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rttp: Avengers Age of Ultron: A decent movie that tries to do too much

error4041

Member
The second installment in the wildly successful Avengers series, while it made a lot of money, most people were let down by the movie.

Watching it again, it's pretty obvious that the movie is attempting too many things at the same time, it tries to be a fairly-straightfaced character study of the Avengers and Ultron and how they fit in the world which shows up most in the tanker scene when they're all whammied by Scarlet Witch and all their insecurities are laid bare and the scene at Hawkeye's Farm where the fact they can't have a normal life is beat into them.

It tries to be a goofy action comedy, with constant quips throughout the movie, and a few comedic situations, several of the quips fall flat in delivery, it does manage to have some good comedic moments like the Avengers playing with Thor's hammer at the party, or everyone's shocked reaction when Vision casually hands Thor his hammer.

It tries to be the Avengers: redux as well, repeating several elements from the first movie to varying success, Loki's staff? check. Shots of all the Avengers? Check. Hulk fighting another Avenger with lives at stake? Check. Fighting against a giant CGI army for the fate of the world? Check.

When the movie gives attention to each of these elements it's often pretty great, stuff like the Scene at Clint's Farm has some good drama and gives us more insight to Hawkeye's and Black Widow's personality, a lot of people love the humor of when all the Avengers are trying to lift Thor's hammer, The scenes with the long takes of all the Avengers fighting together are has enjoyable as they were in the first movie,
The scene with them defending the death switch from Ultron is like a comicbook come to life

But the movie can't focus one element for too long which often undermines the effectiveness of previous scenes, where one aspect drowns out another, like the tanker scene which goes from Action scene with some comedy to a fairly serious look at the doubts of Captain America and Black Widow, all while Thor just gets exposition and a preview for Thor Ragnarok that looks nothing like Thor Ragnarok. which is another thing the brings the movie down, ads for future MCU, we get build-up for Thor Ragnarok, Black Panther, Infinity War and Civil War. While I think the scene with Klaw was pretty good way to set up a future movie and still use it for the purpose of the movie's narrative, the tease for Thor Ragnarok and Infinity War is rather out of place and doesn't serve much purpose outside of a dues ex machina

It's a fun movie, not anywhere near has bad as some people say, it's just a movie that seems to at war with itself and what it wants to be while it suffers a case of sequel-itis
 
It's a giant mess from beginning to end.

It feels like they had 5 movies of unrelated content scripted but instead of making 5 movies they jammed a bunch of stuff into 1.

I never understood how people can trash Batman vs. Superman but give Age of Ultron a pass. Both movies are made with the same mindset and are equally unwatchable.
 

Akuun

Looking for meaning in GAF
I enjoyed it, and I agree with you. The movie tries a little too hard to be witty and is often worse for it.

I generally hated how Ultron constantly shifted between the cold, mechanical superbeing that he's supposed to be... and a completely conflicting, separate demeanor that wouldn't look out of place on some rich snarky asshole.
 

Grizzlyjin

Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
It's a tab bit overstuffed. I rewatched it over the summer and it just doesn't stand up well next to Civil War or The Winter Soldier. The dialogue is a little too cutesy, which happens, you have a lot of characters bouncing off each other so there really isn't time to get deep with all of them. But like you said, some of the moments (dinner party) work when the movie just cools its jets.

It's one of the rare blockbusters where I don't have an issue with the third act. It's the middle where I think the movie loses steam. Ultron has a fucking amazing introduction, stumbling into the party. And I loved seeing all the Avengers work together to protect the people of Sokovia. But the middle section isn't that interesting.
 

Allforce

Member
This is the Marvel movie where I essentially did SeinfeldI'mOut.gif afterwards and have since pretty much not really paid attention to many of the "MCU".

Loved the first Avengers, didn't know wtf was going on in this one.
 

ZeoVGM

Banned
It's a solid movie but quite flawed and with too much going on without being able to juggle it all properly, which is something Civil War was able to do.
 

WoolyNinja

Member
I enjoyed it on initial watch in the theater but over time its come to be my second least favorite Marvel movie after Thor 2
 

Varna

Member
Definitely one of my least favorite MCU films. It's kind of funny, Civil War frames it as a much more interesting movie. So much that I started a rewatch... only to drop it about 30 minutes in.

It's definitely in the Iron Man 2, Thor 2 tier of Marvel Movies
 

Shaanyboi

Banned
It definitely tries to do too much without focusing on what should be its strengths. That said, I still enjoy it and it has some great fucking moments.

A shame Whedon is cemented as a complete shitbasket as I would want to credit a lot of stuff to him but... nah, fuck him.
 

DrSlek

Member
I enjoyed it, and I agree with you. The movie tries a little too hard to be witty and is often worse for it.

I generally hated how Ultron constantly shifted between the cold, mechanical superbeing that he's supposed to be... and a completely conflicting, separate demeanor that wouldn't look out of place on some rich snarky asshole.

I saw the movie after seeing this video, and I was surprised at how it wasn't completely innacurate.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf-_230SjbM
 

The Kree

Banned
It's 15-20 minutes too short for the amount of things it tries to do. Ultron and the twins needed a little more room to develop. Thor also didn't need a subplot dedicated to him when he already gets solo movies. His character could just already have the information he seeks instead of sending him away to find it.

Really good movie otherwise.
 

Dalek

Member
It's 15-20 minutes too short for the amount of things it tries to do. Ultron and the twins needed a little more room to develop. Thor also didn't need a subplot dedicated to him when he already gets solo movies. His character could just already have the information he seeks instead of sending him away to find it.

Really good movie otherwise.

Agree with this. And my main complaint was Ultron's personality. That said-they completly nailed Vision. What an entrance!
 
Felt way too similar to the original and in many ways, a step back from what the Avengers was. The whole Natasha-Bruce love angle was forced and wasn't really properly developed, we get ANOTHER forced fanservice plot point about Hulk going apeshit just as an excuse to give us the Hulkbuster (and in fairness, why do we have to have another Hulk vs. everyone battle again...? This kind of rehashing shit is why people think AoU apes on the original and why it seems very superficial compared to if it was naturally built into the plot), Ultron being who he is loses out on some depth being a Tony Stank creation than if he was simply a Hank Pym creation, and overall, it just seems like this movie lacks a coherent vision because it tries to do too much.
 
Tries to do too much and gets sloppy in parts (real sloppy, for the bar Marvel has set for itself that is). That being said, it gets a pass and is still enjoyable because the characters themselves are fun to watch together, and have compelling stories from their previous misadventures.

That's the main reason I give it a pass vs. other average-or-worse cape movies.

Civil War does what this movie tried to do in a much tighter package and with arguably more stuff.
 

Ecotic

Member
It's just not very engaging and it's hard to pinpoint exactly why. If you missed any of the previous movies then you will have a very hard time following along. Ultron was a weak villain and made the whole movie feel like it was designed to pad out time until the actual danger comes along next time. We are after all teased this Thanos guy, I was pretty sure of it. I dont like paying money to see a showdown with the mid-level boss. There's also a whole new cast of characters that just confuse the comic novice, like who or what 'The Vision' is, and how powerful is he?
 

The Kree

Banned
Agree with this. And my main complaint was Ultron's personality. That said-they complexity nailed Vision. What an entrance!

They could have got away with Ultron's personality better if he just had more screen time to develop that quirkiness instead of handwaving it away with "He's like you, Tony." I feel like he was pretty comic accurate otherwise. He's not strictly a brooding serious villain despite his genocidal tendencies, he's a loony weirdo.
 
It's one of the rare blockbusters where I don't have an issue with the third act. It's the middle where I think the movie loses steam. Ultron has a fucking amazing introduction, stumbling into the party. And I loved seeing all the Avengers work together to protect the people of Sokovia. But the middle section isn't that interesting.

Agree with a lot of this. Not to mention so much was apparently happening off screen like killing Baron Strucker.

My biggest gripe is how they made Ultron visually and personality wise. Like I get why they did it to make him made by Stark instead of Pym but it was a bit too much banter. I love the Ultron from the comics and some animations that is flat out robotic/synthetic life is supreme. Not to mention a scarier face than the movie since it was devoid of many human features. He was just a touch to witty, despite me liking the lines and how he basically one up'd Stark everytime he spoke.
 

Xiaoki

Member
Joss Whedon taking "blame" for AoU was obviously him not wanting to piss off Disney. His original take off Disney suits wanting more and more it this and that was likely closer to the truth.

AoU was trying to do too much and failing at all of them.

It had to be a sequel to Avengers, it had to be the next major milestone in the MCU, set up future movies like Thor Ragnarok and Black Panther, balance screen time of the ensemble cast and, least of all, be its own movie with its own arc and villain.

Hopefully, they use the mistakes from AoU as a necessary learning experience: DO NOT force the movies themselves be too "Cinematic Universe." You get The Mummy when that happens.
 
It's a giant mess from beginning to end.

It feels like they had 5 movies of unrelated content scripted but instead of making 5 movies they jammed a bunch of stuff into 1.

I never understood how people can trash Batman vs. Superman but give Age of Ultron a pass. Both movies are made with the same mindset and are equally unwatchable.

Nah actually BVS had heart to it, it asked questions which other movies in other universes wouldn't even dare to ask until frivolously asking it in Capt Civil War. AoU and BVS are watchable, with BVS being a real standout for me of being more than watchable, it's one of the best CBM movies of all time (Ultimate Cut). Age of Ultron on the other hand felt like an unmemorable quip-fest, actually not sure which one was more unmemorable between Cap:Civil War vs AoU vs GOTG V2
 

Shaanyboi

Banned
Nah actually BVS had heart to it, it asked questions which other movies in other universes wouldn't even dare to ask until frivolously asking it in Capt Civil War. AoU and BVS are watchable, with BVS being a real standout for me of being more than watchable, it's one of the best CBM movies of all time (Ultimate Cut). Age of Ultron on the other hand felt like an unmemorable quip-fest, actually not sure which one was more unmemorable between Cap:Civil War vs AoU vs GOTG V2

...smh

I remember a lot about BvS, just not for the reasons intended...
 
Nah actually BVS had heart to it, it asked questions which other movies in other universes wouldn't even dare to ask until frivolously asking it in Capt Civil War. AoU and BVS are watchable, with BVS being a real standout for me of being more than watchable, it's one of the best CBM movies of all time (Ultimate Cut). Age of Ultron on the other hand felt like an unmemorable quip-fest, actually not sure which one was more unmemorable between Cap:Civil War vs AoU vs GOTG V2

The problem with asking those questions is that it had better be executed well (which imo it doesn't mainly because there are balance and tone issues that undermine those very ideas in the first place). Also, one could argue that the concept of the value of hero was already executed with Nolan's Batman, but that's only one idea compared to the many that BvS tries to tackle. To me BvS and AoU are both poorly executed movies that did way too much and neither gets a pass.
 

Dalek

Member
Nah actually BVS had heart to it, it asked questions which other movies in other universes wouldn't even dare to ask until frivolously asking it in Capt Civil War. AoU and BVS are watchable, with BVS being a real standout for me of being more than watchable, it's one of the best CBM movies of all time (Ultimate Cut). Age of Ultron on the other hand felt like an unmemorable quip-fest, actually not sure which one was more unmemorable between Cap:Civil War vs AoU vs GOTG V2

tenor.gif
 
On paper, the movie should be unwatchable. That it isn't a complete and utter mess that's impossible to watch is a head scratcher.

I still like the movie and hope IW and latter ensemble MCU pics avoid it's pitfalls, but it was kind of the first "hey, even when Marvel Studios fumbles, they still find a way to score" for me in the franchise.
 

The Kree

Banned
Nah actually BVS had heart to it, it asked questions which other movies in other universes wouldn't even dare to ask until frivolously asking it in Capt Civil War. AoU and BVS are watchable, with BVS being a real standout for me of being more than watchable, it's one of the best CBM movies of all time (Ultimate Cut). Age of Ultron on the other hand felt like an unmemorable quip-fest, actually not sure which one was more unmemorable between Cap:Civil War vs AoU vs GOTG V2

BvS was extremely ambitious, which is what makes it such a spectacular failure. AoU succeeds where it doesn't because it doesn't betray it's own far humbler ambitions. AoU doesn't verbally tell you what it's heroes represent and then show you a series of images that contradict that statement - BvS does that and it's bad for it.
 

Ashhong

Member
The problem with asking those questions is that it had better be executed well (which imo it doesn't mainly because there are balance and tone issues that undermine those very ideas in the first place). Also, one could argue that the concept of the value of hero was already executed with Nolan's Batman, but that's only one idea compared to the many that BvS tries to tackle. To me BvS and AoU are both poorly executed movies that did way too much and neither gets a pass.

I can agree with this. Except for some reason I give it a pass. I just really like what it tried to do. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
 
Hell, I like what BvS tried to do. Or at least, what I think it tried to do. That's kinda the problem with BvS; it says it wants to do one thing, while actively doing another.

It's really an amazing failure.
 

Neophant

Member
Age of Ultron is my least favourite Marvel movie, partially because of the deceiving marketing in how Ultron was portrayed in the trailers compared to how he ended up being in the movie, partially because of the incessant quips and constant pandering to the audience, and mostly because how much of a mess the movie is from the writing to the tone of the action scenes and how it transitions from scene to scene. At the very least it's watchable, and I enjoyed the scenes in the farmhouse and in Avengers tower at the beginning of the movie.

And while I do agree that BvS was cut from a similar cloth to Age of Ultron (being used as a delivery method for world-building and setting up future films), the former succeeds in having a strong, consistent tone and more importantly leaving the main focus on the two titular characters of Batman and Superman and their contrasting philosophies and mindsets. Unlike a lot of other comic book films however, Batman v. Superman is more focused on making a compelling story and delivering emotional highs and lows despite how absurd it initially seems.
 

AMUSIX

Member
Going to stay away from the comparisons to other films (as they crazies have already come out) but will just say that AoU needed editing in the script phase. Otherwise, what was there was good.

I think the film truly shines during dialogue. Ultron crashing the after-party was an excellent introduction (the after-party itself was excellent). Ultron's awakening and conversing with Jarvis is another great little scene. Hell, Ultron's final scene is one of the best in any superhero movie:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zKaHp0zW7U

Then there's the Steve and Tony scene, also excellent
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALscDushJW8

And, although so many people misinterpreted it and it got a bad wrap, the Natasha and Banner scene is so good
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUosv677ucA


There are things that really should have been changed. The twins needed at least one more scene to get the audiences to WANT them to be heroes. Thor's vision either needed to be given it's full arc, or be pulled entirely, the half-assed/left on the cutting room floor version just didn't work. Ultron's menace needed to be build up a bit more. Hulk's rampage needed to be more vicious. All of this would have risked making the movie heavier than intended, but I think it would have benefited from it.


And as for where it falls for me in the MCU, I think at the bottom is TIH, then Thor2, then either IM2 or Ultron, as they both have similar flaws.
 
It's like Whedon tried to remake the first Avengers, but not nearly as good.
I still like it enough because of the character interactions and I really like Ultron itself, but the overall plot just isn't there.

And BvS had no heart. Who the fuck even asked for that comparison?
 
There were like 4 and a half MCU movies that bored the living shit out of me in theaters, but I rewatched the entire thing at home like a soap opera and now I'm back on board. Even during the low points I was able to stay invested in all of the side characters and the overarching story. Watching it all in one go I also got the sense that the movies have been getting better as it goes on for the most part.
 
It's definitely a movie that people have soured on over time quite a bit.

Made me feel better about not being impressed by it from launch for all the reasons you mentioned. Saw it at the theater and it was okay but I had absolutely 0 interest in ever watching it again. And I haven't. Lots of flash, very, very little substance.
 

Biske

Member
It was okay, a super safe by the numbers marvel movie.

It's to the point that where you know just about what to expect from each movie and Disney will safely give it to you and not ruffle any feathers.

I'd love to see an Avengers or Marvel movie that really blows my mind and is exciting.
 
It was okay, a super safe by the numbers marvel movie.

It's to the point that where you know just about what to expect from each movie and Disney will safely give it to you and not ruffle any feathers.

I'd love to see an Avengers or Marvel movie that really blows my mind and is exciting.

You mean Civil War? Already happened man...
 

V_Arnold

Member
It's a giant mess from beginning to end.

It feels like they had 5 movies of unrelated content scripted but instead of making 5 movies they jammed a bunch of stuff into 1.

I never understood how people can trash Batman vs. Superman but give Age of Ultron a pass. Both movies are made with the same mindset and are equally unwatchable.

Equally unwatchable? No. Bvs tries to be a decent drama with proper structure, but has way too much padding.

Ultron does not do that. But at least stuff actually HAPPENS in it.
 

siddx

Magnificent Eager Mighty Brilliantly Erect Registereduser
Enjoyed it. I've yet to be disappointed by a marvel movie. I guess I'm the type of consumer they love, easy to please as long as cool shit is happening on screen.
 

Spinluck

Member
I never understood how people can trash Batman vs. Superman but give Age of Ultron a pass. Both movies are made with the same mindset and are equally unwatchable.

BvS is garbage.

AoU is a decent and watchable movie with some problems, and a bit of fluff that needed to be cut.

The characters in BvS aren't even remotely likable in any sort of way.

I'm one of the few that would much rather watch AoU than the first Avengers.
 

DeathyBoy

Banned
It's definitely a movie that people have soured on over time quite a bit.

Made me feel better about not being impressed by it from launch for all the reasons you mentioned. Saw it at the theater and it was okay but I had absolutely 0 interest in ever watching it again. And I haven't. Lots of flash, very, very little substance.

They'll sour on Civil War soon. Love that film gets blows my mind.
 
It's horrendous to sit through again. Makes you appreciate something like civil war or guardians (the real best mcu ensemble movie) more because of it. Feels like a long slog and frankly the action wasn't much to write home about either

Whedons writing/directing just ain't for me. I don't find these movies particularly memorable but I still can recall how bad those exchanges between widow and banner were

Pretty worried about how much influence he has in Justice League since I actually liked the overtly self serious tone that they were applying to it with BvS.
 
Marvel's got a big problem with their second movies: Iron Man 2, Thor 2, Avengers 2, Guardians 2 are all considered among the lower-tier because they try to do too many big hits from the first movie without considering what made the first movie successful and making a good standalone film. Winter Soldier was the only one to fix this slump because it was a completely different movie and not a rehash of the first.
 
Marvel's got a big problem with their second movies: Iron Man 2, Thor 2, Avengers 2, Guardians 2 are all considered among the lower-tier because they try to do too many big hits from the first movie without considering what made the first movie successful and making a good standalone film. Winter Soldier was the only one to fix this slump because it was a completely different movie and not a rehash of the first.

In what reality is GotG 2 considered a low tier Marvel movie?
 
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