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[FeralEcho]

The last dreadful gasps of Snyder’s DCEU shitting their way through theatres this year. The reboot can’t come soon enough… and should have come years ago.

This is not Snyder's DCEU Snyder's DCEU ended when Joss Whedon destroyed Justice League with his garbage marvel jokes and fucking rainbow filters.The only problem with Snyder's vision is that WB didn't even let him start the damn thing properly.

It's good you guys are excited for Gunn's reboot.It's all looking very exciting,that's why even Ben Affleck wanted a part in it....until he actually didn't literally days ago after he saw the disaster Gunn is creating but I'm sure it's all going well...no worries...It's not like they're following the current Marvel model of multimedia connections which is going so well for them and didn't actually release critical bomb after critical bomb....oh wait...

I am going to thoroughly enjoy watching this disaster unfold.I genuinely couldn't care any less for WB after the way they treated the Snyderverse and the actors involved.In a way they deserve lunatics like Ezra Miller and Amber Heard for their treatment of Cavill,Affleck and Fisher.I look forward to see this house of shit they build crash and burn on top of these shit executives.You reap what you sow after all.

 

[FunkMiller]

This is not Snyder's DCEU Snyder's DCEU ended when Joss Whedon destroyed Justice League with his garbage marvel jokes and fucking rainbow filters.The only problem with Snyder's vision is that WB didn't even let him start the damn thing properly.

It's good you guys are excited for Gunn's reboot.It's all looking very exciting,that's why even Ben Affleck wanted a part in it....until he actually didn't literally days ago after he saw the disaster Gunn is creating but I'm sure it's all going well...no worries...It's not like they're following the current Marvel model of multimedia connections which is going so well for them and didn't actually release critical bomb after critical bomb....oh wait...

I am going to thoroughly enjoy watching this disaster unfold.I genuinely couldn't care any less for WB after the way they treated the Snyderverse and the actors involved.In a way they deserve lunatics like Ezra Miller and Amber Heard for their treatment of Cavill,Affleck and Fisher.I look forward to see this house of shit they build crash and burn on top of these shit executives.You reap what you sow after all.

I'm not excited for Gunn's reboot. Because it's half-assed reboot.

The only decent thing DC have done in years is The Batman and Joker - and the last time they actually had a winning ongoing movie strategy was with Nolan's movies.

Snyder was awful. What came after him was awful. Gunn's reboot will probably be awful. Because the problem is too deep seated in the studio (who were dumb enough to put Snyder in charge in the first place).

Also, you do know Snyder cast Ezra Miller, don't you?

 

[NinjaBoiX]

It looks terrible in the trailers.

They put some old Eminem tune on there? Way to make your movie look completely out of touch and dated right out of the gate…

 

[Goalus]

Who would have thought.

 

[Tams]

Lol, Synder fanboi detected.

I'd argue his shite is worse because he tries to be serious, yet still makes cheesy films.

At least Whedon and Gunn have no real pretences about what kind of directors/producers they are.

 

[AJUMP23]

My 8 year old wants to see this.

 

[ReBurn]

My 8 year old wants to see this.

I sat next to some kids about that age last night. They did ok. This one has a few scenes that I thought were just violent and shocking enough to earn it the PG-13 rating, just a bit moreso than the first.

 

[Twinblade]

I simply enjoyed it, it's not the typical dark DC bullcrap from DC and marvel.

 

[FunkMiller]

Jesus. That's 125 million for the film, plus 105 million for the advertising. The movie would need well over $400 million just to break even.

It won't even reach 200 million.

Massive loss for Warner Bros.

 

[Blade2.0]

Just saw it, I liked it. Better than black Adam. It wasn't as good as Shazam 1 though.

 

[Revolutionary]

Movie isn't as good as the first one (which was surprisingly great - it felt like a hard PG-13 that we used to get back in the 90s), but it's still better written and directed than most MCU movies. Much like the first one, it was sometimes dark, clever, funny, and had a lot of heart. That "Wisdom of Saruman" line made me laugh harder than it had any right to

6.5/10

That said, it was a missed opportunity to not follow up on that Mister Mind tease from the first movie, because I would have loved to see where that goes.

Edit: I just realized that the guy who calls him Captain Marvel is the actual guy who played Billy Batson in the 70s TV show. That's amazing.

 

[Doom85]

Funny enough, now the Rotten Tomatoes audience score is a few points higher for this one than the prior one.

I personally preferred the first one. But this one was still fun. Just like the first one, I like how most of the film will be light hearted but then a few specific scenes will go super dark. Very 80’s kids films vibes.

Spoiler

Also, bless Mark Strong for coming back briefly purely for such a cruel joke. I love that Mister Mind never came back for years to give him an update and is super unapologetic about it.

I know some will call the usage of Wonder Woman a dues ex machina, but she is an established part of the universe, it actually pays off Billy constantly thinking about her, and it was discussed earlier in the film that she does have god powers. Honestly, it’s nice to give Gal Gadot a send off just like Ben Affleck in The Flash (and Aquaman 2? Yeah, still confused by that unless the movie says it is set before the Flash movie). Shame Cavill’s final appearance was wasted on setting up a match no one asked for (Dwayne Johnson knows Black Adam is Shazam’s antagonist, why did he push for setting him against Superman?) and we’ll never see.

 

[FunkMiller]

Funny enough, now the Rotten Tomatoes audience score is a few points higher for this one than the prior one.

Unfortunately, that’s probably more down to the fact that so few people are going to see it, that those who are going are more predisposed to enjoy it. I doubt it would be higher if it reached the 10,000 plus reviews the first film has, instead of only a thousand.

 

[Doom85]

Unfortunately, that’s probably more down to the fact that so few people are going to see it, that those who are going are more predisposed to enjoy it. I doubt it would be higher if it reached the 10,000 plus reviews the first film has, instead of only a thousand.

I mean, you could say that about any film. A person going to see a film because the trailer or something else made them feel it was likely worth checking out means they are predisposed to enjoy it.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

Good to hear. The more these things bomb the less they make. I'm also not surprised to see the last remnants of synders dc universe whimper like the sad dog it always was. It was never good.

 

[DeafTourette]

Gawd it’s time for this era of movies to end

6-7 superhero movies in ONE year in a SEA of non-superhero movies is too much for you? If it is, just stop watching movies.

 

[Raven117]

6-7 superhero movies in ONE year in a SEA of non-superhero movies is too much for you? If it is, just stop watching movies.

You know good damn well the superhero movies have taken up a lot of the mindshare of Hollywood. Whether that matters, i don’t know.

 

[DeafTourette]

You know good damn well the superhero movies have taken up a lot of the mindshare of Hollywood. Whether that matters, i don’t know.

To make money... And yet movies like Tár, The Whale, Top Gun Maverick and more are still being made and some like Top Gun and Avatar 2 are making over a billion dollars!

 

[Raven117]

To make money... And yet movies like Tár, The Whale, Top Gun Maverick and more are still being made and some like Top Gun and Avatar 2 are making over a billion dollars!

Avatar 2 and Top gun 2 are somewhat unique. No?

Just saying, sick of the mindshare these dumb superhero movies take up. Whether it’s affecting other movies being made (of course they are just due to the amount of money being thrown at them).

It doesn’t ultimately affect me much. I recognize that. Nor does my opinion on this matter. It just…. It feels so cynical to me at this point.

 

[Bragr]

6-7 superhero movies in ONE year in a SEA of non-superhero movies is too much for you? If it is, just stop watching movies.

Wow wow wow, hold on. If there were 7 Knives Out movies every year and they all sucked, and they dominated social media every few months, and you had hordes of Knives Out fans discussing it all over the internet, you wouldn't be sick of it? come on. We are living through the worst era of movies maybe ever.

 

[DeafTourette]

Wow wow wow, hold on. If there were 7 Knives Out movies every year and they all sucked, and they dominated social media every few months, and you had hordes of Knives Out fans discussing it all over the internet, you wouldn't be sick of it? come on. We are living through the worst era of movies maybe ever.

I sense a bit of hyperbole ...

The difference between your hypothetical example and actual reality is that each superhero movie is different. Sure, the hero keeps coming out the winner (99% of the time) and defeats the bad guy... But the stories are different, the characters are different, the specific outcomes are different, the sub-genres are different... Knives Out is always a murder mystery with a twist of some kind with the same main protagonist.

I get it, YOU don't like them but more than a few people DO ... Or did you think Iron Man through Endgame were all horrible movies? I've enjoyed almost every Marvel movie (2 or 3 exceptions) and MOST DCEU movies (birds of prey and WW84 sucked spider butt).

So 6-7 superhero movies is fine PER YEAR as they're mostly all different stories and sub-genres. That's different from 6-7 Knives Out movies. And I think you KNOW that.

 

[Bragr]

I sense a bit of hyperbole ...

The difference between your hypothetical example and actual reality is that each superhero movie is different. Sure, the hero keeps coming out the winner (99% of the time) and defeats the bad guy... But the stories are different, the characters are different, the specific outcomes are different, the sub-genres are different... Knives Out is always a murder mystery with a twist of some kind with the same main protagonist.

I get it, YOU don't like them but more than a few people DO ... Or did you think Iron Man through Endgame were all horrible movies? I've enjoyed almost every Marvel movie (2 or 3 exceptions) and MOST DCEU movies (birds of prey and WW84 sucked spider butt).

So 6-7 superhero movies is fine PER YEAR as they're mostly all different stories and sub-genres. That's different from 6-7 Knives Out movies. And I think you KNOW that.

They are nowhere near as different as you make them out to be, its different settings and actors, but they all fit into each other and all of them are about superpowered beings with similar contexts and themes.

Dont start with the entire "Doctor Strange 2 is a horror movie, The Eternals is a sci-fi movie bla bla bla", cause that is absolute bullshit.

Its like if they made 7 Knives Out movies in 7 different parts of the world with a few different actors. Its still the same shit redone over and over.

 

[AmuroChan]

Jesus. That's 125 million for the film, plus 105 million for the advertising. The movie would need well over $400 million just to break even.

It won't even reach 200 million.

Massive loss for Warner Bros.

Yep, more validation that the old regime was completely clueless. Making a Shazam movie to start with was dumb enough, but to greenlight a sequel when the original made no money is just pure ineptitude.

 

[ReBurn]

Yep, more validation that the old regime was completely clueless. Making a Shazam movie to start with was dumb enough, but to greenlight a sequel when the original made no money is just pure ineptitude.

The first one made $74m in net profit. That's why a second one got the green light.

 

[AmuroChan]

The first one made $74m in net profit. That's why a second one got the green light.

And they're going to lose more than $74m with the sequel. So congrats WB!

 

[Doom85]

Avatar 2 and Top gun 2 are somewhat unique. No?

Just saying, sick of the mindshare these dumb superhero movies take up. Whether it’s affecting other movies being made (of course they are just due to the amount of money being thrown at them).

It doesn’t ultimately affect me much. I recognize that. Nor does my opinion on this matter. It just…. It feels so cynical to me at this point.

Funny, to me Avatar 2 is the definition of cynicism. Fucking 13 years to make a sequel, and Cameron apparently only gives a shit about making the effects and such pop out, and not so much about making a memorable script or letting the editor do their job because heaven forbid this basic ass plot with a number of relevant characters you can count on two hands not be over three hours.

And sadly, this still gets butts in seats as the box office shows, but you know what? So did Bay’s Transformers films, which also prioritized effects over a good script and such. Funny enough, it took until the fifth film for audiences to catch on and the box office was far less, so maybe that’s why Cameron plans to make specifically four Avatar films. He looked at Bay’s films and were like, “ah okay, it takes five films before people figure out they’re being bullshitted.”

 

[ReBurn]

And they're going to lose more than $74m with the sequel. So congrats WB!

It is possible.

 

[AmuroChan]

And sadly, this still gets butts in seats as the box office shows, but you know what? So did Bay’s Transformers films, which also prioritized effects over a good script and such. Funny enough, it took until the fifth film for audiences to catch on and the box office was far less, so maybe that’s why Cameron plans to make specifically four Avatar films. He looked at Bay’s films and were like, “ah okay, it takes five films before people figure out they’re being bullshitted.”

Yes, but even though Transformers had fancy SFX, it wasn't actually doing anything groundbreaking in the visuals department like Avatar was. And while Avatar's plot was very basic, Transformers' plots are equivalent to 2nd grade level writing. The best Transformers movie was Bubblebee, and ironically that's the one that the fewest people went to see.

 

[Doom85]

Yes, but even though Transformers had fancy SFX, it wasn't actually doing anything groundbreaking in the visuals department like Avatar was.

The first Transformers was absolutely groundbreaking in special effects, like the Oscars giving Best Effects to Golden Compass had people in an uproar even if they hated Transformers. Like, actually look into the work that effects team did for that film, it was crazy, especially that shot when Optimus first transforms and you see inside him, like in 2007 that shit was mind blowing.

 

[AmuroChan]

The first Transformers was absolutely groundbreaking in special effects, like the Oscars giving Best Effects to Golden Compass had people in an uproar even if they hated Transformers. Like, actually look into the work that effects team did for that film, it was crazy, especially that shot when Optimus first transforms and you see inside him, like in 2007 that shit was mind blowing.

I just don't remember it being talked about in the same light as Avatar was. I thought the SFX in Transformers was cool, but it didn't change my life in anyway. If I remember correctly, Cameron literally worked on and developed brand new camera systems and visual effects technology for Avatar. That work was widely praised across the industry. I don't recall if Michael Bay had that same reaction from his peers on his work in Transformers.

 

[Doom85]

I just don't remember it being talked about in the same light as Avatar was. I thought the SFX in Transformers was cool, but it didn't change my life in anyway. If I remember correctly, Cameron literally worked on and developed brand new camera systems and visual effects technology for Avatar. That work was widely praised across the industry. I don't recall if Michael Bay had that same reaction from his peers on his work in Transformers.

Transformers (film) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Scroll down to the Effects portion. Those guys put in the work. 38 hours to render one frame of movement.

 

[AmuroChan]

Transformers (film) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Scroll down to the Effects portion. Those guys put in the work. 38 hours to render one frame of movement.

Again, I'm not saying Transformers' effects stink or that people didn't work har don the film. I'm just saying in terms of industry wide recognition, which would include industry awards, Avatar was more highly recognized.

 

[Doom85]

Again, I'm not saying Transformers' effects stink or that people didn't work har don the film. I'm just saying in terms of industry wide recognition, which would include industry awards, Avatar was more highly recognized.

But again, virtually everyone outside of those awards judges called them out on their bullshit.

 

[diffusionx]

I feel like the era of capeshit is coming to an end, God willing. Of course Batman and Spiderman will always make bank but it seems like you cant throw any asshole from a comic book onto the screen and make $400 million anymore.

 

[AmuroChan]

But again, virtually everyone outside of those awards judges called them out on their bullshit.

Well, the Academy has 10,000 members who vote on the Oscars. They are all members of Hollywood, including directors, actors, cinematographers, producers, etc. So if his own peers in the industry don't regard his work that highly, maybe Michael Bay needs to ask his friends in the industry why. It's not for me to fight the battle for him.

 

[FunkMiller]

65 million global opening.



Won't even clear 150 million at the international box office.

A loss of over 150 million dollars for WBD very likely.

 

[Joramun]

The wife and I liked the first one.

Can't wait to see this instalment.

 

[Jinzo Prime]

It seems like people know when a continuty or series is coming to an end. This same thing happened to X-Men Dark Phoenix after it was clear the Fox movies were winding down. Guess people know when the reset button is about to be pressed.

 

[DeafTourette]

I'm glad we have comic movies. As a long time comic READER, this is a dream come true these last 20 years... And the interconnected UNIVERSES (Marvel and DC) are the cherry on top! It's like the books come to life!

 

[Doom85]

It seems like people know when a continuty or series is coming to an end. This same thing happened to X-Men Dark Phoenix after it was clear the Fox movies were winding down. Guess people know when the reset button is about to be pressed.

Which is annoying because Shazam’s continuity might mostly carry over. Gunn has only ruled out Cavill (and probably Affleck) returning. Hell, we know Viola Davis as Amanda Waller, and presumably some of the Peacemaker team are carrying over (possibly John Cena as Peacemaker as well, we’ll have to see). Also, Aquaman 2 coming out after Flash might indicate Momoa is staying but we’ll have to see, it’s possible the film is set before the reset.

After all, when Barry changes time, as we see in the trailer, some things do stay consistent, like General Zod. So when he presumably changes time again at the end of his film, the same logic works, some things change but some stay the same. This will be consistent with the Flashpoint comic the movie is based on, where when Barry went back in time (first to save his mom, and then again to try to undo the damage that action caused) it brought in the New 52 continuity that (somewhat) retained the continuities of Batman and Green Lantern that had begun in the Post Crisis continuity which preceded the New 52 continuity.

 

[Raven117]

Funny, to me Avatar 2 is the definition of cynicism. Fucking 13 years to make a sequel, and Cameron apparently only gives a shit about making the effects and such pop out, and not so much about making a memorable script or letting the editor do their job because heaven forbid this basic ass plot with a number of relevant characters you can count on two hands not be over three hours.

And sadly, this still gets butts in seats as the box office shows, but you know what? So did Bay’s Transformers films, which also prioritized effects over a good script and such. Funny enough, it took until the fifth film for audiences to catch on and the box office was far less, so maybe that’s why Cameron plans to make specifically four Avatar films. He looked at Bay’s films and were like, “ah okay, it takes five films before people figure out they’re being bullshitted.”

Never even saw the first one. But yeah, I hear ya.

It’s all bullshit.

 

[tkscz]

I wanted to clarify my issue with the villains of the movie. In the first movie, they pulled off the family parallel between Billy and Sivana perfectly. The boy without a family holding on to the hopes of finding one and feeling whole vs the man with a family who held him back and mistreated him. The boy is placed with a family he ignores because he believes he can find his real family and be happy, the man grows to hate his family more and more and makes no attempt at reconciliation. The boy finds his real family but it's nothing like what he though and leads him to realize the given family would "fill that hole" in his life, while the man kills his family and still doesn't feel satisfied. Their parallel is what made them fighting in the end have meaning, especially when Billy shares the power of SHAZAM with his family.

Spoiler

In the second movie, the parallel is broken by one person, the eldest sister Hespera. The attempt here was that Billy being afraid he'd lose his family, held them too close and didn't want them doing things outside of being a family unit causing friction between him and the family, while it would seem like the daughters of Atlas are one unit as a family. However, thanks to Anne, we know there is some friction between the sisters, and while Billy feels like the family isn't a unit, the rest of the family see themselves otherwise as they are used to allowing each other to live their own lives without feeling the others will leave (Billy isn't used to that so it makes sense). Anne makes her stance very clear. She's willing to fall in love with a human and even wanted to save him from her sisters (would've been better had we been given a reason she feels so vastly different but what we get still works). Kalypso makes her stance clear from the beginning, seeing killing and torturing people as fun and being more aggressive about it than Hespera, so her stance is clear as well. Hespera stance seemed clear at first, it was the same as Kalypso's, but that changes in the middle of the movie when the three sisters have the seed of life and staff back. Suddenly she went from revenge for my father to I just wanted his stuff back. There is a scene before that where she explains in detail that she feels her father was robbed, but in the beginning she murders a lot of people and clearly didn't have to and at this point kind of expresses that she doesn't want to. This breaks the parallel because what we learn about both elder sisters is not what we end up getting, so when Hespera suddenly gets stabbed by Kalypso, it doesn't feel right. Like their disagreement came in too late in the movie and messes with the family dynamic parallel. Thing is though, Anne and Kalypso work wonderfully. Even though I called she'd be a sister, it still worked for me that one of the sisters didn't want to hurt anyone and the other wanted everyone to die. What would've made it better is if in the beginning scene, Kalypso caused her chaos but Hespera or turned the people directly in her way to stone. You'd get a better idea that she only wants the staff and seed and couldn't care less about humanity. So when Kalypso and Anne try to convince Hespera to choose one of their sides, Hespera's conflict would make more since and cause what looks to be a held together family unit, to be a split family with differing goals that could cause in fighting.

Longer than I thought that would be but I still enjoyed the movie. Sucks it's not doing so well in theaters.

 

[Revolutionary]

It seems like people know when a continuty or series is coming to an end. This same thing happened to X-Men Dark Phoenix after it was clear the Fox movies were winding down. Guess people know when the reset button is about to be pressed.

Dark Phoenix is just a bad movie, though. I don't know what Fox was thinking when they decided to give the guy who wrote The Last Stand (the worst X-Men movie up until DP) another chance at writing AND directing a Dark Phoenix movie.

Shazam, on the other hand, are not bad movies by ANY means. They both have very well-written scripts and are competently directed by someone who loves making movies (check out his YouTube channel - it has a ton of great insight into the movie-making process). I think most folk would enjoy the movies if they gave them a chance, but the problem is just that "Shazam" simply isn't a superhero most people recognize - to most people, Shazam is just an app on their phone. The fact that they keep being so indecisive with his name in the movies probably isn't helping, either. It makes for some funny moments for sure (for those that know, at least), but the average moviegoer probably still doesn't know that his name is actually Captain Marvel.

The Flash and Aquaman will do much better in the box office because the average moviegoer DOES know who they are. Blue Beetle, on the other hand, will probably bomb as well.


But anyway, it seems David F Sandberg is done with superhero movies for now and returning to horror, partly because he finds the fandom discourse online to be exhausting, so I expect lots of clickbaity articles about that. Can't blame him one bit - you only need to look at this very thread to see how exhausting online superhero discourse is. In any case, I look forward to what he does next.

 

[AmuroChan]

Dark Phoenix is just a bad movie, though. I don't know what Fox was thinking when they decided to give the guy who wrote The Last Stand (the worst X-Men movie up until DP) another chance at writing AND directing a Dark Phoenix movie.

Shazam, on the other hand, are not bad movies by ANY means. They both have very well-written scripts and are competently directed by someone who loves making movies (check out his YouTube channel - it has a ton of great insight into the movie-making process). I think most folk would enjoy the movies if they gave them a chance, but the problem is just that "Shazam" simply isn't a superhero most people recognize - to most people, Shazam is just an app on their phone. The fact that they keep being so indecisive with his name in the movies probably isn't helping, either. It makes for some funny moments for sure (for those that know, at least), but the average moviegoer probably still doesn't know that his name is actually Captain Marvel.

The Flash and Aquaman will do much better in the box office because the average moviegoer DOES know who they are. Blue Beetle, on the other hand, will probably bomb as well.

You can do a movie on a lesser known character if the universe is well established and the films leading up to that point were well received. If the early MCU movies were all terrible, Guardians of the Galaxy would have gotten lackluster buzz too, but because the MCU has earned the trust of its audience, they can make movies about lesser characters and still be successful. The DCEU was a mess right from the beginning with MoS (a film that I actually liked), and it never got better. Now that the DCEU is winding down, it's hard to motivate people to flock to the theaters to watch a Shazam 2.

 

[LaughingStock]

I think it's time to let the super hero genre rest for a while.

 

[Bragr]

I wanted to clarify my issue with the villains of the movie.

It's a bunch of old women and it looks stupid as fuck. The end.

 

[Jinzo Prime]

You can do a movie on a lesser known character if the universe is well established and the films leading up to that point were well received. If the early MCU movies were all terrible, Guardians of the Galaxy would have gotten lackluster buzz too, but because the MCU has earned the trust of its audience, they can make movies about lesser characters and still be successful. The DCEU was a mess right from the beginning with MoS (a film that I actually liked), and it never got better. Now that the DCEU is winding down, it's hard to motivate people to flock to the theaters to watch a Shazam 2.

I've heard some people say Shazam or Antman 3 are doing poorly because of lack of name recognition. GotG were D-tier at best before the Gunn movies. And nobody expected Aquaman to clear a billion at the box office. Shazam 1 was good, but DCEU has been so consistently terrible their is no way to generate hype for these last few films before the reset.

And Zachary Levy is no Jason Mamoa. As in, he dosen't bring in female fans to come see him shirtless.

 

[Blade2.0]

Let's be real, the movie was sent to die. They've announced they were going to can most of the DCEU actors before this even released and have basically said the Flash was setting up for the revival. I quite liked Shazam 2. And it don't hurt that Ortega and Liu were hot as shit in it, either.

 

[FunkMiller]

I've heard some people say Shazam or Antman 3 are doing poorly because of lack of name recognition. GotG were D-tier at best before the Gunn movies. And nobody expected Aquaman to clear a billion at the box office. Shazam 1 was good, but DCEU has been so consistently terrible their is no way to generate hype for these last few films before the reset.

Yeah, that's bullshit. Ant-man did badly because people are fed up with Disney's endless factory production line of 'content' and Shazam 2 failed because people are fed up with the endless shit DCEU movies.

 

[Liamario]

If they keep Shazam while getting rid of Henry Cavill, I'll be pissed.