At least this tells us what we can think of nx gamer now.
PS4's AF issue we need answers!
- Thread starter pixlexic
- Start date
At least this tells us what we can think of nx gamer now.
AF is the same on Xbone version.
dampflokfreund
Banned
I can't understand this. I have a GTX 850m laptop which only has DDR3 memory with 32 GB/s bandwidth, yet I can always choose the highest resolution textures and 16xAF without any performance loss. So how is this a issue with the PS4 which has 172 GB/s GDDR5 Vram?
MilkyJoe
Member
Well...
Yeah that's really noticeable there. Not good at all.
Because something's amiss & relevant parties are hush hush about this.
biglittleps
Member
It has small faster RAM cache just like XB1 and used DX API thats why they call XBOX because its based on Direct X. Don't know its DX11 or not but it should provide all the features of DX11 in their console metal API too.
He doesn't say that, he says that this game (DmC) is a DX11 PC port which is same code for PC and X1 than PS4. Using the higher wrapper may have limits on this, overhead etc.
Edit: X360 is not mentioned in this regard but this did use same split of System ram and smaller (10mb) of eDram that mimics the set-up of X1.
IAmRandom31
Banned
Point exactly.
All you have to do is plant the seed, and watch it grow from there. Almost like Inception.
DF was not saying there was a difference in AF in the actual game. They mentioned it occurring in a single cutscene of the entire game ( who knows why ). That turned into the entire product having AF issues. Somehow. God knows how.
biglittleps
Member
Its API and game engine issue i guess if we go with NX gamers ideas, like it requires some work for AF to work specifically for PS4 which is possible only if they made PS4 as main platform otherwise if its based on XB1/PC as base with DX then it may suffer.
There's definitely some level of AF, the degree to which I'm not sure.
But yea, the anomaly with other games really needs to be sorted. AF is not such an expensive feature that it deserves omission.
Yeah people need to realize that when both ports have bad af it doesn't mean it's "ok"
Are you guys serious?
Just because some games preforms badly in some areas you need Sony to step in and Answer you? really? Like you need proof that the PS4 is the perfect console from the future and can not have some badly preformed games in some areas? You need the developers to answer you also? Would that justice the purchase? Is that your interpretation of games and entertainment ? You can't enjoy a game just because it misses some frames/Pixels or have issue with AF etc?
You need answers?
Bloodborne
Uncharted
The order
That's your answer. Now start enjoy your games and stop complaining about every little detail. Nothing is perfect, And nothing will be.
Just because some games preforms badly in some areas you need Sony to step in and Answer you? really? Like you need proof that the PS4 is the perfect console from the future and can not have some badly preformed games in some areas? You need the developers to answer you also? Would that justice the purchase? Is that your interpretation of games and entertainment ? You can't enjoy a game just because it misses some frames/Pixels or have issue with AF etc?
You need answers?
Bloodborne
Uncharted
The order
That's your answer. Now start enjoy your games and stop complaining about every little detail. Nothing is perfect, And nothing will be.
PolarGamer
Member
Huh? A software algorithm can easily be turned off. And why would you turn it off?! This makes no sense.
What about complaining about people complaining about every little detail?
You can't enjoy a game just because people can't enjoy a game because it misses some frames?
If you don't care about this kind of thing, don't enter this kind of thread.
What about people complaining about people complaining about people complaining about every little detail?
You don't like people complaining about people complaining then don't enter this kind of thread.
I'm so confused.
The difference is that entering a thread to say you don't give a shit is bannable (I would know), entering a thread to discuss what the thread is about is not.
PsihoPerihelion
Member
You can add DmC to the list. Shit is bilinear by the looks of it.
Edit: This is bannable? Where's the report button?
Ok there, we have your feedback now. Thanks for missing the point of the thread.
Edit: This is bannable? Where's the report button?
WTF are you talking about?
Who said I cant enjoy a game just because some people doesn't enjoy it?
What are you 5 years old? telling me not to post my meaning instead of discussed?
lightchris
Member
AF degree is set per texture. So.. it depends.
I wonder if because it's considered not so noticeable by the public at large (NeoGaf has keener senses) the devs decide that it's not worth trying to fix.
Obviously each machine is different in how it works and applies resources. So perhaps there is a headache with how AF is utilized on the PS4. Which requires more resources and time to fix.
I can honestly say I've never really noticed it while I'm playing. Also since I don't buy the same game for multiple platforms I wouldn't know there was a difference.
Obviously each machine is different in how it works and applies resources. So perhaps there is a headache with how AF is utilized on the PS4. Which requires more resources and time to fix.
I can honestly say I've never really noticed it while I'm playing. Also since I don't buy the same game for multiple platforms I wouldn't know there was a difference.
jmaine_ph
Member
This.
You don't go in many Digital Foundry PS4/X1 comparison threads do you?.
RobRSG
Member
I believe that those games were developed first on PC then ported to Xbox One/PS4 real quick.
Xbox One may have AF implementation closer to PC than PS4, and that's where the devs drop the ball.
Maybe newer SDKs releases can make the job easier for devs, since it definitely looks like an optimization problem, not lack of hardware resources.
Xbox One may have AF implementation closer to PC than PS4, and that's where the devs drop the ball.
Maybe newer SDKs releases can make the job easier for devs, since it definitely looks like an optimization problem, not lack of hardware resources.
dead monkey uk
Member
Could very well be this, if a developer gets their game running at 1080p is this not the headline for people who care about such things. I do not think AF is discussed or noticed outside forums like this.
AF will be an issue for Sony and I am sure like everything else it will improve over time on the PS4.
IAmRandom31
Banned
What does Sony have to do with it? AF is one of the oldest post processing graphical effects in computing. Its on the developers for not implementing it or leaving it at a low level or optimizing the engine around it.
At most you will lose 3-4fps by implementing 16xAF. I've never seen a drop, even with my weak ass system, of any higher then that over 15 years of using AF in most every 3D game ever played on the PC. So, when devs are finishing up the game and implementing all the last minute processes and they see that hit from AF. They can either leave it as is, or go in and optimize the engine a bit more to make up for those 3-4 frames. A few devs choose not to optimize from the looks of it, and decide to either leave it out completely or leave it at a very low level with the knowledge that not many people will notice anyway.
This is just ridiculous.. the unfinished swan case, where PS3 has AF and PS4 does not is pure madness. What are you hiding, Sony?
Looking at this again, I realize that this actually a bigger issue than just ground textures. It affects anything that's at an angle to your view. The table top is blurred and that whole left wall progresses into a blurry mess. Maybe GAF should start blowing up Yoshida's twitter again?
RobRSG
Member
Yes.
But one thing is clear for me in DBX case: that game is not optimized at all for current-gen consoles.
My underpowered PC with a mere GTS450 can run it with all settings on maximum and with AF16x set on driver at 60fps. I have set it on driver because the game lacks this level of AA on settings.
Necro900
Member
Yeah, AF basically fixes every kind of angled texture on screen. Be it on the ground, on the walls, roofs or even objects with angled parts, hence the issue showing here and there.
I honestly can't figure out all this. Even if it were a bandwith cap, I don't think that PS4 could reach it with games such as unfinished swan or strider. I could totally understand DriveClub or other effects-driven games, but these? There must be something funky in the porting process.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
Classic NXgamer material right there.
dead monkey uk
Member
If AF is being used by developers more widely on an other system, I am sure Sony will want to help developers overcome the issues they are having. Saying 'Its on the developers' is quite right, but that would not stop Sony wanting to make it easier to implement AF.
People in this thread have shown there is issue in certain titles on one platform and not the other, which as I said is an issue for Sony.
This is just ridiculous.. the unfinished swan case, where PS3 has AF and PS4 does not is pure madness. What are you hiding, Sony?
It must be a software matter. Why Sony & developers let this go past the beta period is beyond me.
CyclopsRock
Member
Well you missed the entire point. "dont take it personally some of us just want to know why."
The vast majority of third party titles are superior on the PS4 in the majority of traditional metrics - frame rate, resolution etc. Yet there's this one effect that seems to be either missing or significantly less pronounced on the PS4, even when compared to the PS3 in many cases. Given the PS4's general power gap over the XBone, there must be some reason why this specific effect taxes the system to the degree that some devs seem to cut or reduce it (though others don't)
You'll note, because you're jolly good at reading, that none of that is a complaint.
Summer Haze
Banned
I have no idea what causes it, but it's really distracting when I play a game on PS4 that has poor AF. Dying Light's ground textures looks absolutely awful on PS4.
Lockjaw333
Member
AF is such a tiny performance hit on PC that I don't even notice the setting on games. Its just maxed regardless of the game.
No idea why its not in most PS4 games. Maybe its there but not working due to a software bug. If so how is it not fixed yet?
No idea why its not in most PS4 games. Maybe its there but not working due to a software bug. If so how is it not fixed yet?
IAmRandom31
Banned
Which is most likely due to the game being written for DirectX language in its original PC form and then they have to port that code over to another API and language in OpenGL on the PS4 and they do not optimize the new code well so they get less performance out of it.
Then they don't have time to optimize anymore, or just don't care and don't spend the time needed to rewrite.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
It has definitely gotten to an unacceptable level, and devs are always super quiet about it. Clearly more noise needs to be made so they actually take the time to fix it, since the PS4 is clearly capable of good AF, just many devs are not ticking certain boxes and working to implement it.
None in the past 5 years really. There is literally no reason to not have AF on 16x.
But what about games like The Order then? I don't think there's any reason for them to implement variable AF if there's no issues at all to have 16XAF on PS4.
There's clearly something PS4 related, hardware or software, I don't know, but it's not that simple.
It's not just about AF completely lacking or being worse than on Xbox One, even when it's better it's still not quite there. On PC it's almost free, and while I do understand that consoles and PC are different, if it's not free on PS4, then it's also a PS4 issue, not a dev issue.
I find it hard to believe that they would just choose not to use 16xAF because reasons.
AF is bandwidth intensive. Pcs with dedicated gpus have a lot of bandwidth. They have seperate memory pools as well that helps with that. Using gddr for everything means everything takes up memory bandwidth. Gddr cannot read and write at the same time which also clogs that bus.
If it's a hardware issue my bet is on it being asocciated to that.
Games with it just juggle memory better than those without is my guess.
I remember with the PS3 dev kit you could 'kill' certain features which were running to reduce footprint. Don't know if AF was one of them. Anyway it's a maybe, like the other dozen or so in the thread.
WeAreStarStuff
Member
This is just ridiculous.. the unfinished swan case, where PS3 has AF and PS4 does not is pure madness. What are you hiding, Sony?
Oh wow....yeah Sony needs to address this.
Dictator93
Member
There's definitely some level of AF, the degree to which I'm not sure.
But yea, the anomaly with other games really needs to be sorted. AF is not such an expensive feature that it deserves omission.
Screens point to it being like 4x or so.