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PoliGAF Interim Thread of cunning stunts and desperate punts

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C

Cloudy

Banned
LMAO, so this is what Obama was talking about:

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=7CBB865D-18FE-70B2-A80ACC7D03A8F14D

To The Editor:

Yesterday, Senator John McCain released a television commercial attacking Barack Obama for allegedly receiving advice on the economy from former Fannie Mae CEO Franklin Raines. From the stump, he has recently tried tying Senator Obama to Fannie Mae, as if there is some guilt in the association with Fannie Mae's former executives.

It is an interesting card for Senator McCain to play, given that his campaign manager, Rick Davis, was paid by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac several hundred thousand dollars early in this decade to head up an organization to lobby in their behalf called The Homeownership Alliance. ...

I worked in government relations for Fannie Mae for more than 20 years, leading the group for most of those years. When I see photographs of Sen. McCain's staff, it looks to me like the team of lobbyists who used to report to me. Senator McCain's attack on Senator Obama is a cheap shot, and hypocritical.

Sincerely,

William Maloni
Fannie Mae Senior Vice President for Government and Industry Relations (1983-2004)
Click to expand...

McShame steps in it again :lol
 
B

Barrett2

Member
Wow at that Fannie Mae exec letter. But at this point, its safe to say the truth is the farthest thing from McShame's mind. Right now he has bigger fish to fry, like making sure Palin doesn't have another 'fungible molecule oil' moment during the veep debates!
 
F

Freedom = $1.05

Banned
lawblob said:
Wow at that Fannie Mae exec letter. But at this point, its safe to say the truth is the farthest thing from McShame's mind. Right now he has bigger fish to fry, like making sure Palin doesn't have another 'fungible molecule oil' moment during the veep debates!
Click to expand...

I hadn't seen the "fungible molecule" flubb till now. I've had pc's putter out in a more coherent fashion that that. Wow.
 
T

TDG

Banned
Stoney Mason said:
There is a lot of truth in what you say but personally I do find political debates to be a useful gauge of their stated policies and ideologies at conflict.
Click to expand...
Not really in American political debates, since the formats don't allow for back-and-forth.

For example, I would love to watch Obama and McCain argue for 5 minutes about the pros and cons of their tax plans. Sadly, it'll turn out like this:
MODERATOR: Sen. McCain, you have two minutes.
MCCAIN: *spends two minutes reciting talking points, and misrepresenting Obama's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Sen. Obama, you have 90 seconds to respond.
OBAMA: *spends 30 seconds rebutting McCain's claims, spends 60 seconds reciting talking points and slamming McCain's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Okay, let's move on to this question about Patriotism...
 
D

Deku

Banned
TDG said:
Not really in American political debates, since the formats don't allow for back-and-forth.

For example, I would love to watch Obama and McCain argue for 5 minutes about the pros and cons of their tax plans. Sadly, it'll turn out like this:
MODERATOR: Sen. McCain, you have two minutes.
MCCAIN: *spends two minutes reciting talking points, and misrepresenting Obama's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Sen. Obama, you have 90 seconds to respond.
OBAMA: *spends 30 seconds rebutting McCain's claims, spends 60 seconds reciting talking points and slamming McCain's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Okay, let's move on to this question about Patriotism...
Click to expand...

Didn't they change the format this time?
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
mclem said:
That PPP NC poll teased earlier is out:

Obama: 46%
McCain: 46%
Barr: 5%
Tied
Click to expand...
First time someone has had it tied. Polling in the state has been all over the place, with Research 2000 and SUSA showing huge leads for McCain, and everyone else showing it closer.
Deku said:
Didn't they change the format this time?
Click to expand...
Yes.

Now the candidates will be asked a question, each will give an answer of two minutes or less, and then they will mix it up for five additional minutes before moving on to the next question in the same format.
Click to expand...
From the NYT article.
 
C

capslock

Is jealous of Matlock's emoticon
Alright, I've been thinking about this as a Muslim, can't Barry just go on national TV in the middle of Ramadan (now when you're supposed to be fasting from sunup to sundown) and eat a BLT and wash it down with a beer, and finally prove that he's not Muslim?

:lol
 
M

Mumei

Member
TDG said:
Not really in American political debates, since the formats don't allow for back-and-forth.

For example, I would love to watch Obama and McCain argue for 5 minutes about the pros and cons of their tax plans. Sadly, it'll turn out like this:
MODERATOR: Sen. McCain, you have two minutes.
MCCAIN: *spends two minutes reciting talking points, and misrepresenting Obama's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Sen. Obama, you have 90 seconds to respond.
OBAMA: *spends 30 seconds rebutting McCain's claims, spends 60 seconds reciting talking points and slamming McCain's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Okay, let's move on to this question about Patriotism...
Click to expand...

From the NYT article on the debates posted a few pages back:

The Obama and McCain campaigns have agreed to an unusual free-flowing format for the three televised presidential debates, which begin on Friday, but the McCain camp fought for and won a much more structured approach for the questioning at the vice-presidential debate, advisers to both campaigns said Saturday.

...

Now the candidates will be asked a question, each will give an answer of two minutes or less, and then they will mix it up for five additional minutes before moving on to the next question in the same format.
Click to expand...
 
W

wonderkins

Member
Stoney Mason said:
I always felt bad for him. You can of course argue that he was running for the Vice President of the United States so there is no real need for sympathy in a sense but he seemed like a decent enough guy unlike say a Dan Quayle or a Palin who really are puppets and mouthpieces for some bad policy. A quote from him years later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Stockdale
Click to expand...
I remember this debate, even if I had no clue of its significance or why it was interrupting normal TV. Stockdale may not have presented well but I remember liking him the way young kids admire their grandparents. No slur intended to Stockdale.

He didn't portray the weird "teutonic" gleam (no offense to our German friends) of Gore (before Gore gained a personality) or the cocksure illiteracy of Quayle. Plus, it was awesome when they would replay the moment (from the debate or not; I can't remember) when Stockdale appeared to be asleep. The wonks feigned incredulity, but I remember thinking, "Right. Yeah, that ol' guy knows how boring this is."

That link shows what an awe-inspiring individual Stockdale was, and unlike McCain, that he never mis-portrayed who he was for political position.
 
S

Stoney Mason

Banned
TDG said:
Not really in American political debates, since the formats don't allow for back-and-forth.

For example, I would love to watch Obama and McCain argue for 5 minutes about the pros and cons of their tax plans. Sadly, it'll turn out like this:
MODERATOR: Sen. McCain, you have two minutes.
MCCAIN: *spends two minutes reciting talking points, and misrepresenting Obama's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Sen. Obama, you have 90 seconds to respond.
OBAMA: *spends 30 seconds rebutting McCain's claims, spends 60 seconds reciting talking points and slamming McCain's tax plan*
MODERATOR: Okay, let's move on to this question about Patriotism...
Click to expand...

I certainly agree that is a far better format and presidential debates are too limiting in their constraints. I think the argument is more a question of whether can some information be garnered from even the admittedly confining constraints of the current debate formats and I think they can although I'm the first to admit they are highly flawed.

Here I am being far more negative for example but it depends on how you look at it. Are they something and better than nothing? Yes. Are they true clashes of intellect that are true policy debates in their best form? No. So its kinda like our media in general. Its better than nothing but certainly not ideal.
 
S

Stoney Mason

Banned
mclem said:
That PPP NC poll teased earlier is out:

Obama: 46%
McCain: 46%
Barr: 5%
Tied
Click to expand...

Good news to hear. I don't believe Obama can take NC but forcing Mccain to defend it even if it will require a massive turnout to get close to these numbers is still a good thing.
 
D

Diablos

Member
mj1108 said:
You gotta be fucking kidding me.

By doing this, the McCain camp basically admits that Palin is inexperienced and can't handle this.

l
Click to expand...
What the hell? You are running for VP, Palin, so ACT LIKE IT.
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
mclem said:
That PPP NC poll teased earlier is out:

Obama: 46%
McCain: 46%
Barr: 5%
Tied
Click to expand...


Not as big of a bump at the chart earlier implied, but still good for Obama. Is there any reason Barr is so strong in NC? He's a native Georgian, right? Not North Carolinian.
 
J

JayDubya

Banned
capslock said:
Alright, I've been thinking about this as a Muslim, can't Barry just go on national TV in the middle of Ramadan (now when you're supposed to be fasting from sunup to sundown) and eat a BLT and wash it down with a beer, and finally prove that he's not Muslim?

:lol
Click to expand...

You mean like, right now?

I was wondering when the hell Ramadan was, but apparently it's September this year. A few years ago, it was October, and then a few years from now, it'll be August. Don't ask me how it works. *shrug*
 
B

Byakuya769

Member
capslock said:
Alright, I've been thinking about this as a Muslim, can't Barry just go on national TV in the middle of Ramadan (now when you're supposed to be fasting from sunup to sundown) and eat a BLT and wash it down with a beer, and finally prove that he's not Muslim?

:lol
Click to expand...

If actively denying being a muslim doesn't work, I doubt anything else would convince the ignorant. You think they know anything about Islam?
 
C

Cloudy

Banned
Anyone watching this forum of past Secretaries of State right now? It's on CNN

Very interesting stuff and Powell just indirectly said McCain is a buffoon for the "We are all Georgians, now" statement. Said you can't just jump and pick one side and Georgia absolutely provoked (Hear that, Palin?)
 
S

sprsk

force push the doodoo rock
GhaleonEB said:
First time someone has had it tied. Polling in the state has been all over the place, with Research 2000 and SUSA showing huge leads for McCain, and everyone else showing it closer.

Yes.


From the NYT article.
Click to expand...


Didn't SUSA have NC totally wrong during the primaries?
 
F

Fragamemnon

Member
Stoney Mason said:
Good news to hear. I don't believe Obama can take NC but forcing Mccain to defend it even if it will require a massive turnout to get close to these numbers is still a good thing.
Click to expand...

PPP-based out of Raleigh, no less- was the only reliable polling outfit that even got close to polling NC right in the primaries. Staples such as SUSA were off by almost 10% in their polling which was done the week before the primaries were held. Even then, PPP still didn't predict the degree of the landslide Obama win here.

I've said it before and I'll say it again-NC, VA, and MO are all going to be nailbiters if the current turnout numbers play out like they are looking to play out. That's why Obama is still there in each of them and fighting hard to win them. Polling for these states was unreliable in the primaries due to turnout volume and will be so in the general for the same reason.
 
F

Fragamemnon

Member
sp0rsk said:
Didn't SUSA have NC totally wrong during the primaries?
Click to expand...

SUSA in NC right before the primaries - +5% Obama
PPP in NC right before the primaries - +10% Obama

Actual results from NC primaries - +15% Obama
 
S

sprsk

force push the doodoo rock
Fragamemnon said:
SUSA in NC right before the primaries - +5% Obama
PPP in NC right before the primaries - +10% Obama

Actual results from NC primaries - +15% Obama
Click to expand...



Ah, so not totally wrong, but pretty far off.
 
G

GoutPatrol

Forgotten in his cell
JayDubya said:
You mean like, right now?

I was wondering when the hell Ramadan was, but apparently it's September this year. A few years ago, it was October, and then a few years from now, it'll be August. Don't ask me how it works. *shrug*
Click to expand...


You seriously don't know?
 
F

Fragamemnon

Member
Also, in that PPP poll, the Bob Barr result could be explained by polling bias-it was a telephone poll, and Barr's name was the first choice given. Same thing in the 46-41 Hagan over Dole result where Chris Cole was the first choice.
 
A

agrajag

Banned
Cloudy said:
Anyone watching this forum of past Secretaries of State right now? It's on CNN

Very interesting stuff and Powell just indirectly said McCain is a buffoon for the "We are all Georgians, now" statement. Said you can't just jump and pick one side and Georgia absolutely provoked (Hear that, Palin?)
Click to expand...

How can they provoke?
 
H

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
Fragamemnon said:
SUSA in NC right before the primaries - +5% Obama
PPP in NC right before the primaries - +10% Obama

Actual results from NC primaries - +15% Obama
Click to expand...
Looking forward to voting for Obama for the second time and having my vote be in a contested election. Gotta do my part to avert the Disasta From Alaska. :D
 
C

Cloudy

Banned
OMG! ROFL @ Latimes.com top story

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-lopez21-2008sep21,0,4025190.column

While many in this Bering Sea burg have seen Russia, they don't feel qualified to be on the presidential ticket
Click to expand...

42459024.jpg


When McGuire told me that she once flew near Big Diomede for a college class and that her plane was chased away by a Russian MIG, I suggested she might be in line to become secretary of State.

"I'll go for president," she said, noting that she has more Russia experience than Palin. "I've seen it closer." To be honest, I hadn't expected to find a member of the liberal media elite in the town that serves as terminus for the Iditarod mush trail. McGuire's views are not local gospel, though.
Click to expand...

:lol
 
S

Slurpy

*drowns in jizz*
JayDubya said:
You mean like, right now?

I was wondering when the hell Ramadan was, but apparently it's September this year. A few years ago, it was October, and then a few years from now, it'll be August. Don't ask me how it works. *shrug*
Click to expand...

Please don't tell me you're Muslim. And it's not frikkin rocket science- the month simply follows the lunar calendar, which advances by a bit every year.
 
M

Miroku

Member
Fragamemnon said:
PPP-based out of Raleigh, no less- was the only reliable polling outfit that even got close to polling NC right in the primaries. Staples such as SUSA were off by almost 10% in their polling which was done the week before the primaries were held. Even then, PPP still didn't predict the degree of the landslide Obama win here.

I've said it before and I'll say it again-NC, VA, and MO are all going to be nailbiters if the current turnout numbers play out like they are looking to play out. That's why Obama is still there in each of them and fighting hard to win them. Polling for these states was unreliable in the primaries due to turnout volume and will be so in the general for the same reason.
Click to expand...


I've said it before and I'll say it again, I think Obama has a real chance in NC. There's yard signs all over. There's a large black population, theres a growing number of students at Duke, UNC Chapel Hill, NCSU, etc... , theres been a huge boom in growth for tech jobs in the triangle which means educated folks. On the other hand Charlotte is a republican haven and has grown a lot as well.

Fingers crossed, its gonna be close.
 
H

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
Cloudy said:
OMG! ROFL @ Latimes.com top story

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-lopez21-2008sep21,0,4025190.column



http://www.latimes.com/media/photo/2008-09/42459024.jpg

:lol
Click to expand...
And don't worry about foreign affairs, Knodel said.

"If McCain dropped dead tomorrow," Palin would have well-informed advisors, and she'd be able to make "common sense" decisions.
Click to expand...
Some people NEVER learn.

Miroku said:
I've said it before and I'll say it again, I think Obama has a real chance in NC. There's yard signs all over. There's a large black population, theres a growing number of students at Duke, UNC Chapel Hill, NCSU, etc... , theres been a huge boom in growth for tech jobs in the triangle which means educated folks. On the other hand Charlotte is a republican haven and has grown a lot as well.

Fingers crossed, its gonna be close.
Click to expand...
Eh, it's kinda mixed. McCrory may have had a deathgrip on his mayoral chair and suburban areas are fairly Republican, but Mecklenburg county itself went solidly for Kerry.
 
S

Stoney Mason

Banned
Hitokage said:
Looking forward to voting for Obama for the second time and having my vote be in a contested election. Gotta do my part to avert the Disasta From Alaska. :D
Click to expand...


Ah ......I didn't realize you were from NC. No wonder you were defensive about my NC and Virginia barbs about Obama having no chance in either ;)
 
H

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
Stoney Mason said:
Ah ......I didn't realize you were from NC. No wonder you were defensive about my NC and Virginia barbs about Obama having no chance in either ;)
Click to expand...
Yeah, I grew up in the Seattle area, but I live in Charlotte.
 
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