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Rottenwatch: AVATAR (82%)

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Just watched it... It certainly looks good and all the visual effects are outstanding.
BUT, it was just a good movie. Nothing extraordinary,
 
Combine said:
Hmm, it's been a few days, but I could have sworn my memory of that scene is telling me that
Trudy used a card she got from the knocked out guard to open the cell.
But of course, my memory might not be remembering that well. Still, with Cameron so nitpicky about little details you'd think he'd consider that.
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This is incorrect. Dr. Patel uses his key card/pin number.

Rody said:
Just watched it... It certainly looks good and all the visual effects are outstanding.
BUT, it was just a good movie. Nothing extraordinary,
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Aye. As much as I love this film, and as much as everything about it fascinates me. It will only be a good film in my eyes. There are more than a couple of things holding it back from being a great film.
 
U K Narayan said:
This is incorrect. Dr. Patel uses his key card/pin number.
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Are you sure it was his card and not the guard's? Why would a scientist's card/pin work in a security/brig? Plus the system would know who accessed the panel, blowing his cover later on.
 
Just saw it, what an amazing movie. I felt it had nicely developed first, second, and third acts and left me very satisfied at the end. I really wasn't digging Jake's character at the beginning, but when he was giving his pep speech at the end, I felt like fist pumping along with the rest of the navi. Also, the expressiveness of the cgi characters, mainly Neitiri, was pretty jawdropping. The marines were a bit too heavily stereotyped, but I guess that was on purpose.

Anyways, two thumbs up!
 
Erico said:
Just saw it, what an amazing movie. I felt it had nicely developed first, second, and third acts and left me very satisfied at the end. I really wasn't digging Jake's character at the beginning, but when he was giving his pep speech at the end, I felt like fist pumping along with the rest of the navi. Also, the expressiveness of the cgi characters, mainly Neitiri, was pretty jawdropping. The marines were a bit too heavily stereotyped, but I guess that was on purpose.

Anyways, two thumbs up!
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GET SOME!
 
Aren't Mercs pretty much generally characterized as scumbags?

In that sense, I didnt really think the humans were too horribly portrayed since they were just guns for hire.
 
DanielPlainview said:
GET SOME!
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:lol

The scene at the beginning where Jake drives off the rhino creature, I remember turning over and telling my brother how he basically spouted off every single cliche tough-guy marine line ever said in the span of like 2 sentences.
 
Dead said:
Aren't Mercs pretty much generally characterized as scumbags?

In that sense, I didnt really think the humans were too horribly portrayed since they were just guns for hire.
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Yeah I think a lot of people are mistaking the mercs in AVATAR as space marines. Like Blackwater ,"private security" is not government sanctioned. Their motivations are purely monetary.
 
Rody said:
Just watched it... It certainly looks good and all the visual effects are outstanding.
BUT, it was just a good movie. Nothing extraordinary,
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The movie had extraordinary scale and great action sequences. It's always throwing something amazing at you.

Anyone expecting Godfather will be disappointed, but it can't be Godfather and succeed at being Avatar. There's not much room for subtleties when you're cramming so much into one movie, much less a science fiction movie that not only has to tell a story, but also explain and successfully convey a completely foreign world unlike what we've seen. Pandora itself had more character than anyone in the film.
 
jett said:
I though the pre-war speech was the greatest since Braveheart. Delivered perfectly by Sam Worthington.
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I just realized you changed your avatar back to Avatar. :D

Yeah, I remember thinking during the trailer how I was gonna roll my eyes at that speech and thinking (oh man, they really expecting us to think everyone will understand his English?). But yeah, I was totally hooked by it, and of course, having Tsu'tey translate was the proper touch.
 
XiaNaphryz said:
Are you sure it was his card and not the guard's? Why would a scientist's card/pin work in a security/brig? Plus the system would know who accessed the panel, blowing his cover later on.
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Think about this. Truddy called Max into the room. She didn't call him in there for nothing. He unlocked the cell door. I remember this.

You guys are overthinking a lot of this stuff. James Cameron isn't known for implementing flawless logic in his films, nor is he known for mindblowing stories. He's known for his ability to entertain above conventional standards.
 
Combine said:
I just realized you changed your avatar back to Avatar. :D

Yeah, I remember thinking during the trailer how I was gonna roll my eyes at that speech and thinking (oh man, they really expecting us to think everyone will understand his English?). But yeah, I was totally hooked by it, and of course, having Tsu'tey translate was the proper touch.
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I think I'll be sticking with this one for a while.

Yeah I also loved the Tsu'tey's translation. Man if this 3D crap didn't have a premium I'd be watching this movie nearly every day. :P
 
Short summary: Lame story and events told competently carried by some incredible visuals. If anything it legitimizes all the time and money spent on the technology used to make the movie.

I quite liked it, but it certainly isn't Terminator or Titanic. Nothing really wrong with that, and I do look forward to what Cameron can pull off with this tech for his next film. We can only hope it's the Battle Angel movie.
 
Dead said:
http://www.learnnavi.org/

Whole site dedicated to learning Na'vi moonspeak
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I can't remember which review it was. But one of the first ones out of the gate said something to the effect of, we have now had the last Comicon ever where there are not blue people speaking Na'vi. Something to that effect.

I think he was right. :lol
 
GhaleonEB said:
I can't remember which review it was. But one of the first ones out of the gate said something to the effect of, we have now had the last Comicon ever where there are not blue people speaking Na'vi. Something to that effect.

I think he was right. :lol
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Ugh. Yeah.
 
GhaleonEB said:
I can't remember which review it was. But one of the first ones out of the gate said something to the effect of, we have now had the last Comicon ever where there are not blue people speaking Na'vi. Something to that effect.

I think he was right. :lol
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The reason Na'vi cosplay will never be as popular as say Star Wars or Star Trek is because being Na'vi essentially requires you to either have a good figure (or risk looking stupid) or tonnes of confidence, since the Na'vi are half naked. Most of these geeks and what not that learn Klingon and all the rest are not super well toned fit athletic types. And I can't imagine they'd be more comfortable walking around with nothing but a cloth covering their privates over being dressed in a full uniform and/or a mask (i.e Klingon/Jedi).
 
MASSIVE SPOILERS AND PIRACY AND TERRIBLE ENDING BELOW!












































































t9t.png



:D
 
nib95 said:
The reason Na'vi cosplay will never be as popular as say Star Wars or Star Trek is because being Na'vi essentially requires you to either have a good figure (or risk looking stupid) or tonnes of confidence, since the Na'vi are half naked. Most of these geeks and what not that learn Klingon and all the rest are not super well toned fit athletic types. And I can't imagine they'd be more comfortable walking around with nothing but a cloth covering their privates over being dressed in a full uniform and/or a mask (i.e Klingon/Jedi).
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Or maybe it's just not a very interesting cosplay. Outside of allot of body/facial paint. It's not very interesting. Ones based on Bodypaint have never been very popular. It's all about the clothing.

Not to mention, not many like to wear Bodypaint. Me included... I love wearing the skimpy things and cross-dressing. But once Body paint becomes involved. I get turned off from the idea. It's messy, looks okay at best, and so forth. Very few people want to be in it for hours at a time.
 
nib95 said:
The reason Na'vi cosplay will never be as popular as say Star Wars or Star Trek is because being Na'vi essentially requires you to either have a good figure (or risk looking stupid) or tonnes of confidence, since the Na'vi are half naked. Most of these geeks and what not that learn Klingon and all the rest are not super well toned fit athletic types. And I can't imagine they'd be more comfortable walking around with nothing but a cloth covering their privates over being dressed in a full uniform and/or a mask (i.e Klingon/Jedi).
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LMAO @ you thinking those "barriers" will stop them. AVATAR cosplay will be HUGE.
 
thespot84 said:
This is unrelated to avatar, but the stereoscopic pictures here are good to practice on. The link is to a bunch of 'fake 3d' like you had done, and if you click on a picture it'll show you both frames side by side:

http://pinktentacle.com/2009/10/animated-stereoviews-of-old-japan/

Here's a little training example: http://www.vision3d.com/dots.html


And lastly...did you ever put your index fingers tip to tip and cross your eyes to make a third, 'floating' finger? it's the same concept.
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Thanks for the links. Helpful!
 
Re-posting my idea for the sequel that no one read or responded to lol. If any of it actually happens, I want to be able to gloat in several years time!


nib95 said:
Massive wall of type that I don't actually expect any of you to read! My crappy predictions as to what could happen in Avatar 2 (just a random idea). My mates doing one too, it's hard to predict but fun trying! Please offer yours too, really intrigued to hear what people come up with. Truth be told, It's quite hard to try and predict.


The below idea is only a loose version. Naturally if it were Cameron's, he'd do everything much better and more poignant.




---

Avatar 2 prediction/idea.


Begins some time after Avatar (1). Movie starts on Earth, going deep in to our world in that period, showing the distressing bleakness of it all. The world is corrupt, deficient, polluted, damaged and wasting away. The vast populace is poor and suffering, and the major corporations are desperate for a means to start re-structuring and salvaging things. The lack of energy/resources is at the forefront of the problems, as are twisted politics.


Desperate times call for desperate measures. In a last ditch attempt to extract unobtanium from Pandora, the humans decide on a different tact to just plain all out war. They elect a specially chosen team of the best and brightest, soldiers and think tanks that will not only be skilled in duties, but have particularly strong reasons for needing to succeed (they too are relying on the unobtanium to remedy issues they have be them with families or whatever). Unlike Jake, they do not have a resentment or careless attitude towards Earth, rather they are deeply passionate about it's survival and patrotic to no end. Call it brainwashed if you must.

With the data retrieved from Jakes and other Avatar memories from Avatar (1), a special project is set up to train these men and women to learn every facet of the Na'vi life in the same way as Jake did. The language, the rituals, the proceedings, everything. They have to be Na'vi through and through. The basic idea being that small groups of them will infiltrate the many tribes spread out accross Pandora, including those of the snow lands (vast spires, amazing creatures), those of the sea (think huge under water caverns, beasts that the Na'vi attach their mouths to to allow temporary breathing under water. Could show off some amazing under water lairs, plant life, lighting etc).


The task of this elite unit of Avatars is to over time, spread animosity and propanda from within. To start inner conflicts and tribal fueds among the clans, and most noteably towards Jakes tribe. Divide and rule so to speak (which goes in line with Cameron's current anti government message lol). To stir trouble from within the tribes is easier due to the fact that Jake is not actually a true Na'vi, rather a half breed. Which revered fearless warrior leaders of the other tribes not only see as a threat, but also detest and are sickened by. The fact that a half breed alien is assuming control of one of the most prestigious clans among the Na'vi does not bode well for them.


Jake, not having the Na'vi history and cultural sensitivity and understanding means he is also rather hot tempered and quick to rise to any animosity with further aggression and anger and show a lack of responsibility in judgements. This not only causes inner conflict with Jake himself, but with his relationship with the tribe, other tribes and more importantly with Neytri, who struggles to get to grips with jakes flippant attitude towards these things, and starts to realise the fundamental issues that carry over with Jake not being a true Na'vi.They struggle with their relationship, growing distant in parts, and through the course of the film, Jake loses grip of things. Things eventually violently flair between all the different tribes.


---

Side note: Among the elite Avatar task force, side stories could also occur. For example, some members of the team, like Jake, could end up admiring the Na'vi ways, and attempt or threaten to reveal true intentions and motives of the task force to the clans. This opens the door for suspense with the other task members making plans to ensure such a thing doesn't occur. Que back stabbing, espionage, tense scenes, murder, cover ups and all other messy scenario's.

---


Eventually, the task force is successful. Enough bitterness and animosity is created that it all ends in civil in fighting between the tribes. And builds to a climactic battle between the largest (Jakes vs whomever elses) of tribes that leaves devestation in it's wake. Jake is forced to lead armies of warriors to the charge against other tribes (could have one particular main revered opposing leader of another tribe who wants to overthrow Jake, could be a total bad ass). Neytri reluctantly following in jakes wake. I'd imagine this could open up the doors for some crazy battles and scenes, this time with Na'vi on Na'vi, but not just jungle based. We're talking sea based battles, snow lands, everything. Huge epic clashes but hopefully Cameronified (as in, not suffering the too much syndrome like TF2 for example).



The massive opposing tribe does lose to Jakes and is forced to reluctantly withdraw. Angered by the loss of thousands of fellow tribesmen and family members, they are torn and desperately seeking any excuse for revenge. This is where the covert members of the task force (who the Navi do not know are Avatars) offer up an alternative idea to the leaders of the losing side.

To seek alliance with the humans, in exchange for unobtanium. Which, is what ends up happening. Humans are back in full force, setting up fortified strong holds and armaments. This time, battling Jakes now vast army with the help of the opposing Naavi tribe. Again, this could open up the doorway for the sequel to have some spectacular end battle, this time not only with Navi on Navi, but with humans involved as well. Naturally the humans have other devious plans in mind (political similarities, think America aiding other countries/factions/sides in war and times of turmoil, but those counrties then being indebted to them and getting screwed in the long run lol) but still happily lend a helping hand (the idea being in the third film that they too turn on or take the piss with the allied trical side



But that's as far as I got. I was thinking the story sets itself up for some interesting cultural and emotional clashes between Neytri and Jake, and within Jake himself. Testing his character and true values/level of respect towards the Navi lifestyle. Naturally because he is actually still human at heart, he has traits that go against the Naavi ways, and opening that up a little to show a darker less Navi sensitive side to Jake might be an interesting character study.
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My idea of a third alien race attacking everyone is better :|
 
I have a hard time imagining Cameron directing an Avatar 2, then a few years later an Avatar 3

On the other hand, I don't want him to make Avatar 2 and 3 at the same time....better to focus on one story...
 
Well I walked out of the movie feeling a little underwhelmed. I would definately reccomend it simply for the visuals of Pandora. I love the design of the world and it's creatures. The expressions on the CGI characters was awsome. But the story was way cliched and the characters very stereotypical. It's one of those movies that from the start I decided to not care about the story and just focus on the spectacle, and I found it enjoyable, even though I was getting a little bored by the end.

My main dissapointment though were the 3d effects. Is anybody else underwhelmed by the 3d effects in this movie? I never one said wow just from the 3d. The artistry itself is great, and it definately benefits from 3d, but nothing ever really flies out at you in 3d. I remember seeing Beowulf and things come out of the screen and almost seem to touch you, kinda like those 3D shows at Universal Studios or Disney World. They never came "OUT" of the screen, if you understand what I mean. They just simply looked 3d, but never came out in front of you like I've seen in other 3d movies. For all the hype on 3d, this was the most dissapointing part. Anybody else feel this way?
 
VindicatorZ said:
My main dissapointment though were the 3d effects. Is anybody else underwhelmed by the 3d effects in this movie? I never one said wow just from the 3d. The artistry itself is great, and it definately benefits from 3d, but nothing ever really flies out at you in 3d. I remember seeing Beowulf and things come out of the screen and almost seem to touch you, kinda like those 3D shows at Universal Studios or Disney World. They never came "OUT" of the screen, if you understand what I mean. They just simply looked 3d, but never came out in front of you like I've seen in other 3d movies. For all the hype on 3d, this was the most dissapointing part. Anybody else feel this way?
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Most people (myself included) think of that as gimmicky 3D. I was glad that Avatar wasn't loaded up with that crap.

I much prefered the subtlety of the palm fronds that are in the foreground, or the holographic computer screens that have depth or best yet, when they look over high ridges/branches and you sense how high they are because of the 3D. My stomach actually dropped when he is looking down from the big tree.
 
VindicatorZ said:
My main dissapointment though were the 3d effects. Is anybody else underwhelmed by the 3d effects in this movie? I never one said wow just from the 3d. The artistry itself is great, and it definately benefits from 3d, but nothing ever really flies out at you in 3d. I remember seeing Beowulf and things come out of the screen and almost seem to touch you, kinda like those 3D shows at Universal Studios or Disney World. They never came "OUT" of the screen, if you understand what I mean. They just simply looked 3d, but never came out in front of you like I've seen in other 3d movies. For all the hype on 3d, this was the most dissapointing part. Anybody else feel this way?
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I think everyone completely agrees with what you said and is totally happy that they didn't use any campy bullshit in this movie just to justify having 3D glasses on the people. It wasn't a gimmicky 3D movie, it was a movie that was presented in 3D. The difference is nobody was shooting arrows into the audience and we weren't splashed with water from waterfalls.

I'm so glad they didn't do any of that crap.
 
rockman zx said:
I don't have the link but Cameron said that Avatar 2, in case he made it, will be outside of Pandora.
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He's on record as saying that the next movie will continue to follow Jake and Neytiri. I would imagine that it might cover the future Earth as well, but Pandora will definitely return and probably continue to be the focus.
 
whytemyke said:
I think everyone completely agrees with what you said and is totally happy that they didn't use any campy bullshit in this movie just to justify having 3D glasses on the people. It wasn't a gimmicky 3D movie, it was a movie that was presented in 3D. The difference is nobody was shooting arrows into the audience and we weren't splashed with water from waterfalls.

I'm so glad they didn't do any of that crap.
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QFT!
 
Ok, I found the quote:

"What would you think if I told you that should a sequel to AVATAR happen, it might not even take place on Pandora? It's all up the air as of now. But remember I'm telling you this. Pandora is not the be all and end all of the Consortium."
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Is not set in stone or anything and he already confirmed that we will follow Jake and Neytiri again if he does Avatar 2.
 
Janken said:
I still wonder why did they choose Papyrus for the title. Was it Cameron that decided it?

Urgh. Really.
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I wasn't as offended by the Papyrus title as I was by all the subtitles that used it. It was distractingly ugly.

(is going to go watch the movie for a second time, without a doubt)
 
rockman zx said:
Ok, I found the quote:

Is not set in stone or anything and he already confirmed that we will follow Jake and Neytiri again if he does Avatar 2.
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Like I said above, I think part of the sequel will take place on Earth. To show Earth's dide of the struggle, and how we too are suffering down here.
 
It is basically a SyFy Channel Original Movie with a huge budget. Technically, this movie is beautiful. Absolutely fantastic; one of the rare movies that must be experienced in a theater, and the first movie to really make 3D legit. There is no gimmick with this movie; the 3D plays an important role in telling the story.

The story, however, is a little stretched. The character development is all over the place and at times, forced. The acting is ham-fisted, and that is only further brought to light by the dialogue. I appreciate what hard work Mr. Cameron did to bring us this movie, but his dialogue in this film is somewhat Lucas-ian in it's cheesiness.

Overall I am glad I saw the film, but I doubt I could sit through a repeat showing.
 
nib95 said:
I'm not so sure. Bit too obvious imo. Plus, humans still need to have a pivotal role in the movie.
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Well they still did in what I wrote (third alien race is very faceless, never actually talking in the movie or anything, just a brutal force of destruction, and humans fight with the Na'vis while other humans are scheming to let them all die hoping to then figure a way to deal with the third aliens and get the Unobtonium). Plus at the end you get a good foundation for humans and Navis to work together permanently, something that is sort of 100% necessary if humans really need Unobtonium.

Btw I was thinking of something..................


JOHN CARTER OF MARS SHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

Anyone else thinks this movie won't be made anymore?

I remember back in 2006 I was at a conference in Montreal and Ian McCaig gave a presentation and drew a sketch of how he thought the aliens in John Cart of Mars should look and they totally looked like Navis too (to some extent anyway).

For those who don't know what JCoM is, IMBD says it is in production. Synopsis?

Civil War vet John Carter is transplanted to Mars, where he discovers a lush, wildly diverse planet whose main inhabitants are 12-foot tall green barbarians. Finding himself a prisoner of these creatures, he escapes, only to encounter Dejah Thoris, Princess of Helium, who is in desperate need of a savior.
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Basically John Carter, former American civil war soldier, fights on Mars alongside some aliens and saves the princess and hooks up with her and all. 12-foot tall tribal aliens to boot!

thumb160x_jcm.jpg


http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0401729/plotsummary

EDIT: OH! I FOUND AN INTERVIEW ON THIS PRECISE SUBJECT!: How Avatar Changd Pixar's John Cart of Mars Basically they don't say anything, but the studio excecutives are either thinking "Woo hoo, people will like it!" or "FUCK, it's too similar, no one will give a damn!"

Plus Disney is planning to make this a trilogy? Uh oh!
 
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