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[Welfare]

Wow, just caught up with everything on the matter and just, wow. Never really liked Phil, but he got people to enjoy a game and actually had a following (for better or worse), so I respect him for that.

Who ever did this just doesn't give a fuck anymore.

 

[VisceralBowl]

I haven't been keeping up with any of this, but are Fez and Polytron really up for sale?

 

[Neoriceisgood]

This, "He did it to himself" BS hits pretty close to home.

A few months back my girlfriend (who is very sick) had her tumblr hacked and her personal information posted. She was asleep when it all went down and woke up to this huge shit storm.

Everyone claimed she did it to herself, that she posted her own personal information to garner sympathy. This, after she had been receiving death threats and rape threats and harassment from reddit's "tumblr in action" forum for months on end.

People immediately jumped to "she's the one who did it", then a group of people decided that she's faking her illness and was scamming people when she was asking for small donations to help out after losing her job.

There seems to be a certain mindset among a group of people on the internet that the only way something like this would happen to someone is if they did it to themselves and anyone it happens to is some kind of drama queen looking for attention and it's sickening.

Sorry to hear this happened. :/

It's actually quite common, it's a big reason I'm extremely reluctant to participate in covnersations about "attention wh*ring" or anything of that nature.

I've seen it used several times as a weapon to try and outright destroy people, especially after they've been bullied, beaten or severely compromised.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

This is never going to be true. Not when people have Twitter and Facebook accounts set up in their own name with their actual face as their avatar. People today do not give a shit if you know that they're racist, sexist, or homophobic. The links that are posted every few hours in the Mike Brown thread in the OT show this quite well. In many ways people seem proud of it now.

That's true. I think the rest of my post still stands though.

 

[wuth]

i'm ok with instantly discrediting every single word someone says if they use the term SJW

Yup. It's fast becoming just another internet-era anti-intellectual slur.

 

[Welfare]

I haven't been keeping up with any of this, but are Fez and Polytron really up for sale?

According to his twitter, yes.

 

[Interfectum]

This is never going to be true. Not when people have Twitter and Facebook accounts set up in their own name with their actual face as their avatar. People today do not give a shit if you know that they're racist, sexist, or homophobic. The links that are posted every few hours in the Mike Brown thread in the OT show this quite well. In many ways people seem proud of it now.

Yeah. We are a very angry, divided society. Pretty depressing to be honest.

 

[besada]

I got news for you from a country where being a writter that is outside of a specific clique and a public persona gets you that.

Present your evidence to me via PM -- you have an hour.

 

[Myggen]

This is never going to be true. Not when people have Twitter and Facebook accounts set up in their own name with their actual face as their avatar. People today do not give a shit if you know that they're racist, sexist, or homophobic. The links that are posted every few hours in the Mike Brown thread in the OT show this quite well. In many ways people seem proud of it now.

Of course people are in general willing to post more hate under an alias than under their own name. That some people are so far gone that they post that shit with their full name doesn't change that fact.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Sorry to hear this happened. :/

It's actually quite common, it's a big reason I'm extremely reluctant to participate in covnersations about "attention wh*ring" or anything of that nature.

I've seen it used several times as a weapon to try and outright destroy people, especially after they've been bullied, beaten or severely compromised.

Lesson being

Limit your exposure on the internet or be ready to accept the risks of being completely vulernable without recourse

 

[mattp]

Yup. It's fast becoming just another internet-era anti-intellectual slur.

i really can't take anyone seriously who uses that stupid term sincerely

 

[RadarScope1]

The term "SJW", or at least how it was used nowl. was more or less invented by people in Men's Rights Activist circles, ie. the people who fight to keep the status quo, or better yet go back to the fucking 50s. It's used as a derisive term by those people, and not as a tern by the people who are actually trying to push back against the status quo.

Yeah, I'm reading it as a pejorative. That's why it bums me out!

 

[KePoW]

According to his twitter, yes.

I thought his twitter was hacked??

 

[besada]

So what exactly is the problem with the gaming community?

You probably don't want to play Socratic dialogue with me today. If you don't understand what I'm talking about, I suggest you read the thread. If that doesn't do it for you, you're welcome to PM me, where I am not bound by the decorum of being a moderator.

 

[PsychoSoldier]

While Facebook and Twitter have shown us pretty clearly that people are willing to say terrible things under their real name, people willing to do actually criminal things like this will hide as far behind that proverbial cloak as they can.

 

[Welfare]

I thought his twitter was hacked??

Polytron twitter was, not Phils personal twitter.

 

[anexanhume]

People keep saying this, but I'm part of other communities where this doesn't happen. John Scalzi is an outspoken progressive, much hated by the same sorts of morons that are doing this stuff, but he's never been hacked or doxxed. Yelled at? Sure. Called names? Sure. Had his banking information, private mails, and life details vomited onto the internet? Nope.

Keep saying it to convince yourselves if you need to, but those of us who are part of other communities know better. And so long as people keep ignoring the problem within this community, you give it cover in which to grow.

There was a similar thing in hockey bloggers recently too. One writer was sending unsolicited creepy things to females in the community. One exposes him and the others get the courage to do so. In the process, apparently one person lied to a male supporting the victims and a bunch of male hockey bloggers used that to dismiss the whole thing and ignore the issue. Pretty disheartening.

 

[DrROBschiz]

While Facebook and Twitter have shown us pretty clearly that people are willing to say terrible things under their real name, people willing to do actually criminal things like this will hide as far behind that proverbial cloak as they can.

Being anonymous and having no accountability seems to allow evil to be committed whimsically

Its a truly scary and fundamental existence on the internet. You can literally ruin lives without recourse

 

[Krejlooc]

Oh wow I just saw all this. This is absolutely awful. Social security numbers, bank accounts, the works? How can some guy saying things on the internet incite this sort of rage from people?

We live in a disappointing world.

 

[kinoki]

I wish we could just go back and discuss Xbone DRM and that PS4 has no games... it was a better time before we devolved into this. Please stop.

 

[Tash]

Lesson being

Limit your exposure on the internet or be ready to accept the risks of being completely vulernable without recourse

Yeah, the only problem with this is the internet is the ONLY worthwhile source for small indie devs on shoe-string budget to get attention without spending a shitload on marketing..and in order for this to work you have to show the world who you are.

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

Present your evidence.

http://www.letraslibres.com/revista/dossier/la-herejia-de-octavio-paz

 

[Toxi]

For the record, Renaud is considering reporting the whole thing but needs to gather the evidence together. Hopefully this helps silence the fucking ridiculous "Phil did it!" group a little.

This is why the whole "Phil Fish is an asshole" tangent is so poisonous. There are other people whose lives are affected by this shit, and it's both disrespectful and completely irrelevant to focus on Mr. Fish's temper as some sort of excuse or justification when these people are getting hit by the fallout.

 

[RicoTheMad]

I wish we could just go back and discuss Xbone DRM and that PS4 has no games... it was a better time before we devolved into this. Please stop.

As the owner of a PS4, I still feel it has no gaemz :-/

It *will* finally have gaemz this fall though. Evil Within and Shadow of Mordor, finally!

 

[Riposte]

You probably don't want to play Socratic dialogue with me today. If you don't understand what I'm talking about, I suggest you read the thread. If that doesn't do it for you, you're welcome to PM me, where I am not bound by the decorum of being a moderator.

You are actually not being very clear in your comparison to, I assume, a science fiction community. Is the problem the practice of doxing being endemic or the attitudes behind the people doing it?

 

[SEGAvangelist]

As the owner of a PS4, I still feel it has no gaemz :-/

It *will* finally have gaemz this fall though. Evil Within and Shadow of Mordor, finally!

But how many exclusive AAA games will it have?

 

[jett]

I mentioned this on the previous page, but here's a picture.

I can't even begin to imagine why he's bothering replying to people.

 

[BibiMaghoo]

Wow this is amazing.

Yes it is. The ending sentence alone speaks volumes.

I do, which is why I don't tell people to kill themselves, or how much I want to set them on fire?

I never said you're not allowed to form opinions based on what people *choose* to put out attached to their names on the web. Everything I write, I expect, to be judged by. I do my best to make sure I make my points as clearly as possible. Sometimes you are misunderstood, it happens, but regardless, to put things out there and not expect people to make judgements on it is silly and obtuse.

I can think you're an asshole all day, but that doesn't mean I get to behave like a dick to you. Mutual respect goes a long way, and on the internet, if you feel like a conversation is pointless of damaging, there are *many* ways to disengage from it.

On twitter you could block people, report them. Same on Facebook, same on here.

And if you try *reeeally hard* you can even just willfully make yourself skip past the vitriol and not even do any of those. Who knows, that person may contribute something of worth later?

That wasn't the part I underlined lol.

I was saying that you, me and the people that attack or judge him via the internet, do not know him either. If people attacked me all day via social media, it's quite likely I would tell them to fuck off, as would perhaps you. We don't get to sit here and say he is wrong for how he handles something because of how you or I would. I can't speak for you, but I assume as with myself, we have never been in that position, thankfully.

Did you watch that video you quoted? It is worth your time I think.

 

[Piston Hyundai]

It *will* finally have gaemz this fall though. Evil Within and Shadow of Mordor, finally!

Not to derail the discussion, but they're not really reasons to own a PS4, though. You'd have no problem playing those if you didn't have a current-gen console. Even Destiny is going to be on the previous-gen consoles.

2015 is going to be that year tho

 

[CambriaRising]

As the owner of a PS4, I still feel it has no gaemz :-/

It *will* finally have gaemz this fall though. Evil Within and Shadow of Mordor, finally!

Doesn't count because they aren't exclusivez. Have the great list wars taught you nothing, good sir?

 

[Toxi]

I can't even begin to imagine why he's bothering replying to people.

Because he's pissed off and human.

In his situation, I would have probably swan-dived off the sanity board Phil Fish-style the moment people accused me of lying about my recent identity theft.

 

[Neoriceisgood]

I can't even begin to imagine why he's bothering replying to people.

Haven't you paid attention? Shutting down evidence or refusing to reply is evidence that you're a fraud.

Spoiler

sigh.

 

[Shingro]

A large percentage of the gaming community is teen - young adult males that think that because they have the anonymity of the internet in front of them they can say and do whatever the fuck they want.

You're obviously going to get bad eggs in every community but there are a lot of bad eggs in the gaming community because of the primary target audience. The target audience that is fed white male protagonists and shitty female characters and LGBT stereotypes and white saviour stories that do nothing to broaden their horizons or understanding of the world.

As long as devs continue to cater to these people, the gaming community will still consist of these people and they will feel that any deviation from the norm, be it feminism, LGBT activism, or racial equality etc is something that is reserved for crazy nut job "social justice warriors" who are trying to shit on the things they love.

This is a little close to the "violent video games will continue to create violent individuals" I remember from way back for me, but you're certainly entitled to your opinion.

I suspect it's more that gaming is so large, and such a connected community that we not only get a larger "insane 1%" but it's also way easier to hear them.

(don't get me wrong, gaming does have issues with transitioning from a 'boy's club' mentality, but I don't think being a gamer can be used as an indicator of, or is damaging to, your position on lgbt issues etc. either :/ )

 

[Orakio Rob]

This, "He did it to himself" BS hits pretty close to home.

A few months back my girlfriend (who is very sick) had her tumblr hacked and her personal information posted. She was asleep when it all went down and woke up to this huge shit storm.

Everyone claimed she did it to herself, that she posted her own personal information to garner sympathy. This, after she had been receiving death threats and rape threats and harassment from reddit's "tumblr in action" forum for months on end.

People immediately jumped to "she's the one who did it", then a group of people decided that she's faking her illness and was scamming people when she was asking for small donations to help out after losing her job.

There seems to be a certain mindset among a group of people on the internet that the only way something like this would happen to someone is if they did it to themselves and anyone it happens to is some kind of drama queen looking for attention and it's sickening.

Oh man, this is awful

 

[Faustek]

You probably don't want to play Socratic dialogue with me today. If you don't understand what I'm talking about, I suggest you read the thread. If that doesn't do it for you, you're welcome to PM me, where I am not bound by the decorum of being a moderator.

hmm, I'm not trying to fellate you or anything but the past days I've seen more of you than ever before and I would like to get your unfettered thoughts on the issue so in other words, may I also pm you and hear your thoughts?

This is never going to be true. Not when people have Twitter and Facebook accounts set up in their own name with their actual face as their avatar. People today do not give a shit if you know that they're racist, sexist, or homophobic. The links that are posted every few hours in the Mike Brown thread in the OT show this quite well. In many ways people seem proud of it now.

I don't think it's people actually being racist/misogynist/homophobic/plain hateful. I think it's coming from a place even darker than that. Self hate, no prospects, nothing they can call their own, just and empty void that needs to filled.

I'm in no way defending this behaviour in any way. There exists help for the people that need it.

 

[KoopaTheCasual]

One thing is pushing social issues aside and another is label the whole as that. When you do that you are alienating people, and not exactly the people that are actually toxic in the community.

Yes, lemme calm down for a second and be more clear. In both cases, I'm speaking strictly of the fringe members of the community. Gaming as a whole is an awesome thing, that allows for accessibility on a really high level. I just think we need to police behavior like... this a lot better, because it only makes us all look bad.

It does. Out of all the communities I'm involved in the gaming community is by far the most toxic. I don't want to push the issue to the side. I also don't want to go away from the community, even if I don't know how to help it aside from not being part of the problem or escalating conflicts.

Yea, I love gaming, and I don't think anything would push me away, but I feel like we just need more serious dialogue on why our community is conducive to behavior like in the OP, as well as "fans" demanding information from the professionals. I think it's time we stop hand-waving the term "gamer entitlement" away as a simple pejorative.

 

[besada]

Anyone is always welcome to PM me. I'm a mod, and that's what we do.

 

[RicoTheMad]

Doesn't count because they aren't exclusivez. Have the great list wars taught you nothing, good sir?

I humbly beg apologies, I forgot since I own a PS4 i must staunchly defend its exclusives. How about that Bloodborne? Huh? Huh?!

Sorry I'll go back and hide in my hole now. I suck at this gamer thing, but to be fair, gamedev is time consuming and making games leaves you almost no time to play them!

But I still buy them. My bank account hates me.

 

[Ingueferroque]

I can't even begin to imagine why he's bothering replying to people.

Those tweets (not from Renaud) are insane. Such a hostile reaction to someone elses misfortune. Disgusting behavior.

 

[kinoki]

Anyone is always welcome to PM me. I'm a mod, and that's what we do.

#weloveneogafmods

 

[Kabuki Quantum Lover]

As a white male, my hatred of white males is soaring these past few days.

 

[Ingueferroque]

As a white male, my hatred of white males is soaring these past few days.

What the fuck does that even mean?

 

[jett]

Those tweets (not from Renaud) are insane. Such a hostile reaction to someone elses misfortune. Disgusting behavior.

They're nothing but miserable, self-loathing fucks. Renaud really should get away from twitter for his own health.

 

[Marky Mark]

Those passwords seems encrypted though, so they're safe right?

It's a UNIX system! I know this!

 

[Riposte]

As a white male, my hatred of white males is soaring these past few days.

Because of Phil Fish? Of the actors in this recent event, he is the only confirmed white male.

 

[TheLostBigBoss]

As a white male, my hatred of white males is soaring these past few days.

 

[kinoki]

What the fuck does that even mean?

To quote Tom Lehrer:

"I know there are people in the world who do not love their fellow human beings... and I hate people like that."

 

[lefantome]

Has Phil Fish contacted the police yet? what happened is a crime, if he did it there is no doubt he was really hacked and doxxed.

 

[Pyroclastic]

As a white male, my hatred of white males is soaring these past few days.

well yeah that's definitely a sensible and measured position to take from this whole debacle.

 

[RicoTheMad]

Yes it is. The ending sentence alone speaks volumes.



That wasn't the part I underlined lol.

I was saying that you, me and the people that attack or judge him via the internet, do not know him either. If people attacked me all day via social media, it's quite likely I would tell them to fuck off, as would perhaps you. We don't get to sit here and say he is wrong for how he handles something because of how you or I would. I can't speak for you, but I assume as with myself, we have never been in that position, thankfully.

Did you watch that video you quoted? It is worth your time I think.

I did respond to your underline. That is my response. You are welcome to judge away at people all day long as long as you're not an asshole to them. If you don't want people thinking you're some jerk, don't put it out there and be one.

Does that mean people get to spam you, etc? No. Does that mean you get to stoop to their level if you do? No, not if you're a mature individual.

I've gotten a ton of douchy comments about my game on Steam. A lot of them blatantly false, etc. Do I call them names? No. If I disagree and feel like it needs to be addressed, I explain why they may be wrong. If I feel like it's just a troll comment, I leave it be. If it's a bunch of vitriol with no point to it, it gets deleted.

But I do my best not to engage them in their games. He should know better by now. It's part of putting yourself out there to the public, you need to grow a thick skin.

Is it awesome that you need to do this? No. Does it change the fact that shouting obscenities on your soapbox to some random internet kid (because most likely they are a kid) is wrong too? No.

You don't make things get better by getting in shouting matches. Lead by example, specially when you have people looking at you.