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[Manmademan]

When I don't need a phone app to chat online I will think about a Switch. Actually, I will probably just wait until Nintendo gives a shit at all about online play. If they did, we wouldn't need another device to do very basic things that other consoles have been doing for 2 full generations now. Pisses me off seeing how out of touch they are about gaming. Gaming is fun, relaxing, and SOCIAL. Nintendo skips over the social aspect every single generation.

They haven't been skipping the social aspect, they're simply convinced that social means local multiplayer, not online- which is the exact opposite direction the market has been moving in.

Either Nintendo is out of touch to the point where they haven't noticed this, or they're hoping to tap into unmet demand for a system that highlights local multiplayer (as the wii did).

 

[geordiemp]

The problems with Wii U were, roughly in order of severity.

1. Confusing name, what is a Wii U and how does it differ from the Wii
2. Vision not clearly communicated, what is asymmetry and why would we want it
3. Bad tooling for difficult architecture, 3rd party devs felt locked out of Nintendo secret sauce
4. Nonexistent advertising
5. Failure of Nintendo to grow their userbase preferences; coming off the Wii which was mostly fitness and party games, Nintendo released in the first year: a party game and a 2D platformer (november), a party game (january), a 2D platformer (June), a party game (June), an RTS (July), an unadvertised messy brawler (August), a remaster (October), party game (November) and fitness game (November). The market for the kind of games AAA devs make was completely absent. By the time Kart and Splatoon came out it was too late
6. Obnoxious licensing and QA
7. Price that stayed high
8. A gadget that was old hat by the time it released
9. A fisherprice controller
10. Lack of robust friend system and partychat
11. Problems with storage and digital content

.

Wow, you really dont see why nobody bought the WiiU do you - Its 2017 and the last few years most kids game in parties online in GTA 5, COD, BF, Destiny, Overwatch, R6, Division, Minecraft....I could go on but hey

WiiU did not play those games and it was a toaster - your list might have had some impact if people playing the big western games even looked at it....but they did not because GTA 5 etc

You list reads like something 10 years ago maybe....times change. You non interest and poor weighting in online ecosystem is wrong.

However for a hand held device it might not matter so much to that market (whatever size it is)

 

[G-Unit]

Some people have some serious negativity issues. Everything is wrong with everything. Screw that, love you ninty

 

[Camper Van Beethoven]

Some people have some serious negativity issues. Everything is wrong with everything. Screw that, love you ninty

Blind optimismism is worse than conservative pessimism.

 

[Lionel Richie]

They aren't naively trying to capitalize on nostalgia. It's just their IP, genres and art styles are their strengths. They can't shift gears and just start pumping out exclusives that appeal to the CoD, Halo, Uncharted, Gears, GTA, AssCreed, Madden, FIFA, Forza, GT, God of War etc. crowd. That's not what they're about and they don't have strengths in those areas. They struggled with the transition to HD even with their more simplistic art designs. They aren't going to be easily able to make something like Horizon to Gears of War even if they wanted to and had put out powerful hardware.

I agree with everything you said but this bit is perfectly how I view Nintendo in today's world. Some people seem to think they pander to nostalgia for whatever reason, but I don't see that. They have been doing their own thing since the NES. More than keeping the same IPs, they have kept up the same vision. The games themselves changed very much, anyone who is paying attention or actually playing the games know that Mario today is not the same as Mario in 1985. The game itself is completely different because you can see an evolution (for better or worse) in every game they put out. More than keeping up the status quo with their intelectual properties, they usually branch out significantly with every release which leads to a feeling of continuity. You have the vision being expanded.

And it's largely in part because they know they can't do games like the ones you mentioned. And they shouldn't because they're not copycats, it's historically not how they ever approached this. So they maintain the same artistic language while pushing their games forward. Just appealing to nostalgia would be lazy and frankly imbecilic and that's just not real. More than anything, Nintendo is aware of their strength and try to build on that instead of trying to mimicking the competition. Which is great IMO.

 

[Ban Puncher]

 

[spekkeh]

None of this is helpful information to me and I never said it would tank the system. I know you may be a Nintendo fan or whatever, but you're not telling me anything new and unless you've got a switch on hand, I don't need to hear the same points and have the same link to that site provided for the 50th time.

Ah I thought you were arguing along with the article of the OP, which did say that a lack of clarity about online and the OS was the major reason the Wii U failed and could mean Switch is going to fail. As for your specific question, the OS has a friend list system, but it's true that Nintendo didn't communicate this clearly, we had to find out via a leak.
Obviously I'd say don't get two Switches at launch if this is a dealbreaker for you.

PS I primarily play on PS4.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

They haven't been skipping the social aspect, they're simply convinced that social means local multiplayer, not online- which is the exact opposite direction the market has been moving in.

Either Nintendo is out of touch to the point where they haven't noticed this, or they're hoping to tap into unmet demand for a system that highlights local multiplayer (as the wii did).

The latter. Again, they've stated they're not good at competing with Sony/MS. So a lot of what they're doing is trying to reach untapped markets.

They'll have online of course, and I don't get why they need to complicate it with phone apps etc., but they are trying to differentiate themselves with stuff like focus on local MP, motion controls, more party games etc.

I don't think it will be a huge success for them, but I've been wrong many times before. In any case, I get their approach. The market doesn't need a third core box. There's never been three successfully selling core consoles in any generation. Hell, only time there's been three successful consoles period was last gen with the PS3 and 360 splitting the worldwide core market and the Wii doing it's own thing which expanded the market it and made it an ideal secondary console for core gamers. They're hoping Switch will do similar, even if it doesn't reach hose lofty Wii numbers, they hope it expands the market some and is appealing as a secondary platform rather than being another Wii U that only appeals to their diehards.

 

[Xist2inspire]

I mean sure, it's a fair point if that's what you think helped tank the Wii U. I personally think the Wii U had a crap-ton of other, more important problems, and the Switch has hit quite a few of those. It's okay to make the same mistake if you're spending that time fixing up other ones.

 

[marc^o^]

Blind optimismism is worse than conservative pessimism.

Neogaf. Believe.

 

[psyfi]

I don't see it. It's clear to me that Nintendo has a hit on their hands, though they're definitely making some mistakes that will mitigate how high this thing can soar. I'm expecting at least a 3DS level success, probably better.

 

[b00_thegh0st]

Wow, you really dont see why nobody bought the WiiU do you - Its 2017 and the last few years most kids game in parties online in GTA 5, COD, BF, Destiny, Overwatch, R6, Division, (...)

All firearms shooters. For the sake of my kids I'm glad Nintendo's still around. Minecraft is great for kids too.

 

[Lionel Richie]

Blind optimismism is worse than conservative pessimism.

What is "blind" in this case? Like optimistic people are just misinformed? How does that work?

 

[Deleted member 752119]

I agree with everything you said but this bit is perfectly how I view Nintendo in today's world. Some people seem to think they pander to nostalgia for whatever reason, but I don't see that. They have been doing their own thing since the NES. More than keeping the same IPs, they have kept up the same vision. The games themselves changed very much, anyone who is paying attention or actually playing the games know that Mario today is not the same as Mario in 1985. The game itself is completely different because you can see an evolution (for better or worse) in every game they put out. More than keeping up the status quo with their intelectual properties, they usually branch out significantly with every release which leads to a feeling of continuity. You have the vision being expanded.

And it's largely in part because they know they can't do games like the ones you mentioned. And they shouldn't because they're not copycats, it's historically not how they ever approached this. So they maintain the same artistic language while pushing their games forward. Just appealing to nostalgia would be lazy and frankly imbecilic and that's just not real. More than anything, Nintendo is aware of their strength and try to build on that instead of trying to mimicking the competition. Which is great IMO.

Yep, very much agree.

I'm skeptical they'll find long term relevance as a hardware maker with this approach, but they shouldn't go away from it. Their games are fantastic and it would be terrible if they shifted to copycat western AAA trends. If the market for their type of games (including the type of Japanese third party exclusives they get) isn't big enough to sustain a hardware platform, so be it. Go third party, or be like Blizzard and just put out their own storefront for the AAA games they want to keep making while focusing a lot on mobile. No reason to change the type of games they make. They just have to adapt the delivery mechanism for those games to fit the market's willingness (or unwillingness) to buy their hardware to play them. Switch sales will be key here.

 

[Effect]

Nintendo thinks noslatgia (and loyalty) will do the job! A big mistake from a comapny that is so oldschool in terms of management and business (wont end well)

Im buying the Switch just for Zelda and the new Mario! After that it will collect dust till the new Metroid.... if ever.

When people say stuff like this it only results in me believing those people aren't buying shit. They want to be apart of the conversation and act like they're taking a "stand". Right up there with people claiming they're canceling a pre-order because something upset them. Please.

 

[The perfect Dark]

All firearms shooters. For the sake of my kids I'm glad Nintendo's still around. Minecraft is great for kids too.

I don't have kids but that's exactly what I thought.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Jax's posts will be amazing to revisit in a year. A next generation's AceBandage in every way.

Catching up with PS4 in two years, yeah no.

 

[Deleted member 752119]

All firearms shooters. For the sake of my kids I'm glad Nintendo's still around. Minecraft is great for kids too.

I don't have kids but that's exactly what I thought.

While I totally see where you both are coming from, the post was about sales. Those shooters are super popular among kids, especially the Tween crowd that's mostly outgrowing things like Minecraft and wanting to play the "cool" games.

For better or worse that drives a lot of sales, and Nintendo not being competitive there has hurt the size of their base. It's a shame too as they had a good start at adding those things to their library with Goldeneye and Perfect Dark on N64 along side Mario, Zelda, Smash, Mario Kart etc.

I think Nintendo overreacted to the GC failing, given that the Xbox failed even worse and MS bounced back and won NA and the UK and finished in a dead heat with PS3 worldwide. Simply nothing was going to compete with the PS2 juggernaught, particularly with the GC lacking DVD playback.

The Wii was an even bigger success for them than the 360 for Microsoft of course, but it was short term and doubled down their image as being for kids and families and not appealing to those kids who want to play the "cool" games with their buddies online.

 

[zelas]

The article is not "wrong" (it is actually quite wrong on a number of specific points, but I'll humor the author here) that Nintendo's messaging over the nitty gritty details when it comes to the OS and account system leaves something to be desired. Where it is wrong, completely so even, is that these are the mistakes that tanked the Wii U.

The problems with Wii U were, roughly in order of severity.

1. Confusing name, what is a Wii U and how does it differ from the Wii
2. Vision not clearly communicated, what is asymmetry and why would we want it
3. Bad tooling for difficult architecture, 3rd party devs felt locked out of Nintendo secret sauce
4. Nonexistent advertising
5. Failure of Nintendo to grow their userbase preferences; coming off the Wii which was mostly fitness and party games, Nintendo released in the first year: a party game and a 2D platformer (november), a party game (january), a 2D platformer (June), a party game (June), an RTS (July), an unadvertised messy brawler (August), a remaster (October), party game (November) and fitness game (November). The market for the kind of games AAA devs make was completely absent. By the time Kart and Splatoon came out it was too late
6. Obnoxious licensing and QA
7. Price that stayed high
8. A gadget that was old hat by the time it released
9. A fisherprice controller
10. Lack of robust friend system and partychat
    [*]Problems with storage and digital content

I'll tell you what nobody in the history of the mass market gave a shit about: the way the OS looked. If the writer of the article seriously thinks that's the major problem of the Wii U he's fucking delusional.
Now these other points, they're a fair game to see how well or poor the Switch stacks up to this. You'll find that the situation between Wii U and Switch is not at all the same, even though there is still room for improvement.

You say the article is wrong for saying Nintendo is making the same mistakes as they did with the Wii U but then you list a bunch of faults that are absolutely happening with the Switch. The bolded were problems with the wii u and are happening now. Some of those items have been Nintendo's MO for multiple generations.

Simply put, messaging ruined the wii u's launch. Nintendo's messaging with the Switch launch is even worse. Nintendo at least tried to communicate properly last generation. This generation has largely been a bunch of silence from Nintendo on some potentially deal breaking issues, leaving Nintendo fans to fill the void by pushing their preferred scenarios as fact.

Using fantasy to build word of mouth hype is fine if you only want to sell to Nintendo fans, but those people were 100% all in before the reveal. The rest of the market needs to be sold on the Switch. Nintendo just sitting back and saying "we have Zelda" will never be good enough.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

Wow, you really dont see why nobody bought the WiiU do you - Its 2017 and the last few years most kids game in parties online in GTA 5, COD, BF, Destiny, Overwatch, R6, Division, Minecraft....I could go on but hey

WiiU did not play those games and it was a toaster - your list might have had some impact if people playing the big western games even looked at it....but they did not because GTA 5 etc

You list reads like something 10 years ago maybe....times change. You non interest and poor weighting in online ecosystem is wrong.

However for a hand held device it might not matter so much to that market (whatever size it is)

I think you are both correct. I think the games were a problem with the WiiU but I agree with him that there were other major issues that also would have hampered the system. I think if some of the issues he listed were solved the WiiU may have seen more CoD, Destiny etc.

With the Switch I think it solves a lot of the issues he listed on the WiiU and that may help in bringing over some of the more larger general audience games like CoD, Star Wars etc.

You say the article is wrong for saying Nintendo is making the same mistakes as they did with the Wii U but then you list a bunch of faults that are absolutely happening with the Switch. The bolded were problems with the wii u and are happening now. Some of those items have been Nintendo's MO for multiple generations.

Simply put, messaging ruined the wii u's launch. Nintendo's messaging with the Switch launch is even worse. Nintendo at least tried to communicate properly last generation. This generation has largely been a bunch of silence from Nintendo on some potentially deal breaking issues, leaving Nintendo fans to fill the void by pushing their preferred scenarios as fact.

Using fantasy to build word of mouth hype is fine if you only want to sell to Nintendo fans, but those people were 100% all in before the reveal. The rest of the market needs to be sold on the Switch. Nintendo just sitting back and saying "we have Zelda" will never be good enough.

The Switches marketing and vision have been pretty clear tbh.

 

[McMoneyman]

Jax's posts will be amazing to revisit in a year. A next generation's AceBandage in every way.

Catching up with PS4 in two years, yeah no.

Correct me if I'm wrong but hasn't PS4 almost caught up with the 3DS at this point.

 

[spekkeh]

Wow, you really dont see why nobody bought the WiiU do you - Its 2017 and the last few years most kids game in parties online in GTA 5, COD, BF, Destiny, Overwatch, R6, Division, Minecraft....I could go on but hey

WiiU did not play those games and it was a toaster - your list might have had some impact if people playing the big western games even looked at it....but they did not because GTA 5 etc

You list reads like something 10 years ago maybe....times change. You non interest and poor weighting in online ecosystem is wrong.

However for a hand held device it might not matter so much to that market (whatever size it is)

Am I out of touch, no it's the kids who are wrong etc.
Fair point, I'd be interested in what the party chat usage statistics really are. I know one of my friends on my friends list is almost always in a party chat but the others aren't, but yes I'm old. In any case I would argue the convenience of party chat mostly follows the biggest install base (you get the console all your friends have for it), the list of points I made were mostly about getting an install base in the first place, where Nintendo failed to take off. After that you can talk about positive feedback loops. And the 10M sales of Kart 8 tells me it's not necessary for online. But still, fair point.

 

[b00_thegh0st]

While I totally see where you both are coming from, the post was about sales. Those shooters are super popular among kids, especially the Tween crowd that's mostly outgrowing things like Minecraft and wanting to play the "cool" games.

For better or worse that drives a lot of sales, and Nintendo not being competitive there has hurt the size of their base. It's a shame too as they had a good start at adding those things to their library with Goldeneye and Perfect Dark on N64 along side Mario, Zelda, Smash, Mario Kart etc.

I knew what you meant. I just wanted to point out that Nintendo still has a purpose out there, despite the shrinking of their base.

 

[Hoo-doo]

What is "blind" in this case? Like optimistic people are just misinformed? How does that work?

No, the optimistic people are continuously extrapolating their own excitement and are often projecting it on the market at large. Acting like it's surely going to be the next big thing. It happened with the Wii-U the exact same way.

And that's simply not how it works. We're not living in some happy universal gaming utopia where everything is a success because you personally think Zelda is worth a 300+$ investment. Oftentimes they don't realize the Nintendo hype-bubble they are in.

Correct me if I'm wrong but hasn't PS4 almost caught up with the 3DS at this point.

Have you seen me make statements about the PS4 catching up with 3DS before launch? Are the situations even comparable?

Jax's claim is just too wild to just ignore. The 3DS only took off once it got a severe pricecut down to 179 bucks. At 250 it was a non-starter. The handheld market is not going to march out en masse for a 300 dollar handheld anytime soon, I think.

 

[McMoneyman]

Have you seen me make statements about the PS4 catching up with 3DS before launch? Are the situations even comparable?

Jax's claim is just too wild to just ignore. The 3DS only took off once it got a severe pricecut down to 179 bucks. At 250 it was a non-starter. The handheld market is not going to march out en masse for a 300 dollar handheld anytime soon, I think.

No no, I was just asking a question about it. I don't think the Switch could possibly catch the PS4. And if the PS4 will catch the 3DS, which levels I doubt the Switch will reach.

 

[Lionel Richie]

Yep, very much agree.

I'm skeptical they'll find long term relevance as a hardware maker with this approach, but they shouldn't go away from it. Their games are fantastic and it would be terrible if they shifted to copycat western AAA trends. If the market for their type of games (including the type of Japanese third party exclusives they get) isn't big enough to sustain a hardware platform, so be it. Go third party, or be like Blizzard and just put out their own storefront for the AAA games they want to keep making while focusing a lot on mobile. No reason to change the type of games they make. They just have to adapt the delivery mechanism for those games to fit the market's willingness (or unwillingness) to buy their hardware to play them. Switch sales will be key here.

Blizzard is actually a perfect comparison to Nintendo going away from hardware if they ever do that. I really can't see them partnering up with Sony or Microsoft or doing what Sega did. I don't see them ever deluding their games or their vision because they have shown over the past 3 decades how resilient they are on those. I definitely see a storefront like Blizzard's for them to continue to release games. Which is honestly ideal if the Switch or the Switch 2 flounders.

 

[Christberg]

The problem with Wii U was a hardware and general messaging one. A PS360 power console with a screen in the controller at the tail end of that generation was a bad move. It cut off their casual base at the knees and offered very little to core gamers that they didn't already have.

I got my money's worth out of mine and then some, but it's not like I don't see the obvious failure it was and why.

Switch has a much better core hardware proposition and it's immediately evident that this is the case.

OS stuff is window dressing. Online is important once the big games start to release (like MK.) Not really concerned about either of these things at launch, although I agree that them showing this stuff earlier and gathering user feedback would be very encouraging.

 

[b00_thegh0st]

We're not living in some happy universal gaming utopia where everything is a success because you personally think Zelda is worth a 300+$ investment. Oftentimes they don't realize the Nintendo hype-bubble they are in.

True. But you also don't get this "Switch is a piece of junk because that's not what I wanted it to be" pov vomited thread upon thread with the 2 other major companies.

Some ppl need to grow up and just admit they're not interested in Nintendo's offering.

I personally don't care for PS and XBox and I'm not splattering it in every thread I come across.

 

[Schnozberry]

I think the article makes some salient points in that Nintendo needs to be showing off the system's online functionality if they're going to be charging for it. I bought into the Wii U, but I can't justify repeating that mistake for a $300 package that comes with no online membership (aside from the beta), no games, and no SD card. Even the Wii U had a model that came with more internal storage and a game.

So they should have included a game, an SD Card, and a subscription to their online service and kept the price at $300?

I think that expectation is a bit distorted. No one could make money with that approach.

 

[Easy_D]

A port, yeah. Not a new one though.

Oh. I missed you saying new

 

[TimeEffect]

True or false: WiiU had similar hype to Switch

I recall people being really hyped and I cant help but feel this is a repeat

 

[Lionel Richie]

No, the optimistic people are continuously extrapolating their own excitement and are often projecting it on the market at large. Acting like it's surely going to be the next big thing. It happened with the Wii-U the exact same way.

And that's simply not how it works. We're not living in some happy universal gaming utopia where everything is a success because you personally think Zelda is worth a 300+$ investment. Oftentimes they don't realize the Nintendo hype-bubble they are in.

Isn't that what every fan does? Expect to see their excitement translated into mass euphoria for that specific product. It didn't just happen with the Wii U, but it happens with every fucking thing ever. Frankly it's much more rational and logical than continuing to see parallels between the Switch and the Wii U on everything.

Also, the Switch hasn't been released. You personally might feel it isn't "worth a 300+$ investment to play Zelda", but you don't know for sure that's how the market will react. So you're the one projecting your own feelings about this into how the overall public will react. Ironic, isn't it?

 

[spekkeh]

You say the article is wrong for saying Nintendo is making the same mistakes as they did with the Wii U but then you list a bunch of faults that are absolutely happening with the Switch. The bolded were problems with the wii u and are happening now. Some of those items have been Nintendo's MO for multiple generations.

Yeah I never said they got all of their mistakes right this time around, I said the mistakes that Polygon mentions are absolutely minute and insignificant compared with some of the much more glaring issues.
I think Nintendo's lineup this time around is much, much better though. Getting an open world action adventure, a fighting game, a competitive shooter, racing game, RPG, and more all out in the first couple of months is infinitely better for growing the player base into a diverse and marketing wise interesting direction than just 2D platformers and party games.

Simply put, messaging ruined the wii u's launch. Nintendo's messaging with the Switch launch is even worse. Nintendo at least tried to communicate properly last generation. This generation has largely been a bunch of silence from Nintendo on some potentially deal breaking issues, leaving Nintendo fans to fill the void by pushing their preferred scenarios as fact.

Using fantasy to build word of mouth hype is fine if you only want to sell to Nintendo fans, but those people were 100% all in before the reveal. The rest of the market needs to be sold on the Switch. Nintendo just sitting back and saying "we have Zelda" will never be good enough.

Ehhhhh. Calling it a fantasy world when last time even professional journalists weren't sure whether the thing they unveiled was a new console is incredibly rich and uncalled for.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

And that's simply not how it works. We're not living in some happy universal gaming utopia where everything is a success because you personally think Zelda is worth a 300+$ investment. Oftentimes they don't realize the Nintendo hype-bubble they are in

The system will not be $300 forever. Most systems see their best years around year 3 of their life when the price is lower. I dont get why the argument about the systems sales is so heavily based on it being $300. It's going to drop in price and it will improve it's library.

I don't see it doing poorly like the WiiU did. Should do alright.

 

[Lionel Richie]

True or false: WiiU had similar hype to Switch

I recall people being really hyped and I cant help but feel this is a repeat

False. The Switch has a much clearer message and isn't held back from the same issue the Wii U had, like people don't knowing if it was a new thing or a Wii accessory and such. "People being really hyped" is a bad way to compare both scenarios that are completely unrelated because people are hyped for everything.

 

[sammyCYBORG]

WiiU at least had a lot of interesting games announced pre-launch, so far we have Zelda and Mario.

The lack of games is the biggest issue with the Switch.

 

[Lylo]

I think we should be worried about what we know, not about what we don't know. Ok, Nintendo didn't release much information regarding it's online service, but they did said there would be a trial period until fall, which i believe starts in late september. So we'll have 6 months to see if Nintendo is really ready to charge us for their online service at no cost. I don't know why should i complain about that.

 

[Soph]

I personally don't care for PS and XBox and I'm not splattering it in every thread I come across.

It's so much more fun to ridicule Nintendo fans! Ever since the times of blast processing I've been licking their salty tears.

True or false: WiiU had similar hype to Switch

I recall people being really hyped and I cant help but feel this is a repeat

I don't think there has been any console with less hype than the WIi U.. maybe the Playstation TV. (I can recall people on NeoGAF being utterly hyped for that as well)

 

[Linkstrikesback]

They'll have online of course, and I don't get why they need to complicate it with phone apps etc., but they are trying to differentiate themselves with stuff like focus on local MP, motion controls, more party games etc.

I think you're right there. The problem with switch is that they seem to be throwing everything at a wall and hoping something sticks, rather than Wii where they had solid gold and they knew it. The joycon could have been a good follow up to the wiimote, but, and maybe I'm mistaken, but I think they missed the opportunity to have that be a thing people want because of the large gap in time from when the Wiimote was on everyone's minds and now 2010 or 11 at the latest, I'd guesstimate). They let the market lapse and as has been said ad nauseum, the mobile market likely sucked that audience all up and it'll be very hard to get them back.

 

[schuelma]

WiiU at least had a lot of interesting games announced pre-launch, so far we have Zelda and Mario.

The lack of games is the biggest issue with the Switch.

I really really disagree. What was "interesting" about Wii U pre-launch announced games? Zombi U was probably the most interesting.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Isn't that what every fan does? Expect to see their excitement translated into mass euphoria for that specific product. It didn't just happen with the Wii U, but it happens with every fucking thing ever. Frankly it's much more rational and logical than continuing to see parallels between the Switch and the Wii U on everything.

Also, the Switch hasn't been released. You personally might feel it isn't "worth a 300+$ investment to play Zelda", but you don't know for sure that's how the market will react. So you're the one projecting your own feelings about this into how the overall public will react. Ironic, isn't it?

Except I actually provided some context for that statement, seeing that the 3DS did not sell until it got a huge price reduction.
Obviously I can't state exactly what's going to happen with the Switch but if people in this thread expect the handheld gamers to propel this thing towards 60+ million sales in as little as two years, then I seriously doubt that.

I mean, speculation is fine in any direction. But just base it on something beyond your own excitement. There's some precedent here with the Switch and I think everyone with a neutral viewpoint can see that the Switch has some hurdles to jump before becoming a huge success. A few of them are outlined in the article.

But if you have a proper line of reasoning that convinces me otherwise, i'm all ears. I'm not averse to having an actual discussion.

 

[RRockman]

It never fails to make me laugh

 

[essenn]

WiiU at least had a lot of interesting games announced pre-launch, so far we have Zelda and Mario.

The lack of games is the biggest issue with the Switch.

Arms, Splatoon 2, Xenoblade 2 are not interesting games?

I'd take Arms and Splatoon over Mario Odyssey any day

Splatoon was better than 3D World to me

 

[spekkeh]

WiiU at least had a lot of interesting games announced pre-launch, so far we have Zelda and Mario.

The lack of games is the biggest issue with the Switch.

Arms, Splatoon, Kart, Xenoblade.

What did WiiU have announced? Nintendoland, NSMBU, ZombiU, Pikmin 3 and Wonderful 101, the latter two of which were eight months out.

There was a reason Wii U was the only Nintendo console I had zero hype for and didn't buy at or near launch since the NES.

 

[reelbigtink]

True or false: WiiU had similar hype to Switch

I recall people being really hyped and I cant help but feel this is a repeat

Anecdotal, but three of my casual video game friends who didn't care about Wii U have preordered a Switch. I think that new Zelda alone will make this a more successful launch than Wii U.

 

[marc^o^]

The handheld market is not going to march out en masse for a 300 dollar handheld anytime soon, I think.

The handheld market, the price sensitive one, won't get it at that price. Nintendo will need a handheld SKU for these, probably next year with Pokemon and/or Animal Crossing. Meanwhile Nintendo is For the Gamers. Sony nailed it with this punchline. It fits Switch just as well. So Nintendo fans and non console warriors, who skipped Wii U and have the money to expand gaming beyond their living room. The own "anytime, anywhere" Switch proposal certainly is enticing.

 

[TheMoon]

Nintendo thinks noslatgia (and loyalty) will do the job! A big mistake from a comapny that is so oldschool in terms of management and business (wont end well)

Im buying the Switch just for Zelda and the new Mario! After that it will collect dust till the new Metroid.... if ever.

The irony here is killing me.

 

[RoyalFool]

Switch has a much better core hardware proposition.

What metrics are you using for this? If we are talking about power differential then the Switch has a significantly larger distance to make up than even the Wii U had at the time.

By summer the market will consist of the 6tf Scorpio, 4.3tf PS4Pro, 1.8tf PS4 then the 1.3tf Xbone. The switch, when docked, maxes out at 1tf, then when undocked is rumored to sit at around 0.5-0.6.

Not sure how you can say it's a strong hardware proposition when for £150 more you get a machine 12 times as powerful, albeit one that cannot be turned into a portable.

Spoiler

Waiting for the 'but Scorpio doesn't have a distance sensor!!' response

 

[TheOnlyOneHeEverFeared]

Blind optimismism is worse than conservative pessimism.

Is it though? Is it even 'blind'?

 

[GankzyMcfly]

What is "blind" in this case? Like optimistic people are just misinformed? How does that work?

lol seriously? From my impressions of this thread all i see is two side of people...the first side is essentially arguing the switch has a lack of information surrounding it (to sums things up briefly) and said lack of information is a problem....the second side isn't necessarily arguing against the fact that the switch has a lack of information surrounding , but instead is arguing against the fact that said lack of information is a problem for nintendo....so despite both parties being blind to the same thing...one is optimistic... i wouldn't really say i have a dog in this race, but you are clearly making every effort to defend the switch at every turn, despite having no additional information over anyone here.