bullshit. When your top leaders are spouting bullshit like they were your supporter are going to follow. Sanders, Weaver, Devine, and the rest of his camp shoulder the burner of responsibility for this.
 
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