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[Synbios459]

I was watching Icons, and they were talking about the history of Donkey Kong. Anyway, when they got to talking about DKC an IGN guy and some other guy were talking about how they thought it sucked really bad (The IGN guy saying it sucked was no surprise) One of the guys said the developer of DKC, and Miyamoto met and he said Miyamoto hated the game, and even said something to the effect of "This just proves that Americans will buy anything.".

So I ask: Did Miyamoto REALLY hate the game, or is it pure PR BS?

 

[JackFrost2012]

If so +1 Miyamoto

Donkey Kong Country is a piece of TRASH!

 

[Alcibiades]

it's true...

 

[Spike]

I actually remember reading about this way back. I don't know if it's true or not, but it's interesting nonetheless.

 

[DopeyFish]

Donkey Kong Country rocked :/

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Hmmm...sounds like bullshit. Wouldn't Miyamoto have had a great degree of control over the final product at that time? In any case, it doesn't matter what Miyamoto thought, as the game sold millions and produced more million-selling sequels...and lots and lots of people love that series. I personally found those games to be too rudimentary compared to other platformers of the time.

 

[Slo]

DKC >>Dating Sims >>>>>>>>>Horse Racing Sims.

Yes. Stupid Americans.

 

[Spike]

Imagine if they never gave Rare the DK franchise to work on. We might've gotten a DK game like Yoshi's Island...

 

[CrunchyB]

I thought the Miyamoto/Rare Yoshi'd Island/DKC episode was common knowledge. Apparently Miyamoto caught some flack from Yamauchi & Co because their SMW sequel didn't look nearly as good as DKC. They had to re-do the graphics and Miyamoto was not happy about that.

Of course, in the end, it was all worth it

 

[AeroGod]

DKC >>Dating Sims >>>>>>>>>Horse Racing Sims.

Yes. Stupid Americans.

You forgot the mother load. TRAIN DRIVING SIMS
WOOHOO

 

[deadhorse32]

Of course, in the end, it was all worth it

yeah Yoshi'd Island still looks beautiful meanwhile DKC looks like shit.

 

[Alcibiades]

yeah Yoshi'd Island still looks beautiful meanwhile DKC looks like shit.

my thoughts exactly...

art graphics > technical graphics...

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

dkc rocked and anyone who thinks differently is wrong

 

[Synbios459]

Wow, I'm really surprised, I wonder if Miyamoto-san still feels that way? I would've understood it had he said that after DK64 was released though. BTW, on a semi-related note, everytime I've seen an interview with Miyamoto-san, he always speaks Japanese. Does he ever speak English?

 

[binary]

I seriously can't believe the backlash on DKC today. When this game was released everyone was singing its' praises. Now people love to hate this game. Sure, the game isn't quite as amazing today as it was 10 years ago, but it is still great for its' time. I also don't understand why GBA versions of DKC scored so very low. Reviewers said the game had aged badly, but I didn't notice anything. Great game is you ask me.

 

[ge-man]

This is no secret. I think Steve Kent even wrote about this episode in Game Over. Miyamoto was certainly not a fan of Rare. The whole DKC thing and the flak that Miyamoto's team got for Yoshi's Island when it failed to have the same flash put a sour taste in his mouth. I think I also read a rumour or comment that Mario 64 became a very important project for Miyamoto because he wanted to show Rare how to make a REAL game. I'm guessing that's just speculation, but I wouldn't be surprised that the whole thing pissed him off enough to encourage him to make one the most important games of the last generation.

 

[Baron Aloha]

He probably hated it because he didn't come up with the idea. DKC series = Rare's best work and some of the best games of the 16bit era.

 

[Rlan]

I seriously can't believe the backlash on DKC today. When this game was released everyone was singing its' praises. Now people love to hate this game. Sure, the game isn't quite as amazing today as it was 10 years ago, but it is still great for its' time. I also don't understand why GBA versions of DKC scored so very low. Reviewers said the game had aged badly, but I didn't notice anything. Great game is you ask me.

Rares ports are pretty wonky. Graphically they look washed out with the brightness WAY up. The sprites look resized too, maying them look petty crap.

 

[belgurdo]

If so +1 Miyamoto

Donkey Kong Country is a piece of TRASH!

The damage control is strong in this one

 

[Alcibiades]

actually, saying "he was not a fan or Rare" is going to far...

he didn't hate them and it was probably his decision to lend them the characters...

it's just probably that he was upset that a game like Yoshi's Island would be outsold because in his eyes people went for the graphical effects (and maybe he honestly didn't think the gameplay was good)...

In the N64 era, he said he liked that Nintendo worked with Rare, but that in a way considered "rivals", and that he would go nuts everytime he saw Banjo-Kazooie because of how good the game was turning out, he felt he had to match their quality...

it was healthy competition within Nintendo IMO, and that comment on DKC was probably him being honest...

 

[ge-man]

He probably hated it because he didn't come up with the idea. DKC series = Rare's best work and some of the best games of the 16bit era.

Really, from what I understand it had little to do with gameplay. This was happen just before the jump into 3D and everyone was seemingly falling in love with the whole pre-rendered look. I don't think Miyamoto cared until Nintendo executives told him and his group that they wanted Yoshi's Island to look as flashy as DKC.

 

[ge-man]

actually, saying "he was not a fan or Rare" is going to far...

he didn't hate them and it was probably his decision to lend them the characters...

it's just probably that he was upset that a game like Yoshi's Island would be outsold because in his eyes people went for the graphical effects (and maybe he honestly didn't think the gameplay was good)...

In the N64 era, he said he liked that Nintendo worked with Rare, but that in a way considered "rivals", and that he would go nuts everytime he saw Banjo-Kazooie because of how good the game was turning out, he felt he had to match their quality...

it was healthy competition within Nintendo IMO, and that comment on DKC was probably him being honest...

You're probably right. I sure it was more about health competition, but that Yoshi's Island scenario must've been some kind of a personal blow.

 

[Mrbob]

Didn't DKC also slap around Yoshi's Island in sales? I remember it being featured more prominently and oveshadowing YI. May be another reason why he is mad.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

rare sprayed water on the miyamoto cat, the end.


And i love ign they are so full of shit, you know they masturbated furiously over the game when they first got it.

 

[Alcibiades]

I seriously can't believe the backlash on DKC today. When this game was released everyone was singing its' praises. Now people love to hate this game. Sure, the game isn't quite as amazing today as it was 10 years ago, but it is still great for its' time. I also don't understand why GBA versions of DKC scored so very low. Reviewers said the game had aged badly, but I didn't notice anything. Great game is you ask me.

I LOVED tha game back then, it was fun and the graphics were cool, but when I look at it now, it really hasn't aged well (as opposed to Super Metroid which I can play over and over now and still hook me, and of course the timeless cutesy graphics of Yoshi's Island must have aged better for longtime gamers since they didn't depend on technical specs for graphics)...

 

[Laurent]

?_?

Then why would Nintendo produce Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat?! Does Miyamoto has something to do with that game?!

 

[Infinitemadness]

Wow, I wonder if it bothers him that the games are still around and being re-released in SP Form. Diddy and that DK's design are even here to stay.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

I LOVED tha game back then, it was fun and the graphics were cool, but when I look at it now, it really hasn't aged well (as opposed to Super Metroid which I can play over and over now and still hook me, and of course the timeless cutesy graphics of Yoshi's Island must have aged better for longtime gamers since they didn't depend on technical specs for graphics)...

dude if you go back to anything that was "GOOD" back then youll see the games havent aged well at all


case in point my mega man and sonic collections i got yesterday look like total shit (but are fun)

 

[ge-man]

?_?

Then why would Nintendo produce Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat?! Does Miyamoto has something to do with that game?!

Miyamoto doesn't hate Donkey Kong himself now if that's what your implying. I really think this is simply of case of his ego taking a hit with all the attention Rare was getting for moving to pre-rendered graphics and getting caught with the industry lust for 3D.

 

[ge-man]

dude if you go back to anything that was "GOOD" back then youll see the games havent aged well at all


case in point my mega man and sonic collections i got yesterday look like total shit (but are fun)

I'm not so sure about that. Yeah, NES games look harsh for the most part (there few well aged ones like Mario 3). But there are plenty of 16 Bit games that remain a feast for the eyes. I definately would consider efralope's example of Super Metroid as one. That game will never need an update.

 

[Alcibiades]

dude if you go back to anything that was "GOOD" back then youll see the games havent aged well at all


case in point my mega man and sonic collections i got yesterday look like total shit (but are fun)

I go back just about every summer to SNES, and believe me, there are some beautiful games from that era, that maybe even gotten BETTER with age sometimes...

Super Castlevania IV may be dated, but it's not ugly, and many of the RPG's don't need FMV, they stand on their art and gameplay just fine...

Super Metroid is the ultimate example though, it's still haunting, atmospheric, and super-good looking everytime I play it...

 

[tedtropy]

I was watching Icons, and they were talking about the history of Donkey Kong. Anyway, when they got to talking about DKC an IGN guy and some other guy were talking about how they thought it sucked really bad (from the IGN guy I wasn't surprised) and one of the guys even said the developer of it, and Miyamoto meet and he said Miyamoto hated the game, and even said something to the effect of "This just proves that Americans will buy anything.".

So I ask: Did Miyamoto REALLY hate the game, or is it pure PR BS?

To be fair, he said something more to the effect of "some Americans will buy any game so long as it has great graphics, even if it has mediocre gameplay". Which is, honestly, completely true. Gameplay wise, DKC was not a stellar game - fun for its time, but nothing phenomenal. What really captivated people about the game was the whole pre-rendered graphics thing that Rare pretty much pioneered on the SNES. DKC is a game that doesn't really age well.

 

[MetatronM]

?_?

Then why would Nintendo produce Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat?! Does Miyamoto has something to do with that game?!

Hey, I hate Donkey Kong Country, but I got to play Jungle Beat today and it was friggin' awesome.

 

[cvxfreak]

I dunno about any of you, but...

DKC > DK

 

[tedtropy]

I go back just about every summer to SNES, and believe me, there are some beautiful games from that era, that maybe even gotten BETTER with age sometimes...

Super Castlevania IV may be dated, but it's not ugly, and many of the RPG's don't need FMV, they stand on their art and gameplay just fine...

Super Metroid is the ultimate example though, it's still haunting, atmospheric, and super-good looking everytime I play it...

I agree completely about your statement concerning Super Metroid. The sheer attention to detail, the music, and just that generally creppy "you really are alone" feeling can still be appreciated with that game. The haunted spaceship level still gives me the willies...

 

[Mama Smurf]

To be fair, he said something more to the effect of "some Americans will buy any game so long as it has great graphics, even if it has mediocre gameplay". Which is, honestly, completely true. Gameplay wise, DKC was not a stellar game - fun for its time, but nothing phenomenal. What really captivated people about the game was the whole pre-rendered graphics thing that Rare pretty much pioneered on the SNES. DKC is a game that doesn't really age well.

I hear this a lot, but I didn't even play the game until years after it was out (it was some time after OoT, that's all I remember) so the graphics were nothing special to me, but I really enjoyed it.

I didn't enjoy the sequels though.

 

[Nerevar]

I personally found those games to be too rudimentary compared to other platformers of the time.

So true. I got ragged on for saying this when the games came out, but now at least I'm vindicated. Donkey Kong Country is garbage dressed up with pretty graphics that wowed everyone into thinking it was a decent game. The whole series just sucks.

 

[aku:jiki]

You forgot the mother load. TRAIN DRIVING SIMS
WOOHOO

That's such a retarded train of thought. He's saying DKC is a bad example of a genre, not that platformers suck. If you like horse racing I'm sure there's some awesome ones out there.

Also, Train Simulator Real and Densha de GO fucking rule.

 

[sprsk]

Yes DKC sucks. my girlfriend loves that shit though i dont really get it. The DK games werent even a quarter as good as the sonic games. Such linear poopy level design.

 

[Mama Smurf]

The music and minecarts were the best parts. Awesome.

 

[cja]

This is no secret. I think Steve Kent even wrote about this episode in Game Over.

Almost right, Steve Kent wrote about the incident in First Quarter (and then the updated with very handy index but awful cover and name "The Ultimate History of Video Games"). David Sheff wrote Game Over.

 

[ge-man]

Almost right, Steve Kent wrote about the incident in First Quarter (and then the updated with very handy index but awful cover and name "The Ultimate History of Video Games"). David Sheff wrote Game Over.

Thanks for the correction. I haven't read either book but knew that it was Kent that covered it.

 

[hirokazu]

if Miyamoto did say that, i'd disagree with him, i thought the DKC series was great, though Yoshi's Island is better, IMO.

 

[cja]

Thanks for the correction. I haven't read either book but knew that it was Kent that covered it.

This'll sound awful preachy but anyone who spends time at GAF should read both books. Take time out from reading this forum to peruse them and you'll get a far greater picture of the industry. Game Over because its a good Nintendo history 'till 93 and it gives a very good grounding in the business models that all three hardware companies still use today. Ultimate History of Videogames is just that, if you have any interest in the goings on of the pre-PS2 days then its a must buy as well.

edit: If anyone is interested in further reading then... those specifically interested in Xbox should pick-up "Opening the Xbox", for Sony Computer Entertainment "Revolutionaries at Sony" will do even though it is rather obscure and a poor translation from Japanese. For more background on the history of the US video game industry there is "Phoenix the Rise and Fall of Videogames" 3rd edition. Kobunheat would moan if he came across this post and I didn't mention "High Score!" 2nd edition, good history on computer games, unfortunately its a bit of a mish mash of piecemeal info on 80's American home computer companies with a bit of console info artificially added. Still recommended for those who loved their Interplay, Microprose and other companies of that ilk.

 

[Laurent]

Miyamoto doesn't hate Donkey Kong himself now if that's what your implying. I really think this is simply of case of his ego taking a hit with all the attention Rare was getting for moving to pre-rendered graphics and getting caught with the industry lust for 3D.

No, I'm implying that Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat is Donkey Kong Country 4 with a new peripheral for GameCube. He hated the fact that he wasn't responsable for Donkey Kong Country, he hated the fact that Donkey Kong Country used prerendered graphics or he hated the game itself?!?

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

No, I'm implying that Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat is Donkey Kong Country 4 with a new peripheral for GameCube. He hated the fact that he wasn't responsable for Donkey Kong Country, he hated the fact that Donkey Kong Country used prerendered graphics or he hated the game itself?!?

he hated the fact it bitch smacked his game at the time.


be glad we woulda gotten a shitty looking mario game instead of yoshis island.

 

[Espio]

It's true, I've been in the room when he's bitched about DKC.

 

[john2kx]

there isn't really anything wrong with DKC.. its problem is that there isn't really anything outstanding about it, aside from the graphics..

it's a decent platformer with weak art direction.

 

[Deleted member 284]

he hated the fact it bitch smacked his game at the time.


be glad we woulda gotten a shitty looking mario game instead of yoshis island.

Imagine that huge smiley throwing up rolleyed smilleys in this place

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

I thought the Miyamoto/Rare Yoshi'd Island/DKC episode was common knowledge. Apparently Miyamoto caught some flack from Yamauchi & Co because their SMW sequel didn't look nearly as good as DKC. They had to re-do the graphics and Miyamoto was not happy about that.

Of course, in the end, it was all worth it