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[UberTag]

The article HEAVILY missed the point.

It's not that white women largely voted for Trump, but that white uneducated people largely voted for Trump regardless of gender.

Hillary was the first democrat to ever win in the category of college-educated white women. That's HUGE and means that Democrats could potentially win big with the Obama Coalition + College Educated Whites.

Yep, you understand the issue perfectly. The education variable is the problem and it needs to be taken seriously and addressed to ensure those that lack education and training are afforded it instead of being taken advantage of for their fears and intolerance. And that CAN'T happen with a government that is actively exploiting them and pushing their buttons out of self-interest.

 

[LionPride]

So "don't be offended when you're implied to be something you aren't"?

Because that's all people are taking offense with here.

And again, seeing as many here agree with the image's message it's not really just one picture at all, it in fact seems to be an attitude shared by many. Do you disagree with the image's message?

If someone who did not vote for Trump takes issue when the statement "White people voted for Trump" is said, maybe they should figure out why they are offended when someone ain't talking about them.

FyreWulf didn't put StoOgE's name in his post did they? If anything, it's StoOgE that's lashing out at him. If "he already knows that", why did he feel the need to show GAF his receipts on what a good ally he is?

The problem is that the photo in question was supposed to rile people up. Yes, but the proper response would've been to face inwards and begin answering the question of why a majority of white women voted for Trump.

The response here amounts to a bunch of people feeling attacked and then proceeding to putting fingers in their ears. Come on now.

Good post

 

[Fuchsdh]

Dunno about OP's intents, but this thread has confirmed my opinion of the huge racial issues American society has. Thank you, US PoliGAF. Stay strong, know your friends and your enemies. Particularly, don't mix the two.

And what magical happy content land are you from, so we might learn your ways of racial harmony?

 

[Morrigan Stark]

FyreWulf didn't put StoOgE's name in his post did they?

Huh? They were responding to StoOgE's post and explicitly quoted him.

As for the sign, I have no problem with it. The photo framing sucks though because it unfairly targets marching white women as somehow being part of the problem. And the tweet is even worse.

 

[Cesare Borgia]

Where is the sign for Self hating black people and latinos who voted for Trump?
Seriously, this is why progress will never be made,

About 95 or 96% of black women voted for Hillary. If there's one group that gets to talk as much shit as they want and hold signs it's them.

 

[Trey]

Where is the sign for Self hating black people and latinos who voted for Trump?
Seriously, this is why progress will never be made,

nah we gathered folks, black women weren't playing them games.

 

[Aytumious]

I don't want conditional allies on myside. Do some introspection.

Care more about your cause than the imagined purity of your allies. Do some introspection.

 

[NoRéN]

Where is the sign for Self hating black people and latinos who voted for Trump?
Seriously, this is why progress will never be made,

Latinos did so in bigger numbers. Yet, here we are with some people singling out the bigger potential ally: white people.

Whatever. At this point I just remind myself it's not me who the noose is being tied for.

 

[akira28]

Something about that sign reminds me of blasting innocent Muslims for the actions of terrorists.

if the framing is to be about blasting innocent muslims, that's one thing. it could be framed as highlighting the underlying social issues that directly contribute to the problems at hand. without so much "blasting".

the "war on terror" was very much a backseat event to the overarching cultural war going on within Muslim society. And if Muslim society had been able to adequately deal with the different levels of upheaval due to economic shifts, fundamentalist revivalism, foreign policy the GWOT would have played out a lot differently without so many Saudi-Iraq-Afghan-Yemeni-Jordanian misadventures.

instead of worrying about the honor of those poor women having the blame of Trump being laid at their feet, remember that the situation of women in this country is far from united, and that a large number of women voters are presenting themselves as obstacles at best.

 

[Hex]

White allies need to be ready to face criticism sometimes. Warranted and sometimes unwarranted. It's a war and bullets are flying everywhere. If they cannot handle that then they are not needed.

This is also horse shit.
If people can't put aside shit to move forward, then nobody is getting anywhere.
Everyone is needed.
I just can' believe on a day meant for unity and peace against a common enemy people can't put aside or at least stifle such things that tear apart for a day

 

[LionPride]

Where is the sign for Self hating black people and latinos who voted for Trump?
Seriously, this is why progress will never be made,

Did the majority of Black people and Hispanics/Latinos vote for him? Nope

While more Hispanic/Latino people voted for him, sure as hell wasn't above 50%

This is also horse shit.
If people can't put aside shit to move forward, then nobody is getting anywhere.
Everyone is needed.
I just can' believe on a day meant for unity and peace against a common enemy people can't put aside or at least stifle such things that tear apart for a day

Hell no.

 

[blu]

And what magical happy content land are you from, so we might learn your ways of racial harmony?

Haha, I'm from Omicron 5. Seriously, though, we don't get that much racism in Europe. We have too many other bases for segregation to revert to petty racism.

 

[More Fun To Compute]

About 95 or 96% of black women voted for Hillary. If there's one group that gets to talk as much shit as they want and hold signs it's them.

If she only 96% voted for Hilary then does that mean she has to chop off a finger in shame like a Yakuza or something? This logic is dumb imo. People cast their own votes for their own reasons there is no collective responsibility based on race or gender.

 

[Fuchsdh]

Haha, I'm from Omicron 5. Seriously, though, we don't get that much racism in Europe. We have too many other bases for segregation to revert to petty racism.

Tell that to the Roma.

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

Where is the sign for Self hating black people and latinos who voted for Trump?
Seriously, this is why progress will never be made,

The 15% or whatever of black voters who supported Trump isn't comparable to the 50% of white people who did the same.

imo, there's nothing wrong with the sign. It isn't attacking protestors, it doesn't use inflammatory language or imagery. It's just a very real statistic that represents a huge chunk of Trump's victory.

 

[Irminsul]

Because if you're a white person who voted Clinton, who is going to vote for Trump's re-election in 2020 or at the very least stay home or vote third party... because a black person asked you to take a look at yourself in the mirror, or questioned if you were partially culpable for President Trump... Well I don't think you'd be remotely typical or average. I think you'd be incredibly *incredibly* rare.

You really have to explain to me how that accusation makes any sense. I'm partially responsible for Trump if I voted for him. I'm not if I didn't. I can't influence people's minds just because they share my skin colour.

What issues do white people face that the rest of us don't?

Maybe being told they don't have any due to them being white. Now, I'm not saying that's what anyone has actually said, but it could sound like it.

 

[Hex]

Did the majority of Black people and Hispanics/Latinos vote for him? Nope

While more Hispanic/Latino people voted for him, sure as hell wasn't above 50%


Hell no.

Interesting

The 15% or whatever of black voters who supported Trump isn't comparable to the 50% of white people who did the same.

imo, there's nothing wrong with the sign. It isn't attacking protestors, it doesn't use inflammatory language or imagery. It's just a very real statistic that represents a huge chunk of Trump's victory.

I guess I just had some kind of ass backwards ideological view of everyone having a bigger issue right now.
Always something to learn I guess.
For my account safety I'm going to bow out

 

[BlackJace]

Huh? They were responding to StoOgE's post and explicitly quoted him.

As for the sign, I have no problem with it. The photo framing sucks though because it unfairly targets marching white women as somehow being part of the problem. And the tweet is even worse.

I know that, but he post isn't trying to drag StoOgE as a person. FyreWullf responded to him for a number of reasons, I'm not sure what exactly it was (maybe cuz he's a mod, with a nice red name, who knows). I'm sure he could've selected any other post of the same content and it wouldn't change his point. I'm not sure it qualifies as "lashing out" (which again is the root of the problem. Why is this challenging of white America seen as lashing out?)

 

[QisTopTier]

Hell no.

Hell no, is not how movements gain power.

But interesting mentality I guess

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

Maybe being told they don't have any due to them being white. Now, I'm not saying that's what anyone has actually said, but it could sound like it.

...

 

[Trey]

Yep, you understand the issue perfectly. The education variable is the problem and it needs to be taken seriously and addressed to ensure those that lack education and training are afforded it instead of being taken advantage of for their fears and intolerance. And that CAN'T happen with a government that is actively exploiting them and pushing their buttons out of self-interest.

this is important and mostly why I think all this "liberals are doomed" rhetoric is ridiculous. voting patterns are trending in same way they were when everyone was declaring that the GOP faced an existential threat. this election was nutty for a bunch of reasons but how people vote and their background correlations weren't out of bound.

And in the white woman voting block, correcting for education is a critical contextualization. But that's not what this thread has become at this point. People are taking this more like blame, than criticism.

 

[Carcetti]

The power of race as it pertains to men has a direct and massive impact on the day to day lives of the women of that race. The women's march and it's associated activities delude female minorities into believing they can get power by latching onto white women. That white women are more their friends than their own fathers and husbands and brothers. That's a damn lie. To achieve anything, they need to support their own men first and foremost. And they will.

What a thread on women's march really needs is a man telling POC women what they need to do and put men before themselves so that he can choose to trickle down some equality on them.

You sure you didn't get lost on the way to /redpill or Voat?

 

[beacon 0f light]

Something about that sign reminds me of blasting innocent Muslims for the actions of terrorists.

That's the vibe I was getting too. Not really sure how that sign applies to the white women at the march unless it's suggesting that they either (1) are secret trump voters or (2) bear the responsibility for voting trump in solely because their race+gender did.

It also wouldn't make sense to go to a poverty stricken neighborhood in the south side of Chicago holding a sign that says "Remember - people without college degrees voted Trump in." Obviously those people weren't the ones voting in Trump.

 

[Plum]

Small starting points:

-When a factually truthful statement akin to "most White Women voted for Trump" is said, don't get mad if you know in your heart that doesn't apply to you or your friends/family

-If a few (and its always a very small number) people making criticisms along that axis go a bit too far (and you can't actually talk to them), laugh them off or shrug them off instead of getting mad, defensive or proclaiming "this is why Trump won".

The rest of the standard volunteering, voting, protesting, talking to white peers that PoC can't reach, etc. and of course standard empathy should help

If someone who did not vote for Trump takes issue when the statement "White people voted for Trump" is said, maybe they should figure out why they are offended when someone ain't talking about them.

I feel like we're just in a circular argument here because the message of the image is not just a statement of fact, it's implying that, despite protesting, that those three women or whomever Torraine was talking, were still in some way responsible for letting Trump women. They're offended because they're being implicated as the enemy for doing nothing at all. Again, if someone were to post a "53% of White Women voted Trump" thread none of this discussion would be had. Torraine even used the term "Why 53% of you," which, if that isn't clearly saying "you had some part in this," then I don't know what is. People are mad because they imply that it does apply to them and/or their family, not because of the fact itself.

As for the people saying "This is why Trump won," they aren't saying "People will vote for Trump specifically because of this," they are looking at the hard truth that, if we don't unite as a whole, the left will not get the supporters it needs from the moderate and disenfranchised to ever have a chance of winning. I'm a Brit and this is exactly what's happened with our liberal Labour party; an "all or nothing" sector has pushed away the more moderate sector (and vice-versa) leading to total uselessness as people are more focused on infighting than anything else. The fact is that, if the left is to be seen as strong, we don't need this type of criticism at all; fight the actual enemy that's visible and clear, not leftist Clinton supporters that happen to be white. The only goal right now is making sure Trump loses some power in 2018, and all of it in 2020; there is literally no other way things can change as without political backing minorities only have themselves and legally powerless allies to support them.

 

[FUME5]

I ain't know that white women who voted for Trump were allies. The more you know

So because a significant percentage of white American women voted for Trump, all women attending the rally must have voted for Trump and are therefore not allies in the cause of womens rights?

 

[MistakenMobius]

Tell that to the Roma.

Well Roma are white,
So European don't need the Yankee reductio ad color to hate on groups

 

[R0ckman]

I think maybe what would help (for those who can't see people as individuals) is if maybe whites who protest actually organized under generalization. Individualizing as an ally is not as impactful to many as pushing to become an ally as a nationality. Saying something like "whites against bigotry" would start painting the image that the biggots are a smaller rougue faction making them seem like the odd ones out or a blot, not the norm of what being white is.

 

[Irminsul]

Hell no.

So you'd rather perish with style than win? Okay. At least that's clear.

 

[ironmang]

Common sense dictates that you don't gain allies by attacking them, but lately everyone has to one up each other with purity tests.

NFL playoff thread yesterday had several people saying if you don't hate the patriots, you support trump. just lol. It's like you need to check off 1000 different things or else you're racist scum.

Just not trump dividing people at this point.

 

[Kinyou]

Who knows what else those women did before they were at the march. To take them as a symbol for white women is a bit messed up considering they actually went out there to march.

 

[notworksafe]

Who knows what else those women did before they were at the march.

they voted for trump, duh

 

[Chococat]

The power of race as it pertains to men has a direct and massive impact on the day to day lives of the women of that race. The women's march and it's associated activities delude female minorities into believing they can get power by latching onto white women. That white women are more their friends than their own fathers and husbands and brothers. That's a damn lie. To achieve anything, they need to support their own men first and foremost. And they will.

Bullshit. Black women will not be slaves to your need power when you refuse to lift a finger to help them. Black equality is for both sexes- not just men.

Thankfully, black women are strong and can fight for themselves. They don't need YOU. They need black men value their human rights.

 

[KO Traveling Hobo]

I guess I just had some kind of ass backwards ideological view of everyone having a bigger issue right now.
Always something to learn I guess.
For my account safety I'm going to bow out

I think you would agree that one of the most important things we should be doing is figuring out how to prevent Trump or someone like him winning again in 4 years. Because as bad as 4 years of Trump is, 8 or 12 or 16 years of Trumpian politics would be exponentially worse.

Asking why 51% of white women voted for an unrepentant misogynistic rapist is part of that.

 

[celljean89]

I don't know is it possible for a white child to grow up in a multi-culture low income environment and be harassed and assaulted for being white and later in life feel extra mental weight from bigoted white insults? Probably. It's not common but it happens. But it's ok right? He's white fuck the history of his own life. His race has had it made in the big times.

Sorry to hear about that white kid that got bully, and that white kid should get help if that kid haven't yet. Also I wish the white kid the best in everything.

But now imagine if the white kid is black and went through the same situation (kinda). And people in power and the history of the country look down on the kid. And not only the black kid will be hurt by the bullying, but the black kid children, and their children, no matter where they live next. And the black kid's parents and their parents most likely went through worse. Imagine even in a low income environment, it might still be hard for the black kid family to live in because of real estate policy. That black kid might have a bad relationship with authority in his environment and in general. That black kid, if the kid follows a bad path, he might get harder sentences because he's black.

 

[voodoojohn]

What a thread on women's march really needs is a man telling POC women what they need to do and put men before themselves so that he can choose to trickle down some equality on them.

You sure you didn't get lost on the way to /redpill or Voat?

Mm, well, black men need to support their women, too. All I'm saying is race is central issue, not gender. How does that make me a men's rights advocate or a misogynist?

 

[LionPride]

Hell no, is not how movements gain power.

But interesting mentality I guess

I feel like we're just in a circular argument here because the message of the image is not just a statement of fact, it's implying that, despite protesting, that those three women or whomever Torraine was talking, were still in some way responsible for letting Trump women. They're offended because they're being implicated as the enemy for doing nothing at all. Again, if someone were to post a "53% of White Women voted Trump" thread none of this discussion would be had. Torraine even used the term "Why 53% of you," which, if that isn't clearly saying "you had some part in this," then I don't know what is. People are mad because they imply that it does apply to them and/or their family, not because of the fact itself.

As for the people saying "This is why Trump won," they aren't saying "People will vote for Trump specifically because of this," they are looking at the hard truth that, if we don't unite as a whole, the left will not get the supporters it needs from the moderate and disenfranchised to ever have a chance of winning. I'm a Brit and this is exactly what's happened with our liberal Labour party; an "all or nothing" sector has pushed away the more moderate sector (and vice-versa) leading to total uselessness as people are more focused on infighting than anything else. The fact is that, if the left is to be seen as strong, we don't need this type of criticism at all; fight the actual enemy that's visible and clear, not leftist Clinton supporters that happen to be white. The only goal right now is making sure Trump loses some power in 2018, and all of it in 2020; there is literally no other way things can change as without political backing minorities only have themselves and legally powerless allies to support them.

So because a significant percentage of white American women voted for Trump, all women attending the rally must have voted for Trump and are therefore not allies in the cause of womens rights?

That wasn't what anyone said. At all.

So you'd rather perish with style than win? Okay. At least that's clear.

Not everyone is needed, some people *cough* like some folks here who claim they are allies *cough* sure as hell ain't.

There was "infighting" during the primaries and after, but folks ain't care then. A woman holds up a picture, which by itself is fine, and shit is in "shambles"

 

[plagiarize]

You really have to explain to me how that accusation makes any sense. I'm partially responsible for Trump if I voted for him. I'm not if I didn't. I can't influence people's minds just because they share my skin colour.

Sure you can.

Could you have changed one person's mind? Maybe. Maybe not. There are people in this very thread saying they were able to convince family members not to vote for Trump. I know it's a tall order and you're more likely to fail than not...

But yeah. Your family are more likely to listen to you, than a random minority.

 

[Secret Fawful]

This is also horse shit.
If people can't put aside shit to move forward, then nobody is getting anywhere.
Everyone is needed.
I just can' believe on a day meant for unity and peace against a common enemy people can't put aside or at least stifle such things that tear apart for a day

Hell no, is not how movements gain power.

But interesting mentality I guess

So you'd rather perish with style than win? Okay. At least that's clear.

Black people can liberate themselves without us, and they will.

 

[SDBurton]

Hell no.

*Sigh*

 

[Trey]

Mm, well, black men need to support their women, too. All I'm saying is race is central issue, not gender. How does that make me a men's rights advocate or a misogynist?

because you came in a thread about women's rights and gender identity politics with that foolishness, chief

 

[LionPride]

Mm, well, black men need to support their women, too. All I'm saying is race is central issue, not gender. How does that make me a men's rights advocate or a misogynist?

Race AND Gender are central issues.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Did the majority of Black people and Hispanics/Latinos vote for him? Nope

While more Hispanic/Latino people voted for him, sure as hell wasn't above 50%

Still, 1 in 3 Latino men voting for Trump is rather alarming. Can we try to answer this question, too?

We know why so many white women voted Trump. It's because they are more racist than they are feminist, because they are evangelical conservatives single-issue voters about abortion (and maybe gay rights too), and because they are uneducated idiots who thought Trump was bringing the jobs (stolen by minorities ofc) back.

Now that we answered that question let's ask the next one: why is 1 in 3 Latino men voting Trump despite him calling Mexicans rapists? Is it abortion again? Cuba related? Are they more misogynistic than they are pro-women's rights? Maybe they are non-Mexican Latinos who hate Mexicans and agree with Trump? I honestly don't know.

Hell no.

Why not? I don't want 8 years of Trump and I'll take all the help I can get.

What a thread on women's march really needs is a man telling POC women what they need to do and put men before themselves so that he can choose to trickle down some equality on them.

You sure you didn't get lost on the way to /redpill or Voat?

Seriously. What a gross post.

Black people can liberate themselves without us, and they will.

Maybe, but it'll take a long ass time and in the meantime people suffer. Women's rights happened because they fought, of course, but also because they had support from male allies. Without those allies it might have taken much longer for women to get those rights.

 

[Plum]

That wasn't what anyone said. At all.

So you don't have a rebuttal then? Because how can "ask yourselves why 53% of you voted for Trump" not, at the very VERY least, imply some sort of racial responsibility? I'd like at least some part of my post to be properly rebuked.

Not everyone is needed, some people *cough* like some folks here who claim they are allies *cough* sure as hell ain't.

There was "infighting" during the primaries and after, but folks ain't care then. A woman holds up a picture, which by itself is fine, and shit is in "shambles"

This is revisionist history. If you look back at the election the constant infighting between Bernie supporters and Clinton supporters was a pretty major thing. Did you not see the protests during the DNC? That's certainly a lot more than just one thread on GAF.

 

[Gotchaye]

Did the majority of Black people and Hispanics/Latinos vote for him? Nope

While more Hispanic/Latino people voted for him, sure as hell wasn't above 50%

This is something that's sort of weird to me about this conversation. 50% isn't some magical threshold. Like, if 51% of white women had broken for Clinton would this still be a thing? The difference between that and what actually happened is pretty small - it's 1 in 25 white women. The difference between that world and this one probably wouldn't show up in most people's close social circles. If you wouldn't be really concerned about trying to understand and criticize white women's collective politics in that case then it's really kind of weird to be concerned about it now. It's the same politics 96% of the time.

 

[Trojita]

it's so hard, I didn't get the instant results I'm used to being able to get due to my white privilege

What.

You think being white works like that?

 

[voodoojohn]

Race AND Gender are central issues.

Perhaps, but the order goes race, then gender. How does that ordering of priorities make me a misogynist or a mens rights advocate? Race subsumes both genders.

 

[Kinyou]

they voted for trump, duh

Damn, you're good

 

[Zen_Arcade]

53% of white women who voted in the last election isn't a generalization it's a fact.

lol at "Welp 8 more years of trump" comments because of that sign. Calm the fuck down and do some much needed introspection.

The irony of this statement.

 

[The Hermit]

Man you guys are so getting 8 years of Trump.

If they keep the population fighting each other, yeah sure.

 

[LionPride]

*Sigh*

Still, 1 in 3 Latino men voting for Trump is rather alarming. Can we try to answer this question, too?

We know why so many white women voted Trump. It's because they are more racist than they are feminist, because they are evangelical conservatives single-issue voters about abortion (and maybe gay rights too), and because they are uneducated idiots who thought Trump was bringing the jobs (stolen by minorities ofc) back.

Now that we answered that question let's ask the next one: why is 1 in 3 Latino men voting Trump despite him calling Mexicans rapists? Is it abortion again? Cuba related? Are they more misogynistic than they are pro-women's rights? Maybe they are non-Mexican Latinos who hate Mexicans and agree with Trump? I honestly don't know.


Why not? I don't want 8 years of Trump and I'll take all the help I can get.


Seriously. What a gross post.

Not everyone is needed. All help isn't good help. Also, the reason Hispanic/Latinos and Black people voted for Trump is likely the same, "He ain't talking about us when he says blakcs have it bad and Mexicans are rapists and drug dealers, so it's fine." There is a problem there, but not as large as trying to figure out why white women voted for him. If a majority of Hispanics/Latinos voted for him, we'd all be trying to figure out why