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[charlequin]

Its being reported everywhere, but I saw it on Time (I think the Swampland blog). Polls close at 8. The good news is I read that there are no paper balloting in the state, so it should be quicker than other states.

That doesn't sound right. I have only ever voted on paper here in Massachusetts. :lol

"I voted in Boston today and there was no one there. BROWN BY 20"

"I just got back from Boston and it was absolutely swamped. Really feel good about Martha's chances now."

I have thirteen friends who tweeted me to go out to the polls and support Coakley

WE HAVE NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT Y'ALLS

Many once believed that segregation and race-mixing were moral issues. Indeed, I'm sure some doctors and nurses in the 1950's South would have believed treating a black person in a white hospital would have been unethical. In short, the framing of doing some act A or refraining from some act A as a moral issue has no bearing on whether that act should be respected. The belief it is immoral to medically treat a rape victim with emergency contraception deserves no respect or protection in the law.

Yup.

If someone tried to claim that their Scientologist faith allowed them to take a job as a pharmacist and then refuse to dispense psychiatric medication, anyone in the country would laugh in their face. There is no relevant difference in this situation.

The purpose of an amendment such as that proposed by Scott Brown is to create localities where a rape victim cannot de facto receive emergency contraception even though they are de jure entitled to it -- in a region where, for example, only Catholic hospitals are within a reasonable radius, there might be no place where a patient could actually be transported that would provide the contraception. Asking them to allow themselves to be physically moved -- possibly to a worse hospital, or a less convenient one, or one that family and friends cannot as easily reach -- to receive treatment is an indignity intended to shame women and prevent them from taking advantage of the treatment they are owed.

(This is, in fact, by and large the entire strategy of the pro-life movement -- to create barriers that force women to avoid abortions because they either fear for their physical safety or lack the ability to actually take advantage of their legal rights.)

The fact that Brown voted for the underlying bill after his amendment failed is meaningless, since both actions (the amendment and the vote) are just taken out of cynical political calculation anyway -- the purpose was to allow him to continue advertising himself as a moderate on abortion while creating a record of introducing an extremist pro-life amendment in order to win the support of pro-life groups in the future. He made that bed and it's entirely correct for Coakley to make him sleep in it.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Yeah. I read about that story yesterday. I think it's asinine. Organized religion is a danger to our country and the world.

If there's a hell, I'm sure Pat Robertson has a reserved seat.

 

[LosDaddie]

Hey PoliGAF, I know you guys are busy worrying about the election and all but I ran across this story and just wanted to know how you people felt about it, it kinda falls into the political/religious/military category and could probably use it's own thread, but I'm too lazy to start one.

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/us-military-weapons-inscribed-secret-jesus-bible-codes/story?id=9575794&page=1

I'm just curious on what people think of this, not really wanting people to go all out, just some basic opinions, that's it.

It doesn't really bother me. But I don't know how JC would feel.

 

[Sirpopopop]

The political right is putting huge amounts of energy into this race. Yes, they could endorse neither, but why would they?.

He was endorsed way before he became a longshot.

I know that Brown is pretty far right, I'm just saying that endorsements don't really stand for a politician's stand on issues.

True, but a candidate can always disavow an endorsement, like Republicans with their regular endorsements from Iran.

 

[gkryhewy]

This is a problem for me in Florida. If there was a light rail built in my county, there's no way in hell anyone could walk to the groceries, mall, etc.. Also, the buses suck here and traffic is too congested. There are over a million people living in Pinellas County.

Even in the most egregious examples of auto-oriented suburbia, there are opportunities to improve transportation options. Just building sidewalks everywhere can do a world of good.

 

[ShOcKwAvE]

If Coakley manages to squeak out a win, who wants to bet that the media will still focus on the GOP narrative that this spells trouble for Dems in Nov?

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Even in the most egregious examples of auto-oriented suburbia, there are opportunities to improve transportation options. Just building sidewalks everywhere can do a world of good.

If you wanted to walk an hour just from one location to another, then sure.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

If Coakley manages to squeak out a win, who wants to bet that the media will still focus on the GOP narrative that this spells trouble for Dems in Nov?

Considering that this race should have never been this close, the whole race spells trouble for Dems. It also shows that Tim Kaine is ineffective as DNC head.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

What is the over/under on how long it takes for the legal challenges following todays election to end?

Depends on how close the race is. If it is Franken-Coleman close, probably will drag out long.

 

[Dooraven]

He was endorsed way before he became a longshot.

True, but a candidate can always disavow an endorsement, like Republicans with their regular endorsements from Iran.

Fair point.

 

[eznark]

If Coakley manages to squeak out a win, who wants to bet that the media will still focus on the GOP narrative that this spells trouble for Dems in Nov?

Dude, it's Massachusetts. If the nationwide senate elections were held today the Dems would be in serious, serious trouble. Of course, not all the lefts candidates will be as inept as Coakley but still, this is going to generate a TON of cash for the right no matter how it goes.

 

[Matt]

Considering that this race should have never been this close, the whole race spells trouble for Dems. It also shows that Tim Kaine is ineffective as DNC head.

No, it does not. The race should have had nothing to do with the DNC. It's only because of how badly the Coakley campaign was managed that they are involved at all.

 

[charlequin]

I've gotten nothing but pro-Coakley ad banners on this thread so far today.

I'm just curious on what people think of this

Company needs to get their contract cut off immediately and probably blacklisted from US military contracts for X amount of time as a result. It's very much a violation of the Constitution for the military to knowingly purchase such weapons, and it's also just a stupid fucking idea by this company that causes problems for our military presence by providing an easy talking point about how American troops are there to spread Christianity by force.

If Coakley manages to squeak out a win, who wants to bet that the media will still focus on the GOP narrative that this spells trouble for Dems in Nov?

Anything that happens is good news for conservatives. Losing in NY-23 was good news for conservatives; the GOP winning the gubernatorial elections with moderate candidates who didn't reach out to the teabaggers was also good news for conservatives. Balloon Juice has an entire blog tag for it.

If the nationwide senate elections were held today the Dems would be in serious, serious trouble.

True.

Of course, not all the lefts candidates will be as inept as Coakley

I really fucking hope this is true. :lol

 

[cartoon_soldier]

No, it does not. The race should have had nothing to do with the DNC. It's only because of how badly the Coakley campaign was managed that they are involved at all.

And DNC should have seen it coming, but they didn't until 6 days before Election day. No Ad buys, nothing. DNC also thought they will win because its a Kennedy seat.

 

[Tamanon]

And DNC should have seen it coming, but they didn't until 6 days before Election day. No Ad buys, nothing. DNC also thought they will win because its a Kennedy seat.

To be fair, if the national committee *HAS* to put money into a traditional stronghold, that's already a huge problem.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

To be fair, if the national committee *HAS* to put money into a traditional stronghold, that's already a huge problem.

Then the DNC shouldn't have supported such a candidate.

 

[gkryhewy]

If you wanted to walk an hour just from one location to another, then sure.

Yes, some things would take an hour to get to, but many suburban residential subdivisions have *something* nonresidential (a strip mall, a convenience store, a school) that would be within a reasonable walking distance if the pedestrian network would allow people to walk there safely and comfortably.

 

[Bishman]

Rep. Anthony Weiner (D-NY), an outspoken advocate for a single-payer health care system, said today reform might be dead if the Republican wins in Massachusetts.

"I think you could make a pretty goood arg that hc might be dead," he said on MSNBC.

Sigh.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

Apparently its snowing in MA including parts of Boston.

Coakley and the Dems are screwed.

 

[The Librarian]

Dude, it's Massachusetts. If the nationwide senate elections were held today the Dems would be in serious, serious trouble.

That doesn't matter... at all.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Apparently its snowing in MA including parts of Boston.

Coakley and the Dems are screwed.

Seems about right. Republicans will go out and vote, no matter how shitty the weather is. Dems, not so much.

 

[eznark]

Sigh.

I doubt that means much, probably trying to drum up a few last minute votes and get dems to the voting booth

 

[dave is ok]

Apparently its snowing in MA including parts of Boston.

Coakley and the Dems are screwed.

It's only an inch or two, Don't think it'll have much of an effect

 

[charlequin]

Then the DNC shouldn't have supported such a candidate.

Er, as far as I know they didn't give her a leg up in the primary or anything.

 

[gcubed]

To be fair, if the national committee *HAS* to put money into a traditional stronghold, that's already a huge problem.

to say it is all Coakley is indeed unfair, in most years Coakley wouldnt have had to do anything... midterms are going to be tough enough, but at least many expect a rebounding economy by that time so it will help the dems a bit, right now its basically a shitstorm of higher then normal enthusiasm, combined with the traditional lack of enthusiasm for a special election, lack of enthusiasm from the dem base and an economy still in the shitter as far as jobs goes

 

[thefro]

You have to remember is that it's a special election as well. Democrats were sitting on their hands. That seems to have changed.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

Jon Stewart tears Dems a new one:

http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmem...he-dems-on-ma-sen-and-health-care.php?ref=fpb

 

[Particle Physicist]

Brown is a pro-choice Republican.

Doesn't mean shit if he makes it to the Senate. He will just fall in line, like they always do.

 

[Suikoguy]

Jon Stewart tears Dems a new one:

http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmem...he-dems-on-ma-sen-and-health-care.php?ref=fpb

Pretty much.
I still don't see why they are so afraid of a fillabuster. Are they really so inept that they can't use the republican fillabuster to their advantage? It would not be difficult. Especially the way things are now. They would be seen as trying to do something, and frame it as republicans simply not wanting to have a vote.

 

[charlequin]

+1 for Coakley. Plus I bought gas for a friend so he could actually make it to the polling place and back to work without running out. :lol

Are they really so inept that they can't use the republican fillabuster to their advantage?

IIRC, actually forcing the real filibuster (i.e. keep the floor until the other side gives up) would require a procedural vote the Dems can't make without 60. Anyone who's clearer on the exact mechanism of the transition to the new bullshit procedural filibuster able to correct me on this?

 

[Cush]

Have there been any polls that indicate the reason people are voting the way they are in the Senate election? I'm just curious because it seems that when it comes to statewide elections in Massachusetts, the Democrats don't hold that great an advantage. Just looking at the governor's races, three of the last four elected governors have been Republican. Is this really more of a personality/small issues vote than a big issues vote (which, tbh, I think most elections are)?

I also find it interesting that in the last two governor's races (Romney vs. O'Brien, Patrick vs. Healey), a man beat a blonde-haired woman...

 

[Pimpwerx]

Jon Stewart tears Dems a new one:

http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmem...he-dems-on-ma-sen-and-health-care.php?ref=fpb

What I've been saying all along. Compromised past the point of compromise, and still can't get it passed. Bush did whatever the hell he wanted, pretty much. The tax cuts and Iraq War are a bigger fiscal burden than HCR could ever be. So it's been watered-down to HCE, and still no dice. The Dems are worthless. Funny how it probably end up being the Dems that fall apart before the Reps, despite what was being said last year. PEACE.

 

[charlequin]

I'm just curious because it seems that when it comes to statewide elections in Massachusetts, the Democrats don't hold that great an advantage. Just looking at the governor's races, three of the last four elected governors have been Republican.

Well, gubernatorial races are very different from Senate races (or, for that matter, Presidential races). If you look at the Dem-leaning northeastern states, all of them have consistently continued frequently electing GOP governors even as their Congressional seats have consistently shifted towards the Dems and their Presidential numbers have gotten more lopsided, simply because the positions represented by these GOP governors are way more moderate, and locally-oriented, than the candidates for national office. Look at Romney -- MA got a public health care system comparable to the current federal bills on his watch. Usually what you're seeing are issues like business development, state infrastructure, taxes, tourism, and other stuff like that come to the fore while big social issues are largely irrelevant -- MA's Democratic party has an iron grip on the state legislature and therefore basically anything that's a major swing issue on the national level is pretty close to settled upfront as a result.

Where the level of Brown support we're seeing is coming from is really, really hard for me to understand, though. There are certainly people of a very easily identifiable stripe who are supporting him -- my in-laws, for one -- but just by the numbers those people really shouldn't exist in large enough numbers to mount a successful campaign.

What I've been saying all along.

The difference here is that Stewart lays out people's legitimate frustrations in comedic form because it's his job to make fun of politics, while you just pop in every few weeks to say dumb shit because you can't be bothered to take two seconds and nuance your position beyond "if the Dems didn't do exactly what I wanted then throw the bums out."

 

[mernst23]

+1 for Coakley. Plus I bought gas for a friend so he could actually make it to the polling place and back to work without running out. :lol



IIRC, actually forcing the real filibuster (i.e. keep the floor until the other side gives up) would require a procedural vote the Dems can't make without 60. Anyone who's clearer on the exact mechanism of the transition to the new bullshit procedural filibuster able to correct me on this?

The actual act of filibustering has been moved to the wayside. The threat of the act of filibustering is enough to kill discussion on a bill unless a 60 vote measure can be passed to kill the filibuster.

 

[charlequin]

The actual act of filibustering has been moved to the wayside. The threat of the act of filibustering is enough to kill discussion on a bill unless a 60 vote measure can be passed to kill the filibuster.

Err... yes, I'm aware of that. My understanding is that there have been changes to the Senate rules that have made the process of forcing an actual filibuster (i.e. talking on and on to stall legislation) difficult or impossible and that's what I'm asking if someone is clearer on the details on.

 

[REV 09]

This may be a dumb question, but since the whole 60 vote supermajority bullshit is gone, why don't the Dems just go back and pass a much more liberal bill with a simple majority...since whatever they pass now would require a simple majority.

 

[charlequin]

This may be a dumb question, but since the whole 60 vote supermajority bullshit is gone, why don't the Dems just go back and pass a much more liberal bill with a simple majority...since whatever they pass now would require a simple majority.

EDIT: Sorry, that original response was pointlessly rude, I'm just cranky today. :lol The 60 vote hurdle is still going to exist for passing the Senate-House reconciled bill. The only real way for the Dems to get to a point where they can pass a bill with 51 votes is to actually eliminate the filibuster.

 

[besada]

The only real way for the Dems to get to a point where they can pass a bill with 51 votes is to actually eliminate the filibuster.

From your mouth to Harry Reid's wrinkled old ear.

 

[VAIL]

Gotta go vote at the senior center around the corner after work. It's a good thing it's close to my house, because from the sound of it here Dems can't be bothered to weather a little snow in order to vote...

:lol

 

[mckmas8808]

Considering that this race should have never been this close, the whole race spells trouble for Dems. It also shows that Tim Kaine is ineffective as DNC head.

IF the DEMs pull out a win today it just means that they will still have 60 full votes in the Senate. It doesn't spell doom nationwide in November.

It does show that Tim Kaine is fucking terrible as DNC head like you said though. And it shows that Coakley was pathetic.

 

[Pimpwerx]

The difference here is that Stewart lays out people's legitimate frustrations in comedic form because it's his job to make fun of politics, while you just pop in every few weeks to say dumb shit because you can't be bothered to take two seconds and nuance your position beyond "if the Dems didn't do exactly what I wanted then throw the bums out."

Opinions are like assholes. Shall I share my opinion of your post quality(or lack thereof), or do you (like me) not give a shit? IOW, keep your opinion on merits of posts to yourself, unless you want to take it there, kiddo.

Regarding your post, forgive me if I'm mistaken, but are you seriously drawing the difference between me an Mr. Stewart as he is paid to be a comedian? So a sarcastic response can only be given by a paid comedian? Maybe I've misinterpreted your post, but that's what it comes across as.

What Stewart says is just what I've been saying. I'll add the "throw the bums out" part myself too, but it doesn't change the sentiment, does it? The Democratic party is hijacked by people who are neither progressive, nor conservative, but emboldened to corporate interests. This is common knowledge now, so should I reiterate this "every few weeks" as you claim? No. They can't pass a bill that represents a pillar of the party platform, yet half this thread is full of excuse-making as to why we should be satisfied with a watered-down pos bill that both YOU and I have to pay. It's not like I'm bitching just for me, it's for everyone. Perhaps I should drive that point home every few weeks? Not really.

All Stewart did differently here was pantomime the exact levels of frustration some of us on the actual left (the progressive left) are feeling over a party some of us reluctantly voted for. I vote Green, and voted for Obama for change, not the status quo. His administration did an awful job of pitching HCR to the people. I doubt this is up for debate. As a result, he allowed douchebags to hijack the conversation, only holding a press conference here and there to run damage control, rather than actually declare necessary bulletpoints. Obama's administration is afraid to fail, and as a result are afraid to succeed. They haven't taken any chances, and yet they're still gonna fail miserably on this issue in the public's eye. Who's winning there?

As someone that has wanted HCR for 20+ years now, why would I change my stance now unless I felt it was a complete waste? This only costs me thousands more per year, and offers me no benefit. I'd pay a tax anyday, as it would have to be tied to a tighter system than this to control costs. But just tossing the few stragglers (most of us I assume are without coverage due to cost) to private industry with the promise of future revisions is Stupid (capital S on that bitch). Toss the bums out, they won't do what I want. PEACE.

 

[Branduil]

Many once believed that segregation and race-mixing were moral issues. Indeed, I'm sure some doctors and nurses in the 1950's South would have believed treating a black person in a white hospital would have been unethical. In short, the framing of doing some act A or refraining from some act A as a moral issue has no bearing on whether that act should be respected. The belief it is immoral to medically treat a rape victim with emergency contraception deserves no respect or protection in the law.

Good point, not wanting to murder babies is exactly the same as not treating a black person.

I'm out.

 

[mckmas8808]

Voter turnout is heavy for the special election today to fill the state's vacant U.S. Senate seat.

A win by Republican Scott Brown over one-time front-runner Martha Coakley would eliminate Democrats' 60-seat supermajority in the Senate and likely kill President Obama's overhaul of health care.

"I've never been a big poll person," Brown said to a swarm of media after voting in Wrentham.

"I'm up in some, I'm down in some. And we'll see what happens, 8:01 (p.m.)."

The last time Massachusetts elected a Republican to the U.S. Senate was 1972.

Democrats outnumber Republicans in the Commonwealth, 3-1.

If Coakley wins, as she predicted after voting in Medford, she would be the first woman elected to the Senate from Massachusetts.

Coakley also refuted reports she didn't campaign hard enough or often enough, saying "we've been working every day."

Brown has been surging, according to recent polls.

A Suffolk University survey taken Saturday and Sunday showed Brown with double-digit leads in three communities the poll identified as bellwethers: Gardner, Fitchburg and Peabody.

But internal statewide polls for both sides showed a dead heat.

HIGH TURNOUT

In contrast to the light turnout for the party primaries last month, there are already signs of a heavy turnout.

A line of cars stretched for nearly a half-mile from the gymnasium at North Andover High School. Some drivers turned around in exasperation.

Massachsuetts Secretary of State William Galvin told WBZ he expects about 40-percent of voters to turn out for the special election.

Galvin said about 800,000 came out for the primaries and he believes that should double to 1.6 million based on the intense interest in this campaign.

Weather could be a factor.

Check: WBZ Forecast

WBZ meteorologists say temperatures will be in the mid-30's and there will be snow and rain showers.

Check: Where Do I Vote?

Polls will be open until 8 p.m.

We will have a live webcast with your emails and early numbers starting at 8 on wbztv.com

WINNER TO DC – HOW FAST?

With the Democrats 60-seat supermajority in the Senate at stake, there has been a lot of discussion about how quickly Brown or Coakley would be sworn in after the election.

It takes ten days to count absentee ballots and certify an election.

But Galvin says unofficial results, if they are decisive either way, could push up action in Congress.

"If the result is decisive, whether it's decisive for Mr. Brown or Ms. Coakley, I will send a letter to the Clerk of the Senate saying 'unofficial returns indicate this result.' It's then up to the Senate as to what to do with that," Galvin said.

NOT DROPPING OUT

A third candidate, Joseph L. Kennedy, a Libertarian running as an independent, said he's been bombarded with e-mails from Brown supporters urging him to drop out and endorse the Republican.

Kennedy, who was polling in the single digits and is no relation to the late senator, said he's staying in.

http://wbztv.com/local/scott.brown.martha.2.1434536.html

Interesting....

Based on this article I'm going to say Coakley wins by 0.1-0.5 percentage points. I'm nervous as crap.

 

[Y2Kev]

She reminds me of the SNL "corkers" skit.

 

[Sirpopopop]

Can you actually articulate why the HCR bill is bad, and how it's worse than inaction? Because really, that's the argument you need to make, MD. You never get 100% of what you want in politics. You have to decide who will provide you the majority of what you want in politics. You have to decide if 20% is better than 0%.

Actually, let's get straight to the point:

Do you understand what the word "compromise" means, MD?

 

[Vgamer]

http://wbztv.com/local/scott.brown.martha.2.1434536.html

Interesting....

Based on this article I'm going to say Coakley wins by 0.1-0.5 percentage points. I'm nervous as crap.

I think she will lose votes to Joseph Kennedy too though. Some Democrats may vote for him just because of his last name. I think the votes lost to each candidate that go to Kennedy will about even out.

 

[Deus Ex Machina]

http://wbztv.com/local/scott.brown.martha.2.1434536.html

Interesting....

Based on this article I'm going to say Coakley wins by 0.1-0.5 percentage points. I'm nervous as crap.

I agree. The more people show up the better Coakley chances. As we know Dems outnumber Republicans 3 to 1 in Mass.

 

[Sirpopopop]

Good point, not wanting to murder babies is exactly the same as not treating a black person.

I'm out.

I agree, one murders babies every time they masturbate.

 

[gkryhewy]

Good point, not wanting to murder babies is exactly the same as not treating a black person.

I'm a one trick pony.

.

 

[ATF487]

anecdotal: tons of brown support at my town hall

I really have no idea how this will turn out.