Reggie: Switch matchmaking and lobbies handled through phone app

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And if you don't have a smart phone? Have they accounted for that portion of the userbase, however small? Because "needs to pay a monthly contract to play online" or "must buy an iPod Touch for multiplayer" is not going to sell devices.
 
GhostTrick said:
It's more about the fact that there are smaller devices with bigger batteries.
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Which ones? Because the GPD ones you mentioned earlier have a clamshell design, so components of the screen, including the touchscren controller can be fitted in the top section, and also appear to be thicker than the Switch.

The Switch also needs space for the fans and it has a bigger / more powerful SoC.
 
orthodoxy1095 said:
1. This is a silly rationale since people who would be using party chat would probably be doing so in environments where they would be near a charger. Also I don't appreciate that I have to chew through my mobile battery and data instead of just limiting this all to one device.

2. They already unveiled their parental control app, this is exactly the kind of thing that app should be controlling. You shouldn't be adding more gates on top of that just because of "think of de childrenz!"
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Come on mate, now you're limited to game near a charge point, thier making something so simple a struggle. It's going to deter gamers (outside the Nintendo faithful), it's got Wii U written all over it.
 
Speely said:
I can't think of a time recently when Nintendo, as a developer, made a bad game. But YMMV.
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I don't know by what metric we consider a game "bad" but I can make a short list of games they didn't get right:

Star Fox Zero
Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival
Most of the recent Mario Party games, especially Island Tour
Rusty's Real Deal Baseball
Pokemon Rumble U
Metroid Prime Federation Force
Paper Mario Sticker Star

There's been some pretty damn mediocre games, too. Like Tomodachi Life, New Super Mario Bros 2, the recent Chibi Robo games, Pokemon Shuffle, Mario Tennis Ultra Smash...

I'll add Mario Maker 3DS for the absolutely stupid lack of uploading and downloading levels of the player's make and choosing.

They put out a lot of great stuff, I'm just saying that they aren't bulletproof.

I could go back to the Wii library if you want some REAL clunkers...
 
Triscuitable said:
And if you don't have a smart phone? Have they accounted for that portion of the userbase, however small? Because "needs to pay a monthly contract to play online" or "must buy an iPod Touch for multiplayer" is not going to sell devices.
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You don't have to have a smartphone to play online games. You just have to pay the fee, like PSN and XBL.
 
Atheerios said:
Which ones? Because the GPD ones you mentioned earlier have a clamshell design, so components of the screen, including the touchscren controller can be fitted in the top section, and also appear to be thicker than the Switch.

The Switch also needs space for the fans and it has a bigger / more powerful SoC.
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GPD Win not only have controls and a keyboard as you said (which then would be moved on sides on the Switch) but also has a fan and a fast mobile SoC (the same as the Surface 3).
 
WhiteRabbitEXE said:
I literally explained why you would have to have two headsets - in the scenario where the player plays the game while using headphones to listen to the game (headset #1, connected to the Switch) AND wants to play online while chatting with friends (headset #2, on connected to your phone). Unless you believe Nintendo is somehow piping the audio from the game to your phone somehow, that player has to use two headsets.

Being on a separate device is inherently intrusive. Want to invite another friend? Whip out the phone. Want to jump into match in a different game? Gotta pull up my phone. Text chat? Phone. etc.. They are necessitating the use of two devices. Even if it's only briefly, that is still one more device than I've ever had to use. It's inconvenient.

Additionally, you haven't answered what players without supported smart devices are supposed to do. iPhone or Android set too old? Have Windows device? No smart phone at all? How does this help those players?

And again, there's still no reason for this to not be on the console itself in addition to the app, rather than just one or the other. If someone wants to use their phone, fine, knock themselves out. But why on earth should this bar me from the simpler and more convenient solution that has worked for over a decade? I can already send my Xbox friends messages, manage groups, check what friends are doing, and even buy and download games, control my Xbox One, and more through my Xbox app on my phone. Even some features that are outright better on my phone as well as some minor conveniences only available there. On the desktop equivalent I can even party chat. And yet I can still do all of that on my console itself as well.
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I just assumed the game audio would be coming through your phone's headset if you're paired for online play.

Is it alienating people without Android smartphones or iPhones? Sure. But that's like saying traditional home consoles alienate people without a TV. Android phones and iPhones are that ubiquitous. And at the end of the day, (despite the tech level) this is a dispensible , luxury product.

As for why you're presumably not given a non phone pairing option, again, why don't we wait and see?

We have no info.

It just sounds like you wanna make up your mind without waiting for the full picture, and that's your prerogative.
 
Oregano said:
It actually sounds worse than what you can do on the Wii U for free. They've literally taken their free, subpar online and decided to make it worse and ask for a subscription.
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For me, yeah, it's actively worse than the Wii U. On Wii U I just used my Xbox One and Xbox Live for voice chat. Now on Switch I still have to use an external device on voice chat, so the same inconvenience I'm already dealing with, but now I also have to pay another subscription fee for it.

lol.

But hey, now I get Ice Climber for 1 month!
 
Pissing off the core fanbase like this seems like a really dumb move by Nintendo. These are the people that kept Nintendo 64, GameCube and Wii U from being gigantic failures.

Seems like Nintendo are risking a lot in trying to captivate new consumers with the Switch, but haven't focused on getting the thing up to speed as a gaming machine.
 
Hmm don't like this idea,I'll reserve judgement until I see how well this app works,not sure what people without a smartphone are supposed to do,I know a few without them,not a huge number just a few
 
I can't wait to see how this is implemented and how it looks visually on the phone. How does it work and how it sets up. How seamless is it. Or how bad is it. Lol
 
Yeah,how exactly is one able to hear in game audio as well as chat without two headsets? Seems like a bizarre set up.

At this point I'm not sure how the Switch can be viewed as a home console with the details outlined so far
 
WhiteRabbitEXE said:
For me, yeah, it's actively worse than the Wii U. On Wii U I just used my Xbox One and Xbox Live for voice chat. Now on Switch I still have to use an external device on voice chat, so the same inconvenience I'm already dealing with, but now I also have to pay another subscription fee for it.

lol.

But hey, now I get Ice Climber for 1 month!
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You also can't access a friend's list or send messages like you could on Wii U and Miiverse is being abandoned.
 
Mass Appeal said:
Is there even a built in mic input on the console or does the console come with a mic with ear bud like Sony ships the ps4 with? Does the pro controller have a headphone jack like the ps4 or xb1?
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It doesn't come with any mic, there's a headphone jack in the main switch unit, and apparently there's no headphone jack in the pro controller.
 
HotHamBoy said:
I don't know by what metric we consider a game "bad" but I can make a short list of games they didn't get right:

Star Fox Zero
Animal Crossing Amiibo Festival
Most of the recent Mario Party games, especially Island Tour
Rusty's Real Deal Baseball
Pokemon Rumble U
Metroid Prime Federation Force
Paper Mario Sticker Star

There's been some pretty damn mediocre games, too. Like Tomodachi Life, New Super Mario Bros 2, the recent Chibi Robo games, Pokemon Shuffle, Mario Tennis Ultra Smash...

They put out a lot of great stuff, I'm just saying that they aren't bulletproof.

I could go back to the Wii library if you want some REAL clunkers...
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You're right. I was corrected earlier and pretty much said the same.

But they have a damn good ratio!! :P
 
Honestly speaking, as long as matchmaking and simple communication (emotes) can be done on the Switch alone, I'm fine with this.

I simply cannot fathom playing a multiplayer game that requires actual communication on a Nintendo console.

But yeah, charging for this is pretty outrageous.
The subscription had better be substantially cheaper than PSplus or XBL. There's just generally not enough online gaming to be had on Nintendo consoles to support a paid service.
 
Could be one of the most valuable features of the switch.


One of the major drawbacks in online multiplayer is having to go to a room to find matchmaking. That is annoying when the game is not popular as mario kart, call of or fifa. I dislike nothing more than waste my gaming time by waiting a connection in an empty room.
I want to be able to play single player mode while I wait for a room to be filled in and, once the room is full of players, switch and launch the online game.

I hope that this app will adress this by allowing to play single player mode on my switch and enter in a multiplayer hub in the app, waiting for people to come.
 
Speely said:
You're right. I was corrected earlier and pretty much said the same.

But they have a damn good ratio!! :P
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Heh, sorry, thread moves fast when you are typing.

They do make good games. I just don't know why a lot us wouldn't wait until more of them are available on the Switch.
 
finalflame said:
But we don't know if it's "impaired" yet because there are no confirmed details one way or the other, except "there will be an app". We're all just making idle discussion over rumors or supposition rather than a complete picture of how the system works. I think it's more than fair to criticize Nintendo for the lack of information, but it's also doing oneself a disservice to dismiss the system before you have the full picture.

I'm not saying this discussion is pointless, I'm saying that if you still have some desire to own a Switch, there's not a reason to dismiss it until we have full details on how online works, unless you just don't want to support Nintendo's behavior on sharing information, which is fair, and you're free to only support those companies who's business practices you agree with. However, in a practical sense, as long as Nintendo shows how this thing works before launch, you're at no disadvantage and can still go pick one up that same week.
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Here is what Nintendo has said officially so far:

Nintendo Switch Online Service website:
Online lobby and voice chat
Our new dedicated smart device app will connect to Nintendo Switch and let you invite friends to play online, set play appointments, and chat with friends during online matches in compatible games─all from your smart device. A free, limited version of this app will be available for download in summer 2017.
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Reggie speaking to GameSpot:
The smart phone app that we’re creating, that will be part of our online service, we believe is going to be a very compelling part of the overall proposition because that’s how you’ll voice chat, that’s how you’ll do your matchmaking, and create your lobby. We also think it’s a very elegant solution because if you’ve taken your switch on the go, you’ve put yourself in a hotspot, you’re looking at get a quick match of Mario Kart in, to whip out some sort of bulky, gamer headset is a bit of a challenge. So we think we’ve got an elegant solution.
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Reggie speaking to Wired:
“We are going to provide an overall online service, subscription-based, that not only will capture the multiplayer opportunity, but also the voice chat capability that we’re going to provide through a global app. We think that that’s just as important as access to Virtual Console content.

The reason for that is, it continues to reinforce our commitment to online, and do so in a way that will enable the consumer to enjoy their Nintendo Switch and to still be able to play those connected experiences—like Splatoon, like Kart, like fill in the blank—while they’re on the go. Instead of having some sort of bulky gamer headset, you’ll be able to do it right off your smartphone, put in your earbuds that you use for your standard mobile device. We think that’s a pretty sweet solution. That’s part of the overall opportunity that we see in a subscription service.”
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David Young (Nintendo PR) speaking to VentureBeat:
And as for voice chat, it sounds like that functionality will only be in the smart phone app, not something that is actually going to be part of the Switch system itself.

“Right,” Young said. “That’s what we’ve been discussing, is that this app will allow you [to use] the voice chat.”
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Multiple Nintendo statements and not once did they use the word "optional app" or say things like "in addition to the built-in console functionality." I don't think people are jumping to conclusions here or speculating too much. This is all the information we have (straight from Nintendo themselves) and it sounds bad. You're right though that we don't know every single detail about their online setup just yet, but that's a big problem for a system that's just 43 days away from launch.
 
Whipping my phone in and out of my pocket in between games and juggling it with my Switch sure sounds a lot more convenient than carrying around my imaginary bulky 'gamer headset'. Yep, real elegant.

Don't blame Reggie. He has clearly no product design input. His job is just to sell it, and he has to try I guess.

Blame NCL.
 
HotHamBoy said:
Heh, sorry, thread moves fast when you are typing.

They do make good games. I just don't know why a lot us wouldn't wait until more of them are available on the Switch.
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I can see that logic. When I try to adapt it, I fanboyishly devolve into Zelda. :/ I am weak.
 
primasaurus said:
Somewhat unfair, I feel the guy was a little provoked
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To clarify, if you follow the discussion, this was a person who claimed that there is some weird unfair thing going on where Sony and Microsoft fans talk up shitty games to bully Nintendo or something like that. His reasoning was that because he didn't like those games, they were garbage and hence it had to be a conspiracy if people liked them. Then he doubled down with "your mom".
 
gofreak said:
Whipping my phone in and out of my pocket in between games and juggling it with my Switch sure sounds a lot more convenient than carrying around my imaginary bulky 'gamer headset'. Yep, real elegant.

Don't blame Reggie. He has clearly no product design input. His job is just to sell it, and he has to try I guess.

Blame NCL.
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Yup, Reggie probably knows he's talking complete shit.
 
I can't. I really can't.

Two-thousand-and-fucking-seventeen. slowclap.gif
 
Speely said:
I can see that logic. When I try to adapt it, I fanboyishly devolve into Zelda. :/ I am weak.
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I hear you, but I got that Wii U so they really haven't helped themselves with that March 3rd release date of both versions.

I also have a PS4 and damn, there's a lot of great games this season that I could get with $300.
 
What in the flying fuck.

I mean, this would be ridiculous in a free service. But in something they want to charge for? You've got to be kidding.
 
finalflame said:
What does network protocols have to do with this? We have no idea how the online matchmaking, party system, voice chat, lobbies, community, or sharing features will work. No idea what the mobile app looks like or how it interacts with the console, how it handles joining game and voice audio streams, or how central it'll be to the online experience. We have no idea how much it'll cost. We have no idea if subscribing for online services will affect eShop prices. We actually have no practical details about Nintendo's online services implementation and how well it will or won't work. Of course it uses the internet and normal network protocols.. I'm not sure why you're even bringing that up to begin with. Of course it costs money -- maintaining actual decent online services and it's accompanying infrastructure isn't cheap, and Sony/MS have been charging for far longer, why would anyone expect it to be free while simultaneously expecting it to be more robust than what's currently offered?

We've SEEN nothing about Nintendo's only service, and heard nothing but the monthly virtual console titles and the existence of an app.
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OK, well, knowing that the app is required for voice chat can you envision a scenario where Nintendo's implementation of your friends or its social features makes up for the inconvenience incurred by having to use your phone?

I don't care if it's free or not. But to me, I can't imagine social features, or a friend system so compelling it makes up for a separate app. None.
 
ZombiePlatypus said:
I just assumed the game audio would be coming through your phone's headset if you're paired for online play.

Is it alienating people without Android smartphones or iPhones? Sure. But that's like saying traditional home consoles alienate people without a TV. Android phones and iPhones are that ubiquitous. And at the end of the day, (despite the tech level) this is a disposable , luxury device.

As for why you're presumably not given a non phone pairing option, again, why don't we wait and see?

We have no info.
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There is no chance the smart device is pumping game audio through to your head phones. There is no mechanism in place for that to be a plausible scenario, let alone one with ubiquitous support across smart devices without significant lag and numerous behind the scenes technical hurdles. Not happening.

We already had numbers in this very thread that shows that only 70% of adults in the US have smart phones, and far fewer children do. Even then, if you assume that 100% of potential Switch owners have smart devices though, no, your TV comparison is still bullshit. Many people do still have dated/unsupported iPhone and Android devices. Others still have Windows devices. You're locking entire standard functionality to devices players could conceivably and reasonably not have. Your TV comparison further fails because literally no one interested in home consoles doesn't also have a TV, as it's something that by the entire nature of the product going back to the very first home console is a necessity. Literally the entire concept of a home game console requires a TV. Not only have console players never needed a smart device, there is no conceivable reason to require them.

As for your "wait and see" and "we have no info" remarks, I point you towards my edit:

WhiteRabbitEXE said:
Let's not dismiss criticism as "Nintendoomed lol" either. That's not a good look. And as far as waiting for them to explain, well they've already done that what, three times now? Once during the show and twice by Reggie? And every time the scenario seems pretty unambiguous? Look, I'm holding out hope this is all some crazy misunderstanding. But the system releases in a month and a half and they've talked about this all multiple times now. If this is just a misunderstanding it's one of the most catastrophically bad cases of miscommunication I've seen, and an absolute blunder on Nintendo's part. So it doesn't seem reasonable to expect that to be the case. But then goddamn do I hope it is.
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LordRaptor said:
You move your 'always online' requirements to the device you have with you that is always on and built specifically for messaging and communications, you decouple your social functions to a platform agnostic device that already has access to a list of your real world contacts and friends and can populate your friends list accordingly, you have a somewhat persistent ID for users so that problematic users can be identified and persistently banned at a more inconvenient level than buying a new console or creating a new username, and you are future proofed against having to recreate all of those social links in future, as you already have a device independent list that would let users of future hardware communicate with users of future IOS or android software.

The practicalities of seamlessly integrating your phone with a seperate device I have no idea how they would handle. Ideally, it would be something as simple as pairing your Switch with your phone by tapping your phones NFC with the Switches, and letting all those features be slaved into the game accordingly. Or even automatically letting you use your phone as a limited wifi hotspot when enabled.

The devils in the details though.
Conceptually its not stupid, especially if it is intended as their basis for all future social features.
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Aka, we cannot be bothered to have Facebook and Twitter integration in our console as well ;)? Seriously, having a well made phone app makes sense. Not being able to do pretty much anything but playing games on a modern portable device and being forced to use the phone does not.
 
HotHamBoy said:
I hear you, but I got that Wii U so they really haven't helped themselves with that March 3rd release date of both versions.

I also have a PS4 and damn, there's a lot of great games this season that I could get with $300.
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Well hell, enjoy it on your Wii U and see what happens!
 
Durante said:
What in the flying fuck.

I mean, this would be ridiculous in a free service. But in something they want to charge for? You've got to be kidding.
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They surely believe it's a sweet deal and doing us a favor. But as people may not be used to paying online and competition provide game rental, they're also willing to devalue their precious NES games. Stop being so entitled please.
 
Sean said:
Here is what Nintendo has said officially so far:

Nintendo Switch Online Service website:


Reggie speaking to GameSpot:


Reggie speaking to Wired:


David Young (Nintendo PR) speaking to VentureBeat:


Multiple Nintendo statements and not once did they use the word "optional app" or say things like "in addition to the built-in console functionality." I don't think people are jumping to conclusions here or speculating too much. This is all the information we have (straight from Nintendo themselves) and it sounds bad. You're right though that we don't know every single detail about their online setup just yet, but that's a big problem for a system that's just 43 days away from launch.
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Also FWIW, from the Splatoon 2 website:

Smart Device Support – An upcoming smart-phone application for the Nintendo Switch system will enhance matchmaking and allow for voice chat options.
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In the case of Splatoon 2's wording, "allow" makes it seem clear that the OS does not "allow" for voice-chat but the app does. The wording of this stuff never makes it sound optional, and we have only ever seen these features mentioned in conjunction with the app.
 
mAcOdIn said:
OK, well, knowing that the app is required for voice chat can you envision a scenario where Nintendo's implementation of your friends or its social features makes up for the inconvenience incurred by having to use your phone?

I don't care if it's free or not. But to me, I can't imagine social features, or a friend system so compelling it makes up for a separate app. None.
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I use my phone virtually all day, whether I'm at work, home, commuting, or out of the house in general, so to me personally I don't see the "separate app" aspect as a negative unless it's a shitty app.

I understand others don't feel the same and are rightfully skeptical, and this is probably where I'm just gonna duck out of the discussion and "wait and see". If it's bad, I'll be right there reaming Nintendo with the rest of GAF, but if it's good, I'll be the first to ask all the naysayers to eat their hats.
 
Speely said:
Far-out prediction: We aren't going to have to juggle phones and Switches. I really think that is a fast-take assumption.
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So does your hot take come with an idea of what the execution involves, or is it one of those which are basically "this probably isn't the negative thing everyone thinks it is, I'm sure Nintendo has a better idea that everyone can't imagine right now, and neither can I"?
 
I really hope the 'free trial' period until fall make them realise how fucked up this is.

People who will actually use it, and not random guys on message boards, should provide negative feedback.

Hope they have a reporting system.
 
orthodoxy1095 said:
In the case of Splatoon 2's wording, "allow" makes it seem clear that the OS does not "allow" for voice-chat but the app does. The wording of this stuff never makes it sound optional, and we have only ever seen these features mentioned in conjunction with the app.
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To be fair, "enhance" matchmaking vs "allow" voice chat does make it seem that a basic matchmaking feature is available outside the app.

I'm guessing random matchmaking in-game, lobbies and friends in-app ONLY.
 
Sean said:
Here is what Nintendo has said officially so far:

Nintendo Switch Online Service website:


Reggie speaking to GameSpot:


Reggie speaking to Wired:


David Young (Nintendo PR) speaking to VentureBeat:


Multiple Nintendo statements and not once did they use the word "optional app" or say things like "in addition to the built-in console functionality." I don't think people are jumping to conclusions here or speculating too much. This is all the information we have (straight from Nintendo themselves) and it sounds bad. You're right though that we don't know every single detail about their online setup just yet, but that's a big problem for a system that's just 43 days away from launch.
Click to expand...

orthodoxy1095 said:
Also FWIW, from the Splatoon 2 website:



In the case of Splatoon 2's wording, "allow" makes it seem clear that the OS does not "allow" for voice-chat but the app does. The wording of this stuff never makes it sound optional, and we have only ever seen these features mentioned in conjunction with the app.
Click to expand...

No, no, no, no, no we need to wait for Nintendo to send representatives to our homes to do a demonstration before we can know for sure!... Remember, always give corporations the benefit of the doubt!

how_to_put_out_a_fire_in_japan-14309.gif
 
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