LOL, what the hell at this response. When did this thread get so serious? Good grief. Do I need to post my Saturn creds or something so that I get some benefit of the doubt next time?
Yeah, unfortunately professional monitors may be hard to come by depending on where you live. There are some great consumer models out there, that folks just want to get rid of though. Keep an eye out.
If you have a PS2, it's also on the Taito Legends 2 compilation for way cheaper, and includes additional games like Metal Black, Gekirindan and Darius Gaiden.
I use RF on a flatscreen. The TV also doesn't properly recognize the frequency and the picture gets fucked up sometimes. It automatically stretches the picture to 16:9 as well (and I never bothered to change it).
I think a lot of you (video/audiophiles) would hate my setup...
I use RF for old systems (Atari 7800, Odyssey 2, SMS, NES 2, TI 99/4A - four of these RFUs are all daisy-chained); composite for most '90s consoles (NES (original), SNES, Genesis+SCD+32X, TG16+CD, N64, Saturn, Dreamcast, and JP PS2 (slim) (and also the Gamecube and PS1, when I hook up those systems which is rare, I play the games on PS2/GC); and component for the US PS2 (fat), Wii, Xbox, and Xbox 360.
RF devices are mostly hooked up by that daisy-chain which attaches to my VCR. I need to flip the switch on the TI99/4A RFU to switch between that and the O2, but the NES and SMS are first so those have the usual auto-switches. Composite systems are hooked into two Radio Shack 5-in-2-out composite (also S-video plugs that I don't use) auto-switchboxes, one connected to the other. I love these things, it's awesome to have a switchbox which doesn't need a remote or button on the unit! They work great, too (and if there is a problem holding a signal, you can turn off the automatic switch and manually use buttons on the switches.). Since Radio Shack is out of business now, I don't know if anyone else makes something as good. At least I have these. Oh, the two outputs on the first box go to the VCR and to the second box. Composite consoles which support tate mode are attached to this box (DC, Saturn) so that I can use them on my third TV (via the VCR's RF output), a junky '90s CRT that I keep tipped up on end for use in tate-mode games. This TV is bigger than the other CRT mentioned below, but only has RF input and nothing else, and has worse picture and sound quality too compared to that one. The RF/cable out jack on a VCR is essential, that's how I get the games to this TV. (For newer systems, I've got to switch multiple cables to use them with the rotated TV -- I can only do this via the output jacks on my HDTV, which are composite only, and the output needs to be SD of course for the rotated TV to accept it. I rarely do this because it's a hassle.) The two outputs on the second switchbox go to the two main TVs, the HDTV and the regular (not rotated) CRT TV. As for the component systems, they're hooked up to a Radio Shack component switchbox, but this isn't automatic unfortunately; it has a remote. Well, at least that's better than having to press buttons on the box itself.
As for things I could improve, of course there are plenty. There are a couple I've thought about in particular, though I haven't done them yet. For the PS2s, I don't know if I have anything for the Japanese PS2 that'd really make it be worth the hassle of switching cables with the component cable I use with the US PS2; few games support component anyway. This is also why I haven't bought a second PS2 component cable. Also, I've thought about getting a VGA box and VGA to component adapter, or a DC component box thing, to improve the Dreamcast's visuals (it would need to be component, I don't have a TV with VGA), but haven't done it;' I prefer to spend the money I spend on games on games, not hardware...
As for S-Video, RGB, or what have you,. I've never used any of those things before, so I don't know how different that would look versus composite. I'm sure it''d look better, but I don't mind the way they look as it is.
The far bigger problem, is that my HDTV is old and has a screen that is mostly tinted yellow... it's annoying, but oh well, fixing it would probably be expensive.
At least I do also have a nice, if much smaller than the HDTV, SD CRT TV, one of the later CRTs with a flat screen. The CRT actually does have component on the back, but doesn't support HD, so I've never really used it (supposedly SD component would look slightly better than HD, but would it really be much of a difference?).
Oh, and as for audio, I've never actually attached external speakers or whatever to a TV, only just used the speakers in the television. The HDTV has pretty decent audio, much better than the CRT SDTV -- audio is kind of the opposite of the picture quality, for old games, since the SDTV has better picture quality but the HDTV better sound. The rotated TV has the worst sound for sure.
As for S-Video, RGB, or what have you,. I've never used any of those things before, so I don't know how different that would look versus composite. I'm sure it''d look better, but I don't mind the way they look as it is.
I think I'll order that Yuan capture card along with my framemeister! It's a clone of the micomsoft one and it costs less so I think it'd be a nice addition. (I hate the el gato so much.)
I see no need right now for me to go the XRGB route until my CRT dies or those prices come down. I would rather spend my gaming budget on games than over priced upscalers.
That's just not an attitude I'd ever have, I'm pretty sure. I mean, I have played games in emulators before, and prefer to play the real thing, composite or no. Or for another example, I've watched plenty of HD video, but have no problem watching a VHS tape either.
So would the picture look better, if I bought whatever was required to get the best picture quality? Sure, yeah, I'm sure it would. But I don't care enough to want to spend money on that instead of games, no way.
On the note of games, I spent almost $200 on old games in the past few weeks. This is why I still don't have any of the current-gen consoles... I keep thinking I should save up for a Wii U and/or 3DS and some games, but then I do this instead. Heh. I did get six (complete, US-version) Saturn games among the new purchases, though -- Dark Savior, Steep Slope Sliders, Fighters Megamix, Last Gladiators Digital Pinball, Decathlete, and Gungriffon.
How else do you attach four RFUs to a VCR (or a TV)? Of course you connect each one to the next. It doesn't affect output quality much if at all -- the Odyssey 2, on the end of the line, looks pretty good. As for using other output methods, you can't use other things for most of those consoles, 2nd-gen consoles do not have any other output, and nor does the NES 2 without heavy modding. I could get a AV cable for the SMS, sure, but I haven't, yet at least. The system has decent enough RF output that I haven't made it a priority.
I have upgraded video cables over time -- back when I first got a Genesis I only had the RFU for that, and the same for when I got a Saturn, but later I got AV cables for both of those systems. The same's true for the Turbografx, which of course has only RF without an addon. When I got a Turbo CD I upgraded from RF to AV, and THAT was a big improvement in picture quality, in a way that the Genesis or Saturn weren't. Honestly I can barely tell the difference between RF and composite with the Genesis, but with the TG16 composite looks worlds better! The picture is dark and muddy with RF, but brighter and much better looking with composite. I might have noticed more of a difference there than going from composite to component with the Wii... (That was something I did several years after getting the system; I didn't have an HDTV until 2012.)
I don't know if I've ever seen a TV that WASN'T only using the internal speakers, certainly not in either my family's house or any of our relatives that I've been to. It's perfectly good for anyone not a huge audiophile, which I am most certainly not. I do like the sound in the HDTV better than the SD one, though, as I said; it sounds better.
As for S-Video, RGB, or what have you,. I've never used any of those things before, so I don't know how different that would look versus composite. I'm sure it''d look better, but I don't mind the way they look as it is.
I still remember buying a 27" Sony Vega and hooking up my Dreamcast to it with s-video for the first time. I just sat there staring at JSR and Soul Calibur.
I couldn't make it through ABF's post. The less I know about that whole situation in general the better, I think.
Eh, I kinda see where Falcon's coming from. (Though I am a bit befuddled about using RF for the SMS, since I believe it uses the same composite cable as the OG Genesis.)
Myself, I try to obtain the highest native, (North American) out-of-the-box audio/video quality for each of the systems. I'm not terribly interested in going RGB/Scart/Framemeister/etc. It's not worth the investment to me right now, and I'd rather concentrate on expanding my library. But I do at least keep a couple CRT TVs on hand for older systems. And all the audio does go thru my receiver/speaker system, since I really enjoy the music/sound.
Eh, I kinda see where Falcon's coming from. (Though I am a bit befuddled about using RF for the SMS, since I believe it uses the same composite cable as the OG Genesis.)
Myself, I try to obtain the highest native, (North American) out-of-the-box audio/video quality for each of the systems.
True, but I'm currently not interested in investing in the extra monitor/convertor/upscaler necessary to get RGB. Composite and S-Video are acceptable to me.
Improvements would be great, but if it's not as easy as simply getting a new cable, I'm probably not going to do it. I've already got too much stuff in not enough space. =(
I just ordered a Saturn and have been raiding the local retro shops of their controllers and accessories. It's my gaming blind spot and I'm having a lot of fun already learning of all the wacky specialized controllers.
Is there a combo RAM cart / memory cart other than the Action Replay? I won't need the import features of the AR, and quite frankly, I think that thing is really ugly and ruins the aesthetic of the system.
I just ordered a Saturn and have been raiding the local retro shops of their controllers and accessories. It's my gaming blind spot and I'm having a lot of fun already learning of all the wacky specialized controllers.
Is there a combo RAM cart / memory cart other than the Action Replay? I won't need the import features of the AR, and quite frankly, I think that thing is really ugly and ruins the aesthetic of the system.
I think there are, but none match the utility of the 4-in-1 yet.
The cart is ugly as sin, so I dismantled mine, removed the label, sanded it down and then sprayed it matte black. It looked a lot better in the NA Saturn after that.
Not entirely so, I've played more than enough classic games in emulators to know what they look like pixel-perfect. So sure I don't know how different it'd look on a TV, as I said, but I wasn't counting emulation there.
Eh, I kinda see where Falcon's coming from. (Though I am a bit befuddled about using RF for the SMS, since I believe it uses the same composite cable as the OG Genesis.)
My Genesis is a Genesis 2, not a Genesis 1. Different cables.
Myself, I try to obtain the highest native, (North American) out-of-the-box audio/video quality for each of the systems. I'm not terribly interested in going RGB/Scart/Framemeister/etc. It's not worth the investment to me right now, and I'd rather concentrate on expanding my library. But I do at least keep a couple CRT TVs on hand for older systems. And all the audio does go thru my receiver/speaker system, since I really enjoy the music/sound.
I agree that the expense of all that modding definitely doesn't seem worth it to me. Maybe someday I'll get S-Video cables for the older consoles that support that, and the s-video cables I'd need to add s-video output to those composite/s-video switchboxes, but so far I haven't done that.
The cart is ugly as sin, so I dismantled mine, removed the label, sanded it down and then sprayed it matte black. It looked a lot better in the NA Saturn after that.
Not entirely so, I've played more than enough classic games in emulators to know what they look like pixel-perfect. So sure I don't know how different it'd look on a TV, as I said, but I wasn't counting emulation there.
I wasn't talking about emulation at all? Emulation looks quite different than RGB CRT though, and playing on the real console is all about the feels you can't have on a computer. And I maintain my statement: If you're happy like that it's great, as long as you are enjoying what you have you don't need to change a thing.
look, to each their own & all, but...most of ya'll don't really need to go framemeister to at least have a clean image.
$50 plus a few SCART cables from retro_console puts you at just under $100 i wanna say, and since we're in a saturn thread? let's not front like "expanding your library" gets you far with $100 right now. me, i've got more games right now than i'll ever have time to play, much less complete, so that's not much to make such a tremendous leap in picture quality.
again, it's your setup so do as you like, but we've got this very thread to shatter the illusion that you need to spend a ton of money to have games look good/proper. if that's not a high priority for you, fair enough, but it can be done without breaking the bank.
Blurgh. My mancave (room, lol) can't handle anymore monitors and cables. I'd have to get rid of an arcade cabinet to make space, and I don't know if I'm ready to do that. As it is, my hobby has also bled into the dining area, living room, and bedroom. My partner's a saint for putting up with it, but I don't want to push my luck too far.
Blurgh. My mancave (room, lol) can't handle anymore monitors and cables. I'd have to get rid of an arcade cabinet to make space, and I don't know if I'm ready to do that. As it is, my hobby has also bled into the dining area, living room, and bedroom. My partner's a saint for putting up with it, but I don't want to push my luck too far.
Playing it with composite now will make the better video signal's strengths (and weaknesses, at least when it comes to mesh transparencies) all the more apparent when you eventually upgrade.
I won't have my framemeister for another two weeks but I'll give it a try in blurr-o-vision.
