decisions
Member
I wasn't expecting much from the Legacy of Thieves Collection, but after playing it I can surely say that UC4 at 60fps, with HDR, and the DualSense features is a flat-out amazing experience that feels like it is at the top of the industry, even though the vast majority of what I am experiencing was developed 6 years ago. I've played TLL much more recently and love that game as well, but here I'll be focusing on UC4.
I haven't played the game since launch and so I've forgotten a good bit of it. The story feels mostly fresh to me and I have trouble not playing the game for 3-4 hours (twice my usual gaming session) at a time because I am so enthralled. The game's segments fit together so seamlessly there never seems like a good point to stop. The shooting mechanics feel much better at 60fps and the graphics are just astounding. It goes to show you that graphics have not really improved all that much since this game's release, but that sort of macro-comparison has been taking a back seat in my mind to a more micro one...
UC4 wipes the floor with TLOU2 in every department. Comparing the two games, I can safely say that TLOU2 is the first dud that ND has released since starting their incredible run with UC2, and is an extreme disappointment, because wow, UC4 was really, really damn good.
I'll make a few categorical comparisons below:
- Gameplay: This is TLOU2's strongest category in my opinion, but even here it loses out to UC4 for me. TLOU2's gameplay improvements were nothing spectacular, while being overall a welcome upgrade over the first game. But UC4's gameplay is just as good, and just as much of a step up over previous games. The guns feel tight and impactful, the movement and cover system was much improved so that you get unintended movement much less often, and the combat arenas were much more open-ended compared to previous games. In terms of platforming, there were some significant editions with the climbing/swinging from the rope, sliding, and some cool platforming "puzzles" such as turning the clock arms in Madagascar that just give platforming sections that little bit of spice and novelty compared to previous entries. Having just replayed the Madagascar chase sequence, I can safely say this set piece has not been topped by any game. My jaw was wide open several times throughout it because I forgot just how many things you can do in this sequence -- you can shoot while sliding on the ground on the rope, you can climb the rope and stop in mind-air and shoot while swinging from the rope, you can jump on any trucks and shoot from the back, you can jump on jeeps and drive them after meleeing the driver, someone can jump on your jeep and you can melee them off, etc. It's really quite amazing, especially when you consider how seamlessly this section ties into the shootout and driving sequence that just happened previously. Sure, these types of set pieces maybe don't suit TLOU as much, but that doesn't excuse the fact that TLOU2 has no gameplay sequences that even came close to entertaining me as much as this in a general sense. In summary, both games brought gameplay improvements, but UC4 arguably advanced its series' gameplay more while also having much more memorable set pieces.
(Note: this gif doesn't have HDR. Madagascar looks way prettier now in HDR!)
- Storytelling: UC4's story is enjoyable and interesting every step of the way. It has likable and funny characters, intense twists, and consistent and interesting themes (passion vs. people, ambition, the value of honesty, what it means to protect a loved one, what love means, etc.). I'm not saying it's dialogue rivals Dostoevsky, and sure there are some potholes for which you have to suspend your disbelief (though the series tonal consistency dilutes the damage of this IMO), but it is a coherent and enjoyable story that will make you think, feel suspense, and have put a smile on your face several times before the credits roll. TLOU2 on the other hand, has an absolutely terrible story with contradictory characters that betray their own nature several times throughout, massive plotholes that cannot be overlooked in the face of the game's relatively realistic and serious tone, and ultimately, nothing interesting to say about it's central theme of revenge. The plot has terrible pacing where you spend long stretches of hours where nothing really happens, and the entire second half of the game is spent trying to communicate something to you that does not require nearly that amount of time (i.e. "the second protagonist has friends too! If you are selfish in the post-apocalypse, you are actually being selfish and hurting other people who also have friends!" No shit Druckmann, I think we understood this perfectly fine from the first game...). It also just doesn't have a good understanding of what the audience has experienced at a certain point, how well the audience understands the characters on screen, and how much the audience cares about certain characters...I could go on, but this post is already too long so I won't.
- Pacing: UC4 is a bit slower than the previous games, trading some shooting for some more platforming and puzzle-solving, but I think this is a fine trade-off. You don't spend long stretches of time doing things you have done before as nearly every section of the game -- platforming, shooting, or puzzle-solving -- is unique due to some kind of environmental gimmick. It's really quite amazing. On the other hand, by the halfway point of TLOU2's 35hours I was absolutely dreading how much I had to walk around very samey looking environments tapping triangle in order to loot items so that combat (on the higher difficulties) didn't become a frustrating slog. I did not have fun playing TLOU2 and it has horrible gameplay pacing, weakening the impact of some of its mechanical improvements such as prone.
Personally, after realizing the above, I am quite worried about ND as a studio moving forward. I think that they still have amazing technical prowess in their graphics and animation engineers, but that it may have been Bruce Straley who was the real genius game director there, and Neil Druckmann far too impractical when left to his own devices. TLOU2 feels like a director trying to make a game out of shock value, rather than one being ambitious while keeping a sense of the big picture of what makes a game great.
What do you think? If you have played UC4 (especially LoT version) and TLOU2 recently, how would you compare them? If you think one is better than the other, why?
TL;DR
Replaying UC4 in The Legacy of Thieves Collection made me realize that TLOU2 was a huge disappointment because before it, Naughty Dog was in absolutely top form, which I had forgotten (perhaps because of the relatively long stretch of time between UC4 and TLOU2).
I haven't played the game since launch and so I've forgotten a good bit of it. The story feels mostly fresh to me and I have trouble not playing the game for 3-4 hours (twice my usual gaming session) at a time because I am so enthralled. The game's segments fit together so seamlessly there never seems like a good point to stop. The shooting mechanics feel much better at 60fps and the graphics are just astounding. It goes to show you that graphics have not really improved all that much since this game's release, but that sort of macro-comparison has been taking a back seat in my mind to a more micro one...
UC4 wipes the floor with TLOU2 in every department. Comparing the two games, I can safely say that TLOU2 is the first dud that ND has released since starting their incredible run with UC2, and is an extreme disappointment, because wow, UC4 was really, really damn good.
I'll make a few categorical comparisons below:
- Gameplay: This is TLOU2's strongest category in my opinion, but even here it loses out to UC4 for me. TLOU2's gameplay improvements were nothing spectacular, while being overall a welcome upgrade over the first game. But UC4's gameplay is just as good, and just as much of a step up over previous games. The guns feel tight and impactful, the movement and cover system was much improved so that you get unintended movement much less often, and the combat arenas were much more open-ended compared to previous games. In terms of platforming, there were some significant editions with the climbing/swinging from the rope, sliding, and some cool platforming "puzzles" such as turning the clock arms in Madagascar that just give platforming sections that little bit of spice and novelty compared to previous entries. Having just replayed the Madagascar chase sequence, I can safely say this set piece has not been topped by any game. My jaw was wide open several times throughout it because I forgot just how many things you can do in this sequence -- you can shoot while sliding on the ground on the rope, you can climb the rope and stop in mind-air and shoot while swinging from the rope, you can jump on any trucks and shoot from the back, you can jump on jeeps and drive them after meleeing the driver, someone can jump on your jeep and you can melee them off, etc. It's really quite amazing, especially when you consider how seamlessly this section ties into the shootout and driving sequence that just happened previously. Sure, these types of set pieces maybe don't suit TLOU as much, but that doesn't excuse the fact that TLOU2 has no gameplay sequences that even came close to entertaining me as much as this in a general sense. In summary, both games brought gameplay improvements, but UC4 arguably advanced its series' gameplay more while also having much more memorable set pieces.
(Note: this gif doesn't have HDR. Madagascar looks way prettier now in HDR!)
- Storytelling: UC4's story is enjoyable and interesting every step of the way. It has likable and funny characters, intense twists, and consistent and interesting themes (passion vs. people, ambition, the value of honesty, what it means to protect a loved one, what love means, etc.). I'm not saying it's dialogue rivals Dostoevsky, and sure there are some potholes for which you have to suspend your disbelief (though the series tonal consistency dilutes the damage of this IMO), but it is a coherent and enjoyable story that will make you think, feel suspense, and have put a smile on your face several times before the credits roll. TLOU2 on the other hand, has an absolutely terrible story with contradictory characters that betray their own nature several times throughout, massive plotholes that cannot be overlooked in the face of the game's relatively realistic and serious tone, and ultimately, nothing interesting to say about it's central theme of revenge. The plot has terrible pacing where you spend long stretches of hours where nothing really happens, and the entire second half of the game is spent trying to communicate something to you that does not require nearly that amount of time (i.e. "the second protagonist has friends too! If you are selfish in the post-apocalypse, you are actually being selfish and hurting other people who also have friends!" No shit Druckmann, I think we understood this perfectly fine from the first game...). It also just doesn't have a good understanding of what the audience has experienced at a certain point, how well the audience understands the characters on screen, and how much the audience cares about certain characters...I could go on, but this post is already too long so I won't.
- Pacing: UC4 is a bit slower than the previous games, trading some shooting for some more platforming and puzzle-solving, but I think this is a fine trade-off. You don't spend long stretches of time doing things you have done before as nearly every section of the game -- platforming, shooting, or puzzle-solving -- is unique due to some kind of environmental gimmick. It's really quite amazing. On the other hand, by the halfway point of TLOU2's 35hours I was absolutely dreading how much I had to walk around very samey looking environments tapping triangle in order to loot items so that combat (on the higher difficulties) didn't become a frustrating slog. I did not have fun playing TLOU2 and it has horrible gameplay pacing, weakening the impact of some of its mechanical improvements such as prone.
Personally, after realizing the above, I am quite worried about ND as a studio moving forward. I think that they still have amazing technical prowess in their graphics and animation engineers, but that it may have been Bruce Straley who was the real genius game director there, and Neil Druckmann far too impractical when left to his own devices. TLOU2 feels like a director trying to make a game out of shock value, rather than one being ambitious while keeping a sense of the big picture of what makes a game great.
What do you think? If you have played UC4 (especially LoT version) and TLOU2 recently, how would you compare them? If you think one is better than the other, why?
TL;DR
Replaying UC4 in The Legacy of Thieves Collection made me realize that TLOU2 was a huge disappointment because before it, Naughty Dog was in absolutely top form, which I had forgotten (perhaps because of the relatively long stretch of time between UC4 and TLOU2).
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