Inquisitive_Ghost
Member
Yeah, you missed a ton of game.
Some demons are immune to certain ailments, which is a huge help on its own, and I'm almost certain there's a helmet in the game that nulls Panic.
And DDS's Hunger Wave is indeed bullshit.
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Shin Megami Tensei IV |EU OT| Atlus Shrugged
- Thread starter Samurai_Heart
- Start date
Some demons are immune to certain ailments, which is a huge help on its own, and I'm almost certain there's a helmet in the game that nulls Panic.
And DDS's Hunger Wave is indeed bullshit.
The boss you fought just before Kanji, Mahamayuri, is immune against ailments and also has Salvation which cures everything on top of fully healing your HP.
His fusion is unlocked after you beat him.
His fusion is unlocked after you beat him.
MrNineties
Member
Amazon.ca just hooked me up with the limited version game for a very very reasonable $25. I'm locking it into the XL as I speak. I'm sure I'll get some great insight from the 21 pages of discussion here. Sayonara!
-90s
-90s
lol
we have gone full circle.
Tizoc
Member
On the one hand I like it, on the other, it's needlessly...exaggerated...
I wouldn't recommend that.
Hard mode is bad imo, as it exacerbate all the bad balance of the game: ennemies almost always have the initiative, which in itself is bad enough. But couple with their higher and your lower damage, the game becomes very frustrating. And those compendium prices...
Tizoc
Member
Normal it is then :V
I don't know much of what can pass onto my NG+ playthrough so I'll find that out by the time I beat it.
I don't even want to think about that. Game is just so uneven, everything is easy, until you get ambushed or one of your Samurai-NPCs gives a boss a random smirk (smirking is stupid too, since enemy smirks occur with more certainty than yours) and everything goes to shit in one round. The only fight I had to redo a few times and really prepare a strategy for was a random demon domain with a Lv75 boss in it, me being at ~Lv25. It's just not satisfying when most of your wins come easily and the deaths feel cheap. I honestly think that this might be the most unbalanced SMT game in the last few years.
They really need to work out some inheritance rules, get a defense stat build in and better movesets/patterns for bosses. Drop the hard mode and work on a more challenging standard mode that doesn't rely on bad luck to kill the player.
It really is odd that the combat would be the biggest letdown in a SMT game, everything else is pretty enjoyable so far, sans some pretty bad demon designs. And I really need to get my hands on that OST.
SMT3, no question about it imo.
Yeah, best game.
But if you want something slightly different you can try the others first. DDS is more traditional, having a party with story characters and no demon fusing. It also has a much bigger focus on story, which is pretty good. Raidou 2 takes an Action approach in terms of battles and does it pretty well. If you want more of the same, go for SMT3, but you probably will not be disappointed with any of those.
Using gas items to inflict a status effect is a pretty consistent way to get rid of them on fodder. Bosses getting them is more of a problem by comparison (you're pretty much stuck hoping to repel, null, or drain whatever they do next).
Not really.
If you start a reincarnation cycle, even hard mode is very easy.
SMT3 of course.
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
From my limited experience (I'm 20 hours in) the problem with smirks is that fights are do or die and are over quite quickly. If the boss gets a smirk, it doesn't matter wether you can remove it or not because you're getting wiped on his turn.
Well of course, but it wouldn't really make sense to start a Hard run with a reincarnation cycle, would it?
And yeah, play Lucifer's Call of course.
snow in jamaica
Member
E_Darkness
Member
Play SMT3, then DDS1&2. DDS is basically Nocturne but with a fixed cast of characters and skill trees so play Nocturne first. DDS in my own opinion is amazing and Embryon are the best characters in everything MegaTen
ill fight you if you say otherwise, legit srs
D
Deleted member 125677
Unconfirmed Member
silly question: Can SMT3 psn be played on Vita?
Orniletter
Banned
Not natively, it is a PS2 classic. I don´t know if it would be possible with PSNow down the line whenever we´ll get it.
I´m still kinda hoping for a Nocturne golden/ 3D type handheld port with some extra content. Alus used to do those a lot
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Finally beat the Minotaur ! What an asshole...
I´m still kinda hoping for a Nocturne golden/ 3D type handheld port with some extra content. Alus used to do those a lot
They missed the 10th anniversary opportunity to do a remake.
TBH I don't want to see that game on handheld because it will inevitably suffer from tuning down to the ground balance-wise. I can somehow tolerate that kind of stuff in a new game like SMT4 but seeing it in a game I love such as SMT3 would break my heart.
P4G is another good example. Even if the original wasn't very well balanced, Golden was so fucking broken. I played it in the hardest difficulty mode and it was a cakewalk. I finished it around level 50 IIRC.
I won't talk about EOU because that one was the worst IMO especially when the gameplay is so important. Break the gameplay and the game isn't interesting to play anymore.
I was pretty hyped for this game, but when it came out I had some other stuff to take care of. However I'm now full steam ahead on the game and I'm really enjoying it. I've just got to Shinjuku and personally I think the difficulty of the game is just right. I'm finding the battle difficulty can still be tough sometimes (some bosses have been pretty easy though), the game is just easier because you can save anyway, choose what skills you want for demons and so on. These things to me make the experience a lot less tedious. One thing I've noticed is that I'm either really unlucky, or the Hama/Mudo skills in this game are insane, because 99% of my deaths now seem to be to these skills, and to demons who aren't even weak to the spells. Particularly frustrating was a side-quest where you have to kill 5 groups of cursed spirits or whatever in Naraku, and on the final fight a mini-boss appears at the end of the fight. I'd get to it, and he would pretty much always get first turn, cast a party wide Mudo spell and just instantly kill two of my members right off, so I'm really appreciating that save anywhere.
What? If anything it is better balanced because they fixed broken skills like Immunize and Survivalists. And expert classic is certainly not easier than EO1. Gunner and Highlander have some pretty overpowered skills, though, so I can see the issues if you're playing story mode.
Yeah I'm talking about the story mode.
They fixed the skills, that's true but that didn't change the fact that they added some things that completely broke the game for me.
Floor Jump, Grimoire System and the game over all was a lot easier and removed the tension.
Imp the Dimp
Member
Well, I'm officially on the Chaos Path. Too bad I didn't get to play the Neutral Path in my 1st playthrough.
I think this game, as well as most SMTs, is really well written. The story is intriguing and the characters are not flat. I'm definitely enjoying the dialogue unlike in most JRPGs.
I think this game, as well as most SMTs, is really well written. The story is intriguing and the characters are not flat. I'm definitely enjoying the dialogue unlike in most JRPGs.
E_Darkness
Member
To be honest if you're aiming for neutral and don't know how it works then you'll probably not get it. I only got neutral because I backed out of chaos because I had a hunch I could get neutral.
Imp the Dimp
Member
Chaos is not too bad I suppose. I recall it being the best ending in Devil Survivor by fair margin.
E_Darkness
Member
Oh yeah it's the best ending by far. But try going
for Day 8 no killing humans path, that is honestly the hardest thing in anything.
Black capes ftw
Inquisitive_Ghost
Member
Only post-alignment lock in this game, unfortunately. In most of the previous entries you can use it to determine your alignment from the instant it appears. In SJ it's even colour-coded.
Law: clockwise
Chaos: counterclockwise
Neutral: wiggles back and forth
I just got past the Reverse Hills.
That's certainly an unpleasant scenario. I suppose it's the classic sacrifice of the few for the benefit of the many quandary but with more brain juice. I also reached the Four Heralds. Still not a fan of this style of design but I suppose it's consistent at least.
Tizoc
Member
OK so uh...what the fuck just happened? Someone help me get a hold of the story please
In a way I like how the world, story and setting is presented to me, on the other I'm confused about a few things.
If these questions will be answered as I progress, then just say so so I keep playing to find out by myself thanks
1-
2-
3-
I guess that's it for now.
I decide to join Jonathan to stop Walter and Lilith. Walter goes to this Yamato Reactor, whatever the fuck it is, and activates it.
Is the Yamato Reactor what brought demons to our world?
I eventually meet The White who reflect upon me, and then I'm in...an alternate reality Tokyo?
This one was destroyed by the demons' arrival and the world is purged, with Pluto pumping poison onto the overworld.
At the time, to counter the demons' arrival, Demonicas were created to fight them, but the Counter Demon Force was defeated and the world destroyed.
That's what I got from Akira at least, I don't think any of the other NPCs elaborated on what happened.
OK so I destroy Pluto and go into that reality's Yamato Reactor, hoping it'll return me to my original reality.
I meet the White again but by now I learn that they're showed me a version of Tokyo that's part of the 'Law alignment' the series is known for.
They send me to another Tokyo reality, but in this one a solution to the demon problem is to create a union or symbiosis of sorts with the demons, some going so far as to fuse with them. Here I meet an Arika who is fused and wants me to deal with some Kanji.
I stopped at that point since i had to go to bed.
Is the Yamato Reactor what brought demons to our world?
I eventually meet The White who reflect upon me, and then I'm in...an alternate reality Tokyo?
This one was destroyed by the demons' arrival and the world is purged, with Pluto pumping poison onto the overworld.
At the time, to counter the demons' arrival, Demonicas were created to fight them, but the Counter Demon Force was defeated and the world destroyed.
That's what I got from Akira at least, I don't think any of the other NPCs elaborated on what happened.
OK so I destroy Pluto and go into that reality's Yamato Reactor, hoping it'll return me to my original reality.
I meet the White again but by now I learn that they're showed me a version of Tokyo that's part of the 'Law alignment' the series is known for.
They send me to another Tokyo reality, but in this one a solution to the demon problem is to create a union or symbiosis of sorts with the demons, some going so far as to fuse with them. Here I meet an Arika who is fused and wants me to deal with some Kanji.
I stopped at that point since i had to go to bed.
In a way I like how the world, story and setting is presented to me, on the other I'm confused about a few things.
If these questions will be answered as I progress, then just say so so I keep playing to find out by myself thanks
1-
Minotaur says he made a contract with his master 1500 years ago, that would make it that Mikado and its surroundings existed for that long period of time.
When I reach Tokyo, I learn that demons invaded the world 25 years ago, and that some people made an exodus in a giant white cocoon. Did this exodus occur upon the demons arrival or shortly after?
Notice also the time discrepancy 1500 years vs. 25! Did time move faster in Mikado or something? Or does Minotaur's contract with Aquila span many realities?
When I reach Tokyo, I learn that demons invaded the world 25 years ago, and that some people made an exodus in a giant white cocoon. Did this exodus occur upon the demons arrival or shortly after?
Notice also the time discrepancy 1500 years vs. 25! Did time move faster in Mikado or something? Or does Minotaur's contract with Aquila span many realities?
2-
Sky and Mikado are a little confusing.
Was the Sky Tower erected AFTER the cocoon left? How did an entire landmass exist atop Tokyo, was an effect from the Yamato Reactor causing demons to appear in our world?
Is the real sky even visible anymore or is it covered up by the landmass?
Was the Sky Tower erected AFTER the cocoon left? How did an entire landmass exist atop Tokyo, was an effect from the Yamato Reactor causing demons to appear in our world?
Is the real sky even visible anymore or is it covered up by the landmass?
3-
When were Demonicas created and how did Mikado get the tech? Are there even any other big nations/cities beside Mikado?
I guess that's it for now.
I just faced Pluto and he was definitely more challenging than the last couple bosses. I didn't have to grind or anything like that but a team and tactics change up was required. Also one of the better new designs.
I chose to go with Walter and side with Lilith. She tells you to open the Yamato Reactor which will allow demons to enter Tokyo which will bring out a chaotic world that the strong will be able to shape. You then press the button (I assume Walter will if you say no) and everything else is the same after that.
Walter won't press the button if you refuse. He says that you should go get some fresh air and come back when you want to press it. So you have to press the button eventually for the story to continue.
I have to say that the requirements for the Neutral ending are completely messed up.
And I'm not talking about dialogue choices, but rather what happens after the alignment lock.
And I'm not talking about dialogue choices, but rather what happens after the alignment lock.
I appreciate the idea that you need to become the number one hunter in order to inspire hope. Good way to merge a gameplay concept with the story. It's also a good way to familiarize yourself with Tokyo and its inhabitants, to motivate you to save the world.
However, who thought it was a smart idea to make non-Hunter Association quests mandatory? Without a FAQ, how was I even to know where to start looking for some of these quests? Some are given by NPCs and others by demons, in remote corners of the overworld. Without any guidance, or even any indication that these quests exist in the first place, players can spend hours and hours exploring every nook and cranny of the world trying to find a way to progress. The unclear overworld navigation and annoying low-level random encounters make this all much more tedious than it has any right to be.
Another problem, perhaps more personal to my experience, is that the battle against Beelzebub was so hard that it necessitated a lot of grinding and I ended up with a team that took away any challenge from the actual end-game bosses (speaking of which, a Neutral-unique final boss would've been pleasant). That bastard can wipe you out in a single turn regardless of your level or preparation, unless you were lucky enough to have gotten a Null Nerve skill, which I found out about later and I believe only a handful of demons have.
Ugh.
However, who thought it was a smart idea to make non-Hunter Association quests mandatory? Without a FAQ, how was I even to know where to start looking for some of these quests? Some are given by NPCs and others by demons, in remote corners of the overworld. Without any guidance, or even any indication that these quests exist in the first place, players can spend hours and hours exploring every nook and cranny of the world trying to find a way to progress. The unclear overworld navigation and annoying low-level random encounters make this all much more tedious than it has any right to be.
Another problem, perhaps more personal to my experience, is that the battle against Beelzebub was so hard that it necessitated a lot of grinding and I ended up with a team that took away any challenge from the actual end-game bosses (speaking of which, a Neutral-unique final boss would've been pleasant). That bastard can wipe you out in a single turn regardless of your level or preparation, unless you were lucky enough to have gotten a Null Nerve skill, which I found out about later and I believe only a handful of demons have.
Ugh.
There is an answer to almost every question if you pay attention and speak to every NPC after each major event. Some of them are alignment exclusive (mainly Neutral).
Basically:
Just like in SMT1, after demons appeared in Tokyo, God launched nuclear missiles to destroy the city. Just before that, god picked up a few humans (with the cocoon) to use them to start over.
If God's scheme was a success, the result is what you see in Blasted Tokyo: wasteland everywhere before the chosen ones have been brought back to build a new city and worship God. Pluto has been sent to exterminate the remaining "filthy" humans.
Infernal Tokyo is the result of humans allying with the demons and totally preventing God from executing his plan. That's why you still see the cocoon in Shinjuku national park.
These are 2 extreme cases that represent Law and Chaos. They didn't happen that's why the White presented them as possibilities.
What really happened is between these 2 extreme scenarios. God was able to pickup a few chosen humans. Meanwhile, a hero was able to summon Masakado, the guardian deity of Tokyo who became the ceiling that protected the city from destruction.
When the cocoon came back, the humans inside found themselves on top of the ceiling instead of the destroyed city but the landscape was very similar(that's why Jonathan said the lakes in Mikado used to be cavities like the ones in Blasted Tokyo).
Akira, a member of the counter demon force and a friend of the hero who protected the city, was looking for his sister who was kidnapped by the angels. He was able to reach the top of the ceiling and decided to stay there, putting a powerful demon to protect the entry(Minotaur).
All that happened 25 years ago but if you talk to some samurai in Mikado some time after you reach Tokyo, they will tell you that they were absent for 1 day but when they came back their children grew up as if 6 months have passed or something, which suggest that time goes a lot faster in Mikado.
Akira became king Aquilla who named the regions of Mikado after Tokyo's districts. That's why the names look so similar:
Kiccigiorgi <-> Kichijoji
Cibooya <-> Shibuya
Shene Duque <-> Shinjuku
If God's scheme was a success, the result is what you see in Blasted Tokyo: wasteland everywhere before the chosen ones have been brought back to build a new city and worship God. Pluto has been sent to exterminate the remaining "filthy" humans.
Infernal Tokyo is the result of humans allying with the demons and totally preventing God from executing his plan. That's why you still see the cocoon in Shinjuku national park.
These are 2 extreme cases that represent Law and Chaos. They didn't happen that's why the White presented them as possibilities.
What really happened is between these 2 extreme scenarios. God was able to pickup a few chosen humans. Meanwhile, a hero was able to summon Masakado, the guardian deity of Tokyo who became the ceiling that protected the city from destruction.
When the cocoon came back, the humans inside found themselves on top of the ceiling instead of the destroyed city but the landscape was very similar(that's why Jonathan said the lakes in Mikado used to be cavities like the ones in Blasted Tokyo).
Akira, a member of the counter demon force and a friend of the hero who protected the city, was looking for his sister who was kidnapped by the angels. He was able to reach the top of the ceiling and decided to stay there, putting a powerful demon to protect the entry(Minotaur).
All that happened 25 years ago but if you talk to some samurai in Mikado some time after you reach Tokyo, they will tell you that they were absent for 1 day but when they came back their children grew up as if 6 months have passed or something, which suggest that time goes a lot faster in Mikado.
Akira became king Aquilla who named the regions of Mikado after Tokyo's districts. That's why the names look so similar:
Kiccigiorgi <-> Kichijoji
Cibooya <-> Shibuya
Shene Duque <-> Shinjuku
GwyndolinCinder
Member
bit offtopic but Whats the DDS series like? I've never heard much about it
It's closer to a traditional JRPG with a much bigger focus on story and characters and it uses a more refined version of Nocturne's press turn system but it has no demon fusions (or recruitment). Great soundtrack, too.
Woah
It is a SMT-take on a more classical JRPG. Bigger focus on story and characters (which are both excellent) and fixed party members for combat. You don't have the freedom of hundreds of demons or the variety of negotiations, but the press turn system is still there and great as ever and the skill system is up to par as well. Also features an outstanding OST. Both games are great.
Now I want to go through 'em again.
The fight against (spoilers of the neutral path)
Tell me this quest is not mandatory, please T_T
Beelzebub is BULLSHIT. Oh, here, let me spam three Megidolaon in a row. Oh, you survived that, never mind, let me use three Mudoons in a row, even though you are resistant to instant death it'll somehow kill you. Oh my, you survived that? No worries my man, let me use this STUPID spell I have which reduces the life of all party members to one and then a little Megidolaon to make sure you die. And all the while all party members are sick, of course.
Winning this is pure luck and I hate it when devs use these cheap tactics to screw with the player. This is the battle planner: "I don't know how to increase the difficulty so I'll just create a boss with stupid unavoidable patterns. Problem solved, I am a genius!"
Fuck you battle planner.
Winning this is pure luck and I hate it when devs use these cheap tactics to screw with the player. This is the battle planner: "I don't know how to increase the difficulty so I'll just create a boss with stupid unavoidable patterns. Problem solved, I am a genius!"
Fuck you battle planner.
Tell me this quest is not mandatory, please T_T