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[terrible]

Brands Hatch GP in McLaren 12C
pCARS: 1:33.330
Forza 6: 1:33.239

Brands Hatch GP in Pagani Huayra
pCARS: 1:31.212
Forza 6: 1:31.110
GT6: 1:31.994

Damn, I'm not even close to touching 1:33 on Brands in Forza 6 with the 12C and that's with tires upgraded to sport. I feel like giving up trying at 1:35 lol. I did a 1:32 in pCARS pretty much instantly though (3rd lap?), I wasn't even pushing the car yet. Forza 6 feels a lot slower to me. You have to wait forever to get on the power and my times from lap to lap are really inconsistent compared to pCARS.

edit: I ate some food and tried again, hit 1:33:367 really quickly after that. I guess I was just hungry lol. That's still way behind my pCARS time with more effort.

 

[Jamesways]

DLC March 1st now?

From Unofficial FB page-

Update 9.0 is now rolling out on Xbox. Also available on PlayStation & Steam.

US Car Pack arrives March 1.

Patch notes for XB1: http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?45243-Project-CARS-Xbox-One-Patch-9-0-Release-Notes

 

[TylerDurden4321]

Damn, I'm not even close to touching 1:33 on Brands in Forza 6 with the 12C and that's with tires upgraded to sport. I feel like giving up trying at 1:35 lol. I did a 1:32 in pCARS pretty much instantly though (3rd lap?), I wasn't even pushing the car yet. Forza 6 feels a lot slower to me. You have to wait forever to get on the power and my times from lap to lap are really inconsistent compared to pCARS.

The tyres in my Forza comparisons are all upgraded to "sport", since that was the only way of comparing them to GT6 when Forza 5 low longitudinal grip was still a thing. It's much less of a thing in Forza 6. Sometimes in Forza 6 I even feel like I'm trading easier handling (and a little soft-air-ballooniness) against more lateral grip when upgrading tyres.

Anyway, for me it's totally the other way around, I never get consistent lap times in pCARS, I just suck at it and constantly overshoot the apex or spin out because I overdo it on the power-oversteer to correct that... or I brake to late and spin out. Especially in some production cars it feels like the car is not been steered from the front wheels but from a little behind the driver seat. Against AI I always mess up in longer races and when I hear people on GAF say what AI difficulty the play, I feel like a total loser in that game (I know, it depends heavily on the car class and track how good the AI is in that game, but still...).

I don't even remember the Forza 6 Brands Hatch time in the 12C to have been hard for me. I do remember that I treated the Huayra in GT6 like a complete asshole around some turns, because it just couldn't have been so fucking slow compared to Forza (idiotic way of *testing*, I know, I remember to feel a little bad about pushing cars to different degrees when I wrote the lap time down).

Another problem with my list is that I didn't keep track, what patch (and tyre model) the pCARS times where on and neither which of my Forza 6 times where before they patched out the snap-oversteer.

Edit: Saw your Edit now.

 

[skynidas]

The game is on sale right now on US PSN, $19.99 for non PS+, $15.99 with PS+.

 

[terrible]

The tyres in my Forza comparisons are all upgraded to "sport", since that was the only way of comparing them to GT6 when Forza 5 low longitudinal grip was still a thing. It's much less of a thing in Forza 6. Sometimes in Forza 6 I even feel like I'm trading easier handling (and a little soft-air-ballooniness) against more lateral grip when upgrading tyres.

Anyway, for me it's totally the other way around, I never get consistent lap times in pCARS, I just suck at it and constantly overshoot the apex or spin out because I overdo it on the power-oversteer to correct that... or I brake to late and spin out. Especially in some production cars it feels like the car is not been steered from the front wheels but from a little behind the driver seat. Against AI I always mess up in longer races and when I hear people on GAF say what AI difficulty the play, I feel like a total loser in that game (I know, it depends heavily on the car class and track how good the AI is in that game, but still...).

I don't even remember the Forza 6 Brands Hatch time in the 12C to have been hard for me. I do remember that I treated the Huayra in GT6 like a complete asshole around some turns, because it just couldn't have been so fucking slow compared to Forza (idiotic way of *testing*, I know, I remember to feel a little bad about pushing cars to different degrees when I wrote the lap time down).

Another problem with my list is that I didn't keep track, what patch (and tyre model) the pCARS times where on and neither which of my Forza 6 times where before they patched out the snap-oversteer.

Edit: Saw your Edit now.

Forza just doesn't feel anything like any of the sims I have on PC and it's a pretty jarring change when I go back and play it. I can seamlessly switch between AC, pCARS, and rFactor 2 but as soon as I boot Forza up it's like learning how to drive all over again lol. That's likely why it took me so long to hit that time. It takes a while to adjust since I have to completely change my driving style.

I only got my wheel relatively recently and I've played more PC sims than anything with it so that's what I'm used to. If you've put more wheel time in with Forza I'm guessing you're just really used to it. Maybe that's where our consistency differences come from.

 

[danowat]

The game is on sale right now on US PSN, $19.99 for non PS+, $15.99 with PS+.

Bargain.

 

[Icefire1424]

Alright, I need help. Recently adjusted the input configurations on the PS4, and although it's been a huge improvement, I'm finding trying to drive a Formula B car at slow speed extremely difficult. At slow speed the car is so sensitive that it feels like I'm jerking the wheel, and it usually results with my spinning out on turn exits. Any way to reduce the sensitivity at slow speeds only, or is that something I'm just going to have to get used to again? To compensate I'm adjusting the steering input in the car set up to slower (around 20), but didn't know if there's anything I can do in the input configurations menu.

Rest of my configurations are as follows. Thoughts?

Controller Input Mode: 2
Advanced: Off

Steering Deadzone: 0
Steering Sensitivity: 0
Throttle Deadzone: 0
Throttle Sensitivity: 5
Brake Deadzone: 5
Brake Sensitivity: 30
Clutch Deadzone: 13
Clutch Sensitivity: 45
Speed Sensitivity: 65
Controller Filtering Sensitivity: 65

 

[terrible]

You could change your steering ratio in the car setup to something slower but then you'd probably introduce understeer. It's not a perfect solution in other words but there's no harm in trying.

 

[Icefire1424]

You could change your steering ratio in the car setup to something slower but then you'd probably introduce understeer. It's not a perfect solution in other words but there's no harm in trying.

Yea, that's what I'm doing for the moment, and the understeer is indeed the problem. I do think it's manageable however. Granted, I think the problem is a bit exacerbated by the fact I'm running a Formula B car in career, which is really responsive compared to the "road" cars.

Also doesn't help that my last couple races were at Monaco and Imola, which probably require more precision than most.

 

[danowat]

Yea, that's what I'm doing for the moment, and the understeer is indeed the problem. I do think it's manageable however. Granted, I think the problem is a bit exacerbated by the fact I'm running a Formula B car in career, which is really responsive compared to the "road" cars.

Also doesn't help that my last couple races were at Monaco and Imola, which probably require more precision than most.

Diff settings will have a big effect on what you are describing too.

You've also got to remember that, in cars with aero, in slow corners to lose a heck of a lot of aero grip

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

The new car pack is live in the US, and with the arrival of the C7.R, I'd just like to say goodbye to rest of the GT3 class. It's been nice knowing you.

 

[Mascot]

The new car pack is live in the US, and with the arrival of the C7.R, I'd just like to say goodbye to rest of the GT3 class. It's been nice knowing you.

You'd normally have to peel the RUF R-GT8 off my sweaty ass under considerable protest, but I must admit the Caddy and the 'Vette do look tempting...

 

[danowat]

The Caddy is great, I was suprised it was forced induction.

Not sure about the Vette, not sure how it will perform with the rest of the GT3 class, being a GTE it's got a great aero package, but feels a little.....I dunno....sluggish?

 

[TJP]

PC DLC arrives at 1PM USA time..

..As I'm in Oz that means at some point today

 

[Icefire1424]

It's funny, I went into last year expecting to pick up F1 2016, but this game has more than scratched my F1 itch. Rather helps that the reviews on F1 were a bit lackluster though, I suppose.

Also, going from Formula B, well, any open wheel race car in this game to another class is really tough. That lack of grip takes some getting used to.

 

[danowat]

GOTY Edition with exclusive (not exclusive) content

The iconic Nürburgring Combined Nordschieife + GP circuit, and 2 exclusive vehicles from Pagani Automobili, both unveiled today at this year’s Geneva Motor Show – the Zonda Revolucion, and Huayra BC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbqQrDk3JY8

 

[xrnzaaas]

I'll be interested in the Pagani DLC if the price isn't outrageous.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

Another version of the Huayra that is already in the game and another version of the Zonda (roadster) that is already in the game, also a new track that is already in the game as its not-combined version.

I'll wait for a summer sale deal... or directly for pCARS 2.

 

[TJP]

To clarify: The Pagani Huayra BC will also be available for existing copies of pCARS. You do not need to buy another copy of the game.

https://twitter.com/projectcarsgame/status/705398787422953473

All of the Game of The Year Edition content will be made available for existing copies of Project CARS as well.

https://twitter.com/projectcarsgame/status/705399757485842432

I'd expect a DLC priced 'upgrade' to the GOTY or complete edition version for existing pCARS owners.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

I'd expect a DLC priced 'upgrade' to the GOTY or complete edition version for existing pCARS owners.

Sounds a lot better. They also should discount single DLC packs at least a little from may on.

 

[Mascot]

Why have I only just discovered how awesome Formula Rookie is?

 

[Pepto]

After all these updates I'm still having terrible wheel oscillation when going straight. Is there a way to get rid of it? I'm using my old Fanatec PWTS.

 

[DD]

Why have I only just discovered how awesome Formula Rookie is?

The lower formulas are cool. Formula B and A are terrible tho. ;(

 

[danowat]

The lower formulas are cool. Formula B and A are terrible tho. ;(

Nah, Formula B is intense.

Been doing a lot of races in the Renault V6 Trophy, that car is so nice to drive, but it does have teeth!

 

[Mascot]

After all these updates I'm still having terrible wheel oscillation when going straight. Is there a way to get rid of it? I'm using my old Fanatec PWTS.

I'm sure there's a more complicted and technically correct way to do it, but for a quick fix try increasing 'Fy Smoothing'. It worked for me on my old Fanatec GT2.

On a separate note, the pCARS Dash dev just informed me that changing the default Android device font also changes the in-app font. After downloading 1000+ free fonts in the Google Play store I've now got something a lot more 'sporty' than Helvetica (or whatever the default was) on my two tablets.

 

[DD]

Nah, Formula B is intense.

Been doing a lot of races in the Renault V6 Trophy, that car is so nice to drive, but it does have teeth!

It's doable. The problem is the suicidal AI in this game. It's impossible to have a clean race. ;(

 

[Mascot]

It's doable. The problem is the suicidal AI in this game. It's impossible to have a clean race. ;(

I've only just started using the open wheelers and yes, the AI goes postal when they get in these cars. In GT classes they are very well behaved. Excellent, in fact.

 

[Jamesways]

I've only just started using the open wheelers and yes, the AI goes postal when they get in these cars. In GT classes they are very well behaved. Excellent, in fact.

Yeah, I love racing the old Lotuses, but you definitely have to be on eggshells around any AI. You sure see some spectacular crashes in the pack.

So I've been having some CTDs lately, never happened before. Frustrating, but this game still rocks in the right circumstances.
The Endurance career is so much fun with the multi-class fights going on.

I know people are up in arms about the GOTY announcement (see pretendracecars/we hate all racing games), but I'll grab that DLC day one.

 

[Mascot]

Yeah, I love racing the old Lotuses, but you definitely have to be on eggshells around any AI. You sure see some spectacular crashes in the pack.

So I've been having some CTDs lately, never happened before. Frustrating, but this game still rocks in the right circumstances.
The Endurance career is so much fun with the multi-class fights going on.

I know people are up in arms about the GOTY announcement (see pretendracecars/we hate all racing games), but I'll grab that DLC day one.

It's not the final DLC either, despite what Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells has been shouting through letterboxes. More is planned.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

Damn, I'm not even close to touching 1:33 on Brands in Forza 6 with the 12C and that's with tires upgraded to sport. I feel like giving up trying at 1:35 lol. I did a 1:32 in pCARS pretty much instantly though (3rd lap?), I wasn't even pushing the car yet. Forza 6 feels a lot slower to me. You have to wait forever to get on the power and my times from lap to lap are really inconsistent compared to pCARS.

Because of the Forza Porsche pack I switched back to my TX wheel-base, changed pCARS FFB to the "66%" setup again and also changed FOV and added a little of look-into-corner, which someone suggested to me. pCARS was better and also easier for me after that.

Went back to the 12C @Brands Hatch lap time and did a 1:30.888 after 4 laps - and that just in "practice"-mode with an almost full fuel tank. Yea, pCARS is quite a bit faster than Forza. Also I had ABS on, which might have helped. Braking into a turn is trickier in pCARS, but assists ( not just talking about ABS) actually can make you faster instead of just dumbing down the game and taking away driving-style options like in Forza.

Really curious about Assetto Corsa, now that I could play it on PC, but I'm gonna wait for a console release. Still might be getting it on PC, but I won't experience it as a newcomer in a bubble if I wait it out until so many will jump on.

 

[TJP]

I know people are up in arms about the GOTY announcement (see pretendracecars/we hate all racing games), but I'll grab that DLC day one.

As a beta tester for another sim, it's always fun to read the absolute shite people post on a variety of forums and websites. Let the PRC blog post their crap, hardly anyone with a brain reads the mud they fling; he makes some good points but mosty it's a load of horseshit. I'll be grabbing the new cars and tracks when they are available; I don't care how 'sim' pCARS is or any other sim for that matter, if it's good fun who cares.

 

[terrible]

Because of the Forza Porsche pack I switched back to my TX wheel-base, changed pCARS FFB to the "66%" setup again and also changed FOV and added a little of look-into-corner, which someone suggested to me. pCARS was better and also easier for me after that.

Went back to the 12C @Brands Hatch lap time and did a 1:30.888 after 4 laps - and that just in "practice"-mode with an almost full fuel tank. Yea, pCARS is quite a bit faster than Forza. Also I had ABS on, which might have helped. Braking into a turn is trickier in pCARS, but assists ( not just talking about ABS) actually can make you faster instead of just dumbing down the game and taking away driving-style options like in Forza.

Really curious about Assetto Corsa, now that I could play it on PC, but I'm gonna wait for a console release. Still might be getting it on PC, but I won't experience it as a newcomer in a bubble if I wait it out until so many will jump on.

In Forza I never use TCS or ABS because it slows me down too much. In Project CARS I put assists on "real". Both games definitely require a different driving style.

I'd recommend grabbing Assetto Corsa on PC when it's on sale at least. The console version will never get the mods that are available on PC.

 

[Mascot]

No matter how good GT Sport, GT7 or Assetto Corsa end up being on PS4 I'm going to struggle to enjoy them without companion apps like Crew Chief and pCARS Dash. I just tried racing without them and it felt like there was a gaping chasm where they used to be. Apart from the increased immersion and authenticity it's incredible how I now absolutely rely on the constant information streams, and I'm really not sure how I managed before without access to a lot of the race data that I now take for granted.

I really hope GTS/7 and Assetto Corsa provide the framework for similar companion apps to be developed or they might end up feeling a little lacking by comparison.

 

[danowat]

In Forza I never use TCS or ABS because it slows me down too much. In Project CARS I put assists on "real". Both games definitely require a different driving style.

That's because the assists in PCARS actually work like real world assists, not like the gamified, dumbed down assists of semi-sim racers.

There is no shame in using real world assists in Pcars IMO.

 

[Mascot]

That's because the assists in PCARS actually work like real world assists, not like the gamified, dumbed down assists of semi-sim racers.

There is no shame in using real world assists in Pcars IMO.

Totally agree with that. It's actually unrealistic to forego assists in classes where they are permitted IRL.

On a separate subject, I've just activated speech recognition and push-to-talk with Crew Chief. Holy shit, it's utterly amazing being able to ask him questions about my car/times/opponents/fuel/damage/brakes/tyres etc etc and get instant responses. It works flawlessly..!

 

[TylerDurden4321]

That's because the assists in PCARS actually work like real world assists, not like the gamified, dumbed down assists of semi-sim racers.

at least for the race cars. In the production cars the assists are still better than in Forza or GT (which is actually not that bad at this).

 

[TJP]

That's because the assists in PCARS actually work like real world assists, not like the gamified, dumbed down assists of semi-sim racers.

There is no shame in using real world assists in Pcars IMO.

Or any other sim for that matter. Try driving a LMP 1 with all the torque they now have without TC on; in the 'real world' the drivers sure as shit don't! When modelled correctly, any assists should work with the driver, not for them.

 

[Mascot]

Does anyone else here use helmet cam in pCARS? I've always dismissed it as a bit of an interesting gimmick but once I'd made the helmet invisible and turned off the alcoholic DoF blurring I found it's a pretty damn awesome feature. OK, it took a couple dozen laps to get used to but the automatic look-to-apex feature really makes the cockpit come alive for me now. Going back to 'normal' cockpit view now feels really restrictive and static by comparison. I'm a definite convert.

 

[fresquito]

Does anyone else here use helmet cam in pCARS? I've always dismissed it as a bit of an interesting gimmick but once I'd made the helmet invisible and turned off the alcoholic DoF blurring I found it's a pretty damn awesome feature. OK, it took a couple dozen laps to get used to but the automatic look-to-apex feature really makes the cockpit come alive for me now. Going back to 'normal' cockpit view now feels really restrictive and static by comparison. I'm a definite convert.

Low FOV helps here too. I use 60 or something like that, so look to apex isn't as desorienting.

 

[Mascot]

Low FOV helps here too. I use 60 or something like that, so look to apex isn't as desorienting.

I think I'm using 80 degrees FoV and am quite happy with that. I might fiddle with the seat position slightly on-the-fly to fine-tune it on a car-by-car basis. I love the way the view tilts slightly when looking to apex, too. It all feels very natural once you make the adjustment from the 'normal' static cockpit cam.

I have to say, since getting the new wheel, fitting the two tablets, installing Crew Chief (and using it through a mic'd headset), installing pCARS Dash, and switching to helmet cam... this game has really come alive for me. I've always loved it but am loving it even more now. My immersion has gone off the scale. The only missing ingredient is VR, so come on, SMS - hurry the fuck up and confirm PSVR support for pCARS 1 please.

(Good to see you back, Fresquito).

 

[TylerDurden4321]

Does anyone else here use helmet cam in pCARS? I've always dismissed it as a bit of an interesting gimmick but once I'd made the helmet invisible and turned off the alcoholic DoF blurring I found it's a pretty damn awesome feature. OK, it took a couple dozen laps to get used to but the automatic look-to-apex feature really makes the cockpit come alive for me now. Going back to 'normal' cockpit view now feels really restrictive and static by comparison. I'm a definite convert.

That's what was suggested to me and really helps! Turn the helmet in the "helmet cam" off, give it a little look-into-corner and lower the FOV. I'm at 72 now, maybe I'll try an ever lower one.
There is tilting too, right? I didn't go back to the options because the changes felt good immediately.

On the TCS topic: I don't really know how to feel about TCS in racing. It's understandable for races that manufacturers are also using as endurance tests, but the entry skill-level for drivers in the 70s and 80s sure was higher than today. A Porsche 917/30 had max torque of 1100Nm in 1973 under regular 1100hp conditions, at maximum boost pressure it could develop almost 1600hp. Driving the Lotus 98T in pCARS is possible too without assists, even if it's ridiculously hard (for me at least). When I see TV actors jump into a ADAC 24h race for a few hours and not even losing positions, I can not help but think that electronic aids are making racing too easy.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

From ISRTV:
https://youtu.be/yEGfkLz9llk?t=2m5s

There is something wrong with tyre model in pCARS that is not just some too tight or generous parameters, but something very deep in their code/formulas. The vertical load on the outside tyres is nowhere remotely high enough to make the tyres grip enough to spin it over - despite the car being super flat and despite the super high downforce that would push the car down again.

(or it was the road surface that still has buggy sections where it stops/crashes your car from 200km/h to 0 in 0.01 seconds. Each time I got the "emergency stop" trophy on PC and XB1, it was due to that bug)

 

[fresquito]

(Good to see you back, Fresquito).

Never went away. I've been lurking the whole time :-D

From ISRTV:
https://youtu.be/yEGfkLz9llk?t=2m5s

There is something wrong with tyre model in pCARS that is not just some too tight or generous parameters, but something very deep in their code/formulas. The vertical load on the outside tyres is nowhere remotely high enough to make the tyres grip enough to spin it over - despite the car being super flat and despite the super high downforce that would push the car down again.

(or it was the road surface that still has buggy sections where it stops/crashes your car from 200km/h to 0 in 0.01 seconds. Each time I got the "emergency stop" trophy on PC and XB1, it was due to that bug)

That's really not the norm. Seeing how it is a new car, I'm inclined to think it's a bug or wrong parameters. As whole, I agree tyres need improvements related to grip gain and loss. At the moment the stages of the drift are not as linear as they should. You can feel the different stages of grip loss. It should be more organic. But it is nowhere near as bad as many people claim it to be (although I'd say the norm is pretty good and the offenders are the exception to the rule).

From my experience, that's something they're addressing for PC2. They're adding new tech, of course, but above everything, it's a tweaking thing. Tweaking tyres for so many cars and so many different conditions is not an easy task, for sure. That's why the game is inconsistent accross the different cars and tyres.

I'll add that I find the Dallara super fun to drive and that, after just one race, it is probably my favoreite modern formula car.

 

[danowat]

Man I have been having some fun on a couple of combo's this weekend.

V8 Supercar at Willow springs and the new stock car at Watkins Glen.

Both great, fast combo's and the fact that both cars are really tail happy makes it a huge amount of fun!

From ISRTV:
https://youtu.be/yEGfkLz9llk?t=2m5s

There is something wrong with tyre model in pCARS that is not just some too tight or generous parameters, but something very deep in their code/formulas. The vertical load on the outside tyres is nowhere remotely high enough to make the tyres grip enough to spin it over - despite the car being super flat and despite the super high downforce that would push the car down again.

(or it was the road surface that still has buggy sections where it stops/crashes your car from 200km/h to 0 in 0.01 seconds. Each time I got the "emergency stop" trophy on PC and XB1, it was due to that bug)

Probably more due to bugged physics detection on the rumble strips rather than a bugged tyre model.

I think the tyres model, at least for slicks, is pretty good, but there is a disconnect with treaded tyres and the tyre/suspension model, I think the blocks move far too much, and cause a weird floating feeling, I also think there is an issue with the heat/melt/cool model on the surface of the tyre, the fact that they have managed to get it better with the new Nitto 5 tyres makes me think there is something up with it that isn't quite right which would explain why (it used to be) very hard to keep a car on the edge of the slip curve, that said, I think it's better now than its ever been.

I'd love some more indepth info about their tyre model though, I personally reckon, as a global model, it doesn't work well, and I wonder if there is a lot of per car and per tyre tweaking going on.

Can anyone with the Pcars2 early access comment on the tyres? Or are we still under NDA? Interested to know if they have made any improvements.

 

[Jamesways]

Does anyone else here use helmet cam in pCARS? I've always dismissed it as a bit of an interesting gimmick but once I'd made the helmet invisible and turned off the alcoholic DoF blurring I found it's a pretty damn awesome feature. OK, it took a couple dozen laps to get used to but the automatic look-to-apex feature really makes the cockpit come alive for me now. Going back to 'normal' cockpit view now feels really restrictive and static by comparison. I'm a definite convert.

YES! Love the immersion of it. I use the same, invisible helmet, no blur, but G forces and tilt cranked. Look to Apex at about 25 or so, more subtle than Shift 2. If anything I wish there was a bit more jostle to the bumps.
Helmet cam, visual and camera effects working, no HUD (just a button for a MOTEC switch), can't beat it IMO.

I think I'm using 80 degrees FoV and am quite happy with that. I might fiddle with the seat position slightly on-the-fly to fine-tune it on a car-by-car basis. I love the way the view tilts slightly when looking to apex, too. It all feels very natural once you make the adjustment from the 'normal' static cockpit cam.

I have to say, since getting the new wheel, fitting the two tablets, installing Crew Chief (and using it through a mic'd headset), installing pCARS Dash, and switching to helmet cam... this game has really come alive for me. I've always loved it but am loving it even more now. My immersion has gone off the scale. The only missing ingredient is VR, so come on, SMS - hurry the fuck up and confirm PSVR support for pCARS 1 please.

(Good to see you back, Fresquito).

I love all the custom options. I use the 4 directions of the d-pad for seat position, forward, back, up and down. That way, in any car, I can quickly adjust the seat just right. Not to complain about other games, but cockpit FOV and seat positioning was an issue for me in Forza. Some cars the camera was pressed up too far, others your arms seemed 12 feet long.
It's great to adjust it to your liking in any car while racing in this.


Again, I am quite jealous of the companion apps you're using.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

Probably more due to bugged physics detection on the rumble strips rather than a bugged tyre model.

Watching it again, I think you're right in this case.
(Edit: Still, why does it spin faster after rolling ~80°, shouldn't the downforce make it spin slower?)

I think the tyres model, at least for slicks, is pretty good, but there is a disconnect with treaded tyres and the tyre/suspension model, I think the blocks move far too much, and cause a weird floating feeling, I also think there is an issue with the heat/melt/cool model on the surface of the tyre, the fact that they have managed to get it better with the new Nitto 5 tyres makes me think there is something up with it that isn't quite right which would explain why (it used to be) very hard to keep a car on the edge of the slip curve, that said, I think it's better now than its ever been.

Yup, heat build-up seems much improved from what I remember when I played it on Xbox. Off the line there is still too much grip and in "pure side slip" conditions on road surface the car feels all kinds of wrong (that gruesome tyre sound might add to my feeling as well). That's why I directly came to the conclusion that this caused the roll-over in the video. Still, the Pacejka "magic formula" has these kinds of problems when you feed it very extreme values of camber and slip-angle. I don't know how heavily SMS still leans on the magic formula, but it's just not made for racing games and extreme conditions, lateral overturn momentum is one of the things where the formula has trouble.

I'd love some more indepth info about their tyre model though, I personally reckon, as a global model, it doesn't work well, and I wonder if there is a lot of per car and per tyre tweaking going on.

Me too.

 

[Mascot]

Again, I am quite jealous of the companion apps you're using.

What's stopping you jumping in?

 

[danowat]

Yup, heat build-up seems much improved from what I remember when I played it on Xbox. Off the line there is still too much grip and in "pure side slip" conditions on road surface the car feels all kinds of wrong (that gruesome tyre sound might add to my feeling as well). That's why I directly came to the conclusion that this caused the roll-over in the video. Still, the Pacejka "magic formula" has these kinds of problems when you feed it very extreme values of camber and slip-angle. I don't know how heavily SMS still leans on the magic formula, but it's just not made for racing games and extreme conditions, lateral overturn momentum is one of the things where the formula has trouble.

My memory isn't brilliant so I might not be remembering it quite correctly.

A little while ago I found a technical document on the tyre model used in PCARS, I believe that it said the model used to be based on Packjka but they moved away from that with the brush model, I can't seem to find that document anymore, maybe they removed it from the web due to competition and the chances of people cribbing their tech?

Edit - might have that wrong, I think Thierry old model was the brush model, latest one is Seta, not sure if the uses Packjka

 

[Jamesways]

What's stopping you jumping in?

Not available for iOS.

 

[TylerDurden4321]

My memory isn't brilliant so I might not be remembering it quite correctly.

A little while ago I found a technical document on the tyre model used in PCARS, I believe that it said the model used to be based on Packjka but they moved away from that with the brush model, I can't seem to find that document anymore, maybe they removed it from the web due to competition and the chances of people cribbing their tech?

I read something about the brush model just recently. It was just a Powerpoint presentation (that went through 6-9 tyre models within maybe 40-50 slides or so), but unlike Pacejka it's a physics based model and not a mathematical model derived from real world data you would need a lot of tyre data for (which can be expensive at extreme values that wear the tyre out quickly or even kill it outright). Also you can estimate the effects of extreme input values easier with the brush model. The model looks at tyre friction as little "brushes" gripping into the asphalt and splits the contact patch into a gripping and a sliding area that can be calculated from input forces and more easily measurable tyre compound values (namely stiffness and tyre-to-road friction coeffecient).

I couldn't find the ppt anymore, but chapter 2 from this paper explains the brush model a little deeper and maybe even better than the powerpoint.
Surely SMS made a ton of changes and maybe combined the two models to the Seta model, but seems to me like they didn't have the money or time to get the tyre data they needed to have any of the models cover extreme cases realistically without chopping off extreme inputs.