Trunx81
Member
He made a statement about it: https://seymourhersh.substack.com/p/why-substack
And yeah, that one “source” is the one thing that makes me not believe it 100%. But Deep Throat was also “one source” in the beginning.
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Russia begins Invasion of Ukraine
- Thread starter AfricanKing
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And yeah, that one “source” is the one thing that makes me not believe it 100%. But Deep Throat was also “one source” in the beginning.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
I’m not necessarily condemning it because it’s on substack I’m just saying being on substack means the traditional checks and balances that have ensured hopefully only truth gets published are not there.
Ironbunny
Member
I dont think that matters anymore who blew it. The pipe is gone and many are happy it for it. One less pipe for Pootin to use for hes smoke and mirrors.
Could be. There is statements that UK will be providing 1300kg storm shadow missiles for Ukraine. Operational range of 560km. I believe those can be shot from the Ukraines existing planes.
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That would be splendid , missiles of those range , would open up possibilities.
Tams
Member
Even if true, no, not really. Aid isn't being sent to Ukraine because of the attack on Nord Stream 2, which wasn't even functioning.
I have no clue as the veracity of Hersh's claim. He has been criticised recently for lacking evidence in his pieces and he is well past his prime. Make of that what you will.
The affected countries will have a better understanding than any of us forum dwellers do and will do what they think is necessary. And even if it was the US, none of them are going to be siding with fucking Russia over this.
Also: 'Pweeze sub to me Substack. Pweety pweeze'.
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Tams
Member
Trunx81
Member
Come on, at least try to discuss it seriously. NS2 "wasn´t even functioning" is false, they could have flipped the switched after it was approved, a decission heavily bombarded by the US.
And "even if it was the US", this would mean maybe not a lot for USA citizens, but it would sure as hell influence Europe. There has been a year-long anti-US movement all over Europe and this kind of article, if (!) true, could change how the european citizens think about the whole war. Support for Ukraine is already dropping, with more and more people not wanting to send tanks (and now planes) over.
If (and again a big IF) the story is true (like I said, I really hope its not), this would have been a) and act of war by the US and Norway. b) an act of terrorism against Germany by fellow NATO members.
We are not talking about a simple "whoopsie, well anyway ..." kind of thing, this ... could be huge.
I´m worried
Lukaku's First Touch
Member
I'll tell you know. It's not true at all. I give you this evidence: ... the same as the author of that article.
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Forsete
Member
DN wrote an article regarding the NS2 explosion that a Swedish warship might have tracked something in the area 2 days prior, and that the same warship then went on a course towards Kaliningrad.
The navy didn't comment on what the warship was doing in the area, but confirmed that they had been there.
www.dn.se
I find that more believable than whatever that Hersh dude has dreamt up.
The navy didn't comment on what the warship was doing in the area, but confirmed that they had been there.
Marinen vid Kaliningrad före Nord Stream-explosionerna
Två dygn innan explosionerna spanade den svenska marinen i områdena vid gasledningarna utanför Bornholm.
www.dn.se
I find that more believable than whatever that Hersh dude has dreamt up.
Trunx81
Member
You´re probably right. When Hersh first broke the Abu Ghraib story, the US government also dismissed it as "a tapestry of nonsense". Why should they be wrong now?
winjer
Member
Could be his source is the Russian FSB. This way he could get all these amazing information but also a lot of Russian propaganda and misinformation.
Trunx81
Member
Absolutely. I agree that the "one source" claim is fishy and in line with yellow press "a friend of the family says" kind of journalism.
Right now it´s a story. No proof.
Patrick S.
Banned
Even if this were true, I guess we'd never know. Nobody is going to come out and say "yeah, we did that."
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Orcs are getting very close to have line of fire over the last road out of Bakhmut.
It's been over 6 months but it might appear the battle for the city is getting close to an end.
It's been over 6 months but it might appear the battle for the city is getting close to an end.
NoLootBoxDev
Member
Tams
Member
Look what 'functioning' means. It was not pumping gas on anything more than a test level.Come on, at least try to discuss it seriously. NS2 "wasn´t even functioning" is false, they could have flipped the switched after it was approved, a decission heavily bombarded by the US.
And "even if it was the US", this would mean maybe not a lot for USA citizens, but it would sure as hell influence Europe. There has been a year-long anti-US movement all over Europe and this kind of article, if (!) true, could change how the european citizens think about the whole war. Support for Ukraine is already dropping, with more and more people not wanting to send tanks (and now planes) over.
If (and again a big IF) the story is true (like I said, I really hope its not), this would have been a) and act of war by the US and Norway. b) an act of terrorism against Germany by fellow NATO members.
We are not talking about a simple "whoopsie, well anyway ..." kind of thing, this ... could be huge.
I´m worried
Europe is not going to rise up against some 'big bad American overlord', especially when the other big (but clearly with not as big teeth as first thought) player is fucking Russia.
Even if it was the US, it'll be quietly swept under the rug as the alternative is far, far, far fucking worse.
Tams
Member
SpaceX should take a good hard look at themselves. Obviously morally, but even if it's for self-preservation - they don't want to find out what it's like when the US government considers you a security threat.
kvltus lvlzvs
Member
Seymour Hersch is super credentialed and, to be honest, did anyone unironically believe it was ever anyone other than the USA?
Ironbunny
Member
This framing really isnt asking a question.
kvltus lvlzvs
Member
You're right, it was pure rhetoric.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
What the fuck. Time to haul these fuckers in front of Congress and force them into compliance with the national interest.
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Gp1
Member
Poor Oryx
Makes absolutely no sense for it to be the US.
Also, Russian Intelligence has been blaming the UK before.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europ...blew-up-nord-stream-gas-pipelines-2022-10-29/
kvltus lvlzvs
Member
Besides Biden and Nuland saying it would happen before the fact, it negating the leverage Russia had over Europe regarding energy, increasing European dependancy on US exports, increasing economic pressure on Russia, and various US spooks like Nuland and Blinken gloating about it after the fact? Perhaps the US-NATO joint naval drills in the area beforehand mean nothing? The fact that the USA absolutely has a long and storied history (much longer and more storied than any other nation in modern history) of carrying out clandestine activities such as this? The fact that of all players involved in this, the USA stands to gain more than anyone else?
You are right about UK though, I remember that. I was actually surprised that they didn't get a shout out in the Hersch article. No matter where you stand in perception of this conflict, the article should be read.
Anyhoo, I really just came to provide my two cents regarding the Hersch article and am bowing out of this thread.
Compliance is likely the whole reason for the change.
I imagine the compliance department at SpaceX shitting bricks when it came out that Ukraine was using the terminals to control drones, kind of surprised it took them this long to address(though given the reaction, I can understand).
NoLootBoxDev
Member
I bet there is no more meat in the prisons. so:
NoLootBoxDev
Member
Looks like you popped in here to spread conspiracy theories. Because Biden saying he’d push to make sure Nordstream 2 didn’t come online certainly doesn’t hint at a military attack on an asset jointly owned by one of their most important allies. No mention was made of NS1 which was also blown up at the same time.
You folks conveniently fail to mention that at the time it was blown up, Russia had already cut gas supplies to Germany via NS1 and were openly talking in the media about the EU freezing in winter. Gas supply agreements are long term contracts that Russia was violating by not supplying gas. They were skirting the issue by claiming maintenance related problems but couldn’t have clung to that for long. Destroying the pipeline freed Russia from potential penalties and was supposed to push a case for a major lift of sanctions.
It also makes no sense to talk about ‘US-NATO naval drills in the area’ when Germany itself is a major component of NATO and would have been involved in the drills. And while the US has a long history of clandestine ops, none of that compares to directly striking at assets of strategic Allies and the attendant negative impact of venting billions of cubic meters of gas into the ocean. This would have been an extremely risky operation that could have caused long term damage to US - EU relations. Not to mention significant impact on Biden’s climate change agenda.
The party that stood to benefit most from this has always been Russia. Yes, Seymour Hersh used to be a very respectable journalist, but the internet is filled with VERY respectable people who still blame Ukraine for starting this war. People like Mearscheimer, for example.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Newspaper reports that Russia has 300.000 troops and 2000 tanks in Ukraine ready for an offensive to begin 24 February to coincide with the anniversary.
www.telegraph.co.uk
Russia prepares 2,000 tanks and 300,000 troops for ‘huge invasion’ in Donbas
The attack is expected to coincide with the one-year anniversary of Vladimir Putin's launch of the war in Ukraine on February 24
www.telegraph.co.uk
Lukaku's First Touch
Member
That's a lot of human wall suicide attacks. Hopefully Ukraine has enough bullets.
Lukaku's First Touch
Member
This was expected with winter if I understand correctly. If Ukraine holds off this new wave of nazi orcs, then the spring will be very interesting. Especially when the new batch of vehicles / weapons NATO will supply arrive.
They are so predictable.. should be easy canon fodder
Tams
Member
They aren't going great for Ukraine, but not terrible either.
Over winter, nothing much was expected to happen and not much has happened other than thousands of more senseless deaths from Russia's invasion.
The autumn gains Ukraine made were exceptions. It's not normal to make such massive gains and even the Ukrainians were not expecting nor fully prepared to support them.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
RealLifeLore has an excellent video on the human cost as of the Ukraine War, as viewed from satellite images.
Usually his videos hit YouTube a week after they debut on Nebula, but here's a link to those with NebulaTV subscriptions (well worth the 14USD per year for the service + curiosity stream):
nebula.tv
It's just a reel of war crimes after war crimes, especially the before and after images of the Mariupol theatre with the words children spelt out and clearly seen by satellites and reconnaissance, but it was still destroyed by a Russian missile strike two days later killing over 600 civilians. Now the Russian cunts are using that site for propaganda, making a mockery of the tragedy they caused. The magnitude of prolonged evil is intolerable and needs to be front and centre in everyone's minds.
NATO should be enforcing a no-fly zone and start launching missile strikes against Russian targets in Ukraine. Zelensky shouldn't be forced to be doing the rounds, begging for scraps, when some of the most dire atrocities are being committed on Europe's doorsteps.
Usually his videos hit YouTube a week after they debut on Nebula, but here's a link to those with NebulaTV subscriptions (well worth the 14USD per year for the service + curiosity stream):
RealLifeLore — How Satellite Images Reveal Ukraine's Destruction
How satellite images tell the story of the war in Ukraine
nebula.tv
It's just a reel of war crimes after war crimes, especially the before and after images of the Mariupol theatre with the words children spelt out and clearly seen by satellites and reconnaissance, but it was still destroyed by a Russian missile strike two days later killing over 600 civilians. Now the Russian cunts are using that site for propaganda, making a mockery of the tragedy they caused. The magnitude of prolonged evil is intolerable and needs to be front and centre in everyone's minds.
NATO should be enforcing a no-fly zone and start launching missile strikes against Russian targets in Ukraine. Zelensky shouldn't be forced to be doing the rounds, begging for scraps, when some of the most dire atrocities are being committed on Europe's doorsteps.
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Excalibur
That artillery precision comes from skill developed from daily usage making the most of the weapons. The third mentions Donets. Made me wonder if there would be many of the same artillerymen. The Ukrainians are getting more experience and training with advanced systems and Russians send in more inexperienced troops with old systems.
This second video makes me hope the Ukrainians are going to be getting air training with the armour training. Tactical as well as field. They're getting a lot more mobility which will change the way they support and utilize their troops. Leopards, Abrams and Bradleys oh my.
He seems very adamant for justifying Russia's aggression as defensive.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Because Ukraine lacks the equipment to push troughs defense lines, their strategy has consistently been one: keep killing orcs with a positive KD ratio. You do it long enough the lines either thin out and you take over or the orcs valiantly advance to the rear.
Because of the conscription Russia has flooded the lines with mobiks so there’s a lot of orc grinding to be done.
winjer
Member
No, he doesn't. He is explaining the Russian mindset.
And in this he is right, Russia has been using the excuse of "existencial threat" for centuries, as a way to justify expanding and invading their neighbors.
He is also very clear, that in the last 20 years, Russia has done 8 invasions of it's neighbors. And if the Ukrainian invasion is successful, then next it will be Poland. This is why we must NOT allow Russia no win this war.
Tams
Member
tl;dr: Ukrainians value their soldiers' lives; Russians don't.
The existential threat is just an excuse for their thieving. The way he words it comes off like apologetics and justification, for example, him, as a mouthpiece, saying that Russia is being interfered with by the West will lead to Russia's destruction. Without saying what the interference is and leaving it unsupported and a vague threat to Russia's existence.
MisterFalcon
Member
The Putin regime is under existential threat by a more prosperous Ukraine. Or any other neighbour.
winjer
Member
No it doesn't. You are just reading that into what is a direct historical analysis of the Russian mindset.
He is not justifying what Russians have been doing since 1992. He is explaining what the Russian plans are.
Understanding how your enemy thinks, is not agreeing with them.
He doesn't know what the Russian plans are, he's speculating. He might be echoing excuses they have used and thinking those are the Russian mindset then going off that incorrectly to make his alarmist assumptions. The top comment on the video from a self identified Russian citizen even mentions that these reasons he espouses aren't the rationale.
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