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Rottenwatch: AVATAR (82%)

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I'm seeing a lot of 3D first timers say 'The 3D wasn't that prominent, whats the point?' as if they're expecting a film whose effects constantly jump out at you to be anything less than a gimmick. The point is depth, its as if you're looking into a window with Avatar. It is natural depth.

Whoever said the depth was only apparent for a few select scenes must be fucking blind. The depth ran throughout the entire film and I imagine they must be referring to the gimmicky pokeintheye depth they were hoping for.

The first time
Jake enters the Jungle with Norm and Grace whilst they're taking samples and analyzing the connections between the roots of the trees is when the 3D effect becomes undeniable. You feel like you're in that jungle and it is simply breathtaking.
 
6a00d83451c45669e20120a764ddb9970b-800wi


"...I've made a huge mistake"
 
Just back from watching.
Was I impressed ....yes.
Was I entertained ....yes.
Would I watch again ....yes.
Do I wantoro go to Pandora and tap some kitty kat ass........hells yeah.

Last 3D film I saw was freddy Kruger and jaws boy has 3d moved on. I think it needs to be renamed to not be tarred.
 
Scullibundo said:
I'm seeing a lot of 3D first timers say 'The 3D wasn't that prominent, whats the point?' as if they're expecting a film whose effects constantly jump out at you to be anything less than a gimmick.
This right here. Avatar is really a different kind of 3d movement. Where the thing that jumps out at you is not the random objects flying out of the screen but rather all those holographic displays. I am not even sure what that was but they stood out so much from the rest of the scene that they really caught the eye.
 
Watched it in Imax 3D and it was awesome. The storyline was a bit same old but was still engaging. Movie overall was probably a bit too long as you definitely felt the length (and was completely predictable of course).

3D and CGI were incredibly impressive. This definitely lived up to the hype for me, the CGI just looked awesome with the added depth in the scenes. Made everything feel much more natural.


Edit: The one thing that did bother me was it took some time to get used to some of the bluriness. It was very hard to watch some people/objects on the screen during some of the panning as they just looked blurred in a lot of cases. This mostly seemed to go away for me as the film went on though.
 
I thought it was too short, personally.

Would've loved more (minor spoilers) [spoilers]scenes with Jake learning/training as a Na'vi. You know, after he joined and before he was gung ho about the whole thing. And some more scenes with the scientists.[/spoiler]

I guess I just didn't want it to end...?
 
The 3D is strange, I thought it was me 'getting used to it', but then I remembered back at the preview footage, and I'm convinced it's the live action just not being as good quality 3D as the animated stuff because during the film, it was once the CG kicked in that the 3D felt perfect, and it was the same in the preview, despite the fact that to get from the live action to the CG was like two minutes at the preview as appose to about twenty in the film.
 
I got there with a min to spare but the IMAX 3D theater was already full so I had to change my ticket to the last screening of the night. Fml
 
stuburns said:
The 3D is strange, I thought it was me 'getting used to it', but then I remembered back at the preview footage, and I'm convinced it's the live action just not being as good quality 3D as the animated stuff because during the film, it was once the CG kicked in that the 3D felt perfect, and it was the same in the preview, despite the fact that to get from the live action to the CG was like two minutes at the preview as appose to about twenty in the film.

Fark that. There are many times I thought the live-shot 3D was better than the CG stuff.
Like when Quaritch is giving his fuckemup speech and you feel like you're amongst the crowd, panning across the back of the audience's heads.
Overall, the 3D was awesome through and through. Nothing will top looking through the jungle the first time though. Wow.
 
LOVED it. The 3D was amazing. It was no where near as cheesy as some of these online reviews would lead you to believe. Sure, some of the characters were comic book quality but aside from one scene, there was nothing cringe worthy.

The story was simple but it worked and I definitely had some emotional attachment to the characters (primarily the Na'vi people.) It's certainly not going to win Best Picture at the Academy Awards but I personally haven't seen a more entertaining film in years.

About the only thing I'm disappointed in is the eventual Blu Ray release and how I'll be forced to watch it in 2d. The final battle is the coolest fucking thing I've ever watched.
 
peterb0y said:
Oh another thing: I loved the humans mech/ship designs, but I HATED the Navi religious hokum- It literally was ripped from Pocahontas, and pissed me off every time they mentioned their stupid spirit god... The end was fucking stupid as well with all the animals coming in to save their asses b/c of the spirit god... bleh, I should have known to expect some sickly sweetness from Cameron however. Just like I cringe sometimes during T2, I expect to cringe during some parts of this film in the future

I personally didn't take it as the Pandora god as being real (not that it couldn't be interpreted that way) since there was a lot of scientific explanation on the nature of the planet and how all of the roots and wildlife are connected via a network much like neurons in the brain. As we can see the Na'vi are able to "halo"(?) with certain animals that have the proper connections as well, it isn't far fetched to believe that Jake was able to talk to the planet when he "prayed" using this telekinetic ability which summoned forth all those animals. I never really took it as their god stepping in so much as Jake's "prayer" catching the attention of the animals. But hey, that's my interpretation, and whether or not you believe a spirit did it or the planet/animals did it due to scientific reasons, it doesn't really matter and both ways are awesome (and essentially the same) in my opinion.
 
border said:
If the arrows are faster than bullets then why don't they fly straight through humans? Why do they get stuck on our gooey innards? I have to imagine we are decidedly less resilient than the bulletproof shielding on a cockpit.

why are you going on and on about the arrows? This isn't reality. Plus them big fucking arrows.
 
Defcon said:
LOVED it. The 3D was amazing. It was no where near as cheesy as some of these online reviews would lead you to believe. Sure, some of the characters were comic book quality but aside from one scene, there was nothing cringe worthy.

The story was simple but it worked and I definitely had some emotional attachment to the characters (primarily the Na'vi people.) It's certainly not going to win Best Picture at the Academy Awards but I personally haven't seen a more entertaining film in years.

About the only thing I'm disappointed in is the eventual Blu Ray release and how I'll be forced to watch it in 2d. The final battle is the coolest fucking thing I've ever watched.

Which is why you should make use of its extended 3 month run in IMAX.
 
Scullibundo said:
Fark that. There are many times I thought the live-shot 3D was better than the CG stuff.
Like when Quaritch is giving his fuckemup speech and you feel like you're amongst the crowd, panning across the back of the audience's heads.

There are a few shots during the live action that I thought the 3D was better than the jungle stuff.
My absolute favorite shot, the cryo chamber. The depth is just...jaw dropping. Another shot, is when Jake is about to be transfered for the first time, look at the little spiral thing that they put him in. The depth in that is amazing. Of course everything that had to do with the human displays. They had 3D layered on top of 3D on those displays.

One thing I haven't seen discussed enough is the camera work. Cameron is the only one who can use a physical camera in a cg world and actually make it feel and look so real. Two shots in particular had me thinking this is just amazing directing.
When all the ships arrive at the Na'Vi's home to blow up their giant tree. Seeing it from the point of view of the Na'Vi was just amazing. Another scene that had just great camera work is at the end of the movie when Jake is fighting Quarritch and Jake is about to get knife by Quarritch, Neytiri aiming and shooting Quarritch with the first shot, followed by the amazing camera work of the second shot. I didn't even catch it my first viewing. But I went to see it again today and was able to pay attention even moreso to every little detail. It's just the best.
 
Just back. Pretty underwhelmed, despite going in with trepidation.

I will say that it was the best execution of 3d I've seen so far. However, I still found intrusive during certain sequences.

Characters were pretty one-dimensional, and it was all a bit smaltzy/cheesy. There was quite a bit of laughter in the theatre at bits which were not intended as comic relief (ie
the animals in the penultimate battle[\spoiler]. Environments were fantanstic, the creature designs less so, though the Navi worked far better than I thought they would. CGI stood out at times, but rarely given how much there was!

I miss the sense of danger and thrill Cameron delivered in say Terminator/T2 :/
 
J. M. Romeo said:
I'll be watching this with the girlfriend tonight. I have absolutely zero expectations from the movie and the plot seems generic as fuck from the only trailer that I've seen. Also, I have a big dislike for CG heavy flicks, prefering usually the old school stuff and pure cinema trickery.

But then again, it's James fucking Cameron. And that man has yet to dissapoint me in a single movie of his. In fact, a few of them are on my top of mind list of favourite films. So I'll walk in with an open mind. Worst case scenario, I see my first 3D film evar!

Quoting myself here. Just came back from watching it. As I kinda expected, the plot was totally throwaway. And I was way too busy looking at everything to care.

HOLY FUCKING CRAP at the CG in this movie. What the hell. I want that shit in my games, like now. Jesus Christ. Beautiful movie.
 
I just finished watching the IMAX 3D...

My cousin and I have to say they have a lot of symbolism/analogies between Middle East and War on Terror.

Some points that I can think of:
Sky People = US
Navi People = Arabs/Expanded Middle East
The speech about Terror with Terror - Phosphorous, Killing Innocent people in War of Terror.
Martyrdom speech = no seriously
Uniting to fight Sky People = Terrorist all over the world uniting to fight.
Minerals underneath the tree = Oil in the Middle East
The Tree of life thing and how they were swaying = Hajj and how they do the rounds.
Using old weapons/uncivilized people = Terrorist using hand made weapons.

Overall the movie was good, but not OMG amazing like the hype was letting it be. Also I still don't the amazing part of it being 3D, it hurts my eyes. :(

PS: The characters and the movie is very predictable.
 
Zapages said:
I just finished watching the IMAX 3D...

My cousin and I have to say they have a lot of symbolism/analogies between Middle East and War on Terror.

Some points that I can think of:
Sky People = US
Navi People = Arabs/Expanded Middle East
The speech about Terror with Terror - Phosphorous, Killing Innocent people in War of Terror.
Martyrdom speech = no seriously
Uniting to fight Sky People = Terrorist all over the world uniting to fight.
Minerals underneath the tree = Oil in the Middle East
The Tree of life thing and how they were swaying = Hajj and how they do the rounds.
Using old weapons/uncivilized people = Terrorist using hand made weapons.

Overall the movie was good, but not OMG amazing like the hype was letting it be. Also I still don't the amazing part of it being 3D, it hurts my eyes. :(

PS: The characters and the movie is very predictable.

Wow, clearly you have unlocked the secrets hidden within James Cameron's cunning subtlety.

dude, the movie totally beat you over the fucking head with the analogy.
 
I kind of don't understand when people say the plot was "throwaway" or calling it "simple" as if simple is a bad thing. Why can't a story be told in a new way? It's done all the time, especially in movies. Just because a story is similar doesn't mean it can't be told or should be considered bad or throwaway. I mean I can understand people's complaints if they didn't like the type of story that's being told to begin with, but just because you've seen a story like it before shouldn't make it bad in my opinion.

Do you only enjoy movies if the story is super unpredictable? Think of your favorite movies and while I'm sure there are some in there that stick out as having very original narratives and having plot twists left and right, I'm willing to bet that you will spot a few that are extremely predictable yet enjoyable.

/rant

Anyway, I can't wait to see it again tomorrow with the family, although I'm kind of nervous because my dad has hated 3D in the past. I am hoping that Avatar changes his mind but I have a feeling he will still be bitter about it.
 
Zapages said:
I just finished watching the IMAX 3D...

My cousin and I have to say they have a lot of symbolism/analogies between Middle East and War on Terror.

Some points that I can think of:
Sky People = US
Navi People = Arabs/Expanded Middle East
The speech about Terror with Terror - Phosphorous, Killing Innocent people in War of Terror.
Martyrdom speech = no seriously
Uniting to fight Sky People = Terrorist all over the world uniting to fight.
Minerals underneath the tree = Oil in the Middle East
The Tree of life thing and how they were swaying = Hajj and how they do the rounds.
Using old weapons/uncivilized people = Terrorist using hand made weapons.

Overall the movie was good, but not OMG amazing like the hype was letting it be. Also I still don't the amazing part of it being 3D, it hurts my eyes. :(

PS: The characters and the movie is very predictable.

Personally, I thought the movie was a commentary on any fuckin war where one civilization is superior to the other one in which they are fighting because they want something from them. It could be diamonds in Africa, oil in the Middle East, or land in the US.

Have you ever heard the wolf cry, to the blue corn moon? Or ask the grinning buck on why he grins?
 
Zapages said:
I just finished watching the IMAX 3D...

My cousin and I have to say they have a lot of symbolism/analogies between Middle East and War on Terror.

Some points that I can think of:
Sky People = US
Navi People = Arabs/Expanded Middle East
The speech about Terror with Terror - Phosphorous, Killing Innocent people in War of Terror.
Martyrdom speech = no seriously
Uniting to fight Sky People = Terrorist all over the world uniting to fight.
Minerals underneath the tree = Oil in the Middle East
The Tree of life thing and how they were swaying = Hajj and how they do the rounds.
Using old weapons/uncivilized people = Terrorist using hand made weapons.

Overall the movie was good, but not OMG amazing like the hype was letting it be. Also I still don't the amazing part of it being 3D, it hurts my eyes. :(

PS: The characters and the movie is very predictable.

Ehh, it was more about the environment/anti corporatism.

I didn't get the vibe you got at all.
 
Azrael said:
I loved it. It is IMO the first great 3-D film. Unlike, say, Up, which was a great film too, but where the 3-D didn't add much to the experience, Avatar just wouldn't be the same experience in 2-D, the way the 3-D effects suck you into the alien world.
I still haven't seen Avatar, but I just can't see it beating Dial M For Murder + silver screen + dual projectors + polarized glasses, for a variety of reasons.
 
Zapages said:
I just finished watching the IMAX 3D...

My cousin and I have to say they have a lot of symbolism/analogies between Middle East and War on Terror.

Well, yes. I don't think it was really a secret. Anyway, it reminded me a bit more of the indians, might be because they are easier to like then terrorists.
 
TAJ said:
I still haven't seen Avatar, but I just can't see it beating Dial M For Murder + silver screen + dual projectors + polarized glasses, for a variety of reasons.

Because then you might be in the same boat as the unwashed masses you so very loathe.

Bit-Bit said:
Personally, I thought the movie was a commentary on any fuckin war where one civilization is superior to the other one in which they are fighting because they want something from them. It could be diamonds in Africa, oil in the Middle East, or land in the US.

Have you ever heard the wolf cry, to the blue corn moon? Or ask the grinning buck on why he grins?

This.

Those of you making War on terror comparisons are forgetting the movie was written more than 12 years ago with the same plot.
 
Zapages said:
I just finished watching the IMAX 3D...

My cousin and I have to say they have a lot of symbolism/analogies between Middle East and War on Terror.

Some points that I can think of:
Sky People = US
Navi People = Arabs/Expanded Middle East
The speech about Terror with Terror - Phosphorous, Killing Innocent people in War of Terror.
Martyrdom speech = no seriously
Uniting to fight Sky People = Terrorist all over the world uniting to fight.
Minerals underneath the tree = Oil in the Middle East
The Tree of life thing and how they were swaying = Hajj and how they do the rounds.
Using old weapons/uncivilized people = Terrorist using hand made weapons.

Overall the movie was good, but not OMG amazing like the hype was letting it be. Also I still don't the amazing part of it being 3D, it hurts my eyes. :(

PS: The characters and the movie is very predictable.

lol what? Haha I think they actually say the words "terror" and "preemptive" in the fucking movie... , although I do think it was more about corporate greed/the environment like one poster said above me... Regardless, James Cameron is the man, but subtlety is not one of his strengths
 
MisterAnderson said:
I kind of don't understand when people say the plot was "throwaway" or calling it "simple" as if simple is a bad thing. Why can't a story be told in a new way? It's done all the time, especially in movies. Just because a story is similar doesn't mean it can't be told or should be considered bad or throwaway. I mean I can understand people's complaints if they didn't like the type of story that's being told to begin with, but just because you've seen a story like it before shouldn't make it bad in my opinion.

Do you only enjoy movies if the story is super unpredictable? Think of your favorite movies and while I'm sure there are some in there that stick out as having very original narratives and having plot twists left and right, I'm willing to bet that you will spot a few that are extremely predictable yet enjoyable.

/rant


You can still enjoy it, but that doesn't mean it's not a fault and that it couldn't be better in a more capable writer's hands.
 
gdt5016 said:
Ehh, it was more about the environment/anti corporatism.

I didn't get the vibe you got at all.

Neither did I. It was definitely anti corporatism/pro environmentalism. People are reading far too into it.
 
MisterAnderson said:
I kind of don't understand when people say the plot was "throwaway" or calling it "simple" as if simple is a bad thing. Why can't a story be told in a new way? It's done all the time, especially in movies. Just because a story is similar doesn't mean it can't be told or should be considered bad or throwaway. I mean I can understand people's complaints if they didn't like the type of story that's being told to begin with, but just because you've seen a story like it before shouldn't make it bad in my opinion.

Do you only enjoy movies if the story is super unpredictable? Think of your favorite movies and while I'm sure there are some in there that stick out as having very original narratives and having plot twists left and right, I'm willing to bet that you will spot a few that are extremely predictable yet enjoyable.

/rant

Anyway, I can't wait to see it again tomorrow with the family, although I'm kind of nervous because my dad has hated 3D in the past. I am hoping that Avatar changes his mind but I have a feeling he will still be bitter about it.
Yeah, I definitely needed to comment on this- I feel like maybe I sounded too harsh on the movie for not throwing in any new "twists" or at least a few surprises along the way... I would have no problem with Cameron retelling an old story with a new facelift, if possibly the characters were interesting/well developed. That isn't the case in this movie, which is cool, but it essentially makes the story just a means to an end, the "end" being a fuckawesome display of CGI and badass fight scene at the end. I also never said that it makes the movie "unenjoyable", but there is a distinct lack of momentum in the movie, as everybody already knows where its headed from the start.


EDIT: One major question I had: Why did they go with a CGI jungle/Navi? Was it strictly for facilitating the 3d? OBecause honestly, I think that they could have potentially pulled the same thing off with a real jungle and prosthetics (and for much cheaper I'm guessing) Or would mixing real life forest footage with CGI be too difficult? (not sure why, as a shitton of movies have done this before....)
 
Bit-Bit said:
Personally, I thought the movie was a commentary on any fuckin war where one civilization is superior to the other one in which they are fighting because they want something from them. It could be diamonds in Africa, oil in the Middle East, or land in the US.

Have you ever heard the wolf cry, to the blue corn moon? Or ask the grinning buck on why he grins?

In many ways it is an illustration of that old white colonialism but the context mirrors many modern cultural references and truths and that is why you will see many suggest the movie to be a political one. However having said all that, I saw it as Zulu in Space (but this time the audience sympathising with the natives).

gdt5016 said:
Ehh, it was more about the environment/anti corporatism.

I didn't get the vibe you got at all.

I think Blood Diamond is something that screams anti-corporatism, at least in my mind, so I can't really say I agree with you here
 
Scullibundo said:
Because then you might be in the same boat as the unwashed masses you so very loathe.
No. I reserve that sort of disdain for contemporary country music. I'm actually pretty easy to please. I love movies, unlike most critics.
 
peterb0y said:
EDIT: One major question I had: Why did they go with a CGI jungle/Navi? Was it strictly for facilitating the 3d? OBecause honestly, I think that they could have potentially pulled the same thing off with a real jungle and prosthetics (and for much cheaper I'm guessing) Or would mixing real life forest footage with CGI be too difficult? (not sure why, as a shitton of movies have done this before....)

CGI jungle = completely unique plants/animals which does a much better job at making the world seem alien (especially the night time scenes, which would not have been possible with any jungle on earth without putting heavy amounts of CGI on real jungle footage anyway). I am extremely glad they went with all CGI jungle. Also I'm glad the Na'vi weren't people in prosthetics, the amount of emotion conveyed with the motion capture would not have been possible with a human covered in layers of face make up/prosthetics, and the ridiculous proportions of the Na'vi help sell them as alien. I'm sure they could have done LoTR type camera tricks to make the Na'vi seem very tall, but their unique build lended very well to the character design (in my opinion...I know there are some who dislike the character design very much but I think it's great).
 
peterb0y said:
EDIT: One major question I had: Why did they go with a CGI jungle/Navi? Was it strictly for facilitating the 3d? OBecause honestly, I think that they could have potentially pulled the same thing off with a real jungle and prosthetics (and for much cheaper I'm guessing) Or would mixing real life forest footage with CGI be too difficult? (not sure why, as a shitton of movies have done this before....)

I can't believe I'm reading this. Are you serious? Also, what problem did you have with the CGI jungle? It looked completely real and convincing.
 
peterb0y said:
EDIT: One major question I had: Why did they go with a CGI jungle/Navi? Was it strictly for facilitating the 3d? OBecause honestly, I think that they could have potentially pulled the same thing off with a real jungle and prosthetics (and for much cheaper I'm guessing) Or would mixing real life forest footage with CGI be too difficult? (not sure why, as a shitton of movies have done this before....)
Really?

First off, every single plant in the jungle does not exist. They were each designed by James Cameron and his team of artists. A majority of the shots took place on a tree the size of the Burj Dubai, which would need to be CG, and therefore completely unmatched to the rest of the shots. Most plants were bioluminescent, an effect that would be nearly impossible to achieve with standard footage and overlaid effects. Also, the destruction of very large parts of the forest is kind of a big no-no in our world.

In terms of the Na'avi, the effect could not be achieved with prosthetics. Interocular distance was nearly twice that of a regular human, and the eyes themselves were much larger, as well. Compositing a twelve-foot alien in the same wide shot with six-foot humans would also have been nearly impossible.

Edit: Beaten like corporate greed
 
Dabookerman said:
Holy Fucking Shit.

I am stunned. Best Movie experience ever. Absolutely beautiful. I want to go see it again.

So true. This was amazing. I felt like I was seeing something no one's ever seen before. You know, a step forward in technology.
 
00011000 said:
The way I justified the name in my head was that this is the material that humanity needs in order to survive and provide the energy needed to make humans a true starfaring nation. The importance of the material and the difficulty of obtaining it was probably not lost on the media and population back on earth. (It's probably what everyone is talking about)

Therefore, it's a name that probably just came into general usage, but not its "official" name.
Thats all nice and good but the thing is, for as long as the movie was, Cameron simply didn't address a number of plot issues. Its nice for you to draw your own conclusion on certain things but the script literally says "The humans are here for X, and will do anything to get X! Those greedy bastards!"

Like why the chief runner up was somehow no greater in the eyes of the people than post-warrior Jake. Why the chief runner up was all of a sudden cool with the fact that Jake fucked his wife to be.

Hell, they don't even specifically say what happens if a pilot dies while attached to the avatar.
 
This movie was fantastic. I really cared about the characters, personally; Jake himself was a little bit underdeveloped (I would have liked to have seen a bit more of him before all of this to have a standard of comparison for his change), but I think that Worthington's acting was good enough to help me make a connection (though his accent wasn't always correct, it sounded cool to me). Zoey Saldana is especially fantastic in this; she captured the character of Neytiri perfectly.

Personally, I did not care one bit that the plot was completely predictable. It was done very well within that predictability, in my opinion. I even was okay with most of the dialogue; it's not Shakespeare, but it is effective in getting across what Cameron wants to get across. I sincerely hope that this gets sequels, as I really want to see more of these characters; I am pretty sure that this is going to do fantastically at the box office, though, so a sequel seems really likely to me.
 
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