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[draliko]

This could be what steam machines should have been from the start, fixed hardware generations with the same os, with forward compatibility (easy on x86 vs cell). Actually I hope this trend catch on, if it does graphics technology will see a much needed upgrade, because let's face it research is always done for the consoles, big money is still there for the big players.
I'm in day one, can't wait (and I'm also a PC player, but all my friends play on ps4).

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

No, I can't see this happening. While I never asked about a slim of og ps4, I'm sure it's coming since the other sku will be a slim.

Oh well, it was a thought....

If the 2X APU power is true and it is slimmer than the PS4 now I'm thinking a lower end Polaris/Zen semi-custom chip is very likely if it is coming in 2017.

 

[wapplew]

I'm not convinced that would change anything.

PS is a global brand, any gains Xbox makes in the US and/or UK will be offset by domination throughout Europe and the rest of the world.

Barring any PS3-style fuck up, I don't see Xbox ever overtaking PS again, regardless of how powerful those consoles are.

I agree. That's why I don't see the reason of PS4K.

 

[orochi91]

I agree. That's why I don't see the reason of PS4K.

PSVR is the likely culprit.

Sony, among other major companies, see VR as the next frontier of gaming.

Powerful consoles are needed to provide a worthwhile experience for consumers.

 

[wapplew]

PSVR is the likely culprit.

Sony, among other major companies, see VR as the next frontier of gaming.

Powerful consoles are needed to provide a worthwhile experience for consumers.

Sony claimed PSVR design for PS4 like in every events and interview, that's slap in the face of OG PS4 owner who pre ordered PSVR.

It will hurt PSVR even more.

 

[Brad Grenz]

Prioritizing immersion, I've been sitting closer than 10' to 100" for years, so for 1920 pixels I get 44 PPD, which for native 1080p entertainment is easily good enough, computing otoh has pixels visible in a way that makes me desire higher PPD

Deciding what you have is good enough is not the same as empirical evidence that you won't see benefits from a higher resolution. Actual tests that have been done seem to show that it's trivial for people to see that 4K looks better than 1080p on 55 inch screens at 9 ft, and that's with filmed content not subject to the great number of rendering artifacts games produce. Engineers working in display tech are finding that we can sense far more detail than Snellen tests imply.

 

[PdotMichael]

I'm not convinced that would change anything.

PS is a global brand, any gains Xbox makes in the US and/or UK will be offset by domination throughout Europe and the rest of the world.

Barring any PS3-style fuck up, I don't see Xbox ever overtaking PS again, regardless of how powerful those consoles are.

Microsoft didn't even overtake Sony after the "PS3-style fuck up", Microsoft has general a brand problem outside of the USA.

 

[El_Chino]

Sony claimed PSVR design for PS4 like in every events and interview, that's slap in the face of OG PS4 owner who pre ordered PSVR.

It will hurt PSVR even more.

I'll refer you to my earlier post.

You seem to be under the impression that everyone will want to buy a PSVR to go along with their PS4/K. You do understand that the PSVR is a add-on peripheral right? It's no way required to enjoy your PS4 games. It's all about options.

A) If you already own a PS4 then you can drop another $350+ and enjoy the VR experience.

B) Already own a PS4 and not interested in VR? then you don't have to buy it.

C) Never owned a PS4? Great, here's a more powerful one and pay either the same price or $100 more as the PS4 launch price.

D) Never owned a PS4 and are interested in VR? Cool. Spend $1000 and get the most out of your VR experience. (Still much cheaper than what it would cost to own a beast pc AND a Rift/Vive)

 

[wapplew]

I'll refer you to my earlier post.

It make people think that PSVR is not working well on OG PS4 or optimal PSVR experience is way more expensive now
People who don't want to upgrade PS4K might not buy PSVR after that.

No, because 'people' know PSVR works with every ordinary PS4.

But release PS4K for PSVR is telling me that PS4 is not good enough for PSVR.

 

[Raylan]

It make people think that PSVR is not working well on OG PS4.
People who don't want to upgrade PS4K might not buy PSVR now.

No, because 'people' know PSVR works with every ordinary PS4.

 

[DancingNalwood]

If I were Sony I wouldn't release it this year. Push psvr instead and have it out next year with the return on GOW and GT. That's roughly 4 years, and then push the ps5 back to make it an 8 year cycle. Or don't, have 4 year incremental upgrades to the same system, with each version having support for 8 years. No one can claim 8 years of support for your machine wasn't good enough.

But yeah, it's too much to release psvr and ps4k within a few months of each other.

 

[Sid]

That would be about 4.7x the power of the PS4. 16-20Tflops is what the PS5 should be to achieve a true leap.

Do you think we'll get 16-20 TF in a console within the next 4 years?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

I think this slide might point to what PS4K might be based on?

PS4 is a tweaked version of "Onion". PS4K could be Zen/HBM based?

 

[Cereal Enthusiast]

Random thoughts, multiple persons here said that it's impossible for PS4K games to run at 60fps while PS4 runs at 30 (would require too much power, even if the GPU is twice as powerful it's not enough etc.).

A game like Murdered Soul Suspect runs at 60fps on PS4 and 30 on Xbox One, PS4 is not 2x more powerful than an Xbox One. Same case with Tomb Raider Definitive Edition (of course it depends on how graphically intense the game is, but still).

 

[ZehDon]

You seem to be under the impression that everyone will want to buy a PSVR to go along with their PS4/K. You do understand that the PSVR is a add-on peripheral right? It's no way required to enjoy your PS4 games. It's all about options.

A) If you already own a PS4 then you can drop another $350+ and enjoy the VR experience.

B) Already own a PS4 and not interested in VR? then you don't have to buy it.

C) Never owned a PS4? Great, here's a more powerful one and pay either the same price or $100 more as the PS4 launch price.

D) Never owned a PS4 and are interested in VR? Cool. Spend $1000 and get the most out of your VR experience. (Still much cheaper than what it would cost to own a beast pc AND a Rift/Vive).

Not at all. The options you present are slanted towards the PS4K being a positive, and offer nothing in terms of counter points. In a world where the PS4K exists, there are two positions for potential PSVR owners:
1. You own a current PS4 and are interested in PSVR.
2. You do not own a current PS4 and are interested in PSVR
If you're in position 2, you have several options for enjoying all that PSVR has to offer at several price points, and get to select your ultimate situation within the Playstation ecosystem. If you're in position 1, congratulations - you get to enjoy PSVR with "significant" sacrifices for the same price, because fuck you.

The "options" your referring to are precisely why the PS4K, if it indeed exists and is indeed an upgrade, is a slap in the face for OG PS4 owners. If the PS4K materialises, it would self-evidently have been on Sony's cards for several years. OG PS4 owners would own the more limited hardware, but not one of them chose to. Sony provided deliberately limited options to early adopters to ensure strong adoption of the weaker hardware. If given the option, or knowledge that the option would be available at some point, how many early adopters would have bought the PS4K over the current PS4? I'd wager a great, great many.

Buying the PSVR and using it with your current PS4 is absolutely an option - no one can argue with you there. However, if the PS4K exists, then that option is objectively the worst possible option. That's kind of the issue - current PS4 owners in no way chose their situation within the ultimate Playstation ecosystem. And in order to improve their situation, they'll need to buy a new, full price console on top the new, full priced peripheral, one they were original told would fully function with their two year old, full priced console. Options, as you put it, are important, and OG PS4 owners were denied them.

 

[wapplew]

Random thoughts, multiple persons here said that it's impossible for PS4K games to run at 60fps while PS4 runs at 30 (would require too much power, even if the GPU is twice as powerful it's not enough etc.).

A game like Murdered Soul Suspect runs at 60fps on PS4 and 30 on Xbox One, PS4 is not 2x more powerful than an Xbox One. Same case with Tomb Raider Definitive Edition (of course it depends on how graphically intense the game is, but still).

It might be because those game running 40-50 fps on Xbox, and running 60-65 fps on PS4, so they lock it at 30 on Xbox.

 

[geordiemp]

Random thoughts, multiple persons here said that it's impossible for PS4K games to run at 60fps while PS4 runs at 30 (would require too much power, even if the GPU is twice as powerful it's not enough etc.).

A game like Murdered Soul Suspect runs at 60fps on PS4 and 30 on Xbox One, PS4 is not 2x more powerful than an Xbox One. Same case with Tomb Raider Definitive Edition (of course it depends on how graphically intense the game is, but still).

]Thats easy, games run at an average, have a low and a high....

Eurogamer first light : .

While exploring the city we found that the frame-rate stuck more closely to a 40fps average. There is a palpable sense while moving about that performance is indeed faster than the original game

So First light you could run in the 40's or cap at 30. PS4K would hit 60 FPS on his game.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2014-infamous-first-light-performance-analysis

So a PS4K could help many game that just cant get there.

 

[GopherD]

The "options" your referring to are precisely why the PS4K, if it indeed exists and is indeed an upgrade, is a slap in the face for OG PS4 owners. If the PS4K materialises, it would self-evidently have been on Sony's cards for several years. OG PS4 owners would own the more limited hardware, but not one of them chose to

This is the most ridiculous assertion in this thread. The PS5 is on the cards too, does everyone get to feel this alleged slap?

This amounts to nothing more than penis envy. Solution? Buy a bigger penis when it goes on sale.

 

[mrklaw]

Not at all. The options you present are slanted towards the PS4K being a positive, and offer nothing in terms of counter points. In a world where the PS4K exists, there are two positions for potential PSVR owners:
1. You own a current PS4 and are interested in PSVR.
2. You do not own a current PS4 and are interested in PSVR
If you're in position 2, you have several options for enjoying all that PSVR has to offer at several price points, and get to select your ultimate situation within the Playstation ecosystem. If you're in position 1, congratulations - you get to enjoy PSVR with "significant" sacrifices for the same price, because fuck you.

The "options" your referring to are precisely why the PS4K, if it indeed exists and is indeed an upgrade, is a slap in the face for OG PS4 owners. If the PS4K materialises, it would self-evidently have been on Sony's cards for several years. OG PS4 owners would own the more limited hardware, but not one of them chose to. Sony provided deliberately limited options to early adopters to ensure strong adoption of the weaker hardware. If given the option, or knowledge that the option would be available at some point, how many early adopters would have bought the PS4K over the current PS4? I'd wager a great, great many.

Buying the PSVR and using it with your current PS4 is absolutely an option - no one can argue with you there. However, if the PS4K exists, then that option is objectively the worst possible option. That's kind of the issue - current PS4 owners in no way chose their situation within the ultimate Playstation ecosystem. And in order to improve their situation, they'll need to buy a new, full price console on top the new, full priced peripheral, one they were original told would fully function with their two year old, full priced console. Options, as you put it, are important, and OG PS4 owners were denied them.

PCVR seems to be working well on the 'minimum' spec, with developers being careful to ensure solid framerates on 970 level hardware - anything higher is a bonus. No reason that couldn't be the same for PSVR. PS4 guaranteed to have solid framerates and good graphics, PS4K gets better graphics/AA/supersampling etc.

 

[hesido]

Is Dreams 60fps? There was a nice gif that was 60fps, but I think all the videos I saw were 30fps.

60 fps with such graphic? :/
By the way the only good thing about the ps4k is if it means to play bad port like The Evil Within, at higher fps, I'll buy it immediately. Man this game runs terribly on ps4, it's barely playable. What a pity.

AFAIK, it's 60fps.

 

[kyser73]

Not at all. The options you present are slanted towards the PS4K being a positive, and offer nothing in terms of counter points. In a world where the PS4K exists, there are two positions for potential PSVR owners:
1. You own a current PS4 and are interested in PSVR.
2. You do not own a current PS4 and are interested in PSVR
If you're in position 2, you have several options for enjoying all that PSVR has to offer at several price points, and get to select your ultimate situation within the Playstation ecosystem. If you're in position 1, congratulations - you get to enjoy PSVR with "significant" sacrifices for the same price, because fuck you.

The "options" your referring to are precisely why the PS4K, if it indeed exists and is indeed an upgrade, is a slap in the face for OG PS4 owners. If the PS4K materialises, it would self-evidently have been on Sony's cards for several years. OG PS4 owners would own the more limited hardware, but not one of them chose to. Sony provided deliberately limited options to early adopters to ensure strong adoption of the weaker hardware. If given the option, or knowledge that the option would be available at some point, how many early adopters would have bought the PS4K over the current PS4? I'd wager a great, great many.

Buying the PSVR and using it with your current PS4 is absolutely an option - no one can argue with you there. However, if the PS4K exists, then that option is objectively the worst possible option. That's kind of the issue - current PS4 owners in no way chose their situation within the ultimate Playstation ecosystem. And in order to improve their situation, they'll need to buy a new, full price console on top the new, full priced peripheral, one they were original told would fully function with their two year old, full priced console. Options, as you put it, are important, and OG PS4 owners were denied them.

Get over yourself.

I'm an OG PS4 owner with a PSVR pre-order, and absolutely do not feel like I've been slapped in the face with the possible option of PS4K.

Stop speaking for people other than yourself.

 

[geordiemp]

PCVR seems to be working well on the 'minimum' spec, with developers being careful to ensure solid framerates on 970 level hardware - anything higher is a bonus. No reason that couldn't be the same for PSVR. PS4 guaranteed to have solid framerates and good graphics, PS4K gets better graphics/AA/supersampling etc.

It did not work out so well for the giant bomb stream using an I5 / 970. There was a handful of performance instances of not hitting the frame rate or tearing I recall etc.

No, dont ask me to watch it again and point them out, would rather jump off a cliff.

 

[KOHIPEET]

I know the dual GPU setup seems unlikely, however this user on Beyond3d, brought up some advantages of a dual APU setup.

There are a number of reasons I consider it *plausible* that PS4K, as described in the various leaks, is powered by a multi-chip solution. Here they are in no particular order.

1. Time frame - This seems have to have come together pretty fast. Taking the existing chip that they had already been (and would already be) shrinking for the new process tech, even without the PS4K existing, and modifying it to accommodate working with another GPU/APU seems like it would be an easier job than designing a whole new chip.
2. Performance target - 2X performance. 2X the same chip with overclocks all around to make up for the imperfect scaling of multi-gpu.
3. Backwards Compatibility - Non-PS4K aware games just work - system sets the clocks to PS4 spec and doesn't expose the second chip. Other games can be patched to varying degrees according to developer commitment. Anywhere from "I can run and benefit from PS4K clocks without breaking" to "We're going to throw some work at the 2nd GPU/APU since it's there".
4. VR - As has been stated, VR workloads map relatively well to multiple GPUs.
5. Economies of scale - There's bound to be a cost benefit to using the same chip in multiple designs and even more of one from using only that chip (2 APU scenario). There may even be chips that are unable to run at PS4K clocks that run fine at PS4 clocks. Being able to bin chips in this way may allow for a more aggressive clockspeed to be set for PS4K. Also, cheaper R&D going forward for enabling further shrinks.
Radeon Technology Group are *really* into multi-gpu.

It's the bolded part that really caught my attention.

What do you think?

 

[Bits N Pieces]

I think a new and improved PS4 and Xbox are inevitable now with Phil dropping it in his speech a few months ago and that Sony eec last year.

Only thing I find strange is how were getting the info about them. Vague messages from high up suits, Scoops with his exclusive from a few devs and what looks like a controlled leak with this thread.

When do they officially announce them, E3 to release later this year or Q1 2017? That's retail suicide and there's no way do they do that, right?

I honestly don't know how they position these new consoles for the consumer without disrupting current sales. It needs to announced and then available to buy 'tomorrow' surely?

 

[geordiemp]

Not at all. The options you present are slanted towards the PS4K being a positive, and offer nothing in terms of counter points. In a world where the PS4K exists, there are two positions for potential PSVR owners:

Oh man, look, most PSVR games have been shown already will be fine with Ps4, there have been enough demos and hands on for games like battlezone, RIGS etc by public and press for about a year now.

The problem comes for the games that are too hard to do that we have not seen yet or tried, maybe a game like NO MANS SKY no way could run at a SOLID 60 FPS on OG Ps4.

So what do you do ? Allow only PC players to play No mans sky in the future, no SONY fans can play it because it has no chance of running and their are too many upset players who are annoyed someone has a bigger epenis than them.

You could say that elite dangerous with nice settings would be hard to run on OG Ps4, and probably project cars.

So, do we ignore those games, if you cant play them no sony fans can ?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

This is the most ridiculous assertion in this thread. The PS5 is on the cards too, does everyone get to feel this alleged slap?

This amounts to nothing more than penis envy. Solution? Buy a bigger penis when it goes on sale.

No beating about the bush there...

This is a big change in consoles so some will feel slapped in the face until it happens and isn't as bad as feared. I think the official announcement will go a long way in abating those fears for many currently against this.

I love a leak as much as anybody, but this leaking up to a year in advance is the one scenario I wouldn't have wanted leaking until much closer to launch.

 

[Marlenus]

Get over yourself.

I'm an OG PS4 owner with a PSVR pre-order, and absolutely do not feel like I've been slapped in the face with the possible option of PS4K.

Stop speaking for people other than yourself.

Same here for me. PS4K, if as rumoured, seems like good timing to me as I am thinking of getting a second PS4 anyway so if there is a more powerful version coming I'll grab that one.

 

[wapplew]

Oh man, look, most PSVR games have been shown already will be fine with Ps4, there have been enough demos and hands on for games like battlezone, RIGS etc by public and press for about a year now.

The problem comes for the games that are too hard to do that we have not seen yet or tried, maybe a game like NO MANS SKY no way could run at a SOLID 60 FPS on OG Ps4.

So what do you do ? Allow only PC players to play No mans sky in the future, no SONY fans can play it because it has no chance of running and their are too many upset players who are annoyed someone has a bigger epenis than them.

You could say that elite dangerous with nice settings would be hard to run on OG Ps4, and probably project cars.

So, do we ignore those games, if you cant play them no sony fans can ?

At what cost thou? So in order for part of the fans able to play some VR games impossible to run on OG PS4, we need a PS4K.
What happen a year or two later, we have more games can't even run on PS4K? So we go down that rabbit hole?

 

[cyberheater]

This is the most ridiculous assertion in this thread. The PS5 is on the cards too, does everyone get to feel this alleged slap?

Your argument fails because its predicated on the belief that and upgrade to an existing system and a new console generation are the same. They are not which is why some folks who already own a PS4 are against this upgrade because they feel that it will have a negative impact on their console.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

Your argument fails because its predicated on the belief that and upgrade to an existing system and a new console generation are the same. They are not which is why some folks who already own a PS4 are against this upgrade because they feel that it will have a negative impact on their console.

They're not the same, yes, which is exactly why you shouldn't expect a negative impact on OG PS4. As someone else said in this thread, the concern in the thread boils down to no more than people being upset at the fact that they no longer own 'the most powerful console'.

This will be in no way the same kind of crap deal PS3/360 owners got on cross gen games when PS4/XB1 came out. The assertion that it is is so ridiculous and hyperbolic.

 

[geordiemp]

At what cost thou? So in order for part of the fans able to play some VR games impossible to run on OG PS4, we need a PS4K.
What happen a year or two later, we have more games can't even run on PS4K? So we go down that rabbit hole?

Well, there is no way around it, you either

A. PS4K owners get to play a possible NO Mans Sky VR.... but not OG Ps4 owners.

B. The petty hate crowd win and NOBODY gets to play it.

Which camp are you in, A or B. There is no magic wand. Vanilla Ps4 seems to just be able to run No mans sky as it is, it seems so ambitious no way is it ever running at a stable 60 FPS on standard Ps4 imo

Instead of moaning posters should suggest a solution.

We are already down that rabbit hole, do you think Project cars will run with decent settings at a rock solid 60 FPS on standard ps4 ?

OK, throw your toys, nobody gets to play it except PC players ...is that what you want ?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Your argument fails because its predicated on the belief that and upgrade to an existing system and a new console generation are the same. They are not which is why some folks who already own a PS4 are against this upgrade because they feel that it will have a negative impact on their console.

Presumably Sony has a plan to explain and reassure current PS4 owners, though.

I think we have to give them a chance to sell the idea before picking up the pitchforks. That's why I think this particular leak has come way too early.

There is going to be months and months of negativity if this isn't announced at E3.

 

[Prisoner KSC2-303]

Well, there is no way around it, you either

A. PS4K owners get to play a possible NO Mans Sky VR.... but not OG Ps4 owners.

B. The petty hate crowd win and NOBODY gets to play it.

Which camp are you in, A or B. There is no magic wand. Vanilla Ps4 seems to just be able to run No mans sky as it is, it seems so ambitious no way is it ever running at a stable 60 FPS on standard Ps4 imo

Instead of moaning posters should suggest a solution.

You could just as easily describe B as "the platform doesn't fragment". It's not petty to assume a generation would remain consistent across SKUs.

 

[cyberheater]

They're not the same, yes, which is exactly why you shouldn't expect a negative impact on OG PS4.

As outlined by other posters in this very thread. The concern relative to the negative impact on OGPS4 are numerous. These include the apprehension that devs might put all their efforts into developing for PS4K and then strip back the game with minimal work to get it to run on OGPS4. In other words OGPS4 getting shoddy ports.
Also it will effect the resale value of our consoles and also there is the fear that eventually there are going to be games that will only work on PS4K.

All are valid concerns.

 

[FrozenCell]

Deciding what you have is good enough is not the same as empirical evidence that you won't see benefits from a higher resolution. Actual tests that have been done seem to show that it's trivial for people to see that 4K looks better than 1080p on 55 inch screens at 9 ft, and that's with filmed content not subject to the great number of rendering artifacts games produce. Engineers working in display tech are finding that we can sense far more detail than Snellen tests imply.

it is empirical evidence I won't see benefits from a higher resolution for the content that's been made available in the past 10 years

when I will upgrade, it'll not be for 4K itself, but instead for HDR - however, 4K makes it possible to also upgrade FOV if it gets WAF

 

[KZObsessed]

This is the most ridiculous assertion in this thread. The PS5 is on the cards too, does everyone get to feel this alleged slap?

This amounts to nothing more than penis envy. Solution? Buy a bigger penis when it goes on sale.

If only I could 😔

 

[Neuromancer]

Your argument fails because its predicated on the belief that and upgrade to an existing system and a new console generation are the same. They are not which is why some folks who already own a PS4 are against this upgrade because they feel that it will have a negative impact on their console.

With ~40 million OG PS4s in the wild I doubt their owners will be left behind. It just doesn't make business sense for the people making the games.

 

[wapplew]

Well, there is no way around it, you either

A. PS4K owners get to play a possible NO Mans Sky VR.... but not OG Ps4 owners.

B. The petty hate crowd win and NOBODY gets to play it.

Which camp are you in, A or B. There is no magic wand. Vanilla Ps4 seems to just be able to run No mans sky as it is, it seems so ambitious no way is it ever running at a stable 60 FPS on standard Ps4 imo

Instead of moaning posters should suggest a solution.

We are already down that rabbit hole, do you think Project cars will run with decent settings at a rock solid 60 FPS on standard ps4 ?

OK, throw your toys, nobody gets to play it except PC players ...is that what you want ?

So what in your mind about PS4K? No to normal exclusive games but VR exclusive is ok?

 

[cyberheater]

Presumably Sony has a plan to explain and reassure current PS4 owners, though.

I really don't see how this is possible. At the end of the day it's a massive kick in the teeth for existing PS4 owners.

I can't think of a case where a console manufacturer has released a hardware performance upgrade to an existing home console.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

As outlined by other posters in this very thread. The concern relative to the negative impact on OGPS4 are numerous. These include the apprehension that devs might put all their efforts into developing for PS4K and then strip back the game with minimal work to get it to run on OGPS4. In other words OGPS4 getting shoddy ports.
Also it will effect the resale value of our consoles and also there is the fear that eventually there are going to be games that will only work on PS4K.

All are valid concerns.

It's as if they're all ignoring the fact that most PS4 multiplats this generation are built on PC and 'stripped down' to run on PS4 and XB1 already. All PS4K does is add another SKU, which is basically the same console except with a bit of extra juice. It's in no way comparable to PS3/PS4 cross gen development when both systems had architectures and power levels that are worlds apart. I feel you're misjudging both how much power this thing will have relative to OG PS4 and how hard it will be to cross develop for both. Again, they're the same console.

 

[geordiemp]

You could just as easily describe B as "the platform doesn't fragment". It's not petty to assume a generation would remain consistent across SKUs.

Oh agree, fragment sounds cooler than saying others cant play a game that I cant, but its the same fucking thing.

Its not fragmenting the ps4 games at all, they all play the same games. However, there is no way around VR on Ps4.

PSVR is more demanding, it requires 60 FPS absolutely rock solid or you will get headaches etc, not every game will run a consistent 60.

So, a new machine is needed for some games to run in VR. That is a fact.

Again which camp are you in for VR

1. If I cant play No mans sky in VR, then nobody can. Call it fragmentation, same thing.

2. I am happy for others to pay for better hardware to play No mans sky VR

Disclaimer : No mans sky is a good example here, I have no insider knowledge at all.

So what in your mind about PS4K? No to normal exclusive games but VR exclusive is ok?

There is no other way, you have to choose, 1 or 2. If you were in charge of Sony, what would you do. Its your choice !

I am an older gamer, I have a 12 year old son, I am past the petty shit so I dont really care and am grown up so Ps4k does not bother me, I may or may not buy it.

 

[Muzicfreq]

They're not the same, yes, which is exactly why you shouldn't expect a negative impact on OG PS4. As someone else said in this thread, the concern in the thread boils down to no more than people being upset at the fact that they no longer own 'the most powerful console'.

This will be in no way the same kind of crap deal PS3/360 owners got on cross gen games when PS4/XB1 came out. The assertion that it is is so ridiculous and hyperbolic.

But there's the problem of marketing

"We present, the Playstation 4k. It's an even stronger system to add to our family of devices and an opportunity to create a new chapter in the console space.
Games made will play on both systems, will have higher fidelity, performance, and offering an even more detailed world in out PSVR. Games will be able to upscale to 4k televisions as well.
The starting price will be $500USD releasing this fall"

OG PS4 owners:.................................?

honestly this sounds more like a "Heres what we meant to launch and sorry that you spent $400 just 2-3 years ago."

 

[omonimo]

I know the dual GPU setup seems unlikely, however this user on Beyond3d, brought up some advantages of a dual APU setup.



It's the bolded part that really caught my attention.

What do you think?

So it means old game will run pratically the same... and ps4.5 basically runs better just when developers push it. Fuck that. I don't care to have a deluxe model just to play the new game at higher specs. It's pratically a ps5.

 

[GopherD]

Your argument fails because its predicated on the belief that and upgrade to an existing system and a new console generation are the same. They are not which is why some folks who already own a PS4 are against this upgrade because they feel that it will have a negative impact on their console.

I have yet to read any coherent rationale that this would seriously impact ps4 owners in any way shape or form, outside of not having the latest hardware.

It will also be a moot point when competitors do the same.

 

[MatrixMan.EXE]

But there's the problem of marketing

"We present, the Playstation 4k. It's an even stronger system to add to our family of devices and an opportunity to create a new chapter in the console space.
Games made will play on both systems, will have higher fidelity, performance, and offering an even more detailed world in out PSVR. Games will be able to upscale to 4k televisions as well.
The starting price will be $500USD releasing this fall"

OG PS4 owners:.................................?

honestly this sounds more like a "Heres what we meant to launch and sorry that you spent $400 just 2-3 years ago."

I don't agree with any of this, but fair enough.

 

[mrklaw]

PSVR is the likely culprit.

Sony, among other major companies, see VR as the next frontier of gaming.

Powerful consoles are needed to provide a worthwhile experience for consumers.

PSVR is a red herring. Sony, like MS, want to move to incremental updates like apple do with their products. PS4 and XB1 are already effectively PCs, and most engines are developed on PC and then adapted for console. Moving to an incremental model provides two benefits for sony and publishers

1) additional revenue from maintaining a product on the market with a relatively higher ASP, even while the older console drops in price.

2) for publishers, it provides a smoother transition between products, effectively removing the sudden jump between generations and allowing them to maintain existing toolchains etc across multiple generations of products. This should help keep costs of development under control

 

[Prisoner KSC2-303]

Oh agree, fragment sounds cooler than saying others cant play a game that I cant, but its the same fucking thing.

Its not fragmenting the ps4 games at all, they all play the same games. However, there is no way around VR on Ps4.

PSVR is more demanding, it requires 60 FPS absolutely rock solid or you will get headaches etc, not ever game will run a consistent 60.

So, a new machine is needed for some games to run in VR. That is a fact.

Again which camp are you in for VR

1. If I cant play No mans sky in VR, then nobody can. Call it fragmentation, same thing.

2. I am happy for others to pay for better hardware to play No mans sky VR

Disclaimer : No mans sky is a good example here, I have no insider knowledge at all.



There is no other way, you have to choose, 1 or 2. There is no other way. If you were in charge of Sony, what would you do. Its your choice !

PSVR is a peripheral though. It may bear all the hallmarks of a new platform, and it may be described as such, but it's tethered to a device, without which it's useless.

What you're describing is a situation in which the usefulness of peripherals can be SKU exclusive. You can try to portray people's consternation at that prospect as being babyish, but I think your original framing of the question was bordering on the ridiculous.

And for the record, no, I don't think fragmentation during a generation with exclusives is a good idea. To my knowledge, there's never been an example of it working well, if you know of one, perhaps you can enlighten me.

 

[Muzicfreq]

I don't agree with any of this, but fair enough.

You're right, forgot to add all the numbers of owners out there and all the hours played ect.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

I really don't see how this is possible. At the end of the day it's a massive kick in the teeth for existing PS4 owners.

I can't think of a case where a console manufacturer has released a hardware performance upgrade to an existing home console.

That is the headache Sony have to tackle head-on. That is why I say this is the worse type of leak.

I see this as more a reset of the gen because a proper jump in tech for 5 years is finally happening and Sony/MS feel they must get in early. I do strongly feel they should start talking directly to their customers, though.

Being upfront and straight will go a long way.

 

[mrklaw]

honestly this sounds more like a "Heres what we meant to launch and sorry that you spent $400 just 2-3 years ago."

Or "building on the base of the amazing success of the PS4, we're delighted to introduce the newest member of the playstation family"

Why doesn't Apple get criticised for the exact same thing? "here is the new iphone 6S. Sorry to all those that bought the 6. I know we said it was amazing last year, but its shit now"