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Pope inducts a U.S. cardinal who openly clashed with Mike Pence on Syrian immigration
- Thread starter CO_Andy
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a lot of my threads involve me fucking up somehow. Perhaps I'm a moron?
It's bizarre how progressive the Catholic church can be sometimes.
Skellig Gra
Member
This has always been one of their core beliefs. Which is why their stance on gay marriage is so stupid.
darkistheway
Member
This is the Catholic Church. Most Christians in America have nothing to do with it.
exmachina64
Banned
Skellig Gra
Member
Also its not hard to figure out. Democrats are for abortion, the church is super against it. They rarely talk about anything else political at all on a local level. If you are a devout Catholic its basically impossible to be a democrat.
Catholics represent a minority of Christians in America. And lots of Catholics are Democrats. See, for example, Tim Kaine. Indeed, our only ever Catholic President was a Democrat.
I am a devout Catholic and would be a democrat if I lived in the states.
I'm pro-life, but not a single issue voter and climate change is the #1 issue of our time as the Pope has said.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
It's been two steps forward one step back with the new pope, but that's better than no progress at all.
Especially compared to Pope Palpatine
It's a bit larger than 20% of the population and the largest denomination of Christianity in the US.
Alas Catholics voted for Trump 50-46.
And bullshit on this whole "can't be a devote catholic and be a Democrat." The church's stance on universal health care, immigration, the death penalty, torture, war, poverty, the environment, and homelessness are impossible to ignore.
Skellig Gra
Member
A perfectly reasonable approach. What I'm saying is that in America the local churches push the pro life agenda very very hard. I dont know what its like where you are.
Okay then how do Catholics vote for the GOP? Oh Abortion. Makes sense I guess although mental gymnastics is still required to vote both for and against your own values.
BladeoftheImmortal
Member
But my parents are Catholic and voted trump.
Definitely, unfortunately most Catholics that I know just could not get over Clinton being pro-choice, even here in Canada. There were a ton of American Catholic priests basically telling their churches vote for Trump in the last month of the election and the Podesta e-mails didn't help.
JonnyDBrit
Member
Breaking that down further: White Catholics 37-60 Clinton-Trump, Hispanic Catholics 67-26. There's gonna be a lot of correlation of matter outside of the faith in that regard.
But yeah, given Francis himself is a Pope from what's typically seen as a 'third world country', and descended of migrants, its not hard to see how either this appointment or his general stance on the issue have come about.
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
Why is this so news worthy? Why would the Pope give a shit what Mike pence thinks? Maybe I'm missing something.
darkistheway
Member
What does that have to with the erroneous point I was responding to?
The majority of Christians in America don't give a shit about what the Pope says. That's just a fact. His opinions would not affect their politics. That is the entire summer of my point.
Woah there... we're pro-choice, not pro-abortion. There's a big BIG difference.
Skellig Gra
Member
Im talking about its legal standing.
My moms aunt is an octogenarian nun. She lives in a convent of elderly nuns and all but two were against Trump. This lead my moms other aunt asking her sister what about abortion. It's a small group of probably 20-30.
I'm catholic. Participation in Jesus teachings has to be done willingly and shouldn't be forced by means of human governments.
VendettaRed07
Member
Its more like 5 steps forward but still five steps behind with him.
He hasnt moved the church backwards on anything. He just hasn't come as far as people would like but he had made great strides.
Edit: misread as one step forward, two steps back
Gnome Scat
Member
Good to hear.
Yup. My mom's side of the family is Catholic and almost all of them always vote Republican solely because they are "pro-life." Except they had a chance in the W administration to overturn Roe v. Wade and didn't do shit about it. It's just a voting crutch for them because they know they have a base that will always vote for them no matter what. I doubt they will ever overturn it because the pro-lifers are way too gullible to realize that.
I doubt the Republicans would have a chance at winning if both parties had the same policy on abortion.
Agreed.
I've seen some people say they voted for Trump because they are pro-life. If Roe v. Wade hasn't been overturned with the decades of Republican presidents we've had since, it's not going to get overturned now.
The doctrine, from what I remember from Catholic school religion classes, is that marriage (and sex) is for the sake of having kids. In theory they'd also be against heterosexual marriages where people aren't procreating, and sex without the intent of doing such as well. Although I'm sure in practice a number of Catholics are actually against specifically gay marriage. But also a lot of Catholics don't oppose gay marriage or sex before marriage or any number of things. And of course some amount of Catholics voted for Trump. So obviously a lot of Catholics don't actually give a shit about the whole "doctrine" thing, or what the Pope has to say. (Unless they see some fake Facebook story about the Pope endorsing Trump, then they'll gladly spread that fake news and vote for Trump because the Pope said so.)
I imagine sometime in the future the Catholic Church will interpret "procreation" to also include adoption, and the doctrine will be fine with gay marriage so long as they intend to adopt and raise kids.
Exactly my point. I don't think my relatives even believe that Tump is really pro-life- they only voted for him because he's Republican. If Hillary ran as Republican they'd probably vote for her, honestly. As an aside, they were all rooting for Ted Cruz to win the nom.
This is especially hilarious because every single one of the relatives I'm talking about is childless and is married or was married at one point.
KuwabaraTheMan
Banned
Catholics are the most Democratic leaning Christian denomination. They've trended somewhat more Republican in recent years, but a good portion of Catholic voters are still Democrats. Obama carried Catholics in 2012, and Clinton got 45% of them this year.
Gentleman Jack
Member
Or rather, how barbaric and stone-aged most of Mike Pence's ideas about tolerance, war, women's rights, etc are that a church that last reformed the year he was born is ahead of him.
Also, most Christians in America are complete hypocrites who are intellectually divorced from the principles of their faith.
The fact that over 80 percent of white evangelicals in America voted for Trump is a total surrender of whatever moral authority they can ever claim to have.
Our only Catholic President was a Democrat along with his brother and Teddy Kennedy. Biden is Catholic. Tim Kaine is Catholic. John Kerry is Catholic.
There are nearly twice as many Catholic Democrats in the senate than Republican ones.
My parents are Catholic and voted Clinton.
Aztechnology
Member
There's a lot of Catholic people in the U.S. I was raised Catholic and with much reference to the pope and teachings over the years. The thing is it seems like a disproportionate amount of Catholics become agnostic or atheist. I'm personally Agnostic now as are most of my Catholic friends.
or did you just mean like interaction with the Catholic "Church" literally.
Despite what I thought growing up in Jersey, most American Christians are not of the Catholic denomination.
The pope is ethnically Italian. His parents were Italian who left after Mussolini came to power. And the reason for having more cardinals from other continents and countries is to offset the fact that European catholicism has been in a decline and world catholicism is on the rise from south american, african and asian nations like the Philippines. They need to reach out beyond Europe now.
My old, Catholic relatives typically vote Republican but not this time. But yeah Catholics are hella liberal. I was raised in Catholic schools from k-12 and the teachers and faculty all pushed heavy liberal beliefs.
The overlying teaching of all my growing up within Catholicism is no matter what you do, if you leave more good in the world than bad, you good.
All Catholics are Christian but not all Christians are Catholics.
The overlying teaching of all my growing up within Catholicism is no matter what you do, if you leave more good in the world than bad, you good.
All Catholics are Christian but not all Christians are Catholics.
Aztechnology
Member
I don't recall in my post saying that they were the majority of all Americans or anything. But I believe they are still the largest religious group in the U.S. Someone feel free to correct me.
Salty Rice
Member
Omg i read "Pepe" first instead of "Pope" and was like wtf.
Aztechnology
Member
mordecaii83
Member
Not catholic, but I applaud the Pope. Seems like Catholics are more progressive than many/most of the other Christian denominations, which surprises me.
No, though Catholics are the largest single Christian denomination in the US.
Analyzing voting patterns within the Catholic population can get a bit weird since an increasingly sizable proportion of US Catholics are (a) Hispanic and (b) first- & second- generation immigrants.
Seth Enosh
Member
Have you heard of the partial birth abortion ban? It was a major Supreme Court case under GWB's administration, setting a precedent for restricting abortion and chipping away at the existing precedent.
There wasn't really anything else he could do except appoint conservative judges to the SCOTUS, which he did - both Alito and Roberts seem to be ready to overturn Roe v Wade if the GOP can ever get a replacement in for Kennedy or one of the 4 liberals. Not sure what you mean by saying they had a chance under bush to abolish it.
Also, on topic of this thread , this isn't really a surprise. The Catholic Church is strongly pro immigration and pro refugee. Many illegal immigrants are Catholics as well.
Yeah, and the pope is a latin american
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