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[Jarmel]

The ship rolled and tumbled so unless you've run a simulation on the whole physics of that sequence how the fuck do you know in the exact spot david's head and body should be at the end? Fact is that the body is in the "trench" below the raised platform.. maybe in reality they should have been 30 centimers closer to the eastern wall. We'll never know!

No. There is nothing tethering David's body and his head to anything. The impact would have sent both flying into the nearest available object which would have been a wall considering they were on a raised platform. So then after the crash, the tumbling which would have just made their bodies stick to the wall they were already attached, similar to a drying machine. There shouldn't be any open space next to them on one of their sides. It's a technical error and a minor one but it is an error.

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

yep, again, people looking for Lindelof hate. Do you really think he wrote in the script "David is still perfectly intact after the crash."

I highly doubt it.

You can blame Lindelof for the anti climatic Vickers death, but the position of the head on the ship isn't vital to a scriptwriter unless it's an actual plot point.

Speaking of screenwriters, did anyone else know that Spaits wrote that Darkest Hour movie that was released around Christmas that no one saw? Now I'm interested in reading his script.

 

[Joe Shlabotnik]

The thing I love about this is how clear it was Theron was not only the least scientifically knowledgable person on on the ship, but also clearly using short hand in the effort to make a smoother clever statement. Nothing about the line she said that in would've sounded smoother if she said light years. It's like saying " we're heading just up the block" when you mean actually a couple miles down the street.

I'm not even sure Neil meant this that seriously, but a lot of people pounce on it as if he did, which is, c'mon son.

This is absolutely nothing and I'm sure Tyson is at least half-kidding, but your explanation doesn't make much sense either. She exaggerated in the wrong direction. IIRC she is trying to express that they are very far from home, but ends up understating the distance by about four hundred thousand orders of magnitude. In your example it would be like saying something in the next town is too far to get to because it's "half a block away". There's also nothing to suggest that this is a joke related to her character or something.

You're right that they used "half a billion miles" because it efficiently sounds far to the audience. But the guy who likely wrote that line also claims he's writing "hard sci fi", too.

 

[symphonask]

So the Jockeys being piled up like this. Were they trying to get through the sealed door during quarantine or were their bodies placed there?

It's gonna be interesting looking at the artbook once I finally get my hands on it.

 

[pringles]

No. There is nothing tethering David's body and his head to anything. The impact would have sent both flying into the nearest available object which would have been a wall considering they were on a raised platform. So then after the tumbling which would have just made their bodies stick to the wall they were already attached, similar to a drying machine. There shouldn't be any open space next to them on one of their sides. It's a technical error and a minor one but it is an error.

But when a drying machine stops, most of the clothes fall to the bottom of the machine? The ship tips over and comes to a stop. David isn't a wet sock, so he would have fallen to the floor. Where he is when Shaw finds him. In a fairly narrow trench, not much room to either side.

Honestly. This is one of the weirdest discussions I've ever been involved in. Even if the body didn't move, it could be explained by that room having some amazing anti-gravity tech. But the complaint is that he's not close enough to a wall?? :-O

 

[JB1981]

What door are they piled up against? Is that the entrance to the Temple w/ the human head inside and the cannisters? So they were all clearly trying to get away from something, something fucking terrifying. But what? I guess a Xenomorph or something else.

 

[Jarmel]

But when a drying machine stops, most of the clothes fall to the bottom of the machine? The ship tips over and comes to a stop. David isn't a wet sock, so he would have fallen to the floor. Where he is when Shaw finds him. In a fairly narrow trench, not much room to either side.

Honestly. This is one of the weirdest discussions I've ever been involved in. Even if the body didn't move, it could be explained by that room having some amazing anti-gravity tech. But the complaint is that he's not close enough to a wall?? :-O

Well this is hard scifi so hey we're allowed to analyze it as such.

 

[zoukka]

My god those artwork were balls amazing.

What door are they piled up against? Is that the entrance to the Temple w/ the human head inside and the cannisters? So they were all clearly trying to get away from something, something fucking terrifying. But what? I guess a Xenomorph or something else.

It was stated in the movie, that some of them had exploded chests so yeah.

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

What door are they piled up against? Is that the entrance to the Temple w/ the human head inside and the cannisters?

It's a wall they never got to the other side of. You can presume its another similar room, but we don't know.

 

[Kai Dracon]

I think one thing you have to assume about the black goo is that it's not merely a single thing. It's no more a deus ex machina than a real life computer is because the computer can run any kind of program you load into it.

The goo is clearly biotech nanotechnology - that's what much of the Engineer's tech is based on. Look at the other fluid that David examines on a control surface - it's full of tiny organic machines buzzing around.

The black stuff seems to be for biological breakdown and reconstruction. The goo that's in the urns is set up much like cluster nuclear warheads - smaller urns each with a smaller amount of the material in them. I suspect the comparison was intentional, to get across the idea that those were weapons. Weapons of mass destruction, in fact.

The goo that the Engineer in the opening ingests is in a different type of ceremonial container. It breaks him down much faster, and the scene clearly shows it is eating and absorbing his DNA. That's the stuff that spread Engineer DNA through Earth's biosphere to seed the evolution of human life.

The weaponized goo appears programmed to create soldier unit xenomorphs. I'd guess that Holloway starts to break down slowly because the deconstructor just keeps on eating out the core of cells after his purpose - passing on his seed - is done. It's a weapon. Seems designed to kill everyone on a planet, so it ain't meant to let anyone walk away alive.

 

[zoukka]

I think one thing you have to assume about the black goo is that it's not merely a single thing. It's no more a deus ex machina than a real life computer is because the computer can run any kind of program you load into it.

The goo is clearly biotech nanotechnology - that's what much of the Engineer's tech is based on. Look at the other fluid that David examines on a control surface - it's full of tiny organic machines buzzing around.

The black stuff seems to be for biological breakdown and reconstruction. The goo that's in the urns is set up much like cluster nuclear warheads - smaller urns each with a smaller amount of the material in them. I suspect the comparison was intentional, to get across the idea that those were weapons. Weapons of mass destruction, in fact.

The goo that the Engineer in the opening ingests is in a different type of ceremonial container. It breaks him down much faster, and the scene clearly shows it is eating and absorbing his DNA. That's the stuff that spread Engineer DNA through Earth's biosphere to seed the evolution of human life.

The weaponized goo appears programmed to create soldier unit xenomorphs. I'd guess that Holloway starts to break down slowly because the deconstructor just keeps on eating out the core of cells after his purpose - passing on his seed - is done. It's a weapon. Seems designed to kill everyone on a planet, so it ain't meant to let anyone walk away alive.

Heh almost exactly my first thoughts and posts about this movie.

 

[symphonask]

I think one thing you have to assume about the black goo is that it's not merely a single thing. It's no more a deus ex machina than a real life computer is because the computer can run any kind of program you load into it.

The goo is clearly biotech nanotechnology - that's what much of the Engineer's tech is based on. Look at the other fluid that David examines on a control surface - it's full of tiny organic machines buzzing around.

The black stuff seems to be for biological breakdown and reconstruction. The goo that's in the urns is set up much like cluster nuclear warheads - smaller urns each with a smaller amount of the material in them. I suspect the comparison was intentional, to get across the idea that those were weapons. Weapons of mass destruction, in fact.

The goo that the Engineer in the opening ingests is in a different type of ceremonial container. It breaks him down much faster, and the scene clearly shows it is eating and absorbing his DNA. That's the stuff that spread Engineer DNA through Earth's biosphere to seed the evolution of human life.

The weaponized goo appears programmed to create soldier unit xenomorphs. I'd guess that Holloway starts to break down slowly because the deconstructor just keeps on eating out the core of cells after his purpose - passing on his seed - is done. It's a weapon. Seems designed to kill everyone on a planet, so it ain't meant to let anyone walk away alive.

Probably my favourite explanation for the goo so far. Makes a ton of sense.

 

[JB1981]

So in the discussion section at this link

http://www.prometheusforum.net/discussion/1646

one of the forum posters links the first "leaked info" on the initial teaser trailer for Prometheus.

Trailer starts with a clip of Ripley from Alien and the words “What if the beginning” and then we see the mouth of the Xenomorph “Wasnt the beginning” or something like that. Then theres this shot of like a giant waterfall on some planet I don’t know what the planet was and a ship traveling to it.

Then we see like two cloaked people talking to eachother near the waterfall or something and theres a voice over from who I’m guessing is Noomi Rapace and she says something like: “A woman once told me a story of how man was created” then we see this giant human like creature thing (which im guessing is the Space Jockey thing from Alien but I’m not sure) Voiceover: “First there was the sun” and we see this giant oval alien ship covering the sky. Voice over ” And the sun said I’m alone and I have noone to shinedown on so it created man” and another shot of the giant space jockey thing. and then theres like shots of the crew on the space ship traveling to that planet

 

[JB1981]

I think one thing you have to assume about the black goo is that it's not merely a single thing. It's no more a deus ex machina than a real life computer is because the computer can run any kind of program you load into it.

The goo is clearly biotech nanotechnology - that's what much of the Engineer's tech is based on. Look at the other fluid that David examines on a control surface - it's full of tiny organic machines buzzing around.

The black stuff seems to be for biological breakdown and reconstruction. The goo that's in the urns is set up much like cluster nuclear warheads - smaller urns each with a smaller amount of the material in them. I suspect the comparison was intentional, to get across the idea that those were weapons. Weapons of mass destruction, in fact.

The goo that the Engineer in the opening ingests is in a different type of ceremonial container. It breaks him down much faster, and the scene clearly shows it is eating and absorbing his DNA. That's the stuff that spread Engineer DNA through Earth's biosphere to seed the evolution of human life.

The weaponized goo appears programmed to create soldier unit xenomorphs. I'd guess that Holloway starts to break down slowly because the deconstructor just keeps on eating out the core of cells after his purpose - passing on his seed - is done. It's a weapon. Seems designed to kill everyone on a planet, so it ain't meant to let anyone walk away alive.

But why? Why do this? For what purpose?

 

[zoukka]

But why? Why do this? For what purpose?

Because they can

No really. Either for experiments and later harvesting or for more noble aims. Do you think humans wouldn't create life if they could? Aren't we trying to do that all the time?

 

[symphonask]

But why? Why do this? For what purpose?

Holloway: Because we can.

Man that exchange between Holloway and David was really great.

edit: beaten!

 

[Kai Dracon]

Heh almost exactly my first thoughts and posts about this movie.

Heh, didn't see your post specifically.

Hmm, about that Livejournal post breaking the movie down:

I think the one thing he's got wrong is the psychic stuff with the black goo responding to the 'intent' of the person it touches. He seems to use that to justify a too-literal interpretation of the mythology the story incorporates.

It's probably safer to assume that the Engineer facility was exactly what they theorized it was - a military base, weapons storage depot, and launch facility for bombers armed with thousands of cluster bombs filled with bio-deconstructor designed to create an infinite army of hunter killers. And eventually scrub a planet of all higher functioning life.

And somebody fucked up, there was a containment breach, and everything went to hell - a simple trope with any storage facility that has technology dangerous to the user as well as the enemy.

 

[Speedymanic]

Holy shit, you guys are still at it :lol

I've made my peace with Prometheus being a disaster. A pretty disaster, but a disaster nonetheless.

A little extreme. It clearly has its faults, but it can't be considered to be a disaster by any means.

My god the artwork is so amazing and indicate a very clear and consistent overarching vision and design for the world, the aliens and the engineers. Why was all this so fucking confusing in the movie? Why couldn't they just explain this all to us in a very coherent manner? Is it because they plan on explaining all these things in the sequel? Was this movie originally conceived as two movies? I remember hearing rumors that it was.

Well, 28mins of footage was cut...not trying to make excuses or anything, but it wouldn't surprise me if those 28mins were vitally important to how the story is presented.

Again, not making excuses and is just speculation on my part, but I remember another movie having a not do great theatrical release due to poor editing and the DC fixed virtually those problems.

I'm hoping the same will apply here, 28mins is a lot of footage to cut from a movie like this.

 

[Replicant]

This is just like the Mass Effect 3 fiasco all over again. I live for moments like this.

I can feel the vomit rising up again. I almost forgot about that #EPIC MESS of ending too. Why did you have to remind me? :/

 

[JB1981]

Heh, didn't see your post specifically.

Hmm, about that Livejournal post breaking the movie down:

I think the one thing he's got wrong is the psychic stuff with the black goo responding to the 'intent' of the person it touches. He seems to use that to justify a too-literal interpretation of the mythology the story incorporates.

It's probably safer to assume that the Engineer facility was exactly what they theorized it was - a military base, weapons storage depot, and launch facility for bombers armed with thousands of cluster bombs filled with bio-deconstructor designed to create an infinite army of hunter killers. And eventually scrub a planet of all higher functioning life.

And somebody fucked up, there was a containment breach, and everything went to hell - a simple trope with any storage facility that has technology dangerous to the user as well as the enemy.

But why would they want to do this to us after going through the effort of creating us? What did we do to them?

 

[Jarmel]

But why would they want to do this to us after going through the effort of creating us? What did we do to them?

We killed Space Jesus.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

The abortion scene seems to get all the attention, but I personally found a 2000 year old dead head reanimating and exploding more horrifying.

I still haven't seen the first two movies but my brother seems to think there's another film remaining between Promethius and them.

It doesn't seem to be a direct prequel. Obviously further movies could more directly touch on Alien, but as I said in an earlier post it's more of a cousin movie. Alien and Prometheus are different "sequels" to the events of a few thousand years ago that killed the Engineers.

You'd think she'd mention it when she's agreeing to take David to the other Engineer ships at the end. It's kind of a big deal. Her 'why should I trust you' is way too muted a response, and could be interpreted as only referring to his trying to keep the alien inside her. I mean, some people here were arguing that she didn't know at that point.

They both know David did it and she makes it clear she doesn't trust him. Explicitly stating "And the reason I don't trust you is because I've inferred you infected Charlie!" doesn't seem absolutely necessary.

I really liked how we never knew more than the characters.

Well, aside from seeing the Engineers seeding life on Earth.

Which is kind of why I found it so weird that Vickers actually died in this movie. I guess Weyland inc has a variety of board members that can run the company in her absence.

I've been thinking that with some of the head honchos away, they were primed for a hostile merger from Yutani.

Well, he was supposed to be *much* older than he should have been. He's been holding on to life longer than natural by a long shot. They don't say how old he's supposed to be, but I think we're supposed to believe him to be like 120 or something.

If he was supposed to be about Guy Pearce's normal age for that TED talk, then by the time of the film 110-120 seems about right.

 

[symphonask]

But why would they want to do this to us after going through the effort of creating us? What did we do to them?

Maybe they look upon us as nothing more than a failed experiment - wipe the slate clean and start over.

 

[Reno7728]

Just a thought i was having, might have been suggested before:

Could it be possible that The Xeno's are some wild species that the jockeys discovered and saw the potential of as weapons. If we take the standard pre-prometheus Queen life-cycle perhaps the jockeys collected/harvested a huge number of eggs that could be used in bombing missions from the ships. However this would be a fairly dangerous means of use and therefore led to the ship found in Alien. (Evidence: fossilised jockey suggests very old, seemingly completely different processes of eggs vs goo).

Because of this, perhaps the Engineers then focused on more safely harnessing the process, and used their organic technology compounds (e.g the goo David sees on the door panels or the stuff the engineer drinks at the beginning) to create the black goo that causes the Xeno's/process we see in the film.

I think this could explain the drastic difference in storage/delivery on the Jockey ship and was wondering what others think.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

The weaponized goo appears programmed to create soldier unit xenomorphs. I'd guess that Holloway starts to break down slowly because the deconstructor just keeps on eating out the core of cells after his purpose - passing on his seed - is done. It's a weapon. Seems designed to kill everyone on a planet, so it ain't meant to let anyone walk away alive.

If it's programmable nanomachines then they've elected to load the "horror movie" program instead of the "efficiently and rapidly wipe out a biosphere" program. I'm not even sure why they're messing around with stupid black goop that creates boogey-men instead of just self-replicating nanomachines that poison the atmosphere. Or aerosol nanomachine colonies that selectively target human beings (leaving the rest of the biosphere in-tact).

If you're concerned about them having a high tech-level, such that they can mount an effective resistance against these attacks, then you shouldn't even be using them like that in the first place. You should be employing Berserkers to take care of your problems - a self-sufficient, fully automated "colony" of space-craft capable of the manufacture of all of its constituent components (i.e. it can create more of itself if it needs to), and the waging of war. They can set up shop, send scouts to Earth to determine what they have in the way of technology, population etc and then deploy appropriate measures to destroy them.

 

[Ganondorfo]

If you read the detailed wikipedia plot synopsis, the storyline isnt that hard to follow. Because I had difficulties understanding the ending of the movie.

For example, the moment they go to the home planet of the engineers/space jockeys. Thats a very open ending, because in the original alien movie they never talk about the home planet of the engineer/creators/space jockeys...

And also what happened to david and shaw, they arent mentionned in the original alien movie. Maybe its my fault, but doesnt alien happen just after the events of prometheus?

 

[Fafalada]

Maybe they look upon us as nothing more than a failed experiment - wipe the slate clean and start over.

I believe that's precisely what the scene where they wake up the Engineer is meant to portray. The expression on his face where he proceeded to kill the group was not one of anger - he looked like he was doing pest-control.

If it's programmable nanomachines then they've elected to load the "horror movie" program instead of the "efficiently and rapidly wipe out a biosphere" program. I'm not even sure why they're messing around with stupid black goop that creates boogey-men instead of just self-replicating nanomachines that poison the atmosphere. Or aerosol nanomachine colonies that selectively target human beings (leaving the rest of the biosphere in-tact).

They managed to wipe-themselves out with the same weapon a few thousand years ago - I think it's safe to say their engineering skills weren't matched by their wit.

 

[FreedomFrisbee]

But why? Why do this? For what purpose?

My thoughts:

-The Engineers are spreading life for some reason, and that reason seems to be hinted at. They are clearly seeking to create weapons for war. The fluid is clearly a weapon of war. How do they make the fluid? And in such large amounts as they had? My friends and I came to the conclusion that they seed life to break it down into the fluid. Life is, for the Engineers, a thing to be harvested at a certain point, and not allowed to rival them. They're trying to eliminate whatever is threatening them, not seed more creatures that could possibly threaten them. Hence their wanting to go to earth and break down life. Answering the invitation was the cue to go harvest them.
-The thing this implies is that the Engineers are fighting something. THAT is the only thing that can't really be answered based on the movie alone. They could be fighting themselves, or something we don't even know about yet. You gotta be making weapons to use against something after all.

I'd love to think the mural shows the Engineer bopping whoever they're fighting in the head.

 

[reggieandTFE]

Thinking back on the movie, did Shaw bash the weird foreign lady with the bowel haircut in the head prior to her abortion? Wasn't she then in Weyland's room acting all nonchalant.

 

[DirtRiver]

Thinking back on the movie, did Shaw bash the weird foreign lady with the bowel haircut in the head prior to her abortion? Wasn't she then in Weyland's room acting all nonchalant.

Yes, yes she was. Don't think about it, just accept it and leave it the way it is.

 

[Reclaimer]

Posting my spoiler thoughts from other thread:

- Clearly the opening sequence is an alternate origin story of life on earth. Read Chariots of the Gods which is a hokey but influential book tracing evidence in Mayan civilisation that our ancestors mistakenly worshipped aliens who originally 'fertilised' earth's ecosystem with the DNA for human life. Scott has cited the book as a major influence for Prometheus.

- The black goo is a biological WMD that is massively adaptive to environment and / or its host. The way I read it, the reaction differed on proto-earth and LV-233, local atmospheric conditions, and characteristics of the host. There is clearly more to be explained here than can be narratively though in this two hour film.

Perhaps way off base, but riffing on this a bit... And it's fun.

Black goo is a BioWMD. Engineers create it. It is designed to rapidly evolve/adapt to different environments, creating the perfect weapon for that environment/ecosystem.

On ancient Earth, the engineers weren't trying to plant the seeds of life, they were simply testing what the goo would create with this Earths environment/ecosystem. They have tried other planets, with less successful results. Engineers were looking for an environment that would create the perfect weapon to use in their wars.

However, with their Earth experiment, they were more successful than ever before. Their BioWMD goo interacted with the microorganisms on Earth, and began evolving into Humans. Realizing that human DNA was almost an exact match with their own, they began more and more tests on them. Coming to Earth to obtain samples (abduct humans) and do further testing to create an even more perfect weapon.

When they realized that modern human interaction with the goo would produce the Xenomorph (full size crazy one from Alien... More powerful than an engineer birthed one), and that the Xenomorph was so powerful (and capable of destroying Engineers), they began to fear Humans.

This species accidentally created as a BioWMD test (humans), if they ever realized what they could create by combining themselves with the same BioWMD goo again (Xenomorph), they could eventually destroy the Engineeers. This human weapon was too powerful, thus it must be destroyed.

 

[Trigger]

Thinking back on the movie, did Shaw bash the weird foreign lady with the bowel haircut in the head prior to her abortion? Wasn't she then in Weyland's room acting all nonchalant.

It was sorta funny how that worked out. I never even got the feeling that they were concerned about her during the trip to meet the Engineer.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

And also what happened to david and shaw, they arent mentionned in the original alien movie. Maybe its my fault, but doesnt alien happen just after the events of prometheus?

Several decades later on a different planet/moon.

 

[bggrthnjsus]

Thinking back on the movie, did Shaw bash the weird foreign lady with the bowel haircut in the head prior to her abortion? Wasn't she then in Weyland's room acting all nonchalant.

hahaha yea that was a little weird she was all forgiven by then

 

[DrForester]

How was David's head and body in the same spot after the ship crashed and fell on its side? I assume maybe the ship had some system that controls the gravity inside.

Inertial Dampeners

 

[Foreign Jackass]

hahaha yea that was a little weird she was all forgiven by then

There was a lot of those disjointed moments in the movie. Like that sequence between Idris and Charlize that goes into sexual innuendo and then goes fucking nowhere. Or the way Shaw just trusts David after the abortion. Or the way David's head didn't fucking move after the crash. Or all the black goo sequences that change the logic of the black goo.

It looks like all those scenes were written/directed without any clue as to what's coming next.

Seriously, the movie's even more of a mess the more I think about it.

 

[Oldschoolgamer]

I guess that the head reanimation was a reference to Alien 3, when Ripley reanimated Bishop's head, the exact same way?

You can blame Lindelof for the anti climatic Vickers death, but the position of the head on the ship isn't vital to a scriptwriter unless it's an actual plot point.

Speaking of screenwriters, did anyone else know that Spaits wrote that Darkest Hour movie that was released around Christmas that no one saw? Now I'm interested in reading his script.

Oh goodness. Really? I heard nothing but bad things about that...

 

[Rickard]

So the snake thing that killed millburn, that's what happens when a mealworm touches the black stuff?

Why were there mealworms on an alien moon?

 

[Foreign Jackass]

So the snake thing that killed millburn, that's what happens when a mealworm touches the black stuff?

Why were there mealworms on an alien moon?

Engineers forgot to take out the trash, son.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Why did the Engineers in the control room of the ship not take off and go to Earth 2,000 years ago?

Because the entire damn facility was under quarantine, remember? If you've got doors coming down and sealing so hard they decapitate guys, the freaking launch bay doors are not opening up either. The pilots set the ship's navigation to head to earth, then hopped into cryo to wait until a rescue team came. But none did, probably because they abandoned the facility. They knew not to fuck around with this stuff, that's why they put the research facilities on the middle of nowhere in the first place.

Why did the star map lead there, instead of to the Engineer home world?

If you go with the theory that the Engineers were using Earth as a cultivation of some kind, and that they would "reset", or infect the planet when we got technologically advanced enough to reach out to them, why would you give them your home address? They left the directions to a military facility, which would be plenty equipped to handle any expedition party that would reach out, without endangering the home world. It's like leaving them the address to Guantanamo Bay instead of San Francisco.

You got to agree that this part implies that the space jockey race are all on that planet, that there is only a handful of them, or at least that those in charge of mankind are only in that galaxy or whatever. Because otherwise you would expect that the rest of the race would have went and killed mankind, but they never did. We get the impression the waken-up engineer is the last one of them still alive and tries to go carry out the mission.

IMO the ship in Alien is another one that managed to escape, but the pilot was infected and a queen came out, leaving eggs in the ship.

Like I said before, because of Scott's interviews, here is where I think the movies are going:

Engineers = fallen angel, Scott said so. He implied that fall angels do "the cool stuff, get all the chicks, go to the best bars", and that paradise is a much different and troubling place. This implies, figuratively, that the jockeys are doing something VERY different from what the "home world" or paradise is all about. We can clearly see the connection here to Prometheus: fallen angels/nephilim (who rebelled against God, gave taught mankind all this such as war, beauty, etc. Read the book of Enoch, it's basically a 2000 years old sci-fi novel. It's the book from where the whole "fallen angels" notion come from as that story is NOT found in the Bible, unlike most people think. The only thing that echos the book of Enoch in the Bible is the following, which goes into much greater details in the book of Enoch:

Bible:

Genesis 6:1-4

1. When men began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them,
2. The sons of God saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose.
3. Then the LORD said, "My Spirit will not contend with man forever, for he is mortal; his days will be a hundred and twenty years."
4. The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of men and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown.

Numbers 13:32-33
32. And they spread among the Israelites a bad report about the land they had explored. They said, "The land we explored devours those living in it. All the people we saw there are of great size.
33. We saw the Nephilim there (the descendants of Anak come from the Nephilim). We seemed like grasshoppers in our own eyes, and we looked the same to them."

In Enoch, the following chapter deals with this:

VI-XI. The Fall of the Angels: the Demoralization of Mankind: the Intercession of the Angels on behalf of Mankind. The Dooms pronounced by God on the Angels of the Messianic Kingdom.

All of those myths are in reality based on Sumerian myths, which is the language closely linked to the one the jockeys write and speak with in the movie.

It's going to be impossible to know until the second movie, but the possibilities are as follows:

1- All space jockeys = fallen angels.
2- Only some of them are fallen, the others remaining on God's side.

If 1 is true, then what happened on the moon was not an accident but a punishment: the fallen angels were attacked by God (in the book of Enoch, the fallen angels and their leader are bonded until judgement day). And this would explain how this may have happened everywhere where the fallen angels had found themselves, and hence why they seem to be all dead. They were all dealt with.

If instead #2 is true, it implies that God fixed the problem (killed/bounded the fallen angels) and the jockeys that are doing his bidding are still out there doing stuff, and that they had no intention of going kill mankind. Less likely, because it would contradict the idea that mankind is wanted dead.

But there is a third possibility, which would be closer to the Islamic version of Genesis, and which might tie into the above but also make more sense in the context of the movie: the angels were told by God that mankind was superior to them, and some of the angels (jinns in Islam) refused to accept this, rebelled, and were punished.

We could see the engineers in the movie as the djinns: they want to wipe out mankind because they have figured God's plan for mankind and reject it. They are basically actively trying to sabotage God's work. They were all stopped, but the one who gets woken up at the end decides to resume his mission.

Food for thought

 

[FStop7]

I thought we concluded that anything the goop touches eventually results in a Xeno variant?

Show of hands everyone?

Consider that perhaps the goop is the method of delivery and transport - as a liquid it's easily ingested by any organic life. It's a biological flash drive.

 

[Stinkles]

The ship rolled and tumbled so unless you've run a simulation on the whole physics of that sequence how the fuck do you know in the exact spot david's head and body should be at the end? Fact is that the body is in the "trench" below the raised platform.. maybe in reality they should have been 30 centimers closer to the eastern wall. We'll never know!

This is one of many imaginary plotholes conceived by people who didn't really pay attention during the movie.

Come on son.

 

[JB1981]

re: Ether_Snake's post

The film was originally going to be titled Paradise but Ridley felt it would give too much away about the plot. Rothman came up with the idea of calling it Prometheus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prometheus_(film)

Good interview with Lindenlof:

There are a few loose ends left at the end of the film, was that part of the writing process, or the re-writes?

One man’s loose end is another man’s ambiguity and Ridley was very interesting in ambiguity. As I said we were talking about 2001 a lot and Ridley is a huge Kubrick fan and he’s still trying to make sense of the end of 2001 and he would say ‘Explain to me the end of 2001′ and ‘is it not some kind of rebirth metaphor?’ and I would agree but 2001 is far more interesting to me than 2010 which spells in out explicitly. So we have to work out if a sci-fi film is going to delve into the question of where do we come from and why has God turned against me? How much do we let people find out for themselves? How much room should there be for future films? We’ve seen the film which is about ‘ok, we’ve unleashed this creature’ and Prometheus is more about who made us, why did they make us and now this question of why do they want to destroy us? Is it at arbitrary as being done with this petri dish, or did we do something to deserve it. This is the fundamental question that we ask ourselves especially when something bad befalls us. This idea of fundamental judgement weigh in. All these questions were on the table and yes, there were drafts with more specifically spelled out versions. Ridley’s instinct was to pull back and I’d say ‘I’m still eating shit a year on from the end of Lost where we didn’t directly spell everything out – are you sure you want to do this?’ He would rather have had people fighting against it and not know then spell it out. I know its obnoxious to say that you should see the movie a couple of times to really appreciate it but that is how the movie was designed – things that seem throwaway, for example when they do the carbon dating of the dead Engineer and realise that he’s been dead for two thousand years and you think ‘if two thousand years ago The Engineers decided to wipe us out what happened back then?’ Is there any correlation between what was happening on the Earth two thousand years ago and this decision? Could a sequel start in that time period and begin to contextualize what we did to piss these beings off

But you and Ridley know, in your mind, exactly what is happening here?

Yeah, and if enough people go and see the movie and if there’s a real sense of people wanting there to be another one then the second movie would clearly answer the question of what did we do to deserve this. And always the question is that if we want to explain this how do we do it in a dramatic way? It won’t be two people siting in a room with The Engineers sitting up and say ‘Ok, well here’s what you did to piss me off…’ I was always driven by the idea that Shaw was the only believer in the crew and that it feels outdated in 2093, it feels old fashioned – especially as she’s embracing this fundamental scientific knowledge, and she gets very excited when she learns that she was created by these beings as opposed to some supernatural deity but he doesn’t make her shed her faith, it only instills it. So, at the end of this journey and she’s only person who made it through you ask yourself why was that? Was God protecting her as the only true believer? The entire point of being alive is to ask these questions and search for some meaning so Ridley wanted the film to end with Shaw announcing that she was still searching.

Was there a juggling act with regards to explaining the unanswered questions about Alien while asking new questions?

Prometheus is promoting a question which is where we created by these things and did these things invite us to this place? The answer to that is yes. What isn’t answered it once we get there and realise that whatever they were making here they were going to drop on Earth but it got out and it killed them first. The new question is what did we do to make them want to kill us and Ridley wasn’t interested in answering that in this movie. He liked the idea that Shaw had that question to answer herself and had a choice – to go back to Earth or she can go forward, trying to determine what they did as a species to deserve annihilation. You don’t argue with Ridley Scott about the movie he wants to make. If you have unanswered questions some people are going to be creatively intrigue by it and others will be pissed off by it and that galvanised him – as there’s nothing he loves more than to piss people off. In the right way of course.

So Ridley is responsible for pushing for ambiguity and Lindenlof is responsible for terrible character decision/motivations and highly questionable internal logic. I think the answer for what we did might actually be because we killed Space Jesus lol

 

[Stinkles]

You can blame Lindelof for the anti climatic Vickers death, but the position of the head on the ship isn't vital to a scriptwriter unless it's an actual plot point.

Speaking of screenwriters, did anyone else know that Spaits wrote that Darkest Hour movie that was released around Christmas that no one saw? Now I'm interested in reading his script.

relevant spoiler from end of Darkest Hour.

Spoiler

boy and girl survivors are literally Adam and eve. Out of nowhere

 

[blizzardjesus]

Here's my next question, what're worms doing on this planet? Can worms survive in carbon dioxide? There's really no point to them considering the direction they went, but still it's something I noticed.

Everything in the room was preserved. Once the door was opened things inside started to deteriorate, the Engineers head started to deteriorate and the mural desolved, just like the paint on the terra-cotta army in china. She put the head in an air tight vacuum bag so that its wouldn't deteriorate any further.
The worms were dormant/suspended hibernation until it was hit with outside atmosphere

 

[kaizoku]

Too much focus on the "they want to wipe us out" storyline. The film itself I feel contradicts every theory I've heard.

Why create us, leave a map for us to go to some planets only for us to find a military base? Absolutely no point if they were just trying to harvest us or whatever.

Why does that base have ships that want to travel to earth approximately 2000 years ago? Why are they breeding what look like WMDs?

I bet it's just a haphazard mish mash of storylines that are trying to be clever but just don't quite fit together as masterfully as we want and in a way that's what keeps us talking about it for so long. Pisses me off tbh.

 

[Shouta]

I still don't really buy the goo being a weapon and LV-223 being a military base idea, myself. Just seems to run counter to the opening scene and the supposed contact they had with humans up until 2000 years prior to the movie. It really feels the "Played God, it backfired" plot is the one that makes the most sense especially when you consider the stupid shit David, as it's basically the same thing but done in regards to humans. Engineers create humans, they become their downfall on LV-223. Humans create David and he becomes their downfall on the planet as well.

A research facility, to me, seems to be the most likely scenario. They used it to seed life and see what it does, their creations turn on them and kill them in a way they didn't expect.

 

[maomaoIYP]

My wtf moments:

Shaw's just had some weird ass alien baby pulled from her stomach and yet no one's surprised or even questions her about her new staples on her belly.

Out of the blue the captain who "just flies the ship" come right out and explains to Shaw that they're dealing with a bioweapon.

David runs around pressing alien buttons, opening doors, and collecting alien samples and not a single human sees fit to question him.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

A research facility, to me, seems to be the most likely scenario. They used it to seed life and see what it does, their creations turn on them and kill them in a way they didn't expect.

We can speculate about what it's original function was, but the snap-shot that was frozen in time by its quarantine/destruction has the base operating in a military fashion - acting as a forward base and weapons stockpile.

Given the "invitation" left on Earth, it was probably the nearest outpost to the planet Earth, and thus the most obvious point of contact. It is indeed isolated and in a hostile environment, so doing weapons research in addition to other things is entirely possible, but this would again just be speculation.

 

[Ether_Snake]

The book of Enoch is so cool, re-reading parts of it. It really is 2000+ years old sci-fi

"And Semjâzâ, who was their leader, said unto them: 'I fear ye will not indeed agree to do this deed, and I alone shall have to pay the penalty of a great sin.' And they all answered him and said: 'Let us all swear an oath, and all bind ourselves by mutual imprecations not to abandon this plan but to do this thing.'. Then sware they all together and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it. And they were in all two hundred; who descended in the days of Jared on the summit of Mount Hermon, and they called it Mount Hermon, because they had sworn and bound themselves by mutual imprecations upon it."

[...]

"And they became pregnant, and they bare great giants, whose height was three thousand ells[66]: Who consumed all the acquisitions of men. And when men could no longer sustain them, the giants turned against them and devoured mankind. And they began to sin against birds, and beasts, and reptiles, and fish, and to devour one another's flesh, and drink the blood."

[...]

"And Azâzêl taught men to make swords, and knives, and shields, and breastplates, and made known to them the metals of the earth and the art of working them, and bracelets, and ornaments, and the use of antimony, and the beautifying of the eyelids, and all kinds of costly stones, and all colouring tinctures. And there arose much godlessness, and they committed fornication, and they were led astray, and became corrupt in all their ways. Semjâzâ taught enchantments, and root-cuttings, Armârôs the resolving of enchantments, Barâqîjâl, taught astrology, Kôkabêl the constellations, Ezêqêêl the knowledge of the clouds, Araqiêl the signs of the earth, Shamsiêl the signs of the sun, and Sariêl the course of the moon."

[...]

"Then said the Most High, the Holy and Great One spoke, and sent Uriel to the son of Lamech, and said to him: Go to Noah and tell him in my name "Hide thyself!" and reveal to him the end that is approaching: that the whole earth will be destroyed, and a deluge is about to come upon the whole earth, and will destroy all that is on it. And now instruct him that he may escape and his seed may be preserved for all the generations of the world."

[...]

"the Lord said to Raphael: 'Bind Azâzêl hand and foot, and cast him into the darkness: and make an opening in the desert, which is in Dûdâêl (Gods Kettle/Crucible/Cauldron), and cast him therein. And place upon him rough and jagged rocks, and cover him with darkness, and let him abide there for ever, and cover his face that he may not see light. And on the day of the great judgement he shall be cast into the fire. And heal the earth which the angels have corrupted, and proclaim the healing of the earth, that they may heal the plague, and that all the children of men may not perish through all the secret things that the Watchers have disclosed and have taught their sons. And the whole earth has been corrupted through the works that were taught by Azâzêl: to him ascribe all sin."

[...]

"And to Gabriel said the Lord: 'Proceed against the bastards and the reprobates, and against the children of fornication: and destroy [the children of fornication and] the children of the Watchers from amongst men [and cause them to go forth]: send them one against the other that they may destroy each other in battle"

Sounds like a prequel to Prometheus