Cant a man dream though?
Maybe not bought outright, but something like the deal Nintendo did with DeNa, that they get big stakes in each others companies, and start working together out of mutual interest.
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Sega Saturn Appreciation and Emulation Thread
- Thread starter Seik
- Start date
Cant a man dream though?
Maybe not bought outright, but something like the deal Nintendo did with DeNa, that they get big stakes in each others companies, and start working together out of mutual interest.
ResidentDante
Member
For the sake of it:
Thanks for this! Interesting to know!
Sure, it's a twisted dream though
D.Lo
Member
I've never actually seen a USA Saturn or game (PAL back in the day, Japanese only for the last 10+ years) so I guess I won out on Sega Rally!For the sake of it:
I always thought Sega on Nintendo made the most sense. They'd fill Nintendo's gaps (fighting, racing, 'mid-mature' games like Panzer Dragoon and Jet Set Radio) and Sonic has always sold best on Nintendo ever since they went 3P.
Instead VF was lost behind its inferior rival Tekken on PS.
socksfelloff
Member
A man can dream but the only reason both companies were so strong is because they were competitors.
Not that I wanted it, but I have a US SEGA Rally. I bought another game from over there years ago, and the seller just added it to the parcel. I never asked them about it, as I didn't want to send back to another continent a $2 game in a shattered case (it was sent broken, there was no pieces in the box). Never played it either because of the save file incompatibility.
Yeah, but during the late 90s both of them were kinda loosing the competition to Sony (and later, MS), so it would have made sense to team up in a way, since they were also both dedicated games-companies.
socksfelloff
Member
I dunno man. Both companies are in somewhat similar positions for the exact same reason. Both companies refused to get their heads out of their asses and pay attention to the way the game industry was changing.
Sega has a storied history with miss management from Sega Japan that caused them to tank long before nintendo.
Nintendo is Fortunate they have DS/Wii money. Had those consoles sold luke warm like every home system they've released since the SNES I think we would see them in a similar state as SEGA during the 6th generation.
I just can't see 90s SEGA and 90s Nintendo working well together.
2016 humble SEGA and humble( hopefully) Nintendo can do great things!
Even teaming up the disadvantages against Sony would still remain the same.
Would Nintendo and Sega teaming up suddenly make them control the cost of hardware as well as Sony which is an electronic conglomerate?
Would Nintendo and Sega teaming up suddenly make their system more desirable for third-party instead of going for the console manufacturer which for historic reason (they weren't really a game company) give priority to third-party?
Would Nintendo and Sega teaming up suddenly opened up their penetration in the fractured european market to compete with Sony which was already established in every country since they were already selling other electronic products?
Would made sense for cash rich Nintendo to buy cash strapped Sega? For which IPs?
Nintendo never had problem to produce hit software.
I dunno the only reason one would dream of a union between Nintendo and Sega is for nostalgia purpose.
They were similar in that both were console manufacturers which operated with the old assumption that a strong first party is needed to lead the spreading of a system since both are gaming company but I fail to see what advantage a synergy between them would have brought to the table.
I think VF4 was meant to be multiplatform (including even Dreamcast) before Sony made some deal with Sega. Shame, the GC and Xbox versions would have looked much closer to the arcades.
sixteen-bit
Member
I still remember playing vf4 in the arcades for the first time and realizing the ps2 had to make visual compromises. Game looked stunning.
Good points all around, guess its just me loving both of them (and not particularly caring for the direction the game industry have went in under Sonys influence), and wanting their game philosophy to prosper, that lies behind the dream, more than any logic or arguments.
D.Lo
Member
Exactly right, Sony had some massive institutional advantages, having already been an electronics manufacturer with worldwide presence.
I think Sega would have done better with a more Nintendo focus as a 3P however. Their Gamecube games (Sonic, Monkey Ball) sold very well, and their Xbox games sold very poorly. Instead of doubling down on the Gamecube, they made Sonic and Monkey Ball multi-platform. Xbox got Panzer Dragoon, Gamecube got Billy Fucking Hatcher lol. GC felt very much like the Dreamcast 2 to me too, small quiet console, clean image quality. For me personally, PAL Xbox had shit IQ (blurry filtered 480i only even via component), I was so pissed playing Sega games on it while Sonic Adventure 2 looked so crisp on component GC.
Yeah I think Gamecube was more of a Dreamcast successor than the Xbox, if you look at Dreamcast's best selling games:
1.) Sonic Adventure - Gamecube had more Sonic games and they sold better on GC too.
2.) Soul Calibur - Both got SC2, but the GC version sold more
3.) Crazy Taxi - GC got a port of the first game, Xbox got the sequel.
4.) Shenmue - Sequel came to Xbox, but iirc it didn't do well? I could be wrong.
5.) RE: Code Veronica - Gamecube was basically the RE system of that generation
Then there's the Sega Sports games, which to be fair actually did do better on the Xbox.
1.) Sonic Adventure - Gamecube had more Sonic games and they sold better on GC too.
2.) Soul Calibur - Both got SC2, but the GC version sold more
3.) Crazy Taxi - GC got a port of the first game, Xbox got the sequel.
4.) Shenmue - Sequel came to Xbox, but iirc it didn't do well? I could be wrong.
5.) RE: Code Veronica - Gamecube was basically the RE system of that generation
Then there's the Sega Sports games, which to be fair actually did do better on the Xbox.
D.Lo
Member
I've never given a crap about licensed sports games, and they were very USA focused. They weren't 'real' Sega games either, just a US studio Sega bought.
Well, Soul Calibur and Resident Evil aren't Sega games either, but I included them since they were two of Dreamcast's defining titles, and they were definitely more Gamecube-centric than Xbox.
As far as this 5th gen goes, it would have been more interesting to see how it would had Sony not joined. I think Nintendo would have won, but I don't think the Saturn would have entirely bled out the market either, especially with Japanese developers preferring CD's.
As far as this 5th gen goes, it would have been more interesting to see how it would had Sony not joined. I think Nintendo would have won, but I don't think the Saturn would have entirely bled out the market either, especially with Japanese developers preferring CD's.
D.Lo
Member
As Celine mentioned, Sony really used their existing network to consolidate Europe in a way Nintendo and Sega wouldn't have at that point.
Sega would likely have won Japan quite easily. One of the big stories of the gen was that Japanese developers wanted CDs, so Square would surely have gone with the Saturn. Many PS1 sales driving hits started as Saturn games (Resident Evil, Tomb Raider) so it would have done quite well worldwide too.
Nintendo would have easily won the US. They did actually win the US for three years against Sony, it was just Sony's headstart and unprecedented sales tail (a huge chunk of PS1s were sold AFTER the PS2 was out!) that meant they eventually dominated in the final numbers.
socksfelloff
Member
What dreamcast were you using? That little fan is louder then a slayer concert. Not to mention that legendary dreamcast Lazer.
I agree with everything else though. Love the DC and GC.
D.Lo
Member
My PAL DC is quiet.
There are ones with louder fans, earlier models I think have a metal fan that gets noisy after a couple of years. They can be replaced.
Shadow Hog
Member
Mine's definitely a noisy one. It's not quite vacuum cleaner levels of obnoxious, but if that thing's on, you sure as hell know it from sound alone.
Lol, yep. Am I a heathen for preferring it to the standard Model 2? And haven't played DBZ personally.
It's terrible. You're much better off with Shin butoden imo.
I'd grab one; they look and feel great. I got it mint boxed with Magic Carpet...definitely not one of my favourite Saturn games, lol.
I don't think I've played the PS1 version since the 90's, but the Saturn version seems like a good port to me. It has some minor loading but nothing too bad. I definitely noticed a fair amount of slowdown in the Super Street Fighter games on Disc 1 though.
Barkley's Justice
Member
Yea but, like, Xbox got the original titles:
Gun Valkyrie
Otogi 1 & 2
Spikeout
Then of course significant sequels (regardless of sales or reviews):
Panzer Dragoon Orta
Toe Jam & Earl 3
Crazy Taxi 2
Jet Set Radio Future
And a bunch more right? Sega made a huge bet on Xbox inititally. When it didn't work out sales-wise, they diversified to Gamecube and PS2. But Xbox was still around before Sega dissolved all of its internal teams and that to me felt like the last genuine hurrah of the Dreamcast era.
Well some of those games weren't done internally by Sega (ToeJam & Earl, Otogi, and SpikeOut). Also the SpikeOut game was actually a sequel to an arcade game made by Nagoshi's team.
But you do raise some good points.I guess GC feels more Dreamcast-centric while Xbox feels more Sega-centric for me, if that makes sense? For example, one of the titles you list is Panzer Dragoon Orta, which obviously I do associate with Sega, but not with the Dreamcast.
But you do raise some good points.I guess GC feels more Dreamcast-centric while Xbox feels more Sega-centric for me, if that makes sense? For example, one of the titles you list is Panzer Dragoon Orta, which obviously I do associate with Sega, but not with the Dreamcast.
alf717
Member
A noisy Dreamcast is a healthy Dreamcast.
Speaking of healthy DCs. I have couple that have trouble reading discs. Both are 00 models with a Yamaha drives. Both consoles were rusted up like crazy and it was a project and half just to clean em up. Sadly the original Yamaha drives were beyond repair. I put a Samsung drive in that I swore worked but now it won't read discs.
Shadow Hog
Member
I kind of want to get Magic Carpet, despite already owning it on PC and PSN. Watching Dad play that game was a pretty big part of my childhood, and it's still pretty fun to play, if not that fun to 100% (killing rival wizards has to be the most tedious thing, especially on a controller).
Main reason would have been that for how things has turn out that generation it was always Sony who aggressively tried to undercut the rivals any time they could.
Sony was the one constantly dictating price cuts which was a painful practice for Sega because Saturn wasn't really designed to be cost efficient.
When Nintendo was releasing the N64, the price was planned to be US$ 249 but then Sony cut the price on PS1 to US$ 199 yet again therefore Nintendo had to price match (which they could because N64 was a cost efficient design due also to the lack of the CD rom subsystem).
Sega was simply unprepared to counter/survive such a aggressive strategy by Sony.
I don't think so unless you are talking launch aligned.
I think it may be better on other platforms as the graphics and framerate were fairly rough on Saturn IMO, but I'm sure there's a cool game in there somewhere. Happy to sell mine, but not sure if you have any interest in the package without the controller.
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTA2NlgxNjAw/z/VUsAAOSwYGFUwhnX/$_12.JPG
Shadow Hog
Member
I was probably gonna opt for the NTSC-U version, though I appreciate the offer regardless.
Also wasn't aware it was sold as a bundle with the white analog controller. That's interesting...
Also wasn't aware it was sold as a bundle with the white analog controller. That's interesting...
No worries. And yeah, looks like those were the only two games bundled with it according to here:
http://segaretro.org/3D_Control_Pad#Release
http://segaretro.org/images/0/0b/Patent_US7488254.pdf
Damn, If you all wondered why the cable was detachable, SEGA had some grand plan for their controller. You can see the precursor to the Dreamcast VMU in some of them. Others though...
D.Lo
Member
Launch aligned N64 would destroy PS1 for three years, as PS1 had a very slow start by comparison.
I believe Nintendo sold more hardware and software (first+third party) for at least two years in the US (97/98), I read in some magazine that 99 was a tie.
The comparisons are somewhat muddied however, Nintendo made far, far more revenue over that period in games, because such a huge percentage of the software sold was their own, whereas Sony only had hardware plus licensing fees.
Ouch, why would you bring such bloodshed in here?
I am a Vita owner.
And interesting insight into the controller, Khaz. Certainly one of my favourites.
I love Astra SS.
Not sure the RAM cart hugely improves the game, though. I always read it was more like a Pocket Fighter/Cotton kinda thing, rather than a Marvel Super Heroes vs SF. I should definitely dust it off, it's ages I don't play that game.
D.Lo
Member
Nope. But then the Game Gear outsold the Saturn too.
As far as hardware units sold is considered N64 outsold PS1 on a monthly basis in US from September 1996 to August 1997 (NPD).
Then PS1 consistently outsold N64.
And Vita too
